I had the same thought and double-checked who had Auspex in scenes where he showed up.
Yeah, Calhoun would've been discovered early on during his tenure as False Primogen of Clan Nosferatu. Newberry might've sat on the information for shits and giggles, but I seriously doubt Annabelle, Critias, and Rosa would refrain from pointing out the impostor among them.

I like how Jackson can swap between formal and street.
I share a lot of the same opinion with Andres, Jackson feels like a rags-to-riches story that still has ties to his roots.
Yeah, Kevin Jackson's rise to power is pretty cool if you ignore all the drug dealing and gang violence. That being said, the Prince does enjoy mingling with the inner-city folks he grew up with in his mortal disguise as wealthy philanthropist Bishop Blake. Additionally, he probably has some of my favorite dialogue in the Quest. He views his rough upbringing as a way to set himself apart from all the old, out-of-touch Princes in Europe as the new face of the Camarilla.

Celia and Sierra are cool to be around, it feels like they both put up this strong front to those around them because they don't want to be seen as weak or inexperienced, respectively.
That's the Lasombra for you. Showing weakness is anathema to any Magister worthy of the clan.

Gabriella's a very human Kindred. It feels like we're just hanging out with a friend making dumb bets. Makes me wonder what she sees in Ballard. I guess there's more to him than just his surface area.
If you look at her stat block in Let the Streets Run Red, Gabriella has a higher Humanity score than Artie.

As for the subject of Horatio Ballard, Gabriella likes him because he helped her out when no one else would. In turn, Ballard finds Gabriella endearing, even if he doesn't fully understand her explanations of how technology works these nights. I will say that while Ballard is far from a paragon of virtue, he is in an excellent position to reward his supporters. Certainly better than Naomi Stewart, anyway.
 
Yeah, Kevin Jackson's rise to power is pretty cool if you ignore all the drug dealing and gang violence.
Fair, I realize he's probably done some less than legally, socially or morally acceptable things. And I do have my own opinions on the subject. But I'm self-aware enough to know that the problems and circumstances of my home are unique to us, just like they would be anywhere else. There is no one-size fits all solution to the problems a person experiences.

If you look at her stat block in Let the Streets Run Red, Gabriella has a higher Humanity score than Artie.
Dang…by kindred standards she's basically a saint at that point.

As for the subject of Horatio Ballard, Gabriella likes him because he helped her out when no one else would. In turn, Ballard finds Gabriella endearing, even if he doesn't fully understand her explanations of how technology works these nights. I will say that while Ballard is far from a paragon of virtue, he is in an excellent position to reward his supporters. Certainly better than Naomi Stewart, anyway.
That makes sense why she would like him, glad to hear the positive relationship goes both ways.
 
Interlude 1.03
[X] [SOCIALIZE] Gengis introduced me to some of his Anarch comrades at Elysium.
[X] [SOCIALIZE] Sierra is hosting Elysium at the ballroom of the Diamond Yama.
[X] [SOCIALIZE] Wauneka and I swapped war stories with the homeless veterans on Lake Shore Drive.
[X] [SOCIALIZE] I grew curious about Naomi Stewart. She's not what you'd expect of a Blue Blood.
After the stockyards closed in the 1960s, Chicago's Kindred left Fuller Park to fester and become one of the most impoverished and underpopulated neighborhoods in the South Side, if not the entire Second City. Save for the odd criminal enterprise or bolt hole, the only things worth noting about Fuller Park are the rampant crime and widespread distrust of the police. These two factors allow licks like you and Gengis to practice the arts of Clan Brujah without much worry about risking the Masquerade.

Gengis's battered sedan groans with relief as he turns the ignition off. The car is an ancient model well below the prices you know Gengis can afford with his inherited wealth. However, you suspect your mawla only chose it because he'd be unlikely to miss it should it be stolen by a local carjacker.

You wait as Gengis fetches a duffel bag from the trunk before following him into the public park that gives the neighborhood its name. At this time of night, the place is deserted. Still, you keep an eye out for any witnesses as Gengis sets the duffel bag down on a picnic table rusted with disuse and lack of care from municipal authorities. "Remind me, Two-Face - you've already tasted the blood of a lick who knows how to use Celerity, right?"

"That's right," you confirm, trying not to let intrusive thoughts of your pitiful performance on Erzulie's dance floor resurface. The influence of your Presence can only linger so long in people's heads. By now, everyone in the Red No. 5's basement probably remembers how you tripped all over your feet and Erzulie's. "So anyway, how are you going to help me learn how to use the Blood to gain super speed?"

Instead of responding verbally, Gengis replies by cocking the hammer of his handgun, causing you to stop short. "I figure the best way to teach you is by playing a few rounds of Nines."

"Nines?" You echo, feeling nervous. Sure, regular ammunition doesn't pose as much of a threat to you as it did when you were still a mortal soldier, but part of you squirms at the thought of getting shot.

"It's like paintball, except with real guns."

"Won't someone get hurt in the crossfire, though?" You ask. Getting yourself shot is one thing, but treating guns like toys is asking for some unlikely bystander to get seriously hurt or even killed.

Gengis shrugs as he takes out a second handgun from the duffel bag. "Eh, in all honesty, we're probably doing the neighborhood a favor by training here. Violent crime keeps housing prices low and gentrifiers out. Plus, shitholes like this make for decent hunting grounds."

You stare at the firearm extended toward you. "No thanks. I'll just focus on using the Blood to help me dodge."

Gengis scoffs but takes the gun back, removing the magazine from the well and the bullet loaded in the chamber. "Suit yourself, Artie. I'll give you ten seconds, and then I'll start blasting. Ready? Ten, nine…"

Debt to Gengis (Debt 2)
In exchange for helping you unlock the Celerity Discipline, you owe Rupert "Gengis" Levine of Clan Brujah a big favor.

Celerity 1/5
  • Rapid Reflexes
    You can instantly perceive events and react to them with superhuman alacrity, allowing you to pull off stunts like dodging bullets. You suffer no penalty when defending against Firearms attacks without cover. You can also freely take a minor action worth up to two dice per turn, such as readying or reloading a weapon.
-​

By the time Gengis runs out of ammunition, you feel like you've gotten the hang of using your Blood to enhance your reflexes. Even as you rush toward Gengis head-on, the vampiric blood flowing through you allows you to crane your head just enough to avoid getting hit. It had been surreal to see nine millimeters of lead fly right past you in slow motion for the first time. It has also been quite disorienting to return to "normal" speeds after utilizing your newly-acquired super speed. That brief moment of vulnerability allowed Gengis to shoot you right in the back. Though the wound may have healed quickly, the humiliation still smarts.

When you return to the picnic table where Gengis left his duffel bag, another person is waiting for you alongside your mawla. Standing at five foot eight, she appears to be a young white woman in her late twenties with the left side of her scalp shaved. The other half has reddish-brown hair that falls to her right shoulder. Her retro wardrobe is the kind of ensemble that cycles back into fashion every few years but gives off the "young, brash Brujah" vibe to anyone in the know.


It only takes an instant for you to connect a title to a face from the Sheriff's dossiers. "Well, if it isn't the Baron of East Chicago herself."

The leader of the "Anarch Center" makes a face. "Please, just Anita. You must be the Prince's new Hound that all the Elysia have been talking about."

"Yes, I am. Artie Delacruz." You shake hands with Anita, who then gestures for you to take a seat at the picnic table. Out of the corner of your eye, you spy Gengis leaning back against a nearby trashcan. It seems he won't be taking part in the upcoming conversation.

You and Anita sit across from each other, contemplating each other in silence. After a few moments, Anita finally speaks. "Tell me, Artie. Why do you support the Camarilla?"

[] "The Camarilla is not without its flaws, but we can make it work better if we only just tried."
[] "The rules are there for a reason. Staying within the walls of the Ivory Tower is the only way we can survive the SI."
[] "I was a starving artist before my Embrace, and serving the Camarilla means never having to go back to those days."
[] "I guess I got used to taking orders while I was in the Army, and Prince Jackson is a better leader than most."
[] "Personal loyalty. The Nosferatu and most of my Mawali are part of the Camarilla, so I am, too."
[] "No real reason. If the Anarchs have a better alternative, let's hear it."
[] Let me write my own response to Anita's question.
 
[X] "The Camarilla is not without its flaws, but we can make it work better if we only just tried."
Focus on how the rules of the Camarilla are good but it's culture is really immoral and impractical. Maybe toss in that Artie thinks the Masquerade will eventually crack even further and the Ivory Tower is the best chance to influence things so Kindred don't get purged.
 
[X] "The Camarilla is not without its flaws, but we can make it work better if we only just tried."

I'm sure Artie can deduce he's not the first kindred to have this idea and he doesn't think he'll be the last. He knows what's he's working towards will be difficult and with some degree of violence. We can admit that ever since the Anarch's left the Camarilla lacks any cohesive reformist faction. Which means someone has to be the Bannerbearer despite the target such a position will give. But just because doing the right thing is hard doesn't mean it's not worth doing.

Me: For those who don't know in old medieval warfare the Bannerbearer was a crucial task and a position of honor in the army. They acted as a rallying point for soldiers in the middle of a battle and can be used as a marker to know where to go. The danger inherent in this position that you advertise your position and role to your enemy. Which incentivizes them in attacking you and this cause general confusion amongst the forces you were directing.

I suggest we ask her why she supports the Anarchs?
 
Me: For those who don't know in old medieval warfare the Bannerbearer was a crucial task and a position of honor in the army. They acted as a rallying point for soldiers in the middle of a battle and can be used as a marker to know where to go. The danger inherent in this position is that you advertise your position and role to your enemy, which incentivizes them in attacking you and this causes general confusion amongst the forces you were directing.
The position of standard-bearer lasted throughout the early modern period, too. Even today, the "regimental colors" play a role in military ceremonies.

The task of carrying the regimental colors often fell to rookie officers whose job was simply not to get themselves killed in battle. Given the number of veteran soldiers tasked with protecting Ensign Newbie, capturing the flag was a big deal and the stolen standard is proof of your unit's martial skill. Conversely, losing your colors was a massive blow to your unit's reputation.

I suggest we ask her why she supports the Anarchs.
Oh, Anita will tell you. Without spoiling too much, her argument essentially boils down to the foolishness inherent in waiting for your "betters" to cede whatever scraps they think you deserve.
 
The position of standard-bearer lasted throughout the early modern period, too. Even today, the "regimental colors" play a role in military ceremonies.

The task of carrying the regimental colors often fell to rookie officers whose job was simply not to get themselves killed in battle. Given the number of veteran soldiers tasked with protecting Ensign Newbie, capturing the flag was a big deal and the stolen standard is proof of your unit's martial skill. Conversely, losing your colors was a massive blow to your unit's reputation.
Thank you for clarifying and extrapolating on what I was trying to explain. I brought it up because it seemed like a good analogy to what Artie's planning to do.

The details surrounding the role of the Standard-bearer differs between cultures and historical periods. For example in Rome, the Standard-bearer, or Signifier was also the legion's banker. An interesting decision for sure, though keeping the guy responsible for signing your paycheck alive, makes a degree of sense.

Oh, Anita will tell you. Without spoiling too much, her argument essentially boils down to the foolishness inherent in waiting for your "betters" to cede whatever scraps they think you deserve.
A reasonable point of view to have. The flaws within Kindred culture can be harken all the way back to its founding, unfortunately. Cain created a society that is incapable of sustaining itself in large numbers or in the long run. Kindred have seen the cycle of the newer generation rising up against their tyrannical elders occur at least twice.
 
Interlude 1.04
[X] "The Camarilla has flaws, but we can make it work better if we only just tried."
"I'll be the first to admit that the Camarilla is far from perfect, but we can still reform the system from within. The Traditions keep Kindred safe, but the Masquerade will only fracture even further. Staying inside the Ivory Tower is our best chance, but we need to shore up its foundations. Reforming the Camarilla will be an uphill battle, but it's the right thing to do. The only thing we can do."

The expression on Anita's face is one of pity - not quite the reaction you were expecting. It's the look you might've given a rookie soldier fresh out of boot camp, eager to shoot terrorists as if real life were Call of Duty. "You know, if it weren't for those scars, I'd think you were one of the Brujah loyalists. You sound an awful lot like Critias."

"I know I'm not the first lick to notice the issues, and probably not the last, either. Still, someone has to try and make things better."

"But that's the thing, Artie. People have been trying. They've been trying since the Convention of Thorns established the Camarilla in 1493. What do they have to show for it? Nothing. It's been over five hundred years, and we still have to put up with the feudal system that governed Europe centuries ago, established by elders who still believe giving power to the 'unwashed masses' was a mistake."

Anita leans back, away from the table, as she exhales through her nostrils. Vampires don't need to breathe, but the little human tics help keep the Beast at bay. "I hate to sound like a geriatric, but you've got to understand what unlife was like before all the elders started packing their bags for the Middle East. The licks who came before us had an iron grip on the reins of power, and they sure weren't using it to benefit all Kindred.

"Whatever you think about the assholes over in the Beltway, you can at least vote them out. Failing that, you find a tolerable successor while you wait for the incumbent to croak. That isn't the case with the elders who run the Ivory Tower. Once a lick seized power, they never let go. The only way things could improve was if others did something about it. Do you think the Old Prince would have stepped down had enough of us mailed in a politely-worded complaint?"

You shake your head. Prince Lodin was before your time as a vampire, but you've heard enough stories to know that he was a real piece of work, even for a Blue Blood. Anita continues. "Of course not. It took a pack of Lupines to overthrow the Old Prince. The elders might throw us some scraps here and there, but they'll never grant us the power to make real change. Ask yourself this: do you think King George would have granted the thirteen colonies autonomy had they not started the Revolution?"

Anita shakes her head. "Enlightened absolutism sounds fine on paper, but it assumes that the ones in charge know what they're doing. The way things have gone over the last decade or two, we're convinced that the Camarilla will end up ruling over a pile of Kindred ashes at best. However, it's far more likely that they'll drag us all down into the Inquisition's barbecue pit."

You've carefully watched Anita as she delivered her speech. Though she contains it well, the righteous indignation of Clan Brujah burns fiercely within her. To try and put out the flames a bit, you ask, "What about the Traditions, then?"

Anita takes a moment to collect herself before responding. "Most of the Traditions are common sense. Our issues are less with the law and more with the people enforcing them."

"You mean people like me, right?"

"Gengis has told us you're not the kind of lick who'd abuse their authority, and I'm surprised to hear myself say that I almost believe him. However, your fellow Camarilla officials aren't so conscientious."

"Alright, so walk me through how the Anarchs view the Traditions," you reply, leaning forward so that you can knit your fingers together while resting your elbows on the table.

Anita appears unfazed by the increased intensity of your scrutiny. "The First Tradition, the Masquerade, makes sense. More than ever with the Second Inquisition on our backs. Any lick could bring the hunters down on our heads. No, it's not the Masquerade we have a problem with - it's how the Camarilla enforces it."

"You mean the ban on computers and smartphones?"

"Exactly. The Anarchs may be more vulnerable to the scrutiny of the NSA, but we're also better connected with the Movements in other domains. The blanket ban on modern technology makes every Camarilla city an island. It might be safer in the short term, but the Cammies are setting themselves up for defeat in detail. We must all hang together, lest we all hang separately, and all that.

"The Second Tradition of Domain also makes sense. Each of us has our territory, even if it's only a basement studio, but the feudal system the Camarilla insists on enforcing makes it a problem. 'My roof, my rules' is an excellent principle, but I don't want my roof under the umbrella of some big-headed lick. If the Jackson regime wants my respect, they could start by not pulling the authority card while standing in the middle of my haven.

"Now, the Third - the Tradition of Progeny. Again, the Ivory Tower likes being selective in enforcing the Traditions. Prince Lodin sired almost a dozen childer in Chicago, yet he consistently refused to allow the 'Low Clans' like the Gangrel, Malkavians, and your own to Embrace more Kindred. Whatever the Third Tradition was supposed to accomplish, I doubt it was to allow Princes to preemptively cut potential threats to their praxis off at the knees.

"Alright, what about the Fourth Tradition of Accounting?"

Anita shakes her head. "It puts a fledgling entirely in the power of their sire. Many licks suffer some form of abuse from their sire. There's no recourse to any higher power, no access to mediation, or any form of justice. If it's not your sire destroying you for your mistakes, it's the Prince. Until your sire releases you, you're just another weapon for them to use in the Jyhad."

"Fifth Tradition?" You prompt.

"Hospitality?" Anita snorts. "The day Prince Jackson honors our territory, I'll honor his."

"And last but not least?"

"The Tradition of Destruction? Well, it might make more sense if there wasn't a long list of licks to which it doesn't apply. Do I need to beg the Prince for permission to destroy a bunch of Sabbat shovel-heads nosing around my haven?" Anita shakes her head. "It's just another ploy to keep the Prince on his throne."

At this point, Anita gets up from her seat. "I'll end this conversation by telling you our next meeting is at the Inland Steel Building in East Chicago this Friday. Gengis, do you mind giving Artie a ride?"

Gengis shrugs. "Yeah, sure, I'll bring him. Gotta make sure he makes it in and out in one piece, right?"

You recognize a dismissal when you hear one. You and Gengis head back to his car while Anita goes her separate way. As you stare out the passenger side front window, you begin forming your opinion on the Chicago Anarchs.

[] [ANITA] The Anarchs speak more to me than the Camarilla. Why didn't I seek them out sooner?
[] [ANITA] Wainwright's right - I'll never be able to accomplish my goals with the Camarilla's elders standing in my way.
[] [ANITA] Anita made some points worth considering. However, the negatives aren't worth throwing the tea into the harbor.
[] [ANITA] The Baron of East Chicago is just trying to sell me the same pyramid scheme as the Ivory Tower.
[] [ANITA] Let me record my reaction to Anita's arguments.


-​

Despite the name, East Chicago is a small city in Indiana sandwiched between Chicago and Gary. On a peninsula extending out into Lake Michigan sits the Inland Steel Building at the head of a vast, semi-derelict steelworking facility. Here, within the disused walls emblematic of the city's failing manufacturing sector, Chicago's Anarchs gather outside to vote on the issues the Movement faces.

As you climb out of Gengis's car, you notice how the Anarchs whisper and point in your direction. What is one of Jacko's dogs doing here at the meeting? Still, Gengis's presence by your side keeps away those who would stake and bake you on principle. It's not a pleasant situation to be in, but you take comfort in the familiarity. After all, it wasn't that long ago that the Degenerates in Annabelle's entourage were mocking you behind your back as you helped set up chairs and tables for the Toreador Primogen's next party.

Many of those present sport the rough-and-ready rebel look typical of Clan Brujah. However, you spy plenty of Gangrel doing their best to conceal their more animalistic features underneath their clothing. There are Caitiff and thin-bloods, too, off in a separate group.

You also count dissidents from the Camarilla clans. Fellow Nosferatu huddle beneath tattered clothing to conceal their disfigurements as the Malkavians babble to each other, themselves, and no one in particular. More than a few members of Clan Toreador flit from one conversation to the next while the Tremere are catching up on their occult reading. You even spot one or two Blue Bloods looking as imperious as can be in casual clothing. Prince Jackson would be less than pleased to find those of his own clan among the opposition.

However, a rail-thin woman in her mid-twenties catches your eye. While her wardrobe of jeans and a band T-shirt is simple, the commanding gaze in her dark brown eyes makes her stand out. Indeed, the other Anarchs seem to be in awe of her. Gengis quickly catches her attention. "Maldavis! I'd like you to meet Artie Delacruz. Two-Face, this is Maldavis."

"Maldavis. The legend herself."

At the height of Prince Lodin's corruption, the Anarchs rallied around a fledgling Maldavis. Under her banner, the Movement grew powerful enough to challenge the Old Prince for control over the Second City. Eventually, the "Council Wars" ended in victory for the Camarilla establishment. However, it seems Maldavis still hasn't given up the fight.

You shake hands with Maldavis and exchange the briefest of pleasantries. However, the substantive conversation will have to wait as Anita calls the Anarchs' meeting to order. You follow Gengis to the catwalk overlooking the factory floor and stand back to observe the proceedings. Eventually, you think you understand the Anarchs' democratic process.

While prominent Anarchs like Anita, Gengis, and Maldavis moderate the debates from their positions high above on the main floor, any Anarch in attendance may step up to the catwalk to present their proposal. However, if none of the moderators second the motion, the idea falls by the wayside. Assuming one of the Anarch Center does speak up in support, at least half of those in attendance must vote in favor of the motion. Even then, if the proposal concerns a territory, two-thirds of the attendees from that area must consent to make it official.

As you observe the proceedings, you can't help but have thoughts about how the Anarchs do things and how they might run the show if they did manage to topple the Ivory Tower.

[] [COUNCIL] I like seeing democracy at work in the Kindred world. The Camarilla could learn a thing or two.
[] [COUNCIL] No bowing and scraping before a lick just because they've been around since the Dark Ages? Sign me up.
[] [COUNCIL] With the SI systematically wiping us out, we need decisive action, not this endless back-and-forth.
[] [COUNCIL] It'd only take one lick with the right Disciplines to turn this "democratic" process into even more of a joke.
[] [COUNCIL] My opinion is more nuanced than this. Let me write it down.
 
[X] [ANITA] Let me record my reaction to Anita's arguments.
-[X] Anita made some points worth considering, but I can do more from within the Camarilla than outside of it.
[X] [COUNCIL] I like seeing democracy at work in the Kindred world. The Camarilla could learn a thing or two.


Artie doesn't strike me as a Republican, so I can't imagine their brand of patriotism excludes a love of democracy.
 
[X] [ANITA] Let me record my reaction to Anita's arguments.
-[X] Anita made some points worth considering, but I can do more from within the Camarilla than outside of it.
[X] [COUNCIL] I like seeing democracy at work in the Kindred world. The Camarilla could learn a thing or two.

I like the idea of Artie walking out of this and gaining an appreciation and understanding of the Anarchs while still staying on the course of the Camarilla. An idea for reform could be something like having the Primogen be elected and the term being for say a decade.
 
[X] [ANITA] Let me record my reaction to Anita's arguments.
-[X] Anita made some points worth considering, but I can do more from within the Camarilla than outside of it.
[X] [COUNCIL] I like seeing democracy at work in the Kindred world. The Camarilla could learn a thing or two.


Anita made some very good points, kindred society was founded on archaic principles at the expense of the younger generations. For the longest of time this pyramid was highly resistant to change but as society developed new ideas and expectations were brought in. The culture clash would eventually result in the formation of the first Anarch Movement. After the convention of Thorns and with the formation of the Camerilla, the First Anarchs would effectively split into the Modern Anarchs and the Sabbat. What this shows is that kindred society is no longer the immutable edifice of the past. With the Gehenna on the horizon and the Second Inquisition nipping at our heels, all kindred need to come together and reevaluate their society. Before either the Kine or the Antediluvians do it for us.
Under the Camerilla we can establish and test a new type of government, one with the checks and balances needed to prevent tyranny, and account for the hypothetically long lives of kindred.

The role of the prince can be repurposed into that a kin to a president, the Prince-Elect. They can serve a term of 10-20 years at the end they can run for reelections. They would retain the right of Veto any bill they do not approve of or make suggestions on what needs to be changed for the bill to be approved. There would be no permanent term limits as such a thing wouldn't necessarily make sense for a theoretically immortal race. Instead a kindred can serve two terms in office either consequently or intermittently before they are required to wait a three term long period of time between their second and third term before they can run for election again. For example let's say Prince Jackson ran for office won two subsequent terms. At the end of the second term he will need to wait 60 years, or three terms, before he can run again. If another kindred is elected but is not re-elected for a second term, he won't have to wait for the end of the three term period to run for reelection. Not until he runs a second term in office anyways.
What the Anarchs have could be use as a House of Representatives but with multiple speakers. The Speakers can be elected to their position by their peers and would in charge of handling minor disputes or grievances.
The Primogen Council can be repurposed into a mix of the Supreme Court and the Senate with each Kindred clan having a representative. This senate/court will act as a check and balances to both the HoR and the Prince-Elect, they are to insure no bill will impede on the rights and freedoms of the kindred individual or discriminate against a single clan. A bill made by the Senate has to be approved by both the Prince-Elect and the HoR. There would be no permanent term limits for the Primogen as such a thing wouldn't necessarily make sense for a theoretically immortal race. Instead there will be a required gap of time they must meet, between their times in office before they can run for reelection again.

This system would have to be tested and refined but if we have proof it can work then we can encourage other cities to take it up. This will hopefully reduce the tensions between the Anarchs and Camerilla.

Me: I know it's not a perfect system, but no one ever said statecraft was easy. I could see this system having possible issues on a national level. But could theoretically work on a local level like a city. Kindred as a 'immortal' race makes a lot harder since so many of them have been prone to corruption and tyranny in the past.
P.S. Sorry this is such a massive post.
 
Artie doesn't strike me as a Republican, so I can't imagine their brand of patriotism excludes a love of democracy.
Yeah, the LGBTQ+ community and the GOP voter base don't exactly overlap much, especially not these days. I like to think Artie would be what Captain America would be like as a vampire.

An idea for reform could be something like having the Primogen be elected and the term being for, say, a decade.
Terms for the Primogen are an idea. Good luck convincing Annabelle that she should step down as "Queen Bitch" of Chicago's Toreador, though.

Anita made some very good points. Kindred society was founded on archaic principles at the expense of the younger generations.
I'm glad that some of Anita's arguments hit their mark. Would you guys mind elaborating on what points resonated with you the most?

After the Convention of Thorns and the formation of the Camarilla, the first Anarchs would effectively split into the modern Anarchs and the Sabbat.
While the modern Movement does have roots going back to the first Anarch Revolt that occurred centuries ago, the Anarchs are more likely to invoke memories of the second Anarch Revolt that saw the Camarilla booted out of California during the 1940s and the establishment of the Anarch Free State.

Of course, we can't forget about the third Anarch Revolt that Theo Bell kicked off in Prague when he shot Hardestadt in the face with a shotgun full of dragon's breath rounds.

Under the Camarilla, we can establish and test a new type of government. One with the checks and balances needed to prevent tyranny and account for the hypothetically long lives of Kindred.
"That sounds like the Anarch Movement, but with extra steps."

The role of the Prince can be repurposed into being akin to a president, the Prince-Elect. They can serve a term of 10-20 years. At the end, they can run for reelection... There would be no permanent term limits as such a thing wouldn't necessarily make sense for a theoretically immortal race. Instead, a Kindred can serve two terms in office either consequently or intermittently before they are required to wait a three-term long period between their second and third term before they can run for election again.
This system reminds me of the Russian presidential election system. You know, the one that allowed Putin to stay in power.

The Anarchs could be used as a House of Representatives but with multiple Speakers. The Speakers can be elected to their position by their peers and would be in charge of handling minor disputes or grievances.
What would the Representatives represent, though?

If representation is based on clan numbers, that incentivizes Kindred to sire more childer to stack the House in their clan's favor. More vampires running around means a greater risk of discovery by the kine. Of course, the Third Tradition can cap the number of licks within the city, but that gives the Prince another edge over the hypothetical Congress.

On the other hand, having representatives for each territory within the domain runs into the same issues that plague the American congressional system. For instance, who gets to determine the borders of each district? An unscrupulous lick could redraw the map in such a way that leaves their political enemies hunting for scraps while their cronies sip on easy prey in the Rack. Domain disputes are easily the most common issue Prince Jackson's government has to deal with.

This system would have to be tested and refined. If we have proof it can work, we can encourage other cities to take it up. This will hopefully reduce the tensions between the Anarchs and Camarilla.
Good luck convincing Anarch strongholds like Berlin and the West Coast of the United States that they should let the Ivory Tower reestablish a presence in their cities.

I know it's not a perfect system, but no one ever said statecraft was easy. I could see this system having possible issues on a national level but could theoretically work on a local level.
Fortunately for your proposal, the Camarilla is decentralized, with the Princes governing their territory as they see fit. Only in extreme cases do we see the Justicars take over. For example, during the Fall of London, Justicar Juliet Parr of Clan Malkavian more-or-less kicked Queen Anne off her throne once the latter's struggle against Mithras got out of hand.

Sorry that this is such a massive post.
Don't be. I love it when you guys go in-depth on your reasoning.
 
Would you guys mind elaborating on what points resonated with you the most?
Old Camarilla vampires making it worse for everyone but themselves, and sometimes including themselves too. They enforce an archaic system inferior to modern ones, they abuse their power, they prevent positive change, and they're leading the Camarilla into the pyres of the Second Inquisition. They're antiquated and obsessed with personal power, which is not only bad for the Camarilla, but sometimes themselves. Just look at Hardestadt. Compare him to Critias who's also an old Cammie, but actually gives a crap about others, and not only has survived for a lot longer, but doesn't need to stay hidden in the shadows out of fear of younger vampires to stay alive. He's got his own flaws don't get me wrong, but he's still an example of how other old vampires could and should be, but aren't.
 
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Old Camarilla vampires making it worse for everyone but themselves, and sometimes including themselves too. They enforce an archaic system inferior to modern ones, they abuse their power, they prevent positive change, and they're leading the Camarilla into the pyres of the Second Inquisition. They're antiquated and obsessed with personal power, which is not only bad for the Camarilla, but sometimes themselves. Just look at Hardestadt. Compare him to Critias who's also an old Cammie, but actually gives a crap about others, and not only has survived for a lot longer, but doesn't need to stay hidden in the shadows out of fear of younger vampires to stay alive. He's got his own flaws don't get me wrong, but he's still an example of how other old vampires could and should be, but aren't.

Very well said. The Elders are unfortunately byproducts of the system they now run and the old societies of human culture. Not to long ago Kindred society was a mirror of human society and many elders were brought those conditions. It's a society that has very little inherent integrity in its operations, it's often lead by the rule of 'might makes right' and is propagated by the conditioning and abuse of younger kindred. Which either leads to these childer being immortal servants to uncaring masters or power hungry usurpers. And unfortunately those in power have yet to see the cyclical nature of Childer slaying Sire for power and freedom.

It's sad to say but there are a lot of bad eggs in kindred society that would disapprove with Artie's reforms. It's sadder to say that the nature of being a kindred often turns good people into those very bad eggs.

But I'd rather we help make a system that raises everyone up, than one that tears everyone down.

Now Anita's debate, she makes a reasonable argument against the Camerilla's ban on Technology. Such a ban greatly hinders our capabilities to not only effectively hide ourselves But our capabilities to strike back as a United front.

I find her reasoning on the second tradition doesn't resonate with me. I mean sure if you're in someone else home or haven you should respect their rules, that just common courtesy. Her argument sounds to anarchic for me. Like every territory should be it's own independent entity.

She makes a very good point about the third tradition. Kindred population should never exceed what the local kine can support safely. I can't think of a good solution that doesn't require convoluted or extreme means to achieve this.

I agree with her on the fourth tradition, there should be some kind of oversight to insure the mental health and well being of the childer.

I like her response to the fifth tradition, it makes me thank that by giving the common kindred access to a system that will let them be heard and participate, on as an even playing field as we can manage, will draw back in some of the Anarchs.

The sixth tradition just requires an adequate judiciary system for the detainment and possible rehabilitation of problematic kindred. I'm not saying destruction is not an option but kindred society needs to decentralize this particular section of society.
 
Just look at Hardestadt. Compare him to Critias who's also an old Cammie, but actually gives a crap about others, and not only has survived for a lot longer but doesn't need to stay hidden in the shadows out of fear of younger vampires to stay alive. He's got his own flaws don't get me wrong, but he's still an example of how other old vampires could and should be, but aren't.
If you can get Critias on your side, he'll be an important voice for reform. A lot of Kindred these nights dismiss the Brujah as troublemakers and rebels without a cause, but that's only because most of the Rabble find apathy to be a greater sin than wrath.

Unfortunately, those in power have yet to see the cyclical nature of childe slaying sire for power and freedom.
Oh, the elders are well aware that new vampires have a habit of throwing tantrums against their makers. It's just that the older licks have always been able to put down or manage such rebellions, even when they blaze out into full-on Anarch Revolts. How is this occasion different from the ones that came before it? (Spoilers: very different.)

I find [Anita's] reasoning on the Second Tradition doesn't resonate with me. I mean sure if you're in someone else home or haven you should respect their rules, that's just common courtesy. Her argument sounds too anarchic to me like every territory should be its own independent entity.
I didn't intend for Anita to sound like a sovereign citizen railing against a government perceived as illegitimate, though there are definitely elements within the Anarch Movement that think that way. Her argument against the Second Tradition is meant to be analogous to civil rights activists who protest against cops barging into people's homes without warning or warrant because they're afraid criminals will flush drugs and other evidence down the toilet if they announce themselves.

[Anita] makes a very good point about the Third Tradition. The Kindred population should never exceed what the local kine can support safely. I can't think of a good solution that doesn't require convoluted or extreme means to achieve this.
Inquisitor: Extreme? I think you mean excellent. Now, where did I put my flamethrower?

I agree with her on the Fourth Tradition, there should be some kind of oversight to insure the mental health and well-being of the childer.
Though it didn't seem that way at the time, Artie was lucky to be Embraced into Clan Nosferatu and receive support from (relatively) nice licks like Cedrick Calhoun. Had I called the vote on Artie's starting Disciplines earlier, our protagonist would've wound up a Malkavian. Can you imagine having Jason Newberry as your therapist?

-​

On a different note, do you guys have any ideas or headcanons for what Artie looks like? I imagine him as an androgynous person whose Nosferatu curse scars can be compared to those of Katawa Shoujo's Hanako Ikezawa. Other than that, it's open to interpretation.

 
I like that look for Artie it seems really badass and fitting. Clan Nosferatu is the clan with the most unity and tend to be less assholish than the average Kindred.
 
I didn't intend for Anita to sound like a sovereign citizen railing against a government perceived as illegitimate, though there are definitely elements within the Anarch Movement that think that way. Her argument against the Second Tradition is meant to be analogous to civil rights activists who protest against cops barging into people's homes without warning or warrant because they're afraid criminals will flush drugs and other evidence down the toilet if they announce themselves.
I figured that's what she meant after a second thought on the subject.

Can you imagine having Jason Newberry as your therapist?
I try not to read the Character profiles ahead of time because I don't want to spoil details about the quest. But even I think that wouldn't have ended well. I imagine Artie would have had a lower humanity score, but more or less the same build but leaning more towards being an Anarch. That and the thread would probably be plotting the final death of Newberry.

Had I called the vote on Artie's starting Disciplines earlier, our protagonist would've wound up a Malkavian.
Honestly that could have been cool. I love playing eccentric characters in both tabletop and rpg games.
Example.
—Wulfric the Bringer, a rich kleptomaniacal wizard that likes living as a hobo.
—THE GREAT! Gash Siannodel, a self described perpetual engine of self-confidence and the greatest person that will ever be born.
—Kornelius Fiendbane, a supervillain Necromancer that loves making the lives of Heroes, Villains, Angels, and Demons a living hell.

On a different note, do you guys have any ideas or headcanons for what Artie looks like? I imagine him as an androgynous person whose Nosferatu curse scars can be compared to those of Katawa Shoujo's Hanako Ikezawa. Other than that, it's open to interpretation.
I always pictured Zulu from Avatar: The last Airbender. Though after getting a nickname from Gengis I started imagining a mix of Harvey Dent and Zuko. Could fine as good an image as Rogue did.




 
Chuck Norris fact for the Day.

The last time a kindred tried to embrace Chuck Norris. Their teeth broke and his neck sucked the blood out of the vampire.
 
You know, in older editions of Vampire: The Masquerade, there's a rule about fighting the First Vampire. It consists of just two words.

You lose.

I think that's true for a setting if the person in question doesn't have Protagonists as a prefix in their name.

My headcanon is that the only person who can be the Caine to Caine is Big D!

Another Joke.
Bruce Lee, Chuck Norris and Big D walk into a bar. The bar and everything in it explodes from the having too many badasses in it.
 
Yeah, the LGBTQ+ community and the GOP voter base don't exactly overlap much, especially not these days. I like to think Artie would be what Captain America would be like as a vampire.
I myself am a Texan Baptist Republican from South Texas. That being said there are certainly things I agree with Democrats on, climate change being a top one. Personally I always thought the LGBTQ+ community received a lot more negativity than it deserved. Down here the most consistent criticisms, I've heard is people being perceived as delicate and wanting to be handed everything.

If you can get Critias on your side, he'll be an important voice for reform. A lot of Kindred these nights dismiss the Brujah as troublemakers and rebels without a cause, but that's only because most of the Rabble find apathy to be a greater sin than wrath.
How much would it be to try to make Critias a Mawla? He's a Primogen, so I'd assume a 4 dot but he could also be a 5 dot because he's a very old kindred.
 
How much would it be to try to make Critias a Mawla? He's a Primogen, so I'd assume a 4 dot but he could also be a 5 dot because he's a very old kindred.
In the past, I've said each of the Primogen costs 15 XP due to their high Status. However, I believe the V5 Corebook states that a Camarilla Primogen/Anarch Revolutionary Councillor is worth four dots, so that's what I'll go with.
 
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