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General Soulsbornekiroring Thread (From Software titles)

bird yells said:
Sorry to hear you're having a bad time, op. If you do decide to stick with it a bit longer, here are some ways you can deal with the hp penalty on death:

1) There's a ring that reduces the penalty very significantly, to the point you should be able to comfortably play through the whole game at max hollowing if you have it on. I dunno if you care about spoilers for this ancient game, but it's called the ring of binding and you find it
in the heide tower area, in a chest close to dragonrider's arena, assuming you're on scholar of the first sin

2) Successfully helping someone in coop restores humanity. This goes both for the standard large soapstone (get summoned and help kill a boss) and the small soapstone (get summoned, kill like five normal enemies and return with a full heal + estus refill + durability restore). I can't promise you get a lot of small soapstone hits these days but it's worth a shot

3) Also don't be afraid to spend human effigies once you've died a couple of times and the penalty is getting noticeable ofc, but I'm assuming you're running low on those

Can't say I know what's up with your game dropping dodgeroll inputs tho. The roll triggers when you release the button rather than when you press it, so you do need to hit dodge a little in anticipation of an incoming move, but you should be familiar with that already. If you run around in majula and roll a bunch, does your guy just refuse to roll sometimes even though you have stamina, or does your rolls come out only they're delayed?
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1) Thanks for the heads up on this ring. I'll head over and pick it up (when I can manage to pick the game back up) and that should help a bit.

2) I haven't even found any of the soapstones yet, so this tips helpfulness will have to be deferred until I do.

3) I might have more than what you're thinking. I've only used a few so far, as I have no idea how common they are. I was the same way with Humanities in DS1 until I had a reliable place to farm more (those ghosts in the Abyss having such high drop rates was one of the things I liked best out of that DLC, lore stuff not withstanding) I'll try to be a bit less stingy and see how that goes.

For the rolling I've only noticed it when I'm in combat with something. I'm locked on and moving to the side then roll to avoid an incoming swing and the game just doesn't do anything. I have the stamina, I just keep moving as I was and get hammered. Usually by a hammer, incidently. Those "armored turtle-backed dudes" are the main offenders of it happening, with the large knights in the tower area bringing up second place. Went there for a bit to poke my head around for easy loot, but didn't get further than the spot with 3 at once (giant sword one and two sword&shield)
 
Pi In The Sky said:
1) Thanks for the heads up on this ring. I'll head over and pick it up (when I can manage to pick the game back up) and that should help a bit.

2) I haven't even found any of the soapstones yet, so this tips helpfulness will have to be deferred until I do.

3) I might have more than what you're thinking. I've only used a few so far, as I have no idea how common they are. I was the same way with Humanities in DS1 until I had a reliable place to farm more (those ghosts in the Abyss having such high drop rates was one of the things I liked best out of that DLC, lore stuff not withstanding) I'll try to be a bit less stingy and see how that goes.

For the rolling I've only noticed it when I'm in combat with something. I'm locked on and moving to the side then roll to avoid an incoming swing and the game just doesn't do anything. I have the stamina, I just keep moving as I was and get hammered. Usually by a hammer, incidently. Those "armored turtle-backed dudes" are the main offenders of it happening, with the large knights in the tower area bringing up second place. Went there for a bit to poke my head around for easy loot, but didn't get further than the spot with 3 at once (giant sword one and two sword&shield)
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You're not some kind of epic chad gamer playing on keyboard and mouse, are you...? there are, or were, some known issues with button mapping on mouse. But assuming you're using a controller this kinda sounds like a controller issue honestly, unless you're just underestimating the additional delay from needing to release the button before the roll triggers.
 
bird yells said:
You're not some kind of epic chad gamer playing on keyboard and mouse, are you...? there are, or were, some known issues with button mapping on mouse. But assuming you're using a controller this kinda sounds like a controller issue honestly, unless you're just underestimating the additional delay from needing to release the button before the roll triggers.
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Oh no, I'm using an Xbox one controller. I was actually wondering if it was something in the new controller that was doing something the older game wasn't made for, but if that were the case I'd probably have found more people with my issue when googling. Someone had made a post here a bit ago but then deleted it asking if I was trying to roll outside of straight up/down/left/right because I guess the game doesn't like doing that when locked on. I'd have to do some testing being aware of where I'm moving the stick to figure that bit out. From my vague memories I feel like that might have something to do with it.
 
Pi In The Sky said:
After many years of putting it off due to laziness/time commitment I finally started playing Dark Souls 2 yesterday. After about 7 hours of it I'm now understanding why this game got so much heat when it came out, because I'm pretty sure that I'm hating it quite a bit. Like, "debating putting it down and never coming back" level of hating it. The fact that they decided to make it easier for you to die the more you die (because it's not like you don't die a bunch in a Fromsoft game :eyeroll:) would be bad enough on it's own, but I am regularly getting screwed over due to the game just not registering my inputs. Not because of animation commitments either (although it does feel like I have to mail out a request and wait 6-8 weeks for some of these attacks to finish) but just walking around an enemy and game refuses to dodge when told to.

Like...I'm really starting to hate this game. 🤬

As rough as DS1 got, its mechanics and gameplay never felt spiteful towards me. Hell, it was kind of the opposite. Like "Damn, you got rocked pretty hard there. Don't sweat it too much. Just pick yourself back up and give it another go!". This does not feel like that. This game feels like it's carrying a personal grudge against me.
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Boy oh boy, DS2 discussion time. DS2 is interesting to me because it hits this strange middleground spot where it does a lot of things that I enjoy and wish could have carried on in the series, but also has some overarching issues that weigh it down such that I consider it the worst game in the series. Not a bad game mind you, I'd still give it a solid rating and I come back to replay it once in a while, but things like tying invuln frames to a stat to the point that early game your rolls can feel completely useless, the inability to rotate your character in an attack chain making group combat painful in a game that loves to spam groups of enemies, lifegems unbalancing the heal economy, etc.

You already brought up the losing max HP on death, which is actually an attempt at replicating Demons Souls if you didn't know - in that game, even a single death cuts your max HP by half, which can only be mitigated by using one of only two ring slots to bring it back up to 75%, or restoring your body form which requires either killing a boss or using an extremely rare humanity-type of item. Gyrobot already mentioned the Ring of Binding, but it does about what it did in Demons Souls: halves the amount of HP lost, which between the loss being much more gradual in DS2 and humanity items being much more common I think it balances out.

Since I mentioned lifegems unbalancing the game, I should at least give that healing tip: if you've gotten anywhere in the Forest of Giants, you probably met the old lady merchant. Once you beat the Forest of Giants boss talking to her moves her back to Majula where she'll have an unlimited stock of basic lifegems for 300 souls each. This might seem a little steep in the earlygame, but trust me having 99 copies of a 300HP heal item makes Estus basically obsolete by the midgame outside of mid-combat healing.

Can't think of anything in particular for roll inputs just not happening. I've played through the game multiple times with a 360 controller myself and the main control issues I've always noticed felt related to the game rather than any controller issues, stuff like a slight deadzone that can make movement feel awkward and makes turning around feel like Mario 64, or being somewhat locked into a direction during an attack chain.

Best of luck and hope you can come to enjoy the game; DS2 has a lot of cool underlying mechanics like the balancing changes to spellcasters after DS1 and one of the best spell lists in the series, powerstancing letting you dual-wield all sorts of weapons, and bonfire ascetics making it the one DS game where you can refight bosses without replaying the entire game. It's just stuck behind a brutally and sometimes unfairly punishing game that in some cases feels like it took "Dark Souls Is Hard" memes too seriously (I mean, there's even a global player deaths counter in Majula and an achievement for your first death).
 
So...brief update. I have now found out about how enemies will stop respawning if killed enough times. As I have already had several times where I wasn't able to get my souls back before dying again, I feel like this aspect is going to very severely screw me over as things go on.

This game absolutely deserves its bad reputation.
 
I think the way DS3 framed your characters max health is lowkey genius. Mechanically it works almost identically to DS2, but instead of framing it as losing a part of your baseline health bar its treated as an temporary extra bit of health on top your normal bar. You are still missing a piece of your max health after death, the UI just doesn't show it.


Pi In The Sky said:
So...brief update. I have now found out about how enemies will stop respawning if killed enough times. As I have already had several times where I wasn't able to get my souls back before dying again, I feel like this aspect is going to very severely screw me over as things go on.

This game absolutely deserves its bad reputation.
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You can join the Covenant of Champions in Majula if you need to infinitely respawn enemies. It brings back despawned enemies while it's active.
 
n ko said:
I think the way DS3 framed your characters max health is lowkey genius. Mechanically it works almost identically to DS2, but instead of framing it as losing a part of your baseline health bar its treated as an temporary extra bit of health on top your normal bar. You are still missing a piece of your max health after death, the UI just doesn't show it.
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I also really liked the "Embered" status visually.

The first time I played DS3, I stared at the smolder effects on my character's clothes for long periods. It just looks really neat.
 
Recently started a DS1 SL1 run and boy does most of it feel easy after DS3 SL1. I haven't even used any pyromancy.

At this point I've beaten the base game minus the final boss and just started the DLC and only Sanctuary Guardian and Four Kings have given me any trouble. The combos bosses can do are just shorter, simpler and slower compared to DS3. The midgame bosses in DS3 start really punishing panic rolling and Estus use, but that just doesn't ever really happen in base game DS1.

I'm sure the DLC bosses will end up giving me more trouble. I know I am already dreading that dual Sanctuary Guardian fight.
 
n ko said:
Its there from the beginning, you have to follow a short path to the right of where you enter Heide's tower of flame.

*right instead of left
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Ah, my inability to see paths that are just off to the side rears its ugly head once again (hi, I'm one of those people that missed the way to Undead Burg from Firelink and instead went to the Graveyard). Thanks for the directions.
 
n ko said:
Recently started a DS1 SL1 run and boy does most of it feel easy after DS3 SL1. I haven't even used any pyromancy.

At this point I've beaten the base game minus the final boss and just started the DLC and only Sanctuary Guardian and Four Kings have given me any trouble. The combos bosses can do are just shorter, simpler and slower compared to DS3. The midgame bosses in DS3 start really punishing panic rolling and Estus use, but that just doesn't ever really happen in base game DS1.

I'm sure the DLC bosses will end up giving me more trouble. I know I am already dreading that dual Sanctuary Guardian fight.
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Manus is probably the hardest of the DLC bosses, tbh. Artorias is difficult sure, and if you let him power up he can oneshot you, but otherwise it's not too bad. Manus on the other hand has a LOT of hard hitting attacks that'll kill you instantly, not to mention his magic in the second phase of the fight where you either have to do some really good dodging or perfectly time the amulet deflection.

But yeah overall, DS1 is the easiest SL1 game of the three, at least partially because unlike the others your SL1 option is a bit... differently balanced? Since Pyromancer is your SL1 instead of deprived, your stats are organized in such a way that you have two attunement slots + easy pyromancy access... in the game where pyromancy has no stat requirements and is powered up exclusively by upgrading the pyromancy flame. Plus, the game is slower paced in general than DS3 such that a lot of bosses can be dodged by just circling around or rolling past one or two attacks. Also easily accessible good shields (lmao Balder shield with 100% physical resist and 74 stability at +14 - 78 stability if you decide to go crystal +4 which is a decent option for shields) in the game where shields are the most OP in the series.

Are you planning to go for a DS2 SL1 run as well at this rate? That one might be my choice for hardest of the trilogy, because DS2 is balanced way differently around the leveling curve. The game expects you to be hitting level 200+ by endgame compared to ~100, and the Deprived starts with only 6 points in every stat. DS2 is massively equipment dependent to SL1 because you desperately need things like Cale's Helm or the Workhook to buff your stats and actually wield any weapons, or farming the peasants garb to have more than about 6 iframes on your dodges.

Pi In The Sky said:
So...brief update. I have now found out about how enemies will stop respawning if killed enough times. As I have already had several times where I wasn't able to get my souls back before dying again, I feel like this aspect is going to very severely screw me over as things go on.

This game absolutely deserves its bad reputation.
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People have already brought up the Covenant of Champions, but yeah there's just... a lot of little things that add up to make DS2 a slog in many different ways. I think once you've cleared the game once and come back with a better understanding of its mechanics, the areas, and so on, the game vastly improves, but it's totally understandable that a lot of people drop it before that point.
 
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The Dark Souls modding community have cracked the code on the engine, and honestly it's approaching Doom levels of crazy

There aren't just one, but two total conversion mods being worked on right now; Dark Souls: Nightfall and Dark Souls III Archthrones. It's honestly incredible given how much effort these people are putting in.


 
McFluffles said:
in the game where pyromancy has no stat requirements and is powered up exclusively by upgrading the pyromancy flame.
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This is why I traded my glove to Snuggly. I'm sure I could make some unholy RTSR pyromancy wombocombo to one-shot most bosses in the game, but that seems to miss the point of doing an SL1 run in the first place.

McFluffles said:
Are you planning to go for a DS2 SL1 run as well at this rate? That one might be my choice for hardest of the trilogy, because DS2 is balanced way differently around the leveling curve.
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I've heard this from elswhere too, I'm saving it for last for that reason.
 
n ko said:
This is why I traded my glove to Snuggly. I'm sure I could make some unholy RTSR pyromancy wombocombo to one-shot most bosses in the game, but that seems to miss the point of doing an SL1 run in the first place.
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Fair enough; yeah without the pyromancy glove SL1 DS1 would certainly get harder, though not impossible or anything; main benefits of pyromancy is high fire damage on demand and Power Within letting you do some damage stacking strats. Heck, I've seen a quick kill done against Kalameet with the right combination of iirc Power Within, Red Tearstone Ring, Dusk Crown, and the Fire Tempest spell - the damage buff stacking just makes each pillar do so much damage you win easy.

Personally, I tend to look at SL1 as "anything goes as long as its within the bounds of the game/isn't just summoning allies to do all the work for you", but it's understandable to want to avoid something that breaks the game as hard as DS1 pyromancy.
 
StellarSeeker said:
The Dark Souls modding community have cracked the code on the engine, and honestly it's approaching Doom levels of crazy

There aren't just one, but two total conversion mods being worked on right now; Dark Souls: Nightfall and Dark Souls III Archthrones. It's honestly incredible given how much effort these people are putting in.


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Can't watch these atm, what do the mods do?
 
Red Orion said:
Can't watch these atm, what do the mods do?
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They're both total conversion mods that actually shuffle around vast pieces of the worldspaces of each game, almost creating new games.

The opening of DS1: Nightfall involves you jumping off the cliff at the Undead Asylum...and downwards into the Kiln of the First Flame.

DS3: Archthrones is taking its world design cues from Demons' Souls (five different worldspaces that you fast travel to from the nexus) and is evidently made by big fans of DS2.
 
Red Orion said:
Can't watch these atm, what do the mods do?
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Both mods are functionally new Souls games, down to the music, the enemies, the layout, and the voice acting.

Specifically, Archthrones revamps DS3 into something more similar in structure to Demon's Souls while also adding in new enemies and bosses through porting and backporting animations from Sekiro and other Souls games (original animations too, probably), while Nightfall is a totally new experience with an entire new story, revamped combat mechanics, and a Majora's Mask-inspired time travel system.
 
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Small update before bed. Using several of the tips and advice generously given (MVPs are the Rapier, usefulness of Lifegems, and the Champion covenant allowing farming for leveling/upgrading despite the occasional total loss of souls) I've managed to work my way to The Last Giant and found victory. Now that I've, seemingly, gotten past the initial hump of all of DS2 being DS2 I'm tentatively hopeful that things should be a bit smoother then they have been.
 
Just beat the double Sanctuary Guardian fight with SL1 and no pyromancy. This has to be the hardest thing I've ever done in any souls game, took me hours of banging my head against a wall.

3000 souls each and they respawn infinitely.

It feels like the developers mock me.
 
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n ko said:
Just beat the double Sanctuary Guardian fight with SL1 and no pyromancy. This has to be the hardest thing I've ever done in any souls game, took me hours of banging my head against a wall.

3000 souls each and they respawn infinitely.

It feels like the developers mock me.
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I'm surprised you'd try the double Sanctuary Guardian fight at all; it's not only 100% optional, I don't think most people even count it as an actual boss between the only 3000 souls thing and not even dropping their souls (even if Sanctuary Guardian Soul has zero reason to exist, since it does nothing).

Wouldn't be surprised if you're right and it's just a developer troll.
 
Update: Finished DS1 SL1. Parrying Gwyn to death is always a nice way to end a run.

McFluffles said:
I'm surprised you'd try the double Sanctuary Guardian fight at all; it's not only 100% optional, I don't think most people even count it as an actual boss between the only 3000 souls thing and not even dropping their souls (even if Sanctuary Guardian Soul has zero reason to exist, since it does nothing).

Wouldn't be surprised if you're right and it's just a developer troll.
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Yeah It's pretty clear that the boss wasn't designed to be fought this way, especially SL1. The winning fight was me just kiting the bosses and fishing for one specific attack and hoping the other one was busy when it happened. Doing anything else had a high risk of instant death.

I'm 99% sure the devs just added the fight without bothering to balance it too much as an optional challenge.
 
n ko said:
Update: Finished DS1 SL1. Parrying Gwyn to death is always a nice way to end a run.


Yeah It's pretty clear that the boss wasn't designed to be fought this way, especially SL1. The winning fight was me just kiting the bosses and fishing for one specific attack and hoping the other one was busy when it happened. Doing anything else had a high risk of instant death.

I'm 99% sure the devs just added the fight without bothering to balance it too much as an optional challenge.
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It's also meant as a way to get the tail cut reward from the Sanctuary Guardian even if you already have defeated it.
Though it's weird they even let you have a retry, every other boss with a severable tail just goes "lol, see you next NG cycle" if you don't get it. Even the Gargoyle mobs don't respawn.
 
More small DS2 update:

Things continue to progress relatively smoothly. Found and took down The Pursuer without too much difficulty. Tracked down the Elite Knight armor and picked that up (I have a soft spot for that set from the first game. Took me very far. RIP Oscar. :cry:) Something else I do have another criticism of is that my Rapier seems rather fragile. I don't recall my weapon being damaged this much in DS1. I'm not sure if that's just a tradeoff of that particular weapon, or if I'm only now noticing durability going down now that I'm not constantly dying as I was before.
 
DS2 is basically the only game in the series where durability actually matters, outside of a few select weapons that use it for special attacks like the Moonlight Greatsword. Everything repairs if not broken when resting at bonfires, but lighter weapons and some rings can be a pain. Highly recommend having a backup weapon you can swap to when the rapier is almost broken, or just carrying arpund some repair powder (though you can't buy that in bulk until later).
 
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