Eevee Therapy for Little Magi (Pokemon x F/SN)
- Thread starter Tale Swapper
- Start date
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Also, aside from not teaching the lesson they thought it would, it's going to teach Shirou and Ilya that the adults/role models can't be trusted implicitly to help them. Ilya especially since she's had her trust in just about every authority figure she's had broken or destroyed at one point or another and only relatively recently been letting her guard down.
The stupid redhead was smart enough to figure out that successfully running away from the Mega Evolved Lopunny is impossible, and only chose to run on the gamble that he could get back to town before it caught him, increasing the number of combatants on his side.
Shirou didn't make the stupid decision, Akari and co, you did, if you wanted him to learn to run, make it so that it's actually the better option, as it is it didn't become the better option until Yagi was wounded badly enough that they didn't have a hope of fighting Astolpho off.
If your opponent is faster than you, don't run, you'll just die tired. You fight, because that's your best chance to win and survive.
Congratulations, you've succeeded! Now he's going to try and kill any possible threats as soon as possible! An overwhelming threat gets an overwhelming response.
As it is, Shirou actually tried talking first, now you've taught him that talking is pointless and to be avoided at all costs, it's better if he strikes first.
Miho Chan
One with too many ideas
- Location
- Hummelstown
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Correct! I'm glad everyone figured out where the Ancient Hero fucked up. You'll see where the ACE trainer fucked up next chapter (TLDR she shouldn't have agreed in the first place), but hey, these are imperfect characters making imperfect choices! Anyway, some responses to comments~
@Barghest Blue In general, you are correct. Well, at least, to a point. There's definitely some intent in our writing process that isn't coming across properly, and the people involved are probably coming across as needlessly callous in general, but yeah, there's definitely a path to interpreting it as "Teaching Bad Lessons" instead of "Trying to teach these kids to not get in over there heads".
As for the latter bit, this is... probably not accurate at all. I get that people dislike this scene and chapter, but I'm really not sure how Shirou goes from "Unwilling to run away from danger when he really should" to "time to immediately escalate to 'kill all my problems' because they'll just try and kill me."
As for the running bit, I do believe that there is a difference between standing and fighter versus doing everything in your power to get away. The "wrong answer" according to the Mega-Lopunny was standing and fighting with the expectation of winning or perhaps stalling long enough for someone to come help, instead of defaulting to diversionary tactics and such that they have access to to slow their pursuer down, especially so close to a town with a Gym in it, where they would be safe.
(I am not trying to justify the actions of the fictional characters we've written, but please actually take a second to consider things from all perspectives and such before casting judgement just because bad things happened to the MCs)
If Tale typed in Ibuki somewhere instead of Fubuki, that's the typo actually causing the confusion here. Bucky is a reference to a certain anime about a certain group of girls that may also be ships.
*nods* It was. There were better tests Akari could have concocted... such as not testing Shirou here at all, and just letting the Therapists do their job. Unfortunately, Lady Akari has her own giant basket of problems and authority issues.
@Barghest Blue In general, you are correct. Well, at least, to a point. There's definitely some intent in our writing process that isn't coming across properly, and the people involved are probably coming across as needlessly callous in general, but yeah, there's definitely a path to interpreting it as "Teaching Bad Lessons" instead of "Trying to teach these kids to not get in over there heads".
As for the latter bit, this is... probably not accurate at all. I get that people dislike this scene and chapter, but I'm really not sure how Shirou goes from "Unwilling to run away from danger when he really should" to "time to immediately escalate to 'kill all my problems' because they'll just try and kill me."
As for the running bit, I do believe that there is a difference between standing and fighter versus doing everything in your power to get away. The "wrong answer" according to the Mega-Lopunny was standing and fighting with the expectation of winning or perhaps stalling long enough for someone to come help, instead of defaulting to diversionary tactics and such that they have access to to slow their pursuer down, especially so close to a town with a Gym in it, where they would be safe.
(I am not trying to justify the actions of the fictional characters we've written, but please actually take a second to consider things from all perspectives and such before casting judgement just because bad things happened to the MCs)
The main problem with the way it has come across is that you seemed to think they didn't fuck up.
Or at least, that's how your posts up until now seemed.
It seems to me like everyone involved needs to be the subject of a not-particularly-nice AAR, here. Not sure who would deliver it though.
Dopplerdee
Accident Prone(Yes the caps are necessary)
- Location
- Happy Place
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I honestly really like the chapter. The adults fucked up, but adults do that sometimes and this was a plain from an adult who has a combo of being traumatized as fuck and being old and powerful enough that people probably don't tell tmher to fuck off enough. I'm exited for what the adults who aren't doing dumb shit because of trauma are going to do. Because this could be good for Akari, and all it took was traumatizing some already traumatized children.
Are you a legendary? Cursing a castle to freeze to death, would require an Ice age.
actually Shirou defaulted to diplomacy...the issue was that no thought was given to how to HANDLE that response...he even said that he had orders to attack...at that point it is entirely reasonable to assume that escape is impossible. at which point it's either fight and hope you get lucky or lay down and die in a real world setting. as i said it was a Bad test and i hope Ilya takes a potshot at Akari...kinda like the magic version of slapping her for being so stupid(and as someone who has lived as long as she has Akari should know better). And before someone jumps in and says "Ilya wouldn't know Gandr" i counter with there is no way the Einzberns would let her go NOT knowing the standard magus attack spell.
Edit: Maybe add a scene in the next chapter where Shirou uses this as justification to WHY he stayed and fought.
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This case was like having someone face a attack helicopter with a pistol. They can't run because it's faster and can out-manoeuvre them. The only chance, no matter how little, is to fight back and pray you get a lucky shot.
If this doesn't have the League come down on Akari and the Clans I don't know what is.
If this doesn't have the League come down on Akari and the Clans I don't know what is.
Ya I think once Shirou explains his though process after they explain the idea someone probably the Ace Trainer is going to be lightly smacking their head on a desk or wall or something especialy against a Lopunny which trying to get into a agility match with one in a Forest is veeery likely to end with you dead especialy with how things seemed to be portrayed
Either way its the sort of thing that can be Pulled off but the Execution on the whole thing was botched a fair bit and it will probably come up in hindsight especialy since they burned bridges and tap danced on the Ashes
Either way its the sort of thing that can be Pulled off but the Execution on the whole thing was botched a fair bit and it will probably come up in hindsight especialy since they burned bridges and tap danced on the Ashes
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xbox432
Lover of Editing
Ah, no. That's a mistake on my end, I got the name mixed up. And, well, Kancolle/Azur Lane reference aside, I'm still sure that "Buki" would be better than "Bucky" simply due to how they are pronounced. Because right now all that's popping into my head with that spelling is the Winter Soldier.
Though as I've never watched/played either of those, I'm willing to bow out on the point.
grommile
nasty-minded old cynic
- Location
- NERV-Mercia
- Pronouns
- Traditional/Animate
Yeah, "Bucky" would work for a name that ends in -baki (if you look at how Japanese handles loan words, English 'short u' /ʌ/ and schwa /ə/ get mapped to 'a' e.g. JP basu for EN bus) but not for a name that ends in -buki.
Dopplerdee
Accident Prone(Yes the caps are necessary)
- Location
- Happy Place
- Pronouns
- She/Her
It's not a standard attack. It's an old Finnish curse. The Einzbern use their hair to make familiars as their standard attack.
I'm having serious doubts with that.
A different mega(Glalie, Camelrupt,Aggron)could work, but one that outspeeds him and his team by that much rendered it a non-choice, it'd only ever generate the correct reaction in someone who is either naive or driven mainly by fear.
Someone with the presence of mind and courage to do threat assessment can only conclude that their best bet is to fight.
So it was down to forcing a fear reaction.
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I mean, I agree, in that 'adults doing dumb shit because they're dumb' is always going to be true, and it's certainly conveyed in the chapter. But this is more than just dumb; this is 'egregiously immoral and poorly planned to a hilarious degree'-levels of brain-dead stupid from multiple adults who all should have known better, which makes the whole situation feel contrived to me. I'm assuming Akari is doing this to prep the MCs for Ultra Beasts dropping on them, since by canon they usually randomly and suddenly attack Fallers especially, completely by surprise? Or maybe some other threat that's had its attention drawn to Shirou and Illya, or something similar? You don't prep for that situation by attacking the kids, hurting them, and trying to use that to teach them to run. You fix that situation by taking the kids into a room, talking to them and calmly explaining the situation first, then setting up defenses and safeguards to prevent the worst from happening, and maybe allowing for someone to accompany/shadow them to keep them safe should the worst happen and give them time to run. Doing the former seems out of character for Akari, who I feel has come off so far as extremely experienced and having lots of wisdom due to their experiences, but maybe this is just the next step in her characterization: showing that her experiences have seriously distorted her too, and her expectations for reactions in dangerous situations is horribly skewed. In which case, great set-up, but it still feels a little off.
Indeed practically speaking just running would never work in this case at bare minimum there would have to be something involved to tweak the odds as happened here by tricking it into thinking they were battling, locking it in place for a moment, making it look away, getting tailwind up and only then running because even with all that Shirou only rated his chances as can maybe make it to around the town's perimeter while if he'd just run that maybe would turn to impossible.
..The Pokèkiller..
Wonder how his good ol' dad would feel about the alleged sightings of "The Pokèkiller" and his Einzbern Companion..
Wait a minute..
I did, the thing is that I can't see a perspective where Shirou didn't make every correct choice here (that isn't from a perspective going into this expecting him to fail and only justifying why afterwards), when the abnormal powerful Pokemon appeared (opening the encounter with an attack that was dodged) Shirou tried diplomacy but that was rebuffed (Astolpho outright stated that he had orders to attack), so Shirou was up against an opponent faster than him and his team who was determined to attack them, and the only correct answer there is to fight, not to win but to survive.
Running is explicitly the wrong choice in this scenario, because there is nothing they could realistically do to get away from Astolpho if he doesn't let them. Even when he did run Shirou fully expected to get caught at some point (notice how he didn't slow down once he started) he was just trying to move the fight closer to town so he could get some help. He never had any expectation of getting away, he was just trying to get to potential allies.
Sometimes running and diversionary tactics just aren't the best choice, especially if you only have a limited number of the latter (because you can only expect them to work once).
Shirou made every correct choice here, and him getting punished here will only incentivise him not doing so. in the future. The problem came from when Shirou didn't react as Akari and the others evidently expected him to, because that then locked him into having to fight for his life.
A similar situation in F/SN is when Berserker and Illya showed up after Shirou was introduced to Kotominei, an overwhelming force that they couldn't run from, and their only choice was to fight.
- Location
- usa
I'll be honest, if Akari doesn't get a broken nose from how fast Ilya slams the door in her face I'm gonna be disappointed. My first instinct is to be as spiteful as possible and I'm not half as bad off as Ilya is.
Like, I'd definitely not listen to a word they say, call the league on them, let the professors know, and try to curse them, as a starter, and I'm not an Ilya who hangs around a fairy type and a ghost/ice type.
Like, I'd definitely not listen to a word they say, call the league on them, let the professors know, and try to curse them, as a starter, and I'm not an Ilya who hangs around a fairy type and a ghost/ice type.
- Location
- TX
I'd let them try to explain themselves first, before breaking any noses, but then, I'm not Ilya... I think that's what Shiro is more likely to do.
...The question here is if Shiro can talk Ilya down enough for that to happen. And, yes. I know this is not the Shiro of canon here.
...The question here is if Shiro can talk Ilya down enough for that to happen. And, yes. I know this is not the Shiro of canon here.
Miho Chan
One with too many ideas
- Location
- Hummelstown
- Pronouns
- She/Her
*nods*
Well, that's all very good information to know, thank you all for the feedback, it genuinely is helpful.
Honestly, at this point, it might be better to rewrite this chapter somewhat so that intent on the authorial end comes through without, well, frank stupidity uncharacteristic of one of the two characters conducting the 'test'.
*groans* The next chapter is absolutely going to need some tuning as a result. Oh well, it is what it is, and being consistent to the characters in question. Hmmmm...
I'll talk it over with Tale tonight and see what he thinks.
Well, that's all very good information to know, thank you all for the feedback, it genuinely is helpful.
*groans* The next chapter is absolutely going to need some tuning as a result. Oh well, it is what it is, and being consistent to the characters in question. Hmmmm...
I'll talk it over with Tale tonight and see what he thinks.
- Location
- Omniverse #1345
Part of the problem as I see it is Akari seems to have misunderstood Shirou's problem in the first place. He isn't suicidally reckless. He's suicidally brave. (But working on it).
As a result no random confrontation of just his team with a random mon is actually going to touch on the problem, because the problem requires other people for him to be protecting. If it's just him he has no qualms about running the hell away if he thinks he can manage it.
As a result no random confrontation of just his team with a random mon is actually going to touch on the problem, because the problem requires other people for him to be protecting. If it's just him he has no qualms about running the hell away if he thinks he can manage it.
- Location
- usa
It's a bit of a catch 22, they all did things that could be reasonably expected of their characters, assuming terrible communication skills (like, 5 minutes on a phonecall with the professors would have instantly told her this was a dumb idea) are the norm for Akari, and the end result should still end with a spiteful Ilya shutting her out the way it's turned out so far.
Reminds me of some authors and how when they start writing the characters, well, 'in character', that a scene or plotline goes completely off the rails of what they were planning originally.
Reminds me of some authors and how when they start writing the characters, well, 'in character', that a scene or plotline goes completely off the rails of what they were planning originally.
- Location
- Canada
Is Illya spiteful enough to also include lord wyrdeer? She did threaten the warden how she would respond if Shirou or any Pokemon had a scratch. Just get Shirou to make an S rank pie, but only let it have a nibble while she is still the warden but promise multiple full pie if they get a replacement warden. Also gandr can't be the only curse she could possibly know, I'm sure Illya knows dozens of curses and she'll have cast at least 5 by the end of next chapter.
- Location
- Belfast
Illya has Wishcraft... if she's willing to burn the Prana then she has whatever effect she wants