- Location
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[X] 160
If the character knows about certain abilities they will use them as best they can. This includes your rivals as well as you. If they haven't fought people before then they'll default to what they believe is best.How does the first ability interact with Unwilling Shield and Body Armour? If you use FILO, it doesn't, and if you use FIFO, it pierces both of them. Next, both that second case and the second ability should result in Body Armour blocking our first melee attack, which means that when the Man With A Gun doesn't have minions, we're actually worse off in combat with these abilities (-10 total damage dealt)... unless we can choose not to use Breath of Eternity? We haven't had a 1vs.1 battle yet since getting higher Phantasm than our Wonder, so I don't know if "Will be used at the beginning of battle." is an option or a requirement.
Korkator said:Nothing you said here answers either question you quoted; the first question is about the order of ability resolution (FILO=First In Last Out, FIFO=First In First Out), and the second question is about whether or not John can choose to use Breath of Eternity or not at the beginning of combat.
Are you trying to say John needs to fight more for the players to find out how his abilities or combat rules work?
Lost Star said:Ah my bad, I tend to answer questions briefly and quickly and I miss things. The breath weapon is not required. He'll use it default if there are more than one people, but he will judge based on enemy abilities and tactics they use.
As for order of ability activation, it's sort of whatever makes sense rather than any hard rules. In this case the chase ability people brought up would have triggered after the smoke bomb.
That answer your questions?
Korkator said:It does; apologies for snapping at you. I mistook that post for a non-answer pretending to be a real one, and I have no patience for those.
Do I have permission to quote this to the thread? Nightmares of Wind having no effect on Smoke Bomb is an important detail. (Since if Smoke Bomb successfully triggers then the Man With A Gun has fled already and Nightmares of Wind only prevents fleeing, not undoes it after the fact... but... if NoW bothers to trigger at all, and you're basing this off of "makes sense", then doesn't that mean it still can?)Wait, hmm, even though you answered my questions, I am still confused. This is another example of why I was making the FIFO/FILO distinction; if it's like the MTG stack (FILO), where all the relevant abilities are tallied, then resolved in reverse order, Nightmares of Wind would work to counter Smoke Bomb, like so;
1. Man With A Gun reaches 0 Cohesion
2. Smoke Bomb triggers, but hasn't resolved yet.
3. John uses Nightmares of Wind, but it hasn't resolved yet.
4. No more ability effects are being added to the stack, so we start resolving.
5. Nightmares of Wind resolves, preventing escape.
6. Smoke Bomb resolves, and it's escape is prevented.
7. Stack empty, go to next turn of combat.
Whereas if it's FIFO instead, we have this;
1. Man With A Gun reaches 0 Cohesion
2. Smoke Bomb triggers, and immediately resolves, MWAG leaves combat.
3. John uses Nightmares of Wind, and it immediately resolves, accomplishing nothing since no one but John is in the fight regardless.
Likewise, here are the examples with Dragon Breath, Unwilling Shield, and Body Armour.
1. John uses Breath of Eternity (Dragon Breath edition), but it hasn't resolved.
2. Unwilling Shield triggers, but hasn't resolved.
3. Body Armour triggers, but hasn't resolved.
4. No more effects for the stack, start resolving.
5. Body Armour resolves, it doesn't get used up because it hasn't taken damage yet.
6. Unwilling Shield resolves, so the MWAG is no longer a valid target.
7. Breath of Eternity (DBe) resolves, disabling abilities for the Manikins only.
8. Manikins break, then MWAG's turn.1. John uses Breath of Eternity (DBe), and it immediately resolves, disabling abilities and dealing 11 damage to all enemies.
2. Unwilling Shield never gets a chance to trigger or resolve, and Body Armour is fully functional next turn, since it did not trigger or resolve to block damage.
3. Manikins break, MWAG at 34 Cohesion, then MWAG's turn.
...but that's all if the order is consistent; if you're willing to use inconsistent order, you can have all sorts of different results, like Breath of Eternity (DBe) piercing Unwilling Shield but not Body Armour, or since US is a targeting effect, BoE(DBe) piercing BA but not US.
Lost Star said:I'm going to be honest in that I'm not particularly treating it rule heavy so much as narrative heavy. I could nail down something solid, but to be frank that wouldn't quite fit the theme of the story now would it?
More seriously, I resolve conflicts by having them trigger in the way that best favors the skill in question. These aren't rulesets so much as people trying to leverage particular powers to the best of their ability. Narrative will trump solid rules. In my head I tend to go, 'Power Used > This power counters > This power counters that power. This one time use power can't be used against this power, so it doesn't trigger.'
It's not a hard and fast rule and I'm sorry about that, but playing to the letter of rules doesn't particularly fit what I'd like to write, and that's very important narrative.
Korkator said:Then, perhaps, is there a theme I can use to predict interactions instead of a hard rule?
The issue about the abilities is they're almost all described in terms of particular effects, with only the title for any further narrative, so several of them could be interpreted in different ways— for instance, since the Dark Scales ability is based on Dragon Scales (theme of surface-only) does that mean it will no longer protect against sunlight at half Cohesion? ...at the first wound? Does it instead offer partial protection? Like effectively making sources of damage deal more than normal, or acting like a strong poison effect as sunlight leaks in?
To summarize; is the ability extremely fragile, favoring the narrative of the dawn ending sleep and dreams forgotten in the morning, or is the ability robust, favoring the narrative of otherworldly supernatural powers winning out against the mundane with effort and resources?
Your handling of abilities has been fairly consistent so far— that's why I thought you were using hard rules, unwritten, in the first place— and they wouldn't be so if it weren't possible to clarify them.
P.S: For another example, I notice you didn't update the description of Stardust Wings, implying that you didn't think it needed updating. What theme were you thinking of that would clarify its remaining unsaid properties? The image I had for it is a wing-driven gust of stardust blowing away effects based on emotions like hate, spite, depression, and uncaring, presumably using an emotion based off of wonder or willful innocence.
Lost Star said:Dark scales won't go away at half health. It's probably best for you to ask questions if you're unsure of something. I'm admittedly bad at doing proper skill and item descriptions at times and can cause people to misinterpret things. It's a failing I'm likely not going to be able to change.
As for stardust wings, I did actually go back and adjust it slightly. It's meant to be only for you, and I've clarified that. If there are any other skills that might be causing confusion let me know.
Korkator said:We wont know which skill descriptions will cause confusion until we test them, one way or another, but I think I've collected answers to the questions I've had so far, even if not all of them were answered directly.
Would it be alright to copy/post this conversation (into a spoiler) in the thread?
Lost Star said:
460-160 = 300.
Yes, thank you for the gossamer catch tooI'm assuming that teaching Harold is a subvote-available task?
Slight problem with this vote; Night Night, Lucid Dreaming, and Dream of Wonder are all effectively prerequisites for Creating a Dream Form, and we probably want to use those as build-up for all the weirdness and disorientation people apparently have with the Dream Realm.[X] Teach Harold a power or powers.
-[X] Create Dream Form first.
[X] Help Meria (Locked)
[X] Visit the dream city and do Bounty
This is a terrible question, but also nice. I'm assuming this question is because of the lack of voters.Ok, serious question everyone. Is the voting too complicated? I'm guessing I'm doing something wrong there. Admittedly I'm getting a bit stalled on this quest, but I do try to keep going on them. Any comments or criticisms are welcome on it. I can and will simplify or change it if you want me to.
Simplicity might actually be what's wrong with this vote; due to my misinterpretation of some actions and pushing as a result, we're down to basically one action of our own (night), and everyone who voted so far feels there's only one choice there anyway. People might just not see much point voting this time.Any comments or criticisms are welcome on it. I can and will simplify or change it if you want me to.
I can allow this if you like
That might change if you allow something like this;
[] Plan Eyes On The Man With The Gun
[X] Plan Eyes On The Man With The Gun
This is possible. Though you'd need to find a very strong source of greed.Could we hunt for a specific dream? I'd like to graft a greedy dream, something that could allow us to add an opponent's Gossamer directly to our hoard.
Would taking the huge pile of gold and people we found be enough, or are they too happy and old to be useful?This is possible. Though you'd need to find a very strong source of greed.
This one is actually more a dream realm feature rather than anything else. You could probably dislodge it, but it might cause issues.Would taking the huge pile of gold and people we found be enough, or are they too happy and old to be useful?
You'd be able to do something with him.The Guardian is a dream, right? If we defeated him, we could use him in our form, to somehow help us guard our hoard, or we'd take his armor?