Remove ads

DC's "Suicide Squad" Casting Revealed

Ah, so it would be legal to kill Spider-man, as he is a spider, not a human being, just like how Killer Croc is a crocodile, not a human being.
 
I think everyone would be better served by dropping this argument before it goes to an ugly place.
 
Bakustra said:
Since Spider-man is white, he is still human despite having animal aesthetics. Unlike Killer Croc, who is a literal subhuman. Miles Morales better watch out.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No, because neither Miles Morales nor Peter Parker are spider-people. They are humans – a black kid and a white guy, respectively.

If Peter Parker or Miles Morales looked like this:


Then yes, I would absolutely agree that they're not really human or intended to be perceived as such, and claiming the latter as an example of black representation would be both absurd and obscene. Similarly, Deadshot is clearly a black guy. Killer Croc is a fucking crocodile-man, right down to the reptilian markings.

Jace911 said:
I think everyone would be better served by dropping this argument before it goes to an ugly place.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If it's going to an ugly place, it's because Bakustra is bizarrely determined to – rather than claiming the moral high ground – shove everyone else onto the low ground. Unfortunately, he has no leverage, so he's just slipping all over the place and making himself look like an asshole.
 
Revlid said:
No, because neither Miles Morales nor Peter Parker are spider-people. They are humans – a black kid and a white guy, respectively.

If Peter Parker or Miles Morales looked like this:


Then yes, I would absolutely agree that they're not really human or intended to be perceived as such, and claiming the latter as an example of black representation would be both absurd and obscene. Similarly, Deadshot is clearly a black guy. Killer Croc is a fucking crocodile-man, right down to the reptilian markings.


If it's going to an ugly place, it's because Bakustra is bizarrely determined to – rather than claiming the moral high ground – shove everyone else onto the low ground. Unfortunately, he has no leverage, so he's just slipping all over the place and making himself look like an asshole.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I don't think I have to claim the moral high ground against "animal aesthetics mean you're not human", dogg.
 
Mind you, if Miles looked like that and we had him quipping and saving people, with him having a bit of inner monologue about how both the jokes and the heroism kept him grounded when 99 percent of people that saw him screamed and ran and the remaining 1% opened fire, we'd have a goddamned tragedy. And I think there was a thread in Suicide Squad that wanted to portray a similar tragedy here. I think it just got lost in the actual treatment of Croc that we saw.
 
Revlid said:
If it's going to an ugly place, it's because Bakustra is bizarrely determined to – rather than claiming the moral high ground – shove everyone else onto the low ground. Unfortunately, he has no leverage, so he's just slipping all over the place and making himself look like an asshole.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I don't really care who's driving the bus over the cliff, but if you don't open the emergency exit and bail out then you aren't much smarter than he is.
 
Robert Liguori said:
Mind you, if Miles looked like that and we had him quipping and saving people, with him having a bit of inner monologue about how both the jokes and the heroism kept him grounded when 99 percent of people that saw him screamed and ran and the remaining 1% opened fire, we'd have a goddamned tragedy.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah, absolutely! But either way, you don't get to point at that 99% of people and say "oh those goddamn racists, #BLM" because that's not a black person it's a fucking spider monster. It can be a tragic, sympathetic spider-monster, it can be a spider-monster with a heart of gold, but it's still a spider-monster, and you can't expect people in the setting – or audiences, for that matter – to respond to it as anything else.

There's a reason no-one remembers Spawn was black, and it's because his visible race is "rotting skinless demon carcass" 99% of the time.

Bakustra said:
I don't think I have to claim the moral high ground against "animal aesthetics mean you're not human", dogg.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
"Animal aesthetics" would be a green t-shirt with a crocodile logo, or a crocodile tattoo, or a crocodile mask.

Killer Croc is a literal goddamn crocodile man.

Surely you must understand the difference, right? I mean, I already clearly indicated the distinction between someone with spider-aesthetics (Spider-Men of various identities) and a literal goddamn spider person. You get that there's a difference between Diablo – a latino man with a skull face tattoo – and a literal goddamn skeleton man, right? You do understand that it'd be total bullshit to claim a literal goddamn skeleton man as latino representation, even if he spoke Spanish? Even Nick Cage had a fuckton of screentime as "white guy", he didn't spend all of Ghost Rider as a screaming, burning skeleton (who by the way is white).

Jace911 said:
I don't really care who's driving the bus over the cliff, but if you don't open the emergency exit and bail out then you aren't much smarter than he is.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
"It doesn't matter who started it, blah blah blah"

Either weigh in, file a report, or keep your head down.
 
Last edited:
Killer Croc in this movie isn't even a crocodile man, but the broader point is that defining personhood on the base of appearance is morally wrong.
 
Bakustra said:
Killer Croc in this movie isn't even a crocodile man, but the broader point is that defining personhood on the base of appearance is morally wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Don't try and retroactively move the goalposts, man. All it takes is clicking back three pages to see exactly what your original point was:

Bakustra said:
Killer Croc, for example, is a guy who if he was white would be Crocodile-Man or the Alligator Avenger, but because he's black is treated as a subhuman monster and cannibal- so he acts within those bounds without letting them cage him mentally ("I am beautiful").
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
With all this talk of Killer Croc I feel the need to point out that while they did a good job making him look like a crocodile man, they failed to find someone sufficiently bulky or do proper practical effects to make him larger. It was fine for the first half of the movie when he wasn't shown in comparison to anyone else and was fully clothed, but once he stripped down he was just a regular sized dude. That is not what I think of when I think of Killer Croc.
 
mc2rpg said:
With all this talk of Killer Croc I feel the need to point out that while they did a good job making him look like a crocodile man, they failed to find someone sufficiently bulky or do proper practical effects to make him larger. It was fine for the first half of the movie when he wasn't shown in comparison to anyone else and was fully clothed, but once he stripped down he was just a regular sized dude. That is not what I think of when I think of Killer Croc.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yea, I think of the Killer Croc From the Arkham games, who's between 8 and 11 feet tall depending on the game. He needs to tower over everyone else.

 
Last edited:
Pictured: white reptilian


Pictured: white (German) devil



These are neither nor blue, but instead white. And both are treated as heroes based on their appearance and suffer no discrimination.

Right?

I mean its not like the general populace sees them and inhuman right?
 
I'm not really sure you want to use the Lizard as an example of someone treated as a hero or villain based on his appearance.

I mean, I'd assume that he's treated as a villain because he almost murdered a bunch of people on a bridge and tried to forcibly turn the entirety of New York into a bunch of humanoid lizardmen against their will, and that the fact that he's white is largely irrelevant to his treatment as a villain.

I'd sooner accept the Lizard as an example of ableism in action than as an example of a white dude getting better treatment in a film than black dudes in the same.
 
Well, yeah, that is very true.

But I couldn't think of any other similar reptilians in recent films so I went with the Lizard.
 
Revlid said:
Don't try and retroactively move the goalposts, man. All it takes is clicking back three pages to see exactly what your original point was:
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Does that conflict with "determining personhood based on appearance"? I don't see how it does. Maybe if you hadn't decided to go down the road of "literal subhuman" this would have remained an argument over whether a guy speaking AAVE in a thick Louisiana backwoods accent is readable as black or not.
 
So I just realized something that bugs me from all the spoilers being dropped here:

Are you telling me only one of the Suicide Squad actually died? And before the mission at that?
 
Aaron Peori said:
So I just realized something that bugs me from all the spoilers being dropped here:

Are you telling me only one of the Suicide Squad actually died? And before the mission at that?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Two. One in the beginning, one in the end. Three if you count the person who fell off the squad. Or 2½, depending on how you count persons, as it's kinda complicated then.
 
Last edited:
What's really funny is that Killer Croc in the comics is in fact white (well as much as a man - reptile can be considered white), and at no point in the movie do they indicate this is not the case in the movie. Other than one joke about him wanting to watch BET. So all this is based on the idea that only black people watch BET.
 
Last edited:
VolantRedX said:
What's really funny is that Killer Croc in the comics is in fact white (well as much as a man - reptile can be considered white), and at no point in the movie do they indicate this is not the case in the movie. Other than one joke about him wanting to watch BET. So all this is based on the idea that only black people watch BET.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Nnnno, Killer Croc is black in the comics. He may well have started out white – I don't recall any pre-green images of him from his original debut, where he was a shadowy crimelord using deadly hit-tactics to claw his way up to the top – but these days he's black. I think Brian Azarello started it – certainly, the Killer Croc that appears in Joker is very clearly African American, with just sharp teeth and rough skin to mark him out as different. This one follows the trend, and has a black actor.

If Croc was originally white, it's a race-change that no-one's noticed or really cared about, because at the end of the day he's still a fucking crocodile man. It'd be the weakest possible addition of diversity to the Batman cast – which character shall we make black? Oh, the big green crocodile man? Yeah, that makes sense. I'd rather they made Catwoman black, to match Eartha Kitt. Give me some real up-to-date movie synergy.
 
Last edited:
Revlid said:
Nnnno, Killer Croc is black in the comics. He may well have started out white – I don't recall any pre-green images of him from his original debut, where he was a shadowy crimelord using deadly hit-tactics to claw his way up to the top – but these days he's black. I think Brian Azarello started it – certainly, the Killer Croc that appears in Joker is very clearly African American, with just sharp teeth and rough skin to mark him out as different. This one follows the trend, and has a black actor.

I do believe Croc was originally white, but it's one of the few race-changes that no-one's noticed or really cared about, because at the end of the day he's still a fucking crocodile man. It's the weakest possible addition of diversity to the Batman cast – who shall we make black? Oh, the big green crocodile man? Yeah, that makes sense. I'd rather they made Catwoman black, honestly, to match Eartha Kitt.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That might be the case, but I know at least on the cartoon he implied to be of Italian decent, and they did have a black Catwoman after Eartha Kitt, but nobody liked that movie.
 
I don't really get why everyone is up in arms about Croc's aesthetics. I mean, he eats people. I think they're treating him like a monster because he is an actual cannibal (Shia LaBeouf).
 
Revlid said:
Yeah, absolutely! But either way, you don't get to point at that 99% of people and say "oh those goddamn racists, #BLM" because that's not a black person it's a fucking spider monster. It can be a tragic, sympathetic spider-monster, it can be a spider-monster with a heart of gold, but it's still a spider-monster, and you can't expect people in the setting – or audiences, for that matter – to respond to it as anything else.
.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

We are, though, supposed to remain on Parkers side when this happens to him

 
Flectarn said:
We are, though, supposed to remain on Parkers side when this happens to him
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That is at least in part because of the long background of heroism and knowing who Peter Parker IS under all of that spider monster though. If Peter Parker had a history of being a murderer and cannibal when he was running around as a spider monster I doubt we would be expected to sympathize with him.
 
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top