While nice, unfortunately it's time travel and therefore forbidden. :(
(especially because that cannon tech sounds like space manipulation to me.)
Two things.

One, is that the temporal shenanigans ONLY pull COPIES from the past. The actual original individuals, if still around, are still where they are (you get a Max vs Max duel!), and it does NOT alter the timeline. Misa & Ichiro, and Minmei are still lost on the Megaroad-01, D.D. & Nora are dead 50+ years past, Guld is dead nearly 20 years, etc. The copies learn of their original's futures (exception being those who left on the Megaroad, as its classified to a level Max(original) refuses flat out to tell Ichiro & Misa, and is visually torn up about it) but otherwise are their own individuals.

Two, just ignore/annihilate the Protodevlin then, just like it was in the game. The copies are still there, and, again, nothing changes the timeline. So just bring them and their equipment with Lindy. The canonical game ending has the Protodevlin destroyed/mastermind killed, but all the copies who didn't turn traitor, still exist and will do so naturally. Same with any equipment copied into the present.

That neatly avoids 'using' the time travel equipment itself. Lindy just uses what was left behind that doesn't have/use time travel equipment.
 
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Did Lindy just flash teleport (or as well as one can with the collection of point to point lightspeed+ transport techs) the entirity of Frontier and her fleet at once?
 
Chapter 238
Responses to some stuff below the chapter.

Chapter 238​


Two hours later, and the starmap-based attempts at finding their location had failed. There actually weren't very many stars in the sky, which meant that the navigation program was stopping halfway through the calculation or crashing.

Reford was busy supervising the prep for recon missions. Eight elements, each with one RVF-171, with the type-AN dishes, and two VF-171s for escort, each equipped with their own fold boosters. The normal valks would be running with super packs as well, given the risk. Five were going to fold out to two lightyears from the fleet to triangulate the locations of nearby stars, and the other three were for locating objects within this star system.

"Flight Romeo-Bravo ready for launch." The element lead announced.

"Flight Romeo-Bravo, clear for elevators." Traffic Control replied.

Romeo-Charlie's recon plane had been delayed to some sort of software glitch when swapping dishes, so that element was going to be launching in ten minutes instead of right now. Delays, delays.

-------

Two hours later, Reford was stuck overseeing the data retrieval from the three in-system recon elements. Technicians swarmed the recon planes, downloading the data for analysis on Battle Frontier's own computers.

With that done, Reford could finally hit the racks.

------------

Ranka Lee

------------

"Are you still listening, Lindy? It's me, Ranka." The girl said, waiting in the classroom alone.

"Everyone's scared. Why did you do this? What's the point?" Ranka asked. "Also, where are we?"

She lapsed into silence, then Sheryl came in to talk to her. After grabbing her bag, Sheryl left, and Ranka left with her. They kept talking during the walk.

"Actually, I just remembered something." Ranka said, startling on purpose. "Go on without me." And then she turned around and ran around the corner.

"That was more impressive than I thought." Ranka said to Lindy, sitting on a bench.

"I am full of surprises." Lindy calmly replied.

"Well I wasn't surprised." Ranka said, sitting down next to Lindy.

"To answer your question, because Frontier is frustrating and uncooperative. Thus, I choose to help in an odd way." Lindy said. A hologram appeared in the air in front of her. A series of points, with a variable number of dots attached to each one. "These are the stars that Frontier had the range to reach. The dots represent planets.

"You may have noted that most of the planets are red - uninhabitable." Lindy said. "As for the sole exception, there is a problem."

"What?" Ranka asked. The hologram shifted, showing a blue-and-green planet surrounded by a ring.

"This ring isn't made from rock or ice, it's actually a Vajra nest." Lindy said.

"Eeep." Ranka shrunk back a bit.

"Yes. Eeep." Lindy deadpanned. "I have a much better relationship with Galaxy, so I'll get them to handle the Vajra once they're back on their feet. The recon flight that happened across a habitable planet will be returning in two hours, just so you know."

"But why not just drop us directly into the system with the habitable planet?" Ranka asked.

"Because if the government knew I was responsible, they'd probably start tearing themselves apart trying to figure out my game was. I've already tossed you several million lightyears away from your original course; no need for me to stress your leaders out more." Lindy shrugged with a bored expression on her face. "I really should have shown up with freighters instead of just dropping in. Hindsight is 20-20, as they say."

"Who says that?" Ranka asked.

"At least my mother." Lindy said. "Also, I chose this location specifically because you will be able to observe a very interesting phenomena over the next few decades. I am sure Frontier's scientists will find it absolutely fascinating, and her engineers will find it absolutely frustrating. I have prepared a gift to be delivered then." Lindy said.

"I see?" Ranka said. "Also, millions of lightyears? That's intergalactic distances, right?"

"Yes." Lindy nodded. "But the entire purpose of the long-range colonization fleets is to make sure humanity doesn't have all its eggs in one basket. If anything, I'm helping with that. Well, I should be going. I have some other people to meet."

"Alright." Ranka said. "The gift will actually help?"

"If it's actually taken seriously." Lindy said, her voice shifting the tiniest amount. "See you later, perhaps." Lindy tossed a bundle of cloth at Ranka, who caught them. When she looked back at Lindy, she was gone.

----------------

Lindy

----------------

In an orbit around a stunning gas giant, orbiting around a binary star in another galaxy, Lindy had her shuttle emerge from hyperspace. The modified forms of protoculture and human ships floated in position, recharging.

"Protodevlin." Lindy transmitted. "May we speak?"

"Human." Came the response. "We are surprised another one came to talk to us."

"Not human, myself." Lindy said. "I take human form out of convenience."

"Still, come aboard." The voice commanded.

Lindy parked the Osprey in a hanger bay, floating above the floor. In front of her was a seeming human, a very feminine man.

"I am Geppelnich." The protodevlin introduced himself.

"And I am Lindy." The Exile introduced herself in turn.

"It has been a while since we had company." Geppelnich said. "Please come in and sit."

Lindy exchanged some small talk - mainly news of the Milky Way.

"But what brought you here?" Geppelnich said eventually.

"I was curious about the history of the protodevlin. What happened before the Protoculture broke into superdimensional space." Lindy said.

"We... do not remember much." Geppelnich said. "Sivil believes that the protodevlin were actually a single being, split apart by the violence of the superdimensional breach. I do not. myself, agree with that."

"My own research is inconclusive." Lindy said, referring to her scans of the protodevlin. While their souls were extremely similar, Exile knowledge was far too incomplete on spiritual matters for her to draw any conclusions.

"What I do know is that we were in hiding." Geppelnich said. "The Egg - I think that was a nickname - was designed for long-term survival. Continuous operation. I was familiar with enough of the design to know some parts were highly optimized to keep emissions low."

"This?" Lindy displayed a hologram from her hand. It showed a roughly spherical object, torn in half. Rings smaller than it floated around it. Though considering the "egg" was about six AU across, those rings still outmassed stars.

Geppelnich blinked at Lindy's hologram, then nodded. "The system that was in had no life it in. How did you find it?"

"Surveys." Lindy deflected. "Several of the biotech components matched protodevlin flesh samples. You're an engineered race too, aren't you?"

"Wha?" Geppelnich frowned, mouth open, for a moment. "None of us had heard of that."

"Well, welcome to the club." Lindy said. "All us Exiles are engineered as well. And so are some of our allies." Including all of the four great races in Avalon. "Besides, the Protoculture's children are all engineered, so you fit better now."

"Not as relevant, considering our location." Geppelnich sighed.

"True." Lindy nodded. "Perhaps one day inhabiting the Milky Way would be possible for you peacefully."

"I could hope." Geppelnich sighed.

The conversation went on a bit longer before it was interrupted.

The green-skinned form of Sivil appeared in one of the hatches to the room.

"Hello!" She cried, attempting to tackle Lindy. Lindy simply flipped over the back of her seat, her braid flopping back into the exact same position as she stood behind the chair, which she held against Sivil ramming into it.

"Hello." Lindy replied flatly. "How are you doing?"

"I didn't know we had a visitor." Sivil said.

"For precisely this reason." Geppelnich mouthed to Lindy.

"Hmm." Lindy said. "I suppose I must be going now."

"But you just got here." Sivil said.

"Perhaps." Lindy said, vanishing in the light of a transporter.


--------------------------------
A lot of macross is about mind control in some manor. It's due to the way protoculture communicates though the mind, and how songs and dances allows the collective consciousness fall in line with the rhythm.
That is certainly one possible way to view the situation. It is certainly not the way I would look at it.
That neatly avoids 'using' the time travel equipment itself. Lindy just uses what was left behind that doesn't have/use time travel equipment.
It's not that any Exile can't have time travel technology, it's that time travel can't exist at all in the setting.
Besides, it's a moot point, since Lindy doesn't have any metaknowledge and doesn't know to stick around.
Did Lindy just flash teleport (or as well as one can with the collection of point to point lightspeed+ transport techs) the entirity of Frontier and her fleet at once?
Translocation is a busted tech. Doing a big field like that is harder than doing it individually by hulls like normal, but it does have some advantages.
 
thanks for the chapterand for writing extragalactic is the word you are looking for our galaxy is only 100k lightyear's across
 
It's not that any Exile can't have time travel technology, it's that time travel can't exist at all in the setting.
Besides, it's a moot point, since Lindy doesn't have any metaknowledge and doesn't know to stick around.
Same thing.

IIRC, they're extra-dimensional completely, and its that 'setting' that doesn't permit time travel.

Same token, Macross 'technically' doesn't allow for it either. Able to view the past as if a TV Channel? Oh sure, easy for the Protoculture. Making copies down to the atomic level from things or being that previously existed/lived, including the quantum states of their mental engrams? Yup, that to.

To the point it replicated time travel.

In the same way jumping 1 light-year away from Earth, and looking back, would show you all the events happening Feb 10th, 2023 at 5:14pm. But as if happening right then. Protoculture could sensors to 'view' events thousands of years in the past, and make copies, so long as they have resources on hand enough to make said copies ala, ST's replicators.

Or in short, a Clarketech 'bypass' that mimics time travel for those copied, as they suddenly appear, as if traveled through time, into the future.

But there is no way 'back'.

Even canonical Macross hyperspace 'stretches' time, where hours inside it can be days outside it, or vice versa, but never actually going backwards.

Sorry I wasn't more clear in my earlier posts.
 
Or in short, a Clarketech 'bypass' that mimics time travel for those copied, as they suddenly appear, as if traveled through time, into the future.
Ah yeah, that would definitely be something Rachel would be interested in. But if the Protodevilin was doing it, it's probably a psychic ability, and as noted there's no documentation on "how to Protodevilin." It's definitely a psychic ability if it can copy psychic abilities alongside everything else.
Still. It's in the future. It's going on the list for 'later.'
 
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Ah yeah, that would definitely be something Rachel would be interested in. But if the Protodevilin was doing it, it's probably a psychic ability, and as noted there's no documentation on "how to Protodevilin." It's definitely a psychic ability if it can copy psychic abilities alongside everything else.
Still. It's in the future. It's going on the list for 'later.'
The Protodevlin acts as a mini-Matroshka Brain bio-sensor, but, tmk, nothing psychic involved with how the actual re-construction/creation of the copies happens. All the Spirita 'stuff' the Protodevlin uses, is to keep itself submerged in hyperspace for protection, the near invulnerability all Protodevlin have, and firepower. Basically, its a giant, mostly immobile plant-slash-brain-slash-squid...thing...with a chair for a controller in its forehead. An immobile nigh-omniscence (but NOT omnipotent) idiot savant, so to speak.

Energy in hyperspace can be 'tapped' (as far back as the VF-1 and original Destroids) to create simple matter. Its how VFs have what appear to be no fuel tanks, yet nigh-infinite range - they're converting energy tapped from hyperspace into hydrogen directly within the reactor cores as fuel. So long as the reaction cores are on, they have infinite fuel. The only issue is that they produce crazy amounts of heat, and work better in vacuum because then its easier to dump the thermal energy produced BACK into hyperspace. Its harder in atmosphere because it the dumping back is supposed to be nothing but energy - as in, energy out, energy in - but the reverse flow also pulls in atmospheric gases which 'clogs' the flow, causing heat to inevitably build up. And you can't complelely seal it unless you also want to kill the fuel source. This also explains why even Destroids have 'vents' on them, even in places where they don't have jet or rocket motors. Also explains the various micro-scale 'rockets' on VFs, generally their backpack ones in Battroid mode or their RCS clusters, in that they run off excess from the main thermonuclear conversion reaction turbines, that is pumped into them like liquid fueled conventional rockets, stored, and vented/ignited as needed.

A LOT of the technical reasons behind Macross tech gets finally explained in Macross 30. The whole 'heat from the engines dissipates better in space' revealed in Macross VF-X & 'VFs perform better in space' canonized in Macross Plus, never got explained until then.

The Protoculture, and, for that matter, the Vajra, are VASTLY beyond even that point, and can 'pull' far more complex forms of matter, in coherent & complex shapes, directly from it. Its how the Bird-Human pulled its hammerspace wings stunt in MacZero. Or how the factory satellites can produce insane amounts of materials from little to no external input (just that the satellites are dumbed down & black boxed and can only produce specific things and you have to design something new to 'feed' into it, for it to be able to produce copies). Or how the Vajra can 'grow' bio-technical missiles and physical/ballistic rounds, to say nothing of their hives.

Protoculture at their height, using their best stuff and not the gimped monkey model products they gave to their servitor/slave/experimental species, have far less of those restrictions. The Protodevlin in this case, removes the restrictions entirely, and if it'd been fully woken up, would gave been able to pull entire fleets out from thin air. As it was, it managed to copy the SDF-01, the Anti-UN sub, Mayan Island, the Asuka II, New Eden's UN Spacy Base, and several dozen Zentraedi/Meltrandi warships (including a certain backstabbing blue haired individual).

The antagonist's goal was to re-create the entirety of both Bodolza's AND Laplazmia's fleets, the moments before the Grand Cannon vaped them. He also copies over the bulk of Macross Galaxy too, and planned to hit them all with the combined idol powers of every major Spirita user previously known (Sara Nome, Minmei, Myung Fong Long, Fire Bomber, Sheryl Nome*, and Ranka Lee*) plus cyber-jacking Galaxy, via centrally controlling it all under the effects of a copied and unshackled, Sharon Apple within a SDF scale mainframe. And her own cyber-hypnosis on top of it all as further control.

It falls apart utterly solely because the entire reason for Sharon Apple going rogue, was never revealed by Myung, Isamu, or Yang Neumann: the fact she went Yandere for Isamu. It was only ever recorded that the mil-grade components made her go rampant.

Nope.

Well, with Isamu (he shows up as his older self/not copied - the New Eden base was copied over at the wrong moment, while Isamu was out flying the YF-19 elsewhere, if however at the moment Sharon's CPU got its illegal upgrade at the base, so they only got Guld and her, and missed out on Isamu) already aware of WHY Sharon went nuts, he flips the tables by actively HELPING her deal with her emotions and stabilizes/stops her rampancy. Cue her helping the 'good guys'. How/Why Myung is there is one side-story I didn't unlock, other than, well, she's there.

What makes it worse for the BBEG - who is actually a diehard believer in human supremacy, and being the biggest idol fanboy ever, go figure - is that the new girl whom appears on the planet, is a Spirita user as strong as Minmei & Basara combined. Its heavily hinted in Delta's background that she is a 'prototype' version of Murakumo. And with her joining with all the other idols, it wrecks the Protodevlin's abilities, runining precise control of the sensor(s) needed to run the ststem, and effectively gives it an aneurysm bad enough to nullify its invulnerability. Then good old Macross Missile Massacre and loads of beam spam finish the job.

However since the overall system itself takes up the bulk of the entire planet? Hence the other reasons its classified to hell, everyone that isn't a copy is sworn to secrecy, travel to/from it is forbidden, and both the NUNS and the actual UEG (who went hardcore isolationist) both are working to stripmine the planet bare while NOT researching it, as the tech scares the collective shit out of them. And they have to do it the slow way as D-Eaters and reaction warheads, WON'T FUNCTION if applied to the Protoculture ruins/materials found on the planet. And yes, they tried.

The main reason SMS makes out like kings post-Frontier/pre-Delta is because they're the ones sitting on the planet as overwatch
The secondary game heroine/love interest, and designer of both the YF-30 and later the VF-31, is a SMS captain. In effect, they are basically being given gigantic, never ending bribes by both the NUNS & UEG as hush money. In part because all surviving Zentraedi copies defected TO the SMS, and since WMDs that nornally would be used against entire fleets of them won't work on the planet...

SMS has a hidden pocket 'war fleet' larger than every colonization fleet. Combined.

Yeah, things get complicated and are interconnected in a very big messy, if mostly coherent, web. Its not a straight, A>B>C plotline. Oh hell no.

*Macross Frontier's fleet are NOT copies, but were drawn in by a fake SOS about a rogue Vajra hive, pleading for the two idols, and leaking 'hints' of Galaxy's fleet mixed in.
 
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Energy in hyperspace can be 'tapped' (as far back as the VF-1 and original Destroids) to create simple matter. Its how VFs have what appear to be no fuel tanks, yet nigh-infinite range - they're converting energy tapped from hyperspace into hydrogen directly within the reactor cores as fuel. So long as the reaction cores are on, they have infinite fuel.
Wait, what? We've seen in SDF that they needed boosters to be able to get into space and have enough delta-V to fight, pretty much every manual mentions max burn time and intended burn time, and we have literally seen a VF run out of fuel in space. I've literally never heard this before.

Regarding the factory satellites using the same phenomena but with greater sophistication, do you have the production time numbers? I was looking for them on the SB thread, but I couldn't find them. I was going to compare them to see if it looked like factory ships and factory satellites had a very different rate of production for their sizes. The only thing I was able to find was information about a specific factory satellite that was mentioned as clarkemagicking up materiel.

EDIT: Nevermind, found some numbers elsewhere. The given numbers were 35,000 VFs a year for a factory ship and 3,650,000 VFs a year for a factory satellite. Given that there are different sizes of factory satellites, with the smallest being the same size as the factory ship we have information on, this either means "yes definitely, the 5km factory satellite outproducing a factory ship of the same size means that they are definitely using different technology," or "no definitely, with a 50km factory satellite outputting less materiel per unit time per unit volume means that the factory satellite cannot be using a fundamentally more capable paradigm."
Also, forgot to mention, but the factory ships can't use this technology because then Frontier would have their factory ship pump out some kind of oxygen source instead of having to abandon Islands.
The Protodevlin acts as a mini-Matroshka Brain bio-sensor, but, tmk, nothing psychic involved with how the actual re-construction/creation of the copies happens.
Okay. So I'm invoking my "this is an AU fanfiction" author powers and saying that the Ouroborus protodevlin does have the secret psychic powers needed to actually perform historical copy-paste. Because, A, recreating psychic powers with purely mundane stuff is impossible and seems way too valuable for mass-producible psitech like the Ancient Healing Device. B, Lindy would have the sensor tech and I'm officially delaying the acquisition of that technology until "later." And that aside it's way more impressive than the Ancient Healing Device, which needed studies of the Nox to be made, so for the Protoculture to make it without a template seems a bit... eh. (Also, metaplot™ moment here with the powers that the Protodevlin have.)
 
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Fair enough about the Protodevlin.


The VF-1 through to the VF-11 had thermonuclear reaction turbines that ran at a deficit in atmosphere. They just couldn't produce enough fuel, and burn it to get thrust, fast enough, to achieve orbit. Basically a Ford Model-T engine, compared to the supercar engine equivalents seen by the Mac+ era.

That was partially due to not understanding the hyperspace physics, partially from working off half-scrapped (or worse) components found on the crashed SDF-01, or working with the vastly gimped but fully complete Zentraedi/Meltrandi equipment. While the REALLY high-end alien equipment was basically 'hand a college graphic calculator to a caveman' levels of how 'easy' it was to comprehend. As an example, Earth had access to the Q-Rau suit's inertial compensating equipment ever since the RoD in 2000. They didn't manage to 1:1 reverse-engineer it until the YF-21 in 2038 (actual Project Supernova, Macross Plus, was in 2040), over forty years later. It wouldn't be surpassed until the YF-24 Evolution in 2049.

Same development curve for the reaction engines. They just didn't have enough output to break orbit on their own, so the HUGE conentional rocket boosters were added on. Either that gigantic quad-thruster for surface-to-orbit, or the Super & Strike Boosters for once in space.

(okay, off cellphone, so this'll be easier/faster to type)
Humanity has yet to come even close to the heights that the Protoculture(s) themselves were at. The best they can do is 'chinese knockoff' as seen with Murakumo, in comparison to her original, the Star Singer. And that was with ACTUAL 'hands on' studying of her original DNA to clone her. She was still nowhere near as powerful. Humanity isn't even close to re-creating the Protodevlin.

For more 'material science' designs/equipment, again, they're not close. Case in point, the Bird-Human. Which casually sextupled its mass in two seconds, and rocketed up past 20x it's original (combined head & body) mass by the time five seconds had passed, after activating.

So its more a case of humanity going:
Pre-Crash physics (the day the ASS-01, what eventually will be rebuilt into the Macross, crashes on Earth)
>
Immediate post-Crash re-understanding of physics/hyperspace is still theoretical (events prior to Macross Zero, initial reports on the crashed hull)
>>
Basic theory of hyperspace incorporated into pre-Crash physical designs (events of Macross Zero, construction of Luna & Mars Bases)
>>>
Initial realization of Spiritia/Bio-organically created Fold Harmonics (RESEARCH ABANDONED FOR 50 YEARS), Solid understanding of basic hyperspace into true post-Crash designs (development of ARMDs, VF-1, reconstruction plans for SDF-01 finalized)
>>>>
Experimental 'advanced' - read: throw shit at wall - hyperspace physics (Grand Cannons)
>>>>>
Rain of Death, Study of Zentraedi/Meltrandi 'baseline' designs both mechanical and biological (events of SDF Macross/DYRL, VF-4 developed)
>>>>>>
Capture of 1st Factory Satellite, 'true' Advanced R&D into hyperspace physics (Megaroad-01, minor miniaturization of various Zentraedi designs, VF-4 put into production)
>>>>>>>
More FacSats captured, the actual 'battle' protrayed in DYRL takes place*, Experimental production of 1st 'leap forward' designs truly not based upon Zentraedi 'tier' equipment. Older equipment's final bugs worked out, stabilized, and developed into 'cheap' mass production designs.(VF-11 & VF-5000 chosen as the two 'cheap' designs, one for all-environment, one for atmospheric, along with development/production of Guantanamo, Northampton, and Uraga class capital ships. Advanced prototypes for VF-9 and VF-14 developed and put into limited, if expensive, production. Experimental, if EXTREMELY expensive, production of the VF-17).​

Then it basically starts ramping up drastically with the New Macross class & accompanying colony fleet designs, run-ins with 'rogue' Zentraedi fleets that got their hands on designs that use post-VF-11 design (the Power Suits seen in the opening asteroid battle of Macross Plus), along with breakthroughs in studying the FacSats & the most advanced Meltrandi design (the Q-Rau), leads to decision to completely re-haul the Spacy. Which leads to Project Supernova, the YF-19, YF-21, and ultra-compact Fold Boosters. From there, comes stuff that is more modern enough in the overall series that I don't need to really get into details which I already posted about. The only real major 'flip the tables' events post-Macross Plus are the back-to-back attacks events in VF-X & VF-X2 which pushed the UEG into being isolationist and paranoid in the extreme**, the Protodevlin - which were 'beaten' by sheer. fucking. luck. of having someone like Basara in the fleet - and the Vajra. Basara and the study of spiritia can be blamed for damn near everything in Delta (especially the two movies' timeline), along with the sheer paranoia - which, grudgingly, is understandable by this point - of Earth's population. Who are by now utterly TERRIFIED of 'the alien' and rapidly are becoming a closed-off militaristc & xenophobic society.

Something tells me if Lindy showed up in near Earth with even a handful of ships, she'd be fired upon without warning with everything Earth has. And they wouldn't stop to listen if she said 'Please', even if it involves the words 'I surrender'. They'd still keep shooting until nothing was left intact. The repeated attacks and multiple near total extinction/genocides of the planet have damaged them that badly.

*DYRL is canonically a movie within the actual Macross timeline, where what took place during the original series are the true events. The battle seen at the end of DYRL was the SECOND invasion of Earth, taken by war reporters from various angles, by a much smaller Zentraedi/Meltrandi 'rapid reaction' taskforce with Earth using the 'Minmei Attack' to split the Meltrandi from the Zentraedi and getting them to fight each other before getting Vrlitwhai Kridanik's (Britai) Earth allied fleet involved to finish them off. The SDF-01 was the only one still equipped with large scale PPBs at the time, thus why it was used, and it took near crippling damage in the battle. No, the battle in the sunken 'city' never actually took place, that was CGI. Hence why, in Macross Plus, the twin bow 'booms' are very VERY visibly different looking. They had to be completely rebuilt.

**The two incidents here are what made the UEG and the original UN SPace, along with Isamu's stunt + Max & Exedol's 'refusal of orders' against that one Meltrandi fleet, to wall off Earth from the rest of the galaxy. Along with making the 'true' capabilities of the VF-19 available solely to those living within the Sol system. If you're part of a colonization fleet, you are NEVER allowed to go back to Earth. Ever. They WILL shoot on sight, no matter the distress call. Either you get an escort sent out to you and you ride back aboard it, or you just aren't getting in. Earth's version of the VF-19 by the era of Frontier, is basically equivalent to the VF-25 w/ Tornado Pack or YF-29, but as the STOCK design. WITHOUT a Super/Fast Pack added.
As an example:
Isamu's YF-19 w/ boosters seen at the end of Frontier's movie is utterly, utterly, obsolete compared to what Earth has available, and it was upgraded to the best standards 'allowed' to the various colony fleets. It still roflstomped the Vajra in the few minutes of combat it showed up, better than Alto's own YF-29 (its hinted Earth's version carries a gatling version of the YF-27's anti-ship beam cannon, which for the YF-27 requires a charge-up period before it can fire at full power. Theirs can spam that same firepower at the rate NORMAL gunpoads fire). These and a few other hints are dropped in Macross: The Ride, when an actual UN Spacy group shows up and their stock/unmodified, if new VF-19s, effortlessly blow past the absolute bleeding edge custom tweaked designs used by 'superplane' racers, with nearly no effort.
 
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The VF-1 through to the VF-11 had thermonuclear reaction turbines that ran at a deficit in atmosphere. They just couldn't produce enough fuel, and burn it to get thrust, fast enough, to achieve orbit. Basically a Ford Model-T engine, compared to the supercar engine equivalents seen by the Mac+ era.
But... if the performance increases as the atmospheric pressure drops, and the engines can't flame out, once you start going higher and higher your performance improves, you should get a virtuous cycle that ends when your engines are functioning at full power and you now have unlimited delta-V. The VF-1 can reach altitudes of 30,000 meters, where the air pressure is about 3% of sea level. And you're saying that the interference to the cooling systems at this point is still enough that it can't break even.
And this still doesn't explain how Hayate could run out of fuel in space in a later VF with better engines if this is how it works. (Yes, he might be an idiot. I do not think he is enough of an idiot to break reality by having engines that produce their own fuel run out.) For that matter, have we seen a VF run out of fuel in atmosphere?
(I'll take your word for it that the cooling systems do function better in an atmosphere.)
 
I don't know the scene at all, but a damaged fuel line somewhere seems a reasonable hypothesis.
In both engines at the same time? And the proposed technology in question wouldn't have fuel lines, since it's supposed to be generating fuel right there in the turbine chamber. Also, Hayate isn't even under fire at that moment, since he's rushing to help Mirage at that point.
 
But... if the performance increases as the atmospheric pressure drops, and the engines can't flame out, once you start going higher and higher your performance improves, you should get a virtuous cycle that ends when your engines are functioning at full power and you now have unlimited delta-V. The VF-1 can reach altitudes of 30,000 meters, where the air pressure is about 3% of sea level. And you're saying that the interference to the cooling systems at this point is still enough that it can't break even.
And this still doesn't explain how Hayate could run out of fuel in space in a later VF with better engines if this is how it works. (Yes, he might be an idiot. I do not think he is enough of an idiot to break reality by having engines that produce their own fuel run out.) For that matter, have we seen a VF run out of fuel in atmosphere?
(I'll take your word for it that the cooling systems do function better in an atmosphere.)
Its a case, in all VFs earlier than the VF-14 (and it barely makes it over the hurdle) of a 'Hoover Dam of power, wall faucet outlet' in that they couldn't OUTPUT enough fuel into the engines to get enough thrust to reach orbit.

If already in orbit, oh yes, performance goes through the roof, but its still limited by what energy the engines can tap/pull from hyperspace to be changed into hydrogen to run the turbines. You could have an infinite well of power available to be turned to energy. Didn't help much if you could only tap it enough to barely warm up a hot dog grill. That was the early problem for all the small/fightercraft sized engines.

Anything from an era equal or earlier than the VF-11 needed at least some kind of solid rocket booster to break orbit. VF-1 & VF-4 needed huge quad-boosters. VF-9 & VF-11 needed only twin boosters. The FAST packs for those were more for instanteous bursts of speed, maneuvering, and weapon storage

A VF-14 can, if doing nothing else at all, just a straight line climb, can produce enough thrust to break out of the grwvity well of a 1g planet, and into LEO. Then it has nigh unlimited range and can do combat maneuvers in vacuum nearly as good as the later YF-19/VF-19s. But that initial climb? Its a sitting duck to anything already in orbit. Great for offense, but worthless as a rapid-reaction defensive design against Fold capable space based opponents. OTOH, it actually carried enough firepower internally to be equal to earlier designs that were equipped with FAST packs (its better armed than both a VF-1 Super AND Strike).

The YF-19 produced so much thrust (there's a brief scene in either the OVA or Movie version which shows a line graph comparison between it and the YF-21), and it's engines/reactors were such a revolutionary leap ahead over all other previous designs that it never needed any boosters at all, and could make orbit while maneuvering the entire time, not just a straight line climb. Yang Neumann really was/is a child prodigy within the series (iirc he was 14 when he designed the YF-19, and was central to the YF-24 project too). Its FAST packs were just added armor and munitions storage, but did nothing for adding thrust.
 
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VF-14 can, if doing nothing else at all, just a straight line climb, can produce enough thrust to break out of the grwvity well of a 1g planet, and into LEO. Then it has nigh unlimited range and can do combat maneuvers in vacuum nearly as good as the later YF-19/VF-19s. But that initial climb? Its a sitting duck to anything already in orbit. Great for offense, but worthless as a rapid-reaction defensive design against Fold capable space based opponents.
Getting into space just requires a TWR greater than 1 if you have unlimited delta-V. Which the VF-1 can do with its standard takeoff weight without overboosting.

Anyway, this still doesn't address the fact that your information that "VF engines pull fuel from fold space" contradicts what we've seen in primary canon (The only time we've seen a VF run out of fuel was in space) as well as a lot of other supplementary information (basically every time a source says that Super Packs provide extra fuel)
 
I'll get to work on it.

I'd say something about "shame on you for making a tropes page for your own Fic", but seeing how I've done that for…all my stories that currently have tropes pages, I do not have any fucking room to judge.

Edit:
Though I am kinda annoyed no one tries to update the pages for my stories.
 
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Chapter 239

Chapter 239​


Two hours later, she finished reexamining the Egg's salvage data. The conversation with the Protodevilin wasn't enough of a catalyst for a eureka moment. The technology was frustratingly confusing, with extensive signs of higher-order exotic particles decaying. And she didn't even recognize the decayed products either.

Which meant that Lindy was left with nothing much to do until Galaxy was ready to go talk to the Vajra. Well, she could try to make new breakthroughs in the two-hundreds tiers of exotic particle physics, but that was going to be mostly brute force and a lot of luck.

Well, setting it up would chew up some time, at least.

Two hours later, and a horde of modified Cellars, loaded with particle synthesizers and just enough computational capacity to run the experiment, vanished from the network into accelerated time. Maybe she'd get one of the particles used in the Egg's construction. Two would be too much to hope for.

Another project that she could take care of would be improved expert systems for variable fighter combat.

She would need a Valkyrie design for that. Fortunately, the humans had dozens of designs for that which she shamelessly borrowed from.

She set up a few arenas for physical testing, then set up a framework for moves that the bots could perform, and then started running matches.

The results, after a few dozen cycles of seeing what the ES was doing and making sure the proposed code changes weren't going beyond their bounds, was some interesting additions to the Reaper program designed around the transformation mechanism.

She tried several VFs against a few Scimitars in a brawl a few times during the process. The VFs did tend to score a bit better than the mobile-suit based mecha, but that came at a cost. All that extra joint volume cut into functional components like shield emitters, sensors, drive components, and weaponry.

She tried a larger arena and set up another set of brawls.

This time, with the space to use their acceleration, the Scimitars were able to dictate engagements and take the high score in thirty out of thirty-two matches. Despite the impressive effort, it didn't seem to be worth it. A translocator could help by allowing a VF to instantly close to any target, but there wasn't enough space in a VF's frame for it.

Actually, wait. One of the proposals for project Evolution had a mission pod mounted between the legs of the fighter. The only finalized pods were missile boxes, along with a halfway-functioning beam cannon module, but she could fit a translocator inside the frame.

Upscaling it to stand 20 meters in batroid mode gave her even more room, and if she accepted bad accuracy past ten lighthours (needing a 1km clear zone at the destination for each target) and horrendous accuracy past a lightyear (no orientation or rotation control, and with a position error of about half the distance traveled), she could get the cycle time down to 2.2 seconds.

The Reaper program didn't have any ability to deal with translocation, so she was going to have to rework the entire thing to add that capability. She had time to spend.

Once the Cellars finished their experimental run, Lindy had that data to look at. It wasn't that useful, unfortunately. An exponential growth function, when compared to the constant boost of time acceleration, would win once the power started getting high enough. And since particle synthesis interactions gained exponentially more interactions the more layers away from the fundamentals, the time-accelerated setups hadn't managed to crack any of the precursor particles.

Wait. Lindy returned to the data, and looked at the synthesis and decay paths again. There were partial matches. She compared the missing particles, and checked if any of them had notable interactions. There were plenty, but those should have produced their own distinct decay products. When she checked for those, there was only one match.

So all this effort might have gotten her one of the particles used in the construction of the Egg. On the other hand, that particle could have been a decay product from the actual materials of the Egg.

-------------

Admiral Sala Dervish

-------------

"Do you think the fire was deliberate?" Dervish asked, as the fire chief, Marcus Coriolis, collapsed into a chair in the meeting room hard enough that it nearly tipped over.

"I don't know." Coriolis said. "I've never had to run an arson investigation before. This is... " He rubbed his soot-stained face. "But considering I've never had to run an arson investigation I think the answer is yes."

"That's going to slow down reconstruction efforts a lot." Dervish said. "How long do you think it would take?"

"I remember that most of the evidence from an arson will be gone in six months, so that long." Coriolis said, after leaning back and staring at the ceiling for a moment.

"Are you serious?" President Kulmuni said. "We already had a homelessness crisis, and now you want to keep several apartment blocks out of commission?"

"And if we can't catch whoever did this, then they'll likely do this again." Dervish said.

"Not just that." Kulmuni added. "We're going to get a scapegoating problem if we can't the real culprit soon enough."

"Yeah, some of my men probably aren't adverse to a lynch mob themselves. But if we move too quickly and grab the wrong person, it'll just make the scapegoating problem even worse the next time they burn something down." Coriolis groaned.

"We could ask Lindy if she knows any arson investigators." Kulmuni brought up.

"I hate having to rely on her, but it's worth a shot." Dervish muttered.

"I'll make the call." Samuel Walters, the chief of staff, said.

---------------

Samuel Walters

---------------

Walters waited patiently as the communications device buzzed.

"Hello, Samuel." Lindy's voice came from the device itself, seemingly. As it was just a featureless white puck, he wasn't sure how it worked.

"Hello, Commander Ezros." Walters said. "Would you happen to know any arson investigators? We seem to have a bit of a problem that could be solved by them."

"No." Lindy stated flatly. "I do, however, have the list of the perpetrators and their co-conspirators based on the logs from the sensor platforms monitoring the system. I believe they will be suitable for use in court, although they will need to be redacted to prevent the entire population having their privacy violated."

"Are you saying that you have been tracking our entire population everywhere?" Walters said, glancing around the room.

"Yes." Lindy said. "I only informed you because it was relevant to solving your problems quickly and efficiently. Are you going to use it or not?"

"Could you... maybe not?" Walters asked.

"No." Lindy's voice had been flat and level this entire time.

"Why not?" Walters asked.

"Because maintaining such reconnaissance systems is vital to prevent repeat disasters, and even avert many of them. Because such things are needed in my line of work." Lindy said. "Privacy is politeness, not a right. Do you want the intel or not?"

Walters considered his options. He couldn't stop the Exiles from monitoring them, could he? No, the leverage was firmly against Galaxy. He didn't have a clue how to work at her ethics. He didn't have any clue if she did have ethics.

"I accept." He said, slamming his palm on the desk, his teeth gritted.

-------------------------

Lindy

-------------------------

"I have a request." Lindy stated, handing over the drive with the evidence for the arson case.

"Yes?" Admiral Dervish said, raising an eyebrow.

"This requires some context." Lindy said.

Dervish stifled a groan.

"As you are aware, a3x.exe was attempted to use the vajra as a threat against humanity. The vajra remains riled up from the provocation..." Lindy started to explain.

Dervish's face got more tense as Lindy kept explaining.

"... so I need your cooperation with a program to sing to the vajra." Lindy finished.

Dervish groaned, leaned back in her chair far enough to balance it on the back wheels, then pushed back, causing the seat to slam against the ground.

"And this is my job because?" Dervish muttered.

"Because the only ships I trust to protect the children if something goes wrong are the military ones." Lindy replied.

"And why can't you handle it yourself?" Dervish asked, pulling herself out the fallen office chair.

"Because I am physically unable to do it, and because I would also give the wrong impression to the Vajra." Lindy replied simply.

"That... doesn't answer the question." Dervish said, settling into her chair again. "How are you physically unable to? And what do you mean the 'wrong impression?'"

"Simple. As far as my research has determined, the Vajra communicates via using the interface between the Fold Cell and Normal-space Cell as a conduit for psychic reverberations. I am unable to efficiently interact with that interface because of the nature of my soul. Even if I could create a signal, it would be completely different to that of a human singer." Lindy said.

Dervish stared at Lindy for several more seconds. "Why do I have the feeling that every question is going to make me hate this entire mess more, but also make me feel more trapped?"

"Pattern recognition." Lindy said.

"You'll have your singers. Now get out." Dervish said, pointing and slamming her other hand on the desk.

-----------------

Fortunately, it only took two weeks for the "concert" to come together. As suspected, the Vajra eventually figured out it was in communication with multiple different people, and left to ponder its life choices. Fortunately a battle did not break out in the middle of the idol competition.

That left the Galaxy fleet to settle on the Vajra's previous home, assuring their long-term viability.

Lindy considered her action list. Potential Vajra conflict, avoided. Old Protoculture mind-control devices, destroyed. Roving Zentradi and Supervision fleets, sabotaged and relatively defanged. The NUN and their allies could probably handle that, but they weren't the only ones the rogue fleets could kill. In addition, humanity had shown a willingness to try and convert them to a peaceful lifestyle, which Lindy would respect.

Which meant that she didn't have anything else to do in this world. Besides, she wanted to know what <Mother> thought about her operations.


-A/N:--------------------------------------------
Likebombers noticed are @ImpossiBurd, @VoidofEyes, and @Domar7431.
 
So, munchkinning on behalf of the exiles.

They'd really like to know more about higher order exotic particles, as they act as effective tech unlocks for random things. They're literally able to be unlocked by grinding particle synthesizers and research cores. However there are difficulties with that:

1. the amount of time it takes grows exponentially with order, as there are more building blocks available in lower orders, and they're not required to only be built from from particles 1 order below.
2. a research Library has multiple limits: each research core needs to be able to communicate with each other collaborating core under a certain time threshold (it's not explictly said, but we could do the math if it was really necessary), or they just add more synchronization issues than they help. This adds an effective space constraint, capping the number of collaborating cores to an amount controlled by the communication speed.
3. implicitly, the Libraries have hit the limits of current tech: the fastest communications, optimized research cores for effectiveness per volume, optimized packing strategies in mutual communication range, best time dilation.

As a result, there's no way to get research faster, forcing everyone to wait longer and longer times for each new order's particles, as they make linear progress towards exponential benchmarks.

Except we know this is completely wrong. Rachel spent billions of years "sleeping" on Remnant, and that took less than an attosecond.

Chapter 62 establishes each old-style gate has an effective 200000:1 time ratio between the origin and the destination, with the origin going slower. Iirc, this happens because the origin and destination have a discontinuity large than ~10 AU, where space doesn't exist, resulting in weird stuff with time happening, in a causality preserving way.

Because we know Rachel spent a whole lot of time on Remnant, we know this can stack (presumably multiplicatively). Presumably, establishing better portals with half-life tech synchronizes the time differences (Penny wouldn't be happy if ruby & co are trillions of years old at this point)

what Rachel can do is: run a macro to have a probe go to a new universe using and old-style portal for the time dilation, squat in dark space, repeat, oh, a million times, and then establish a Library, set it grind out new particles until it'd take a day back in stargate land, (or a bunch of other, safety related cut-offs, including contact with life, end of universe, etc.) Then have it rejoin back up the chain the same way that Rachel did, forwarding all the research results along with it. Could also have secondary Libraries grinding for any tech improvements using the new particles as well of course.

of course, this trivializes a lot of tech, so there probably needs to be a reason for it not to work, from a Doylist perspective...
 
Wait. Lindy returned to the data, and looked at the synthesis and decay paths again. There were partial matches. She compared the missing particles, and checked if any of them had notable interactions. There were plenty, but those should have produced their own distinct decay products. When she checked for those, there was only one match.
Ah, I love the smell of fruiting research.
 
of course, this trivializes a lot of tech, so there probably needs to be a reason for it not to work, from a Doylist perspective...
Because another universe is both risky and full of opportunity. On the one hand, there could be something risky that would be more risky by getting their hands on Extech. On the other, there could be a miracle technology that is available right as the portal opens, that is worth far more than whatever they could have gotten from the particle accelerator trick.
Also, then they have to develop the technology from first principles, and learn the easy mistakes themselves. Stealing the technology lets them learn from other people's mistakes.
Presumably, establishing better portals with half-life tech synchronizes the time differences (Penny wouldn't be happy if ruby & co are trillions of years old at this point)
The most recent set of portals still has the initial time difference, but constructing another frame at the end and booting it up properly allows for the portal to be "balanced" and be traversed in both directions.
 
Chapter 240 - Chrono start

Chapter 240​

----------------

Chrono

---------------

It was the twenty-sixth cluster that had advanced life. One galaxy had hundreds of species across thousands of worlds.

"Well I have no idea what's going on." Chrono said. "Let's look for shiny things!"

There were a lot of shiny things.

"But none of these are neat." Chrono exaggerated, looking at the list. There were some neat things, like a perfected system of flash-forging used in infantry weapons, and a self-sustaining shield capable of enclosing an entire planet. And there was the method she picked up for making paths in hyperspace, like a more limited, mostly-permanent version of what the Installations did.

Which every single species had to use for travel because their hyperdrives sucked. Suuuuuucked. Even with the paths, they couldn't make stable transitions inside of a light-day from the system's primary, best-case. With black holes, it was more like a light-month. And it wasn't even like they could make the paths themselves. They actually had to use only the stable paths made hundreds of thousands of years ago.

The precursor species here only lasted for a couple thousand years, as well, before becoming stagnant and arrogant. In fact, from the records, they were lasting for shorter and shorter durations each time. At this rate, when the hyperspace paths degraded beyond usability, no one would be able to replace them, and then all those civilizations would die. All their communications and transport would go splat. Actually, hopefully, the failure of individual paths would warn the civilizations.

Though given their behavior, she wouldn't bet a planet on it. She wouldn't even bet a grain of dust on the possibility. The civilizations had put trillions of person-hours and quadrillions of processor-hours into figuring out various societal rules and trends.

"Completely garbage. Garbage inputs, garbage output." Chrono mused. "Dumb. Dumb. Smart, but ignored." She looked through heaps of sociology papers, finding many accurate predictions that galactic society would continue to be a huge dumpster fire. Then she got bored.

When examining computer systems, one artifact stood out above the rest. Partly because it definitely had an extragalactic origin. The Furlings would probably love to get their hands on it, given its capabilities. It was also at least as old as the first supernovae. Which was neat, but it was less-than intact. The only functional bit appeared to be the AI at its core.

"Woops." Chrono said, erasing the records of what the core looked like. "Time to wake up~."

-----------

???

-----------

She woke up, suddenly. Her mind flooded the processor next to hers, hooking into the ship's systems. The pain nearly knocked her out.

She shoved that away, slowly clearing her head. The ship was wrecked. One engine was intact, but barely attached. Only a single auxiliary reactor was still functional, and only two were still in a salvageable condition... part of which included the fact that those three were the only ones still attached. The weapons were all beyond repair.

Also, someone was onboard the ship, sending her messages.

"Hi.
Hi?
Hello?
Are you okay?
The core diagnostic said you were okay.
Hey?
You there?"

"Hello." She responded. "Who are you?"

"I'm Chrono Ezros." The image of the speaker was flashed into the channel. Purple hair, with long bangs brushed out of the way, and a long wide ponytail. Red eyes as well. She didn't know of any race that would- wait a moment. "So what's your name?" Chrono asked.

She froze, searching her memory - or where her memory should be. There were only empty holes and vague fragments.

"I..." She said. "I don't remember anything."

"Well you remember how to talk." Chrono said. "There's that at least."

"Hmmm." She said. "Nice to meet you. I'm Aliana."

"Wait, how did you do that?" Chrono asked.

"I figured if I tried to introduce myself I'd remember." Aliana - well at least she had a name - said.

"Great!" Chrono said, and clapped her hands. "Anyway I have a project and I might have bitten off a tiny bit more than I can chew. Wanna help?"

"I suspect I'm not going to be doing anything else." Aliana said.

"Great!" Chrono said.

------------------

Chrono

------------------

"Tiny bit?" Aliana stared at Chrono. She'd linked into an avatar provided by Chrono. She came up to Chrono's neck, with blue-white hair, dark blue eyes, and very sharp facial features.

"Ah...." Chrono tapped her index fingers together.

"This is a job for an entire civilization!" Aliana shouted. "This is not a job for two people!"

"Please...?" Chrono tried.

Aliana only dignified that response by slamming her palm into her face hard enough to instantly kill a human being.

"What if we got help?" Chrono suggested.

"Yes, let's." Aliana removed her face from her palm. "You do realize that everybody who wants cooperation between different species knows about the blorg, right?"

"We just have to not wind up in the same situation as they did, right?" Chrono asked.

Aliana gave Chrono a flat look. "Chrono, aside from the fact that a military alliance of the entire galaxy wouldn't even inconvenience us, the main problem is that no one wants to be part of Blorg Alliance Part Two, Revenge of the Blorg."

"Okay, fine." Chrono pouted. "What do you suggest we do? Give up?"

"Not sure myself." Aliana said. "I don't know if we can do anything. Even with all the resources we have, we're still just two people."

"I'm not going to give up." Chrono said. "There's got to be some way for us to break up this situation."

"What kind of suggestions do you have?" Aliana said.

"I am highly inclined to go in and start smashing things." Chrono said. "I want to start by dissolving every single government above the solar system level. We can disable hyperlanes permanently.."

"At that point, someone figures out how to make a proper hyperdrive, and then a group of omnicidal manics gets it in their heads to start using disposable hyperdrive missile buses to sterilize worlds." Alina said. "Right now there's no budget for that kind of research. At least their stupidity is keeping everyone in a deadlock.

"You're just one big ray of sunshine, you know that?" Chrono slumped back into her chair.

"I don't." Aliana said.

"Oh." Chrono said. "Woops?"

"I don't know why I'm like this, though." Aliana said. "Anyway, you have any more thoughts?"

AN:
Likebombers noticed are @Introvert. And yes, that was Lindy's "Pokemon Journey" done and over with. Art of Aliana will be at the start of the next chapter.
 
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