Kantai Collection - Fanfic Idea and Recs
- Thread starter sasahara17
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The original design did include 8x21" fixed underwater torpedo tubes. That was a thing with capital ships designed before the Treaty-imposed battleship holiday.
They were almost useless and typically removed during refits. The only time I can think of where a BB/BC's torpedoes actually were useful was after Jutland.
The only forward compartment SMS Seydlitz had which wasn't flooded when she limped into port after the battle was the one where the torpedoes were stored. If that had flooded she would have sunk.
FailLord
2050 lb bombs?
- Location
- very high up
There is also the WSGR version of Constellation.
edgy refit included
I'm aware that was a thing with earlier battleships. But for some reason WG decided to put above water, swiveling, tubes on her. Despite the fact that the US had gone away from arming surface combatants other than destroyers with them.
That brings to mind the picture of shipgirl Seydlitz compulsively keeping a few empty torpedo casings on hand at all times as emergency floaties.
SeismicGuide
The Quakiest of Quakebotes
- Location
- A usually Warm, Southern state of the US
The first few Atlanta's beg to differ,
Granted: The 'Lanta's were basically Large Destroyers, iirc.
Doesn't discredit that they were Cruisers, though. ;v
Jonen C
F.M.D.G.
- Location
- Lincopense, Ostrogothia, Suecia
The mention of floaties brings to mind another shipgirl commenting that Seydlitz is 'hydrodynamic' and needs floaties.That brings to mind the picture of shipgirl Seydlitz compulsively keeping a few empty torpedo casings on hand at all times as emergency floaties.
Spherical_Light
Likely Illuminating a room near you
- Location
- NW US
Incidentally, wargaming released a news thing today about Large cruiser Congress, a 1940 design. From what I saw in the article, the double turret is on the bottom while the triple turret is on top, seems odd layout...
As for Constitution, I like that 10 gun layout instead of the 8 gun.
Have another idea...
A very rough snip.
As for Constitution, I like that 10 gun layout instead of the 8 gun.
Have another idea...
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A seagull alighted on to a perch, which twitched. The scavenger bird tilted its head down to look and blinked as an eye snapped open, screeching in alarm, the bird tried launch itself into the air, but was handicapped by the sudden immobilization of its feed. The eye watched as the bird started to peck at the trap, only to pause at the weird result.
"Stupid bird." The figure smiled as the bird screeched, trying to get away as her other hand came up and proceeded to crush the seagull's head. "Birdbrains." The prone female muttered before eating said remains, followed by the rest of the bird.
It really didn't make that much of a dent in her supply chamber, with a frown she considered the rest of the island she was on. "Looks like I'll have to denude another island AGAIN." This had happened before, a couple days ago after having had to fight through sea-zombie hordes for the second time in her short existence.
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Day 1
Ships log.
I...I can see.
I... I have a head, eyes, ears.
I... I have a body and not a hu-oh wait, nevermind.
I... I have no memories, of anything, except that I'm a ship, with a human-like body.
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A seagull alighted on to a perch, which twitched. The scavenger bird tilted its head down to look and blinked as an eye snapped open, screeching in alarm, the bird tried launch itself into the air, but was handicapped by the sudden immobilization of its feed. The eye watched as the bird started to peck at the trap, only to pause at the weird result.
"Stupid bird." The figure smiled as the bird screeched, trying to get away as her other hand came up and proceeded to crush the seagull's head. "Birdbrains." The prone female muttered before eating said remains, followed by the rest of the bird.
It really didn't make that much of a dent in her supply chamber, with a frown she considered the rest of the island she was on. "Looks like I'll have to denude another island AGAIN." This had happened before, a couple days ago after having had to fight through sea-zombie hordes for the second time in her short existence.
==========================================
Day 1
Ships log.
I...I can see.
I... I have a head, eyes, ears.
I... I have a body and not a hu-oh wait, nevermind.
I... I have no memories, of anything, except that I'm a ship, with a human-like body.
================================================
A very rough snip.
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Putting the triple superfiring up top with the twin below it was a US thing (see: Pensacola-class). This allowed the turrets be placed closer to the bow and stern for more available deck space between them while retaining a fine low-drag underwater hull shape.
Spherical_Light
Likely Illuminating a room near you
- Location
- NW US
I see, thank you for that information. I watched one of Drach's videos on the Pensacola and that class had a similar layout.
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Norman Friedman put out a series of books with boring titles like "U.S. Battleships: An Illustrated Design History" that are very detailed.
They are not light reading and I first came across them in a bookstore when I was a kid. I remember my mom waking me up after I fell asleep with my head buried in the one about cruisers when I was eight or nine.
EDIT: Mom just called me back. She thinks I fell asleep while reading about the Brooklyn-class because those pages of the Cruiser book in the family library have some water damage. I was not a normal child.
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TwinAttorney864
Child
- Location
- New Jersey
Can I just...*Nabs the idea*
No, but seriously, can I use this idea? It would work perfectly with my story (Albeit I'd have to tweak this idea around to fit with my story) I always like the idea of USS Prinz Eugen, and it's a shame we don't have more of it
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A/N: this is a "what if I designed the steam plant for the Montana's."
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Renown was line astern of the American battleship when her radar and lookout fairies spotted two huge contacts on the horizon. Before she could say anything Montana radioed the fleet, "Turn to zero-six-seven. Increase speed to thirty-one knots. Those are Yamatos. Renown, Repulse you have the trailing one, I'll take the lead one. Weapons free, fire when ready."
Renown acknowledged the American and followed Montana through the turn while her fairies readied her main guns and she accelerated.
She had two major concerns: the 18" Japanese shells and Montana's steam plant.
The former because of how the Japanese shells meant she and her sister were effectively unarmoured.
The latter because Montana's design flank speed was only 27-28kts. She radioed Montana, "Will your machinery hold up?"
The reply was, "The Navy asked for 850F, 565psi. The little shit in charge of my propulsion says the engineer who designed it bamboozled the Navy and gave me 2,100F, 3,500psi instead."
Renown just whistled and said, "What's your actual flank?"
"I don't know. My chief engineer thinks it's about 34 or 35 knots but doesn't want to risk melting turbine blades to find out."
"Faster than an Iowa? With your plump figure? That's bollocks!"
"Hey! I'm not fat. I'm just shapely with a very thick belt." was the indignant reply.
The banter was interrupted by eighteen enormous shells landing a few hundred yards short and behind Montana.
****
Renown was line astern of the American battleship when her radar and lookout fairies spotted two huge contacts on the horizon. Before she could say anything Montana radioed the fleet, "Turn to zero-six-seven. Increase speed to thirty-one knots. Those are Yamatos. Renown, Repulse you have the trailing one, I'll take the lead one. Weapons free, fire when ready."
Renown acknowledged the American and followed Montana through the turn while her fairies readied her main guns and she accelerated.
She had two major concerns: the 18" Japanese shells and Montana's steam plant.
The former because of how the Japanese shells meant she and her sister were effectively unarmoured.
The latter because Montana's design flank speed was only 27-28kts. She radioed Montana, "Will your machinery hold up?"
The reply was, "The Navy asked for 850F, 565psi. The little shit in charge of my propulsion says the engineer who designed it bamboozled the Navy and gave me 2,100F, 3,500psi instead."
Renown just whistled and said, "What's your actual flank?"
"I don't know. My chief engineer thinks it's about 34 or 35 knots but doesn't want to risk melting turbine blades to find out."
"Faster than an Iowa? With your plump figure? That's bollocks!"
"Hey! I'm not fat. I'm just shapely with a very thick belt." was the indignant reply.
The banter was interrupted by eighteen enormous shells landing a few hundred yards short and behind Montana.
CV12Hornet
Riter.
- Location
- Tacoma, Washington
Okay, that's actually not possible. Like, even if we handwave the boiler change, that is in fact hydrodynamically impossible and there's only so far I'm willing to push Sparkly Magical Shipgirl Bullshit.
Spherical_Light
Likely Illuminating a room near you
- Location
- NW US
Yeah, I'm with Hornet on this one. Seems a bit off.
What's fascinating to me about the steam side of the power plant is that they have vents apparently in the hull bottom to run seawater through to assist with condensing steam. Even if that system really only works and greater then 8 knots.
I wish that in some respects, we could go back to that time period and observe as all of these new technologies came out. Specially to be a naval engineer back then, must've been very interesting times with all the stuff being designed.
What's fascinating to me about the steam side of the power plant is that they have vents apparently in the hull bottom to run seawater through to assist with condensing steam. Even if that system really only works and greater then 8 knots.
I wish that in some respects, we could go back to that time period and observe as all of these new technologies came out. Specially to be a naval engineer back then, must've been very interesting times with all the stuff being designed.
Jonen C
F.M.D.G.
- Location
- Lincopense, Ostrogothia, Suecia
You ever hear of Rule the Waves.
Spherical_Light
Likely Illuminating a room near you
- Location
- NW US
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Going from 850F, 565psi to 2100F, 565psi would allow you to wring approximately 300,000shp out of machinery that's about the same size as the 172,000shp machinery the Montana's were designed for without increasing fuel consumption at all due to increased thermodynamic efficiency. With WWII-era screws that alone ups a Montana's flank speed by about 7kts.
Upping the pressure so it's in the supercritical region when the H2O hits turbine inlets makes the powerplant smaller.
Skywalker_T-65
Writer with too many ideas.
- Location
- United States
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- Plural/They/He/Her
I can't believe I'm posting in this thread again…but.
It doesn't work that way. This isn't the F4 and the Triumph of Thrust over Aerodynamics. Even if I put aside my skepticism that such hilariously high-temp boilers are at all reliable:
Hull form, yo. Hydrodynamics.
It doesn't matter how much power, if the hull isn't designed for speed. Longtana is a thing for a reason. Iowa's massive nose is a thing for a reason. You need a hull designed for the speed you want. It's why Kongou, even with a ton of extra power (double the original design, more or less) just couldn't go much past 30 knots.
You start damaging the hull because it just isn't meant for that.
It doesn't work that way. This isn't the F4 and the Triumph of Thrust over Aerodynamics. Even if I put aside my skepticism that such hilariously high-temp boilers are at all reliable:
Hull form, yo. Hydrodynamics.
It doesn't matter how much power, if the hull isn't designed for speed. Longtana is a thing for a reason. Iowa's massive nose is a thing for a reason. You need a hull designed for the speed you want. It's why Kongou, even with a ton of extra power (double the original design, more or less) just couldn't go much past 30 knots.
You start damaging the hull because it just isn't meant for that.
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Those "hilariously high-temps" are totally doable with the kinds of steels I design around. 310 Stainless doesn't start creeping until 2,102F.
- Location
- California Conservation Corps
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Oh sure the boiler and turbines can take that kind of temprature and pressure if designed that way. The problem is, the ship itself cant actually handle that much shaft horsepower, nor does it have the hulform to actually convert that power into speed.
You are right though on Montana having no clue what her top speed would be, just are wrong on what would go wrong. I'm pretty certian that if the gearbox doesn't tear itself apart under the increased load, the propeller will as they appaerntly throw a fit when theyre even slightly outside their design tolerances. Presuming both were replaced with unobtanium, the hull form itself would cap the speed the ship could reach.
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The gearing and propellers are part of the steam plant, so that's a non-issue.
The hull, however, is not. The Montana-class, as paper ships which were never built, might be able to handle the increased speed without a change in hull form because they were designed to be tougher than the Iowas* ... but there are no guarantees.
* The Iowas had to fit through the Panama Canal. The Montana's were under no length, beam, draught, or displacement restrictions.
CV12Hornet
Riter.
- Location
- Tacoma, Washington
No, the propellers cannot handle that amount of horsepower. There's only so much power you can dump into a propeller before cavitation strips away all the extra energy you're putting into it. That limit, even today*, is about 70,000 shp per shaft and you've blown right past that.
And the problem with the Hull is not structural strength, it's hydrodynamics. The Montanas have a solid length to beam ratio, but it's a ratio designed for 30 knots and they don't go all-in on the hydrodynamic trickery the Iowas do. You're going to be dumping excessive amounts of power into the water for every knot above 30.
And the real nail in the coffin? The US Navy studied a fast Montana design with 320,000 horsepower. It was expected to make only 33 knots. It had six propeller shafts. And this with a significantly higher length to beam ratio that likely compensates for the actual design being 10,000 tons lighter.
So no. You're not getting 35 knots out of that horsepower and you're certainly not dumping that amount of power into four shafts.
*Unconfirmed rumors about the Ford-class aside.
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You are entirely wrong in all of your statements. The Emma Maersk is larger than a Montana and capable of 25-26kts on a single 109,000hp shaft.
CV12Hornet
Riter.
- Location
- Tacoma, Washington
No, it is not 109,000 shaft horsepower. That's the engine output; no source I've found states what the actual shaft horsepower is, but given the definition of shaft horsepower* it's lower than the engine horsepower.
Also, good job addressing none of the other points I raised, including the actual design the Navy themselves drew up.
*The power acting directly on the motor shaft after power loss from the gearing and transmission.
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