Path of Ascension by C Mantis. A Western Xianxia inspired progression fantasy with Litrpg elements.

One reason concentration is weird is that the author fucked up the math, and the beta readers didn't understand the intent chiefly and didn't catch it. So it got retconned later.
The advice given very early on is don't bother with concentration at all during the lower tiers because your return on investment is so tiny,
And even that advice is not uncontested. We see some people squabbling over it during the training planet arc.
 
Basically I wouldn't work about the raw numbers of it, the root is 'most mages give up a modest part of their mana pool for more potency each tier, and Matt can't do the former so need to work harder to make up for the latter.'
 
Chapter 357
Back to Soerilia with a look at two people in particular.

Lmao, a professor insisting that ancient aliens were once on the planet. Funny IRL, but here, he is technically completely correct. Managed to make his own runic array to communicate with the aliens and is ecstatic that one of them showed up. If this guy could kludge one together on his own from what he found in ancient ruins, I wonder what he can do with proper instruction and actually having his own cultivation?

One of the soldiers has continued leveling and reached tier 4. Inspiration to make his Concept and reach tier 5. So going back to a previous conversation, definitively yes, at least some of the current generation (or at least this one guy) are capable of making it to immortality. But although this guy is still thinking of his planet instead of abandoning it, he seems more looking forward at the possibilities of cultivation and magic than he is about anything involving looking back. I imagine anybody else blazing forward in the tiers would also lean towards the side of being progressives. Anyone of this generation that actually makes it to immortality by pushing forward on their own merits probably aren't going to be the historians and cultural preservationists that one leader wanted.
 
Chapter 358
Ah, a nice chapter. Multiple perspectives from different people around the Empire to changes being made by the trio, mostly Matt's recent aura rifts.

People lower down like commoners and low-ranking nobles willing to work at improving things are taking it well. Snobs and people with entrenched power are being dipshits as expected. Though thankfully even they are wary of pissing them off and causing eventual death-by-Ascender, so at least they aren't dumb enough to try more permanent methods of stopping them it seems.
 
I liked how Matt's blatant berserk button is... doing pretty much exactly what he'd fervently wish it to. He has some pretty severe hard lines and he is in no way subtle about them. It's also interesting to notice how the opposition is only barely held together.

I also think that they are pretty severely underestimating the Ascenders. They really don't know the depth of resources that the team can draw on, and things like "the profound gratitude of a whole bunch of lower-tier people" are resources that they're not even wired to acknowledge as meaningful at all.

It was interesting to see how things like the aura rifts would tend to siphon resources out of the higher-tier worlds and towards the lower-tier ones.

Thinking about it... I have a suspicion that even if it's not a deliberate part of the pan, Lily is likely to rank up eventually as a result of the absurd amounts of mana being thrown around. When you're going for high-speed research powered by a nearly-unlimited mana budget, mana efficiency is not the first priority of your process, you know?
 
The intermission was nice to show the effects ripple out. And the Senses part was cool to built some anticipation. In a way, I liked that more than Vergil. She's so vile that any POV from her is just kind of gross. These people on the other hand are just assholes.
I liked how Matt's blatant berserk button is... doing pretty much exactly what he'd fervently wish it to. He has some pretty severe hard lines and he is in no way subtle about them. It's also interesting to notice how the opposition is only barely held together.

I also think that they are pretty severely underestimating the Ascenders. They really don't know the depth of resources that the team can draw on, and things like "the profound gratitude of a whole bunch of lower-tier people" are resources that they're not even wired to acknowledge as meaningful at all.

It was interesting to see how things like the aura rifts would tend to siphon resources out of the higher-tier worlds and towards the lower-tier ones.

Thinking about it... I have a suspicion that even if it's not a deliberate part of the pan, Lily is likely to rank up eventually as a result of the absurd amounts of mana being thrown around. When you're going for high-speed research powered by a nearly-unlimited mana budget, mana efficiency is not the first priority of your process, you know?

It's... funny and disturbing that they're like "What a psycho, still angry about some mortals 200 years ago". Which, in immortal timespans isn't even that long.

It makes sense that the opposition is pretty fractured. They're a definitional opposition, held together by nothing but opposing them for their personal gain. More, they each have a different personal gain, so they can't even rally around that. There's almost certainly also an organised opposition, but they can talk and act mostly openly, because they can defend those actions to Emps and the Royals. Even if they don't like it, if they're acting with good intent, they won't get punished. Hell, they arguably have a Royal, since the the newest one is basically the representative of the hereditary nobles.

I don't think the gratitude of the lower levels is actually all that useful, except in the long term. Not useless, but nothing compared to Free Money, being (and being friends with) the local superweapons, and being family (or friends) with the top of the pyramid. That lets them power through the opposition in a way they're not expecting, even knowing about the second two points. (All of those reinforce each other. Free Money means that the Royals can act more freely, because the cost doesn't have to fall on their people, which let's Matt make more use of the Free Money, etc)

The gratitude is a side effect of the short/mid term goals. It is, however, extremely important in the long term plan of changing the empire. Because that is ultimately a matter of culture and expectations. However, that has a time horizon of many tens of thousands of years. Matt and Co might not even be there to really see it. And it's not a concern for most of the Senses. The winterwolves don't give a shit, so long as they remain in power. This does hurt them, but it's more of a sideshow. The aperology and tech people are the same. They're losing money, and such changes would probably reduce how much money they make, but it's not that important.
The one group that cannot have this is the inheritable nobility. It's an existential threat to them, and it's also an ideological one.
 
One that struck me the most is aside from the Winter Wplf, the others are largely opposing Aster not out of particular objection to what she's doing but just out of the principle to stop boat rocking. They aren't as vile as Enrique, being ok with aura, but collectively working on trying to encourage the trio into being non politically active ascenders.

I assume these are our big arc opponents- at tier 45 no push overs- and it will be interesting to see how they go.
 
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Hm, regarding the usefulness of the gratitude of the masses, here's a thought: maybe some of Matt's innovations ends up being something that helps along the next Ascender. While it will take a while for the gratitude of the average joe to actually build up enough to be useful to higher tiers, an Ascender pops up very fast in comparison.
 
I don't think the gratitude of the lower levels is actually all that useful, except in the long term. Not useless, but nothing compared to Free Money, being (and being friends with) the local superweapons, and being family (or friends) with the top of the pyramid. That lets them power through the opposition in a way they're not expecting, even knowing about the second two points. (All of those reinforce each other. Free Money means that the Royals can act more freely, because the cost doesn't have to fall on their people, which let's Matt make more use of the Free Money, etc)
Sure. Matt and co have certain blatant advantages, but their enemies are mostly tracking on those. The gratitude is one that they simply aren't. Now, maybe that's actually legit, and you're right and it doesn't matter. I'm thinking, though, that from an intel perspective, having the underlings love you is potentially quite valuable.

I assume these are our big arc opponents- at tier 45 no push overs- and it will be interesting to see how they go.
I'm pretty sure they're not T45, though, or not all T45 - not if they're talking about "death by Ascender" as an actual thing that they need to be potentially concerned about.
 
Sure. Matt and co have certain blatant advantages, but their enemies are mostly tracking on those. The gratitude is one that they simply aren't. Now, maybe that's actually legit, and you're right and it doesn't matter. I'm thinking, though, that from an intel perspective, having the underlings love you is potentially quite valuable.
They're not tracking the infinite money. That's a complete game changer, and it also means that starving them out is futile, and trying to block them with politics is only very slightly less futile.

And sure, having personal loyalty of underlings is super important. But the gratitude thing only comes into that on the long term, because nobody benefiting right now in a truly life changing way is powerful or related to someone powerful. That's why what they're doing matters so much. Right now, they're just not useful, and won't be for at minimum hundreds, but more likely thousands and often tens of thousands of years.

And for individual people, it's quite possible to gain their loyalty and gratitude without helping the entire realm. More, the aura rifts aren't revolutionary because they allow something new. Concept potions do something similar, just worse and more expensive. Shards of Reality are actually better, just way more expensive. And aura did exist beforehand, just also more expensive. So someone rich could already gain someones loyalty by helping them or their loved ones to immortality. Or help them in some other way.

As a sidenote: If you want to argue the worth of gratitude people have towards Matt, I'd say the Bandage skill is more important right now. He did that one, and by this point there are many, many people who either owe their life to it, or love someone who owes their life to it. And crucially, most of those will be delvers (who are generally more useful per the Emperor), and a good number will be at higher tiers, and therefore immediately useful.
 
I'm pretty sure they're not T45, though, or not all T45 - not if they're talking about "death by Ascender" as an actual thing that they need to be potentially concerned about.

Remember how fast Ascenders rise next to everyone else - a 26 turns into 40s in a relative eyeblink, just a few thousand years.

They might not all be 45 but they're all probably fairly high tier. Very few people can consider themselves safe from an Ascender with a grudge.
 
They're not tracking the infinite money. That's a complete game changer, and it also means that starving them out is futile, and trying to block them with politics is only very slightly less futile.

And sure, having personal loyalty of underlings is super important. But the gratitude thing only comes into that on the long term, because nobody benefiting right now in a truly life changing way is powerful or related to someone powerful. That's why what they're doing matters so much. Right now, they're just not useful, and won't be for at minimum hundreds, but more likely thousands and often tens of thousands of years.

And for individual people, it's quite possible to gain their loyalty and gratitude without helping the entire realm. More, the aura rifts aren't revolutionary because they allow something new. Concept potions do something similar, just worse and more expensive. Shards of Reality are actually better, just way more expensive. And aura did exist beforehand, just also more expensive. So someone rich could already gain someones loyalty by helping them or their loved ones to immortality. Or help them in some other way.

As a sidenote: If you want to argue the worth of gratitude people have towards Matt, I'd say the Bandage skill is more important right now. He did that one, and by this point there are many, many people who either owe their life to it, or love someone who owes their life to it. And crucially, most of those will be delvers (who are generally more useful per the Emperor), and a good number will be at higher tiers, and therefore immediately useful.
You know what? Fine. Congratulations. Your use of "well actually" is successful. The particular example that I mentioned of advantages that the Ascenders have isn't that big a deal, and this other thing is something that they're unaware of that *is* a big deal and I'm sure that if I kept going you could keep finding things that I'd said that were in some way imperfect and you could pick holes in those too. You have styled upon me and surely your status will increase as a result. You have won the internet. Go you.
 
Remember how fast Ascenders rise next to everyone else - a 26 turns into 40s in a relative eyeblink, just a few thousand years.

They might not all be 45 but they're all probably fairly high tier. Very few people can consider themselves safe from an Ascender with a grudge.
There's also the sand dragon in the short term. That's also death by ascender.
You know what? Fine. Congratulations. Your use of "well actually" is successful. The particular example that I mentioned of advantages that the Ascenders have isn't that big a deal, and this other thing is something that they're unaware of that *is* a big deal and I'm sure that if I kept going you could keep finding things that I'd said that were in some way imperfect and you could pick holes in those too. You have styled upon me and surely your status will increase as a result. You have won the internet. Go you.
I don't see anything where I was all that pedantic, and I didn't really want to (or did, as far as I see it) style on you. It's talking about a thing everyone here enjoys. Either way, I clearly fucked up on tone, and I apologize. I didn't and don't want to hurt you enjoyment of either the story or the this thread.
 
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I don't see anything where I was all that pedantic, and I didn't really want to (or did, as far as I see it) style on you. It's talking about a thing everyone here enjoys. Either way, I clearly fucked up on tone, and I apologize. I didn't and don't want to hurt you enjoyment of either the story or the this thread.
Okay. I was perhaps unfair. Here's what I perceive.
- First, for reasons that have nothing to do with this message board, I am currently low on a number of kinds of social ergs. This makes me more sensitive to things, more easily frustrated, and also generally less able to win when intellectually sparring on the internet. Oh, and it makes intellectually sparring on the internet more tiring and less fun as well.
- I was trying to make an overall statement about how the opposition were in a much worse position than they realized, including a particular example of how they were blinded to certain of those advantages simply by matter of their outlook on things. They'd seemed meaningful to *me*, anyway. In retrospect, how meaningful they were is a matter of genre more than anything else. It *might* matter, it might not, and it's n many cases a matter of authorial interpretation, and of how much influence and/or understanding the little people actually have.
- You responded with (to my perception) an assertion that the example I'd pulled of the benefits was not meaningful, with supporting arguments. Realistically, this point, being a matter that was semi-subjective but still subject to some degree of rational argument, was almost ideal for a bit of meaningless fun internet sparring... but in my current condition, internet sparring is not a lot of fun. Still, I did what I could to raise to the challenge. The resulting counterargument was not up to my usual standards.
- You responded again with further arguments supporting your own side, and then seized on something else I'd written in my counterargument to attack that too. I found the entire experience frustrating and exhausting, and I basically gave up.
- I got all butt-hurt about it. I should probably go touch grass. I will go touch grass. It's going to be the next thing I do after I hit post.

Sorry for being a landmine that you walked into without any reasonable way you could have seen it coming.
 
There's also the sand dragon in the short term. That's also death by ascender.

Sure, though one they already know how to avoid. Matt's the grudge holder.

Hm, Bartholomew/Smell is definitely tier 45, but it was Touch who had the worry about being killed. Touch is the aperologist, so reasonably high tier, but likely a crafter/researcher unlike Bartholomew, and not necessarily as high.


Thinking about it Sirrocco is probably right about them not all being high tier. They each certainly represent powerful well connected interests, but Bartholomew entertained the thought of direct targeting in his head, he may effectively be the muscle of the group, the one recruited that others can hide behind in case of direct confrontation.

Hearing is a researcher/crafter too. Taste…. not sure, maybe noble. Probably noble. If there's another strong one I'm betting them based largely on vibes and having a solid intel network, suggested wetwork against Liz's noble candidates. Sight was also worried about confrontation, seems like probably guilds? Seems to think about taxes and such a fair amount and focused on Matt's guild.
 
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Chapter 359
Huh. Sect visit.

Yun Me is a lot more chill than I was expecting. But I suppose in retrospect, she would have to be. After all, Ascenders have the reputation of going wherever they want and doing whatever they want. As long as they don't do anything serious enough to cause a war (and such a threshold would probably be higher than normal for an Ascender), they probably fuck with a lot of people in their downtime. For someone as notable and long lived as Yun Me, she undoubtedly would have been the target of many Ascender shenanigans over the years. Finding a way to deal with that would have been absolutely necessary to continue as she has over the ages. And it seems that method is to just suck all the fun out of teasing her.

Gan Le is back on screen as well. Seems he and Matt might get a chance to get along better after all, since they are no longer at war, and Matt is deciding not to hold too strong a grudge against him since he wasn't the one who directly killed Eric. Seeing him peacefully eating Aster's intentionally bad ice creams again my mind is now suddenly getting the crack idea of Aster/Gan Le.

I wonder what exactly Zack has been up to over the years, aside from working a bit on projects.
 
Yun Me has such 'been there done that' energy. Take the wind out of Ascender antics by making it routine. Wreck the place? That's just part of the landscape now and she won't rush to fix it.

It makes sense that Matt doesn't hold a grudge against the ones that just stood up and fight. No warcrimes, no assassinating his friends, just tried to kill him or in the case of Gan, just protect his allies even. I'd be interested in seeing a Long Zhiyuan meeting…. Matt was annoyed at him for Minkalla but that's probably the extent of it.

Interesting Zach chose to 'age' some.
 
Chapter 360
Delving the rift. Nothing earth shattering, but that also made it just feel like a fun chapter. Just being able to rampage through a rift without caring too much about things like other people, politics, or consequences.

For Matt, that began with pulling his newest set of armor out of storage. Sadly, it wasn't the hyper-awesome set of power armor that he'd used in the war, but a new set he'd commissioned for himself now that he was Tier 26. In theory, if they were to start a new war right now, he'd go back to using his power armor. But with centuries of peace for the Empire ahead of them, that wouldn't be happening. The maintenance of the armor made it impractical to use in normal delving, and it wasn't technically his anyway. He could push that fact if he really wanted to, but… eh. He had used others' old weapons and armor and that was only possible if the Empire had them ready to loan out.
With his personal buffs taken care of, Matt withdrew his trusty growth sword. He hadn't used it in the war, but he had personally enchanted it with runes in all of its forms. Thanks to a bit of shenanigans with an [Overcharge]d [Sword Twin] and its ability to create four copies of the blade, he'd melded the best of its five forms into a single longsword that had the potency of dagger armor-piercing and the spell empowerment of a glaive, all further empowered. He swept the re-merged blade through the air, feeling out its weight and adjusting his [Archmage's Presence] strength boost until it had the right heft to it.
Ah, none of the shiny OP equipment from the war, but the explanation makes sense. Super optimized equipment with high maintenance makes sense when you have access to the total war machine of the Empire and are playing high stakes, but less of a priority in normal times. Kinda nice having his old sword that he self-tinkers with back.

Even as he noted that thought, a cavalcade of buffs landed on him from Zack. While the man wasn't much of a support mage, he had a number of interesting and unique buffs that he could provide, though Matt wouldn't say he was especially good at using them to their maximum.

Once he felt he was in perfect sync with Liz and Aster, then he'd drill more with Zack. That might be a few centuries away, but he was immortal. He had time.
Turning, Matt looked to Zack, whose small smile would have been the equivalent of a manic grin for anyone else. It was good they were on the same page, even after a decade apart.

Matt let a mana stone crumble in his hands, just in case there was somehow someone spying on him, and unleashed massive amounts of mana into their surroundings.

Once the area around their platform was saturated, Zack twisted the affinity, kickstarting a cascade. But instead of dropping his connection to the mana, Matt kept throwing mana at the problem, like someone trying to outrun speed wobbles on their flying sword by accelerating through. There were only two possible results, you outran your problem, or spread across whatever was under you.

And Matt was nothing if not fast.

The resulting explosion lasted for almost an entire minute, and was bright enough to dissipate the surrounding gray smoke like fog under the morning sun.

Once the attack settled down, Matt felt thousands of shackles cinch down onto his spirit. And from Zack's small wince, he must have encountered the same.
Zack's newest toy, his spell array, helped him use all sorts of external focuses to influence his spells even more than he already could, giving him a frankly absurd amount of versatility in his casting. But even without that, they'd had plenty of ideas for combining Matt's overwhelming power with Zack's exacting control during the war, lots of which they hadn't been able to try at the time.

But rift monsters, unlike soldiers, weren't up to date with the latest in countermagic.

Matt fired a massive [Mana Beam] at Zack, who intercepted it with his fiery spell array, filtered it through a dragonscale, and unleashed a massive, elongated snake-dragon upon the monsters around them, laying absolute waste through the physical embodiment of Matt's ludicrous power.

That wasn't sufficient, or at least using only that would have been boring. So over the next day, they tried out a bunch of their more outlandish combos. Some, like trying to turn Matt's [Tribulation Strike] into gravity, literally blew up in their face, but others were much more promising.

Fortunately, with the final monster's death, the shackles fell off their spirits, relieving a tremendous amount of spiritual pressure on him and Zack alike.
Also nice seeing Matt making plans for people outside of just Liz and Aster. I mean, working together with Zack isn't exactly going outside of his comfort zone or anything, but interacting with other friends is nice.

"I wonder what it will be?"

Allie poked at it without disrupting the membrane, which would have condensed the reward. "Gotta be something good, right? We did the perfect run, just like Sien said. I swear if we just get mana stones, I'm going to dissipate this rift."

Allie leaned in and started whispering mean things at the rift distortion while Matt and Liz tried not to laugh.

How Allie would replace the rift's lunch with plain cheese sandwiches was a mystery, but he didn't doubt she would do something if the rewards were bad.
Not gonna lie, I'm not exactly blown away by any of these rewards. I hope Allie does steal the rift's lunch somehow.

Unless this insta-volcano rock turns out to be something more special. Some kind of super magical volcano. Wasn't Liz getting a fire planet? Can this volcano be put on that planet to make it even firier?
 
I like the rift-reward ritual they do, adds character.

Insta-volcano is weird enough to probably satisfy.

This one sounds like it'd be a lot of fun to re-do and purposefully give the boss different combos.
 
Not gonna lie, I'm not exactly blown away by any of these rewards. I hope Allie does steal the rift's lunch somehow.

Unless this insta-volcano rock turns out to be something more special. Some kind of super magical volcano. Wasn't Liz getting a fire planet? Can this volcano be put on that planet to make it even firier?
You gotta realize, this is the pull for running a single rift. We've gotten accustomed to looking at the kind of loot drops that fall out of things like "doing well in wars", "doing well in major tournaments" and "Minkalla". Like, seriously, I don't actually know how long it's been since we got told what the drop was for a single rift-run by the protagonists, but it's telling that "Lol. Have some mana stones." was legitimately on the list of options.
 
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You gotta realize, this is the pull for running a single rift. We've gotten accustomed to looking at the kind of loot drops that fall out of things like "doing well in wars", "doing well in major tournaments" and "Minkalla". Like, seriously, I don't actually know how long it's been since we got told what the drop was for a single rift-run by the protagonists, but it's telling that "Lol. Have some mana stones." was legitimately on the list of options.
Yeah, I think the last time we saw a lot of that, "mana stones lmao" was the normal results, maybe with some metal thrown in or whatever. But that was way the fuck back in the training planet/vassal war area. Most of what you get is like resource drops in some games: There's a million different ones, you need them in large quantities for cool shit, but they are certainly not cool shit, and most will be useless to what your doing. You're better of trading them for what you actually want.

Then there's a much smaller group of weird shit that is useless for you, but if you're lucky it's exactly what someone out there wants, and you can sell it for huge cash. If not, you have a neat new wall ornament.

The "actually relevant to you, personally" is pretty rare. There's a reason it takes tens of thousands of years to get anywhere. Doubly so if you don't want to be a loser. Because it just takes a long time to find what you need, or something you can sell for what you need.
 
You gotta realize, this is the pull for running a single rift. We've gotten accustomed to looking at the kind of loot drops that fall out of things like "doing well in wars", "doing well in major tournaments" and "Minkalla". Like, seriously, I don't actually know how long it's been since we got told what the drop was for a single rift-run by the protagonists, but it's telling that "Lol. Have some mana stones." was legitimately on the list of options.
Fair enough.

It was a notable rift above their tier that they did a special challenge for, but while it might be hard to do as Tier 26s, it could probably be easily farmed by a Tier 30. If the rift really dropped anything super special, it would be getting farmed already by higher tiers.
 
Fair enough.

It was a notable rift above their tier that they did a special challenge for, but while it might be hard to do as Tier 26s, it could probably be easily farmed by a Tier 30. If the rift really dropped anything super special, it would be getting farmed already by higher tiers.
It is special, and probably does drop particularly cool stuff. Just at a 1% instead of 0.0001% chance.
 
Was looking back at the older updates, trying to find out when the last time *was*. At the moment I'm back to 247, the beginning of the war, and still going strong.

There's some interesting stuff though, now that we have better context. As an example, we have Su Yu from the sects, who is currently... tier 24? I think? Basically his whole thing is looking at the Unyielding Anvil Yun Me and thinking "That. I want to be that when I grow up... in 100,000 years or so." She has five techniques that she crafted herself, that she teaches only to the worthy, and he has thus far been granted the profound honor of learning one of them. He eagerly pursues merits with ferocious (and murderous) vigor in the hopes of some day earning another. When I read through it the first time, that just kind of washed by and didn't really mean anything. Reading through again, it's got more depth to it.

edit: found it.
chapter 245 said:
It took them almost a week to clear out the network of tunnels, but they managed it, and their reward was a bag of valuable herbs used for refining the bloodline of Magma Carp, which they threw in their pile of loot to sell.
That's 15 months ago.
 
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