Guys what are we going to say to Eric
Arise o Youth, Destiny is Yours (No SV, Welcome to the MCU)
- Thread starter Magoose
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[X] Plan, if Idealism doesn't cut it...
-[X]Allow it: You want to see what this feeling is, perhaps you can see it.
Come on it is Charles Xavier...
And let's not try to convince him that Revenge is Bad, but let's point out that keeping his family safe is far more important
-[X] Erik, let's cut the moralistic crap... Those fuckers deserve to die and you deserve to take your revenge, nobody will deny that, BUT what you are missing is the price that you may have to pay to get it... I know for sure that the American and the Soviets extracted some of the worst War Criminals from the Camps, because the potential of their scientific studies and offered them employment... And if someone notices a trail of dead Nazis impaled by their cutelry they will eventually send people to hunt you, and whereas I have no doubt that you can handle them, What about Magda and Anya? Will you risk having your baby daughter being experimented on like they did with us for revenge?
@Magoose does this work?
-[X]Allow it: You want to see what this feeling is, perhaps you can see it.
Come on it is Charles Xavier...
And let's not try to convince him that Revenge is Bad, but let's point out that keeping his family safe is far more important
-[X] Erik, let's cut the moralistic crap... Those fuckers deserve to die and you deserve to take your revenge, nobody will deny that, BUT what you are missing is the price that you may have to pay to get it... I know for sure that the American and the Soviets extracted some of the worst War Criminals from the Camps, because the potential of their scientific studies and offered them employment... And if someone notices a trail of dead Nazis impaled by their cutelry they will eventually send people to hunt you, and whereas I have no doubt that you can handle them, What about Magda and Anya? Will you risk having your baby daughter being experimented on like they did with us for revenge?
@Magoose does this work?
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Magoose
SV's Questing Fanatic
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Fluffy_serpent
a snake pretending to be human
If no one else creates a plan against our minds being read then I'll try to create one
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Good, any extra insight for my little speech to Erik?
Magoose
SV's Questing Fanatic
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Eric is very much angry right now.
And unless you provide him something that can be different then, say... revenge, he may leave for a little while on a anti nazi rampage.
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And his keeping his family safe doesn't count?
As a cynic myself I can see why someone so jaded and broken as Erik won't give a single fuck about the moralistic bullshit about the difference between revenge and justice, and how revenge feels empty...
So I find that it could much more convincing to appel to the practical problems of revenge, like that you and your family become targets.
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Fluffy_serpent
a snake pretending to be human
[] Eric, while most deserve death for what they did there are many others who were just trying to survive and following orders, just look at many of those who made possible the death of hitler and the liberation of germany from the Nazis were former Nazis ... well, what you want is not so different from what they did, kill Nazis for the simple fact of being one without investigating their history and their crimes.
if not for that reason at least for your family, no matter how powerful you are, you are not god, if you do that there is a high risk that they will suffer the same as you.
presentation is everything, if you do what you want they will be "the wife and daughter of the greatest serial killer in history who hunted and killed thousands" but if you take them to trial as long as you have enough evidence or make them confess they will be "the wife and daughter of one of Germany's greatest heroes, the one in charge of bringing all the Nazis to trial and receiving their deserved punishment"
Well this is what I'm wearing, I know it's horrible but I wanted to see if someone likes it and can adapt it to something acceptable to create a plan
if not for that reason at least for your family, no matter how powerful you are, you are not god, if you do that there is a high risk that they will suffer the same as you.
presentation is everything, if you do what you want they will be "the wife and daughter of the greatest serial killer in history who hunted and killed thousands" but if you take them to trial as long as you have enough evidence or make them confess they will be "the wife and daughter of one of Germany's greatest heroes, the one in charge of bringing all the Nazis to trial and receiving their deserved punishment"
Well this is what I'm wearing, I know it's horrible but I wanted to see if someone likes it and can adapt it to something acceptable to create a plan
StarSerpent
Upjumped Peasant
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Uh, "What if those that want to deny you revenge go after your loved ones" is a shit argument against warning someone who's able and willing to take on the world and win. All that means is that the Americans and Soviets in charge of Paperclip and Whatever-Soviet-Paperclip-was-called get put on the kill list too.
I never understood this. Revenge feels fucking amazing. The 'empty' bit is when you have no answer to 'what next'. The act of revenge itself isn't empty, it's when revenge is everything. It's clearly not for Erik, since he's got a family and has the inklings of mutant identitarianism lurking in the background.
And I personally think Charles Xavier could do with a little understanding of boundaries, and which ones shouldn't be crossed.
All the same, "just following orders" is an equally shit response. Nuremberg should have proven that to everyone. And besides, his shit list consists of Nazis who were in the SS and either experimented on mutants or played mass murderer. Forgive me if I can't sympathize with the idea that some of them were "decent people".
[X] Plan, if Idealism doesn't cut
Warning: Magneto responds very poorly to people using "Just Following Orders" as an excuse.
- Location
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NEVER, EVER USE THAT FUCKING ARGUMENT WITH A HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR!!!!
EVEN IF YOU ARE A FELLOW HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR!!!
View: https://youtu.be/4VC8goX1XL8
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Magoose
SV's Questing Fanatic
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If you try to use a just following orders argument, know that I will not count it.
Eric might kill you if you try to use that against him.
Hell, I would also call it out of character for Heinrich.
He knows men who decided to not follow orders, and put their faith in their country, instead of their leader.
Hell, he helped them kill hitler.
Fluffy_serpent
a snake pretending to be human
are you one or what?
It is also the truth even if you do not like it
StarSerpent
Upjumped Peasant
- Location
- Cowtown, AB
[X] Plan No Entry
-[X] Deny it: You are not going to allow this. Push it out.
-[X]Write in: "If you're dead-set on this path, no one can stop you. But it's dark road that you're treading on, and there's no sense in going at it alone. You aren't the only one seeking to put an end to the Nazis. I cannot agree with your way, but I won't let you do this alone. Others walk the same path too – Germans, Jews. Not all good men, perhaps. But men seeking redemption and revenge. And if nothing else, they can find the hiding rats faster than you or I alone."
The only good Nazi is, indeed, a dead Nazi. Preferably through a concrete burial or an unmarked grave.
I can buy that ordinary Germans followed the orders of whoever was above them, kept their head down and whatnot. People who willingly joined the Nazi party, climbed the ranks, and went whole hog on ethnic cleansing, mass genocide and human experimentation? Yeah, no. Fuck 'em, and the shitty excuse they rode in on.
-[X] Deny it: You are not going to allow this. Push it out.
-[X]Write in: "If you're dead-set on this path, no one can stop you. But it's dark road that you're treading on, and there's no sense in going at it alone. You aren't the only one seeking to put an end to the Nazis. I cannot agree with your way, but I won't let you do this alone. Others walk the same path too – Germans, Jews. Not all good men, perhaps. But men seeking redemption and revenge. And if nothing else, they can find the hiding rats faster than you or I alone."
The only good Nazi is, indeed, a dead Nazi. Preferably through a concrete burial or an unmarked grave.
I can buy that ordinary Germans followed the orders of whoever was above them, kept their head down and whatnot. People who willingly joined the Nazi party, climbed the ranks, and went whole hog on ethnic cleansing, mass genocide and human experimentation? Yeah, no. Fuck 'em, and the shitty excuse they rode in on.
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To be fair, at this point Erik is still someone who is pretty powerful, but really far from the Physical God in which he will eventually become... So I think that appealing to keep his family safe could work much better than any variation of Revenge is Bad that I can think of.
But if you have a better idea on how to approach this I am open to suggestions.
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- California
[X] Plan No Entry
Fluffy_serpent
a snake pretending to be human
[X] Plan No Entry
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- United states
Um guys, you do realize that in character we don't really know about telepathy or how it works? We are still in the late 40s where such concepts haven't even started becoming more widespread IIRC. I view the allow telepathy thing as trying to learn more about what's trying to reach us.
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[X] Plan Let Them In
-[X]Allow it: You want to see what this feeling is, perhaps you can see it.
-[X]Write in: "If you're dead-set on this path, no one can stop you. But it's dark road that you're treading on, and there's no sense in going at it alone. You aren't the only one seeking to put an end to the Nazis. I cannot agree with your way, but I won't let you do this alone. Others walk the same path too – Germans, Jews. Not all good men, perhaps. But men seeking redemption and revenge."
OK I like this, But I want to let them in since we know that Xavier is one of the good ones
-[X]Allow it: You want to see what this feeling is, perhaps you can see it.
-[X]Write in: "If you're dead-set on this path, no one can stop you. But it's dark road that you're treading on, and there's no sense in going at it alone. You aren't the only one seeking to put an end to the Nazis. I cannot agree with your way, but I won't let you do this alone. Others walk the same path too – Germans, Jews. Not all good men, perhaps. But men seeking redemption and revenge."
OK I like this, But I want to let them in since we know that Xavier is one of the good ones
StarSerpent
Upjumped Peasant
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- Cowtown, AB
That's an even better argument in favor of not letting it in. Letting your mind be read is clearly not the logical response when you feel weird shit probing at you.
It's like pegging. If it's consensual, by all means let the strange sensations in and have your new experience. If it's not, you don't spread your cheeks further.
That's...pretty close to metagaming. There's no way the MC has any clue who these 2 are. All he knows is that they're foreigners, youthful, and have something to do with his head feeling now quite right.
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- Location
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Maybe not, but I don't see as a completely alien concept. This isn't possession, but there are parallels with 'inviting,' another to your mind.
Ghost in a wall
Just a bit spooky
Well, another point of note is that there are other telepaths besides Xavier. So it might be a good idea to politely tell whoever it is crawing into our brain to stop it and talk like a normal person.
It cost's nothing to be polite, and mind reading a child for no apparent reason isn't something I'd think as a good thing.
Besides, Mental Defenses are Always a good thing. This might help lean into that and give us a training opprotunity for it.
[X] Plan No Entry
It cost's nothing to be polite, and mind reading a child for no apparent reason isn't something I'd think as a good thing.
Besides, Mental Defenses are Always a good thing. This might help lean into that and give us a training opprotunity for it.
[X] Plan No Entry
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Again, in-character that isn't really seen the same. Like at the moment no one at the time is going to immediately fully understand what something like 'it feels like someone is trying to touch my mind and emotions'. From what it is worded it seems like it feels like someone is curious and trying to communicate with us. This isn't modern times where numerous stories about telepathy are a wide known and popular concept thanks to science fiction and super hero stories being spread out through the world with things like the internet.
In fact I'd call that reasoning outright meta gaming since it's obviously influenced by modern ideas about how telepathy works on top of people knowing who Xavier is.
Magoose
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I am going to say this, just so that the comedy may come.
Charles is still learning to control his powers to the fine level that we see in first class.
He's doing this partially out of training, and partially out of boardom.