CV12Hornet
Riter.
- Location
- Tacoma, Washington
If it's an Undertale reference it's a Touhou reference anyway, given Toby Fox is a giant Touhou Superfan and Undertale heavily inspired by Touhou.
Hyphen (Pokemon Emerald)
To be fair, it's probably difficult to make a pokeball not activate around sapient pokemon. What sort of marker do you program into it? It's not like the pokeball is sapient either! But yeah, they absolutely should do something about it. It being difficult to work is not an excuse for letting it remain a possibility. Given how rare they are, it's likely that pokemon don't have an exact legal status; it's probably very ad hoc. It definitely varies between region. Depending on the species, personality, and trainer, they might be inclined to not rock the boat about their status. Whether because they like fighting and they feel content. Or just because they feel powerful enough that if they really wanted to they could destroy the pokeball and hit the bricks. Astra's village is probably going to be a huge wtf moment for a lot of reasons.
Right, I'd forgotten that the Ancestor picked up memories of that afterwards and hadn't been physically there. That makes me more curious about who uplifted this population.
I don't think you can really massage the ecosystem to deal with five hundred Abra. Because it raise the question of how many Abra were their at their height? They wouldn't have more children in poverty, they couldn't. Especially because these Abra can't take care of themselves. It doesn't ruin the chapter or anything, I just end up ignoring it.
I suspected that the care of the Kadabras left the Abras worse-off when there were no longer enough of them around. What you mention about who layed the eggs is interesting. You might have some of the more intelligent Abra laying eggs before they ascend, but not afterwards. And since these Kadabra don't lay eggs, they're not adding their intelligence back into the population. Sure, I'm sure there have been some Kadabra who had children. And I'm sure there's been some marginal improvements, but it couldn't be a lot of improvement even over so many generations.
I'd forgotten about the Twisted spoon. That was pretty damn neat way of including them. To be fair, I think random metal spoons wouldn't necessarily be outright Twisted. Echo mentions that the spoon helps them think too. If these Abra ever get helped, giving them spoon teaching aids might help teach them language too. They might not get so attached to it if they start aware that they are just a tool, rather than an extension of themselves.... and I just noticed that the gold spoon factoid came from Pokemon Ultra Sun and not the other games damn it. Still, whether they're just metal spoons or silver spoons made by humans they wouldn't necessarily have the same implications of taking a spoon from a Kadabra (that also probably means less power). Though I don't think Astra would think to go look for a spoon. She might get one if she comes across one, but otherwise it'd be epilogue material. (I still think it's likely that pokemarts would have silver spoons for Kadabra and Alakazam who lose theirs
)I think personal power is at least part of the issue. It wouldn't solve anything on its own, but being able to get tasks done quicker (she doesn't even have a spoon!) should at least help! Might even help her multitask too. Barrage showed Echo multitasking a lot better than Astra did. Alakazam would probably be better at it and spoon. Though there'd obviously the difficulty of relearning to do it with a spoon. But again, epilogue.
I'd forgotten that Astra's village could ferment berry juice, but I was talking specifically about the Abra village.
I agree that the odds aren't great for there to be Kadabra still alive, but I think there's a chance. It's also not unlikely that at least one gave in. I don't think Astra or Echo would consider it, if at all, and whether it comes true depends on you writing. Still it's something interesting to think about for readers. It'd obviously be epilogue material if it happened.
I'm glad though we're going to see more of Echo soonTM!
I can see Astra letting it slip to Stephen. He's powerful enough to feel secure in his position and not threatened by a pokemon wanting to challenge him. He's loaded, so that but even more so. So he could definitely let it slide because he's interested in seeing how it turns out. He might give Astra the idea to tell Brendon and May. That could happen if he figures out she's a pokemon or not. If he figures it out and he's interested in seeing how it progresses, he could tell her to help with the cover story. Or he could just incidentally mention it, telling her that he knows she's psychic and mentioning how notable her telepathy is.
The funniest possibility is that Astra is ready to come completely clear to them, but Steven interrupts her and tells them that she's a perfectly normal psychic human who was raised in a cave secluded from civilization. It would be even funnier if he did it completely unintentionally and Astra is just nodding along agreeing with Stephen's explanation about her muteness and he doesn't have an idea she's a pokemon.
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Hmm I bet Steven would preempt Astra's coming out by revealing she's a Psychic so she end up acting as a translator for Echo.
I kind of doubt he would dig deeper considering how huge the existence of Echo's community, the biggest mystery of Dewford Island is something he would be really excited to study.
I wonder if Steven's Metagross or Claydol can help Echo remember long lost memories, scientists and researchers would be killing each other to join the team investigating Echo's culture.
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I have a theory about how the reveal is going to go. Steven Stone has been teaching his Metagross human language out of idle curiosity and the Metagross has reached an advanced level of communication. Metagross is also capable of limited flight. So when Steven Stone is flying Metagross-back over the landscape, Metagross observes a human and a kirlia traveling together, intriguing Steven. Much more so when he only sees two people together. Naturally, he investigates. He becomes even more interested when he sees that both the human and the illusionary human are Pokemon trainers. After giving a no holds barred beat down, he reflects that one of them spoke only with psychic powers.
When May and Astra turn up again, Steven Stone requests that his father send a letter for the trainers to deliver in order to lure Astra to a sufficiently private place. As Astra is separated from her friends by the Kadabra, even better. Steven is going to throw an ultra ball at Astra, capture her and reveal her true nature to her friends a little later.
If I'm correct and figured out the plot, please don't change it because someone found the twist out. Hypothetically speaking, it's a great twist and it should be executed as you have planned.
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Dermonster
The Shittiest Wizard
Was literally anybody at all going to tell me that they're called LAIRON and not LARION.
I've been calling them Larion in my head forever. Holy shit.
Holy shit. It sounds wrong. Lairon.
God fucking damnit.
I've been calling them Larion in my head forever. Holy shit.
Holy shit. It sounds wrong. Lairon.
God fucking damnit.
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PaarSiivOnikaan
Resting on a pile of books
- Location
- Germany
In my defense, I am german and only know them as Stollrak. They also do not really show up in the (english) fanfics I read.
Sooo... not my fault! XD
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Well sure, but, putting aside how incredibly useful pokeballs are as medical and educational devices (a reasonable thing to do given the negative connotations) they do not yet exist in a world where humans are acknowledging them as people and could program that. They exist in a world where they have an available tool to prevent their capture by humans.
Hm… I wonder if humans have developed any treatment for spoon loss. Pokemedical technology is really advanced.
I thought this was based on the earlier generations? In those, it's either 25 or, in OR/AS 19. Though I suppose if we're going hard "emerald only" then Heal Pulse wasn't introduced until Gen V.
Flairina
Least Omnipotent Goddess
- Location
- The next infinity over
...Regice? If so, not sure that rage has actually faded all things considered, given Astra's passing "encounter" with Screaming Ice Island. ^^;
Yes Astra, the special psychic/fairy combo currently shared by only you and the Hatenna line get to be natural empaths. That's not actually common to most Psychic Pokemon, so feel proud!
...what an artful way of describing a slow decline into ignorance and extinction.
Love, love details like this. Yes I DO want to know what the Abra line's culture looks, or at least once looked like! Yes I DO want to know what they did for fun and training and how they lived before everything went to hell! That's really interesting to me, and I'm thrilled to see so much of it here! O(∩_∩)O
In another world, Astra is out there having some truly wild teenage years.
...yes, Touhou games do tend to be like that in my experience.
I imagining a Kadabra either psychically flinging a Mawile from afar onto a Sableye, or a Kadabra keeping a Mawile levitated on the roof of a cavern until a Sableye walks under and then dropping them like Spiderman, and am unsure which image I prefer. XD
A lesson Mawile!me could stand to learn sooner rather than later... assuming I ever get ABG back up and running, eheh. ^^;
I enjoy the train of logic here, despite the unfortunate result. I wonder if any of Dewford's inhabitants have noticed the ecological collapse going on in the caves as a result of that effort, or if no one cared enough to even think of what would happen afterwards. It's just a handful of trainers complaining that all these Pokemon they'd heard about supposedly being present in Granite Caves aren't anymore, after all...
(Then again, maybe that's why Steven here to begin with.)
Yeah, really, what a rip off. Have they not tried to solve that deficiency over the last however many years humanity has had capture technology for now? Does Big Pokechow have its fingers in Pokeball development, and is holding its foot against the door on the subject of developing hunger stasis? Pah.
Echo: [Ah, back when could afford to get high... had time... do so miss those days.]
Again, very interesting! I kind of assumed we'd cut off at "and then it all went to hell and we retreated to make the best of what was left", so hearing how the Kadabras collectively tried to adapt/deal with the problem is really neat.
...and here I was assuming that "five spoons" legend Brendan mentioned before was just a mega evolution reference. Turns out the reality is far sadder.
On the whole, this was genuinely a fascinating chapter with a lot of really, really interesting worldbuilding details! I don't care if it was a lot of exposition, it was good exposition, and I'd dare say I actually enjoyed it more than any other recent chapter. Well done Derm! ♪(^∇^*)
- Location
- UK
Did a fanart.
Please pretend there are more Abra, I got tired :3
Oh! I know this, it's Geometry wars!
cB557
voOOP
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKkHfkvpw34 I've been posting this everywhere the past few days and I'll take any excuse to do it again
Olivebirdy
mook.
I'm happy with the exposition, it was a complete story in and of itself. A sad one, with good storytelling and a storyteller you just want to hug.
Echo's
Brendan's
missing end quote
She's objecting to the idea she would capture one. I'm hoping she'll bring the most pugnacious sleepy Abra with her. She can afford to feed one, at least.
Ah. So it's not going to be particularly doable for Astra to have one on her team, it'd take too long.
Dermonster
The Shittiest Wizard
I am hyperbolically fixing one typo every five minutes.
End my suffering.
End my suffering.
Echo
Stop Me If You've Heard This One Before
- Location
- "echolocation" dur hur hur
I'd guess it's more a matter of this being a fleshed-out setting where game mechanics aren't everything, meaning that Mawile are also super effective against the Small-Enough-To-Fit-in-Mouth type.
Dermonster
The Shittiest Wizard
Sableye are good at ambushing.
Not so good at being ambushed.
Especially not so good when the ambusher is literally manifested out of thin air by an angry Kadabra.
The supply of fresh, Lairon dug gemstones isn't so great anymore either...
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Wouldn't she have noticed that anyway? She can read and communicate with May.
- Pronouns
- It
It wouldn't be a very good disguise if it couldn't pass at least a cursory inspection from any sensing pokemon skills or human technology now would it?
in all honesty I chose zorua because not a lot of Pokémon can become human and when I saw the typing I knew I had to make the panic punt joke.
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Maybe she carries a Ring Target.
I helped edit (very minorly) and argued to keep it the length. Because it gave the emotions of this chapter time to sink in. This was a heavily emotional episode and I felt those emotions were best stewed in. Is it long? Yes. But I think that makes it all the more impactful as you learn more about what happened here. The knowledge that things were bad, are bad, and the reveal of just how bad things are compared to how things use to be.
How things could have gone with Astra's village.
In other thoughts... I give May 60:40 odds of hugging Astra versus just beating her up while crying.
I was thinking more about how the village might be helped if Astra manages to win. Anyways, the first thing they need is food and medical assistance. That can, and should, be provided. Then you need more hands. Echo won't want humans in the creches. Scientists will probably want to observe it some, but the creches would likely be a red line. Astra's village might be able to provide spare hands to help. The Abra will need more puzzles. They need new puzzles too. Thinking about the same things over and over again won't help them. A berry farm might be good too, on the surface. They should be able to teleport there, and it'd be a radically different experience for them. It would also give them their own source of food that isn't charity.
It might be possible to give Echo a prosthetic spoon. And you might also be able to give training spoons to Abra to help boost their efforts until they can speak on their own. Then let them go without until they evolve. It's possible regular spoons wouldn't work, but humans have technology that let them make metal more permeable to Psychic energy. They wouldn't be as good as the spoons they create, but they'd still be spoons to use. Though it is definitely possible that it just doesn't work that way too. Alakazam are said to have created their spoons. Odd Incense boosts psychics too, it might help. But those aren't exactly cheap either.
To be fair, it's probably a limit of pokeballs. If Big Pokechow had such a grasp, PCs probably wouldn't be able to keep pokemon in storage indefinitely without being fed. Unless...
I could see it if five-spoon died a few months ago, but that's obviously not the case.
It might be possible to give Echo a prosthetic spoon. And you might also be able to give training spoons to Abra to help boost their efforts until they can speak on their own. Then let them go without until they evolve. It's possible regular spoons wouldn't work, but humans have technology that let them make metal more permeable to Psychic energy. They wouldn't be as good as the spoons they create, but they'd still be spoons to use. Though it is definitely possible that it just doesn't work that way too. Alakazam are said to have created their spoons. Odd Incense boosts psychics too, it might help. But those aren't exactly cheap either.
Might just make them a new one. Sort of like a prosthetic. They might be able to imbue them with psychic-energy like they did with the rocket. But I could see it just being impossible to replicate it.
That 'fading' could be that Regice is dying. It's hard to exert such an aura of cold fury if you are falling apart after millennia of imprisonment.
To be fair, it's probably a limit of pokeballs. If Big Pokechow had such a grasp, PCs probably wouldn't be able to keep pokemon in storage indefinitely without being fed. Unless...
She'd have to capture the Abra to bring it with her. Otherwise one of the other trainers might catch it. Catching the Abra would also let her us TMs on it. But Astra obviously has objections against catching her cousins, no matter how unintelligent they may be.
I'm reading this more and the more I do the more I can't get over five hundred Abra. These Abra have less survival instincts than normal Abra. They can't support themselves and if they can its only marginal. Kadabra at best are half as good as they are without the spoon. And it took Echo a long time to figure out how to use her powers without the spoon.
I could see it if five-spoon died a few months ago, but that's obviously not the case.
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Astra bought seeds.
Astra bought seeds and there is a group of pokemon that need food.
How long does it take a berry bush to grow?
Would it be enough?
Is there a place that can be hidden from humans for long enough on the island?
The Froggy Ninja
The Blade Will Never Die
Considering Derm's ominous statements about getting a new spoon, I doubt it's that simple. One interesting question would be what happens if a Spoonless Kadabra evolves to Alakazam. Do they get two spoons or only one, leaving them still crippled but less so?
Dermonster
The Shittiest Wizard
'Here we see an author, once again reminded to Never Use Hard Numbers for scale, measurements, time, populations, or anything else they know absolutely nothing about.'
Edit: Oh now I remember where I got that number from.
I looked up 'sustainable population number' and it said 500 individuals were needed to guard against genetic drift or something. Whiiich looks to maybe not be accurate?
Well, whatever. It's Pokemon, there's probably some bullshit or another in the background that just lets this be fine.
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All of my greatest pokemon have been severely inbred. In the video game canon, inbreeding is one of the surest steps to power.
There's a bigger, more important question, is there a place on the island that is close enough to the caves that the Abra can access it regularly without expending more calories than can be brought in that can be hidden from other pokemon too? I also don't think Astra has enough seeds to feed several hundred Abra.
I'm not sure. Look at how Dermonster described twisted spoons. It involves taking a spoon from a Kadabra. Their piece of art, a spoon that is literally part of them. Take it from them and leaving them to die or cannibalizing it from a corpse. But it's possible giving them a random spoon (or attuned) won't do anything because it doesn't have the connection to the pokemon and it can't have the same connection because it wasn't made by them. Though maybe the psychic prions (???) come from trying to use something you didn't make. Echo might also be opposed to it too.
Alakazam are said to create their own spoons in Platinum and in several later games, so they might be able to create more. Ultra Moon says that if they trust someone, they might share one of those spoons. Maybe Echo if had silver, she could shape her own replacement spoon?
If I remember correctly, individual humans are abnormally genetically alike compared to many other animals. Pokemon probably aren't, either that or they have much less lethal recessive traits. The egg groups might indicate it's the latter. The human-like egg group has a lot of species in it too. So they aren't necessarily limited to this cave's Abras if diversity is a problem.
Also I think it would make sense if this cave was closer to the point of no return than not.
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