Let's Play Every Final Fantasy Game In Order Of Release [Now Finished: Final Fantasy Tactics]

Fwiw, the game that this thread has made me most want to go play myself so far is ffv, the job system has seemed the most fun set of combat mechanics. But the one I have most enjoyed vicariously experiencing via omi's posts is ffvii.
Take it with whatever grain of personal preference, but since FFV I've been playing along with each game to some degree or another. FFVI, I gathered the party in WoR before burning out. FFVII, I got out of Midgar and then just got distracted by other games.

FFV, I had a blast all the way through the Void and killing ExDeath, so, you know, make of that what you will.
 
Just realized finding a FFVIII copy nowadays means it won't be the funky translation that felt like it was translated to French and back to English that I played back in the day.

I'm still wondering about the reasoning behind some of the summon's attacks.
 
Just realized finding a FFVIII copy nowadays means it won't be the funky translation that felt like it was translated to French and back to English that I played back in the day.

I'm still wondering about the reasoning behind some of the summon's attacks.
Well, I could always find a French copy of the game, so it'd feel like it was translated to French and back to English and back to French!
 
If nothing else, VIII has a more recent port then VII, with the Remastered Version available on Steam, unlike 7 where it's console only.
I've already suggested against playing with the Remastered version because the new character models really don't work in the game's favor - both of the two images of "modded remasters" of FFVII that @Omicron posted are better, more faithful to the original FFVII than the FFVIII remaster is to the original FFVIII.

Of course, the first Steam version murdered the soundtrack (again), so really, finding a way to play the original version of the game (FFVIII even had an original PC port which worked fine) would be my suggestion here.
 
Can't write a lot now because holidays, but thanks you Omicron for this LP, now I remember plently why I dislike FF7. I can return to the arena of the best FF with new ammo, armor and swords. IT'S TIME FOR BLOOD !!

I am waiting with eagerness the next ones (especially VIII, Spirit Within and X-2, I suppose it will make me an even fan of this LP, depending of the order they arrive).
 
With regards to the VI versus VII debate, I'd like to throw a 500th hat into the ring, with an interesting case study.

See, I've talked a lot about the oddities of the original SNES translation, and one of the strangest ones was a case that affected Setzer. You see, in the original dialogue, Setzer basically says "thanks to the Empire, business has dried up," before deciding to put his support behind the party. However, Woolsey misread this as "thanks to the Empire, business has gone up." This led to him translating the line as Setzer claiming, "The Empire's made me a rich man." Consequently, the Woolsey line unintentionally completely changes Setzer's character and motivation: before, he's a completely neutral party, joining the group for the self-centered reason that the Empire has been bad for his career of sky piracy and gambling, and now, he's been a willful profiteer and collaborator, or at least didn't mind taking advantage of the situations the Empire has created, but is choosing to make amends for his actions, something he does with gusto for the rest of the game. Woolsey turned Setzer's arc into a redemption arc, by accident. But how was Woolsey able to make that mistake, if it's so significant in its effects on Setzer's character arc?

Because it's the only time in the entire game that Setzer really talks about his prior relationship to the Empire. One sentence. Everything else is left to implication and guesswork.

Because that's what happens when you have a game like VI, where you have an immense scope but the amount of text and story you have to work with is at a premium: entire, major character beats have to be glossed over, at least somewhat, usually with maybe one or two easily-missed sentences to vaguely imply something that sounds right. And that applies to a lot of ideas in VI, which are left largely undefined: what was Terra like before the Slave Crown? Why did Celes go traitor? Why were Leo and Cid so loyal to the Empire, despite the narrative framing them as sympathetic? Is Locke's whole thing supposed to be romantic, creepy, or both? How much does anyone know about Shadow? What was that whole thing with the fake Siegfried? What is Gau's deal? What is Gogo's deal? What happened to Banon? How did Kefka get so powerful so quickly?

This becomes a blessing and a curse, because while the game provides enough wiggle room to make up a suitable answer for yourself, and enough implication to at least guess why it happened, it also means that an actual suitable answer is just kind of missing. And when people play an older game, they accept that these things are true, and they're willing to play along. Final Fantasy VI came at a period in history, albeit near the end of that period, when it was accepted that a game story had to be at least a bit crap no matter what, due to the limitations of the hardware and the culture. It's hard to name a game from that era, barring maybe pure adventure games, where you don't have to end any given compliment about its writing quality with ", considering."

Final Fantasy VII is a different story. Final Fantasy VII came out three years later, the same year as the original Fallout, one year before Half-Life and Metal Gear Solid. At that point, people were starting to accept that a game's story could be simply, unqualifiably good, and that a game had enough leeway to tell a complex and interesting story for its bad writing to simply be judged as... well, bad writing. There's a lot more text in VII, there's a lot more cutscenes, there's a lot more time to flesh things out and give defined answers. We don't see what pre-Slave Crown Terra was like, but we're given a pretty good picture of pre-Nibelheim Cloud. We don't really know why Kefka became such a hardline nihilist other than "magic stuff, probably", but we're given a very clear point-A-to-point-B of most of Sephiroth's motivation. Locke/Celes kind of just happens, while Cloud/Tifa and Cloud/Aerith are completely believable; they're not good love stories by the standards of the time and the medium, they're just good love stories, period.

And so, in FFVII, when a character's dialogue gets garbled by translation or just major writing flubs ("let's mosey" being the memetic example), or when the game leaves a plot unresolved, it ends up off in a way that it doesn't in VI. Both games have a lot of bad writing, but in VI's case, there's maybe half as much of a story to have bad writing, and as such, it's easy for your mind to skate over it or fill in the blanks. VII's bad writing is longer, and it more often gives you the answer flat-out, which gives more room to be disappointed (i.e. Vincent sitting in the Cuck Coffin for 30 years), and since it so often gives definitive answers, that means that times when it doesn't, like Sephiroth and Jenova's relationship, or whether the ending represents humanity going extinct, feel more clearly unsatisfying.
 
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Well if we are still debating the merits of each entry, i will throw my hat for V too.

Of all the titles reviewed so far, it's the only one where reading the LP made me want to, you know, actually play it. I will take a simple concept executed flawlessly over an ambitious but janky game any day.
 
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FF6 came out in 1994. Six months later Live A Live was published. Around another half a year after that, Chrono Trigger came out, still on the SNES.

From the perspective of Final Fantasy, FF6 was the end of the SNES era, and FF7 was the bold 3D follow up on new hardware. But while there's plenty of heated internet arguments on which was truly the final capstone masterpiece of the era (and in fact there were still fondly remembered Square SNES titles released in 1996 like Super Mario RPG) it's hard to say definitively that FF6 was the peak of their SNES releases.

If this thread was about the era rather than FF specifically, there's a lot more to have opinions on. But it's not, so while I'll heartily recommend Chrono Trigger for fun and perspective, it's not really the intent of Omicron's challenge to get sidetracked too much. Tactics is a game in communication with the other Final Fantasy games in a way other cool games like LiveALive and Chrono Trigger aren't.

From my perspective as a reader who has only played FF4 and FF7 out of those played so far, I'll agree that FF5 is the one that most engaged with me to be tempted to give it a try. But I do feel, how to put this… That my views exist in light of modern attempts at similar concepts.

I've not played a game that I register as being a modern, better take on FF6. Except with how FF7 itself does Materia perhaps. Maybe one of the later final fantasy games relates to it that way more strongly, but I haven't really registered it or become aware of it.

In contrast, with FFV I have played that game, I've played three of it even. Bravely Default and sequels/successors are not perfect, but they take the ideas FFV had mechanically, push past the limits even in some ways, and take the storytelling risks Omicron was noting FFV doesn't. They don't always pay off perfectly! But there's definitely the ambition.

And that contrast makes FF6's gameplay feel… hollowed out? No, more like a dead end? I'm not sure how to put that better. it definitely makes me favor FFV more than it maybe deserves on its own merits, to see where iteration on it ended up.
 
I've not played a game that I register as being a modern, better take on FF6. Except with how FF7 itself does Materia perhaps. Maybe one of the later final fantasy games relates to it that way more strongly, but I haven't really registered it or become aware of it.

In contrast, with FFV I have played that game, I've played three of it even. Bravely Default and sequels/successors are not perfect, but they take the ideas FFV had mechanically, push past the limits even in some ways, and take the storytelling risks Omicron was noting FFV doesn't. They don't always pay off perfectly! But there's definitely the ambition.

Yeah i have to admit i am biased for the exact same reason.

V is the grandaddy of Octopath Traveller and those are two extremely good games, specially the second.
 
My general view is that CT is Square working at the absolute peak mastery of the available hardware coupled with the storytelling ambition that more fully manifests in FF7.
 
On the V vs VI front, I feel like the reason VI gets remembered more - aside from nostalgia since it got an official US release - is because of that ambition. I think you can respect a game a lot for trying to be epic of scope and character, even if it falls down. And to its credit, FFVI does a lot of things very, very right. And honestly, the bits where it falls down...well, for those of us a product of its time, things like Kefka's sudden Thamasa power-up were no more egregious than the many a time some 90s Saturday Morning Cartoon Villain got a sudden competence/power boost because they were doing a multi-parter and/or needed an excuse to give the Heroes some shiny new toy. It wasn't even just the medium and limitations of the genre, but I'd argue a product of the greater (US, mind you) cultural time it was released in and the target audience who picked it up having been influenced by that cultural milieu.

So yes, looking back on it with an adult lens and/or absent of that nostalgia, Kefka's sudden wins are plot-asspulls that don't make sense. But if you were a 90s Kid and used to that sort of thing, well, that doesn't make it better but it does make it a whole lot easier to just shrug off and accept it as necessary to get the plot where it needs to go.

As for VII, it was (arguably) the first mainstream US FF game and I can only speak for myself - but I think a lot of people were similar - that we were all just so wrapped up in the experience of it all, that we just brushed off or didn't pay attention to when the writing fell down. And again, like VI, it does so much so very well that overall we come away with an extremely positive impression of it all so we just don't pay attention to minor details like "where did Marlene go?" And also, for better or worse, Cid's schtick probably was considered more funny/acceptable back in 1997 than it is in 2023.
 
Highly belated because of the holidays, but good closing post. I think the takeaway that playing FFVII now is fundamentally distinct from playing it when it stormed the gaming world is a very salient thing to address, and I especially like the breakdowns of the cast by major character.
 

A. Funny tumblr post
B. I feel like this puts its finger right on one of the reasons why that subversion about Cloud's character work so well. It's not just the way he looks and talks, but rather how he exposits: this tutorial example, telling Barret that if there were any First Classes at the reactor they'd all be dead, being the narrator of Nibelheim and introducing Sephiroth to the narrative…

One of the most important skills for a conman to master is how to act authoritative. Cloud, too, acts incredibly confident in the first part of the game, both in how he explains things and how he pushes the party to pursue Sephiroth. Does it really have much to do with Avalanche's original goal of stopping Shinra from killing the world? Not actually, because all we know about Sephiroth at that point is that he had a mental breakdown and set a town on fire that one time. But Cloud is utterly set on revenge (and likely the Reunion Instinct) with a confident determination that no one else can match, and so he just ends up wresting control to lead a bunch of weirdos around the world to chase a stranger.
 
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It's a quote from Prokopetz that says: "One of the better examples of integrating video game conventions of play into the narrative is how the game mechanics tutorials in the opening stages of Final Fantasy VII (the original) flip the customary script and have Cloud, the player character, be the one explaining things to other characters, thereby establishing the unspoken expectation that his narrative function is to be the guy who knows what the fuck is going on and lending greater weight to the eventual revelation that he has no idea what the fuck is going on."
 

A. Funny tumblr post
B. I feel like this puts its finger right on one of the reasons why that subversion about Cloud's character work so well. It's not just the way he looks and talks, but rather how he exposits: this tutorial example, telling Barret that if there were any First Classes at the reactor they'd all be dead, being the narrator of Nibelheim and introducing Sephiroth to the narrative…

One of the most important skills for a conman to master is how to act authoritative. Cloud, too, acts incredibly confident in the first part of the game, both in how he explains things and how he pushes the party to pursue Sephiroth. Does it really have much to do with Avalanche's original goal of stopping Shinra from killing the world? Not actually, because all we know about Sephiroth at that point is that he had a mental breakdown and set a town on fire that one time. But Cloud is utterly set on revenge (and likely the Reunion Instinct) with a confident determination that no one else can match, and so he just ends up wresting control to lead a bunch of weirdos around the world to chase a stranger.

Also helps that at the rendezvous at Kalm the party consists of Tifa, Aerith, Barret, and Nanaki. Tifa wants to get Sephiroth just as much as Cloud and is crushing on Cloud to boot, and Aerith is also attracted to Cloud and is trying to figure out what in the world is going on with him and why he reminds her so much of Zack. So those two are going to be pre-disposed towards Cloud's plan anyway. And if those two and Cloud go together that's Barret's entire circle either dead or unreachable, so of course he's going to stick around. Among other things Marlene is still with Aerith's mother as far as he knows, so Aerith is a link to the person he cares most about in the entire world.

And Nanaki could split, I suppose, but these are a bunch of people incredibly good at applying a little focused violence who have shown they will apply that towards keeping him from being Hojo's experimental animal, so, like, where's he going to find a better group to watch his back?
 
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It's funny to me that I went "This is a Prokopetz post" from the first sentence despite the tumblr blog name not appearing in the embed and it turns out it was, in fact, a Prokopetz post
 
Some readers lost interest in Sephiroth as soon as he started showing up as his modern self with the self-aggrandizing claims of godhood, while others were ready to abandon VI entirely after Thamassa first, and even moreso after the Floating Continent. Both these characters were divisive and had some significantly harsher detractors than myself.
Oh hey, it's me!

…OK, so, here's what I can say about FF6 versus FF7. When I first experienced FF6, I was sucked into it enough that Kefka's plot armour infuriated me and I stormed off in disgust. After Omi's incredible style managed to get me through it, I was kind of satisfied to know how it ended, but it remains ruined for me.

FF7 I just… don't find interesting. Flashback Sephiroth was a cool dude with some complexity, and then he stopped existing. The power trio of Cloud, Tifa, and Aeris was amazing, and then Aeris stopped existing. And then, well… even Omi couldn't get me through it. I stopped reading through, and only came back to read the wrap-up and the responses to the wrap-up.

I'm sure I'll be able to go back and get through it now that I know it's complete and I can binge it, but I honestly just don't want to. I was enthralled with the whole thread for the 4 games I didn't really know, and then the best one which is FF5, and then the one I hated which was FF6, and then FF7… I just don't care. FF7 is just boring to me, for some reason I can't understand or explain.
 
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