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Ar Tonelico and * nosurge discussion thread

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    • Baughn

    Baughn

    Healing-type writer
    Location
    Dublin
    Translated Material for Ar tonelico
    Translated Material for Surge Concerto
    Game (re)translations
    Language Information
    Fiction
    Here on SV:
    In the harmonious land of ponies:
    The above is woefully incomplete. Please send links.
     
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    • Vehrec said:
    Well no we aren't sure about that because nobody ever talks about it. But I seem to recall that the description of a songstress' duties indicated that they retired after ten years, not that they were so worn out they had to be euthanized and replaced and we just use retire as a euphemism. Misha's the...31st Star Singer, right? So a 30 year term makes no sense because that's over a thousand years. So either Mir was killing them off whenever their attention flagged, or Misha is lying about how many there have been, or...something else I haven't thought of.

    They're probably prematurely aged, and might only have a fraction of the normal 150 year lifespan left, but Misha's immediate predecessor is probably the only one who might have had a sudden failure while on the line, since her successor wasn't around and she would have had to keep singing past her retirement date because someone was missing. Unless I've completely borked up the timeline of Misha leaving.
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    Star Singers only sing for 30 to 60 years in total, as their powers start waning after that time and they become effectively useless for maintaining Mir's seal. Once they are released from their duty, they are made to taught their successor about their duties and after that, they live the rest of their lives in Platina enjoying a full welfare plan sponsored by the government. Sources: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 17 ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 18 Additionally, there are indications that Misha made up the number of Star Singers because the timeline doesn't add up with the number of years their terms take, and the fact she is always doing everything to gain Lyner's attention and admiration (And I'll just add that what shesaid in issue #18 was what killed every shred of respect I had for her).

    Baughn said:
    Colette's existence there could be excused as... in one of the other songs, describing the creation of Ar Ciel, the Wills (I think?) are described as gathering people from the entire universe. She could be one of them. It's a bit of a stretch, but not inconceivable.

    I believe Casty describes her as the "Goddess of time and mind", however. :p
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    Horus describes herself as the goddess of love, and Cas calls her the goddess of time and spirit, but none of those are her roles: she is merely the mother Will of the Land Lineage, and thus the mother of all life in Ar Ciel. The other two lineages are the Souls and Sky lineages, which rule over H-Wave and U-Wave activity, and over Ar Ciel's atmosphere and contact with the wills from other celestial bodies respectively.

    al103 said:
    Soda and meat. Mir and Aurica's specialty. Just one puts meat in soda and other soda in meat.

    ...

    Actually... Are we sure that Aurica's code isn't because she is just plain descended from Mir? Which gives some implications, though not very surprising ones *shudder*.
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    100% sure. Mir even commented on it twice: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 49 ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 67 (issue #67 is noteworthy that Mir didn't realize the consequences of taking over Aurica's body, and she gets horrified after Aurica makes her realize that there).

    Also, it was mentioned in the second volume of the Ar tonelico Arpeggio manga that a 10% of the Reyvateils in the world inherit Hymn Codes from the Betas only because the garbage data they have in their Soulspace's Hymn Code zone happens to give off a character string identical to a previously registered Hymn Code. And that data is garbage in the first place only because their Hymn Codes weren't registered into the Tower and assigned a proper tag. The source for this is here: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 115

    About Sasha, it was mentioned previously she has nothing to do with the Will Sashanomiya beyond being named after her (source: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Ar Ciel Technical Data Compilation Room/Issue 3). And her birth month isn't November either: according to the AT3 setting encyclopedia, she was born in June.

    About the Flash Cosmospheres, I've got the translated files for them stored in my hard drive, so it's just a matter of finding another host for now, since blackraen has already told me the lodging he's giving to these files and the ones for the Class-Arnosurge-Proto novel is temporary in nature.
     
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    Baughn said:
    Anyway, Mir's hymn code is MIR_TEIWAZ_ARTONELICO... I don't think the same rules apply.
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    Haha, Aquagon didn't beat me to it - Mir's hymn code is still MIR_FEHU_EOLIA_ARTONELICO, she just hacked in a modification that made MIR_TEIWAZ_ARTONELICO redirect to her real one, making it for all intents and purposes a new name worn over the old one.

    ...and now I'm gonna go doublecheck that just in case.
     
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    ................................That Bad End in the 2nd Anniversary Cosmosphere........................... I correctly predicted the other secret character, but I did not see that Bad End coming. Well played Gust, well played. :rofl:
     
    Antumbra said:
    Haha, Aquagon didn't beat me to it - Mir's hymn code is still MIR_FEHU_EOLIA_ARTONELICO, she just hacked in a modification that made MIR_TEIWAZ_ARTONELICO redirect to her real one, making it for all intents and purposes a new name worn over the old one.

    ...and now I'm gonna go doublecheck that just in case.
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    justinkal said:
    In programming terms, she used her super hacking skills to add an alias for her Hymn Code.
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    Yep, both of you are completely right on it. The source for that information is Toukousphere Issue #74, for the record, which was also the place where the Hymn Codes' structure and meanings were explained: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 74

    Quickshot0 said:
    It looks pretty blonde to me, other images online of it are also blonde. See for instance this one.
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    Yeah, I've always seen it as blonde too.
     
    al103 said:
    *clicks on image* *sees pink hair* Uuuuuuhhhhhhmmmmm...

    PS. Well light (yellowish) pink is pretty close to strawberry blonde...
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    I'm now suspecting you call colors slightly different names then I do. Because that in no way really makes me think pink.


    Edit, After some more thinking I suppose our color processing could be different instead as well.
     
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    aquagon said:
    About Sasha, it was mentioned previously she has nothing to do with the Will Sashanomiya beyond being named after her (source: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Ar Ciel Technical Data Compilation Room/Issue 3). And her birth month isn't November either: according to the AT3 setting encyclopedia, she was born in June.

    About the Flash Cosmospheres, I've got the translated files for them stored in my hard drive, so it's just a matter of finding another host for now, since blackraen has already told me the lodging he's giving to these files and the ones for the Class-Arnosurge-Proto novel is temporary in nature.
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    ARM Backup said:
    Sasha's name is indeed based on Sashanomiya's. Sasha's grandmother gave her that name. She gave her that name in order that Sasha might grow up to be a smart girl, but it seems to have worked a lot better than she could have ever expected.
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    It's only natural that Sasha was named by a relative. I wouldn't say that this answers anything conclusively, however, which is how I prefer it; leaves it up to other writers. :)

    So, hosting. Unless it's more than a couple of gigabytes in size, I'm perfectly willing to host it. How about it?
     
    aquagon said:
    Star Singers only sing for 30 to 60 years in total, as their powers start waning after that time and they become effectively useless for maintaining Mir's seal. Once they are released from their duty, they are made to taught their successor about their duties and after that, they live the rest of their lives in Platina enjoying a full welfare plan sponsored by the government. Sources: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 17 ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Toukousphere/Issue 18 Additionally, there are indications that Misha made up the number of Star Singers because the timeline doesn't add up with the number of years their terms take, and the fact she is always doing everything to gain Lyner's attention and admiration (And I'll just add that what shesaid in issue #18 was what killed every shred of respect I had for her).
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    I really do not like subsidiary material overriding the main games. Especially when it means that Characters are just randomly lying for no reason.
     
    Quick question. Is there an easy way to get a PDF (or EPUB) version of the light novel translations?

    The normal "save page as PDF" function built into internet browsers doesn't work correctly for wikis, and Wikipedia has its own button for exporting a page as a PDF, but I don't see that button on the EXA_PICO wiki.

    Mobile browsers seem to have a habit of sometimes caching a page when your looking at other tabs and then reloading it when you come back, but your scrolling position within the page gets completely lost when that happens. Would be really nice to be able to read those novels in multiple sittings without that happening.
     
    justinkal said:
    Mobile browsers seem to have a habit of sometimes caching a page when your looking at other tabs and then reloading it when you come back, but your scrolling position within the page gets completely lost when that happens. Would be really nice to be able to read those novels in multiple sittings without that happening.
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    Depends on the browser. Chrome, at least, is good at remembering your position.
     
    Baughn said:
    Depends on the browser. Chrome, at least, is good at remembering your position.
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    For the sake of having my bookmarks and stuff sync up, I use Firefox on my Android device. I would use Chrome on my laptop, but I really like that Firefox still allows you to have a classic Menu Bar.

    Also, having images in the middle of the page tends to mess up that type of autoscrolling too.

    I guess I could try using the mobile version of Chrome just for those light novels, but an ebook style format would still be way more convenient.
     
    Baughn said:
    It's only natural that Sasha was named by a relative. I wouldn't say that this answers anything conclusively, however, which is how I prefer it; leaves it up to other writers. :)

    So, hosting. Unless it's more than a couple of gigabytes in size, I'm perfectly willing to host it. How about it?
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    And that bit about Sasha isn't the only thing: for a Will to descend upon the land, they would have to possess a human or reincarnate as one (the latter being what Sashanomiya would need to do to be born as Sasha if that actually were the case), both feats requiring large amounts of energy due to having to downsize her own waves in order for her to interact with the other humans as equals. However, this has not been possible for any of Ar Ciel's Wills since the Grathnode Inferia happened: between being without a Heart of the Land, existing depending merely on the effects of Wave Inertia and the energy harvested by the Antibodies, and having a severe lack of Symphonic Power due to Moocheriel continuously sapping it away, there is no energy the Planet can spare to allow for the descent of any of its Wills due to how weak it had grown by the time the games take place. In fact, the Wills that manifest themselves in AT3 only did so taking advantage of the technology that was available in Sol Cluster, like Tilia's SH Server (which had Antibodies connected to it, making them into a hotline of sorts to some of Ar Ciel's Wills) and the development of the Gamma Sublimate Reyvateil. (source: ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Ar Ciel Technical Data Compilation Room/Issue 4)

    About the hosting, the files have in total a weight of 293 MB. Would that be okay?

    justinkal said:
    For the sake of having my bookmarks and stuff sync up, I use Firefox on my Android device. I would use Chrome on my laptop, but I really like that Firefox still allows you to have a classic Menu Bar.

    Also, having images in the middle of the page tends to mess up that type of autoscrolling too.

    I guess I could try using the mobile version of Chrome just for those light novels, but an ebook style format would still be way more convenient.
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    Unfortunately, I don't have anything like that, as the entire translation was made on a plain text document with all the formatting and codes it'd need to display correctly on the wiki.
     
    aquagon said:
    And that bit about Sasha isn't the only thing: for a Will to descend upon the land, they would have to possess a human or reincarnate as one (the latter being what Sashanomiya would need to do to be born as Sasha if that actually were the case), both feats requiring large amounts of energy due to having to downsize her own waves in order for her to interact with the other humans as equals. However, this has not been possible for any of Ar Ciel's Wills since the Grathnode Inferia happened: between being without a Heart of the Land, existing depending merely on the effects of Wave Inertia and the energy harvested by the Antibodies, and having a severe lack of Symphonic Power due to Moocheriel continuously sapping it away, there is no energy the Planet can spare to allow for the descent of any of its Wills due to how weak it had grown by the time the games take place.
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    Well, ouch. Okay, that's definite enough. I wonder if they can give blessings?
    aquagon said:
    About the hosting, the files have in total a weight of 293 MB. Would that be okay?
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    Perfectly fine. If you can drop by IRC, we could discuss the details.

    (That's irc.rizon.net #nanoha. Also, not for the next hour plz; dinner needs to happen.)
     
    Baughn said:
    Well, ouch. Okay, that's definite enough. I wonder if they can give blessings?

    Perfectly fine. If you can drop by IRC, we could discuss the details.

    (That's irc.rizon.net #nanoha. Also, not for the next hour plz; dinner needs to happen.)
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    I don't think they'd have major problems bestowing blessings.

    And okay, I'll try to log in tonight after I get out from work (which it'd be around five hours from now for me.)
     
    aquagon said:
    About the hosting, the files have in total a weight of 293 MB. Would that be okay?
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    If it's that small, any particular reason why it can't just be hosted on the free version of something like Google App Engine?

    The free version of that lets you host webapps written in PHP, Java, Python, or Go (plus HTML and Javascript, of course) and gives you access to 5 GB of cloud storage space.

    From what I can tell, the only usage limits that have even a slight chance of ever being an issue are that the free version is capped at 28 instance-hours per day (total time that the webapp isn't idle) and 1 GB of outgoing bandwidth per day.
     
    justinkal said:
    If it's that small, any particular reason why it can't just be hosted on the free version of something like Google App Engine?

    The free version of that lets you host webapps written in PHP, Java, Python, or Go (plus HTML and Javascript, of course) and gives you access to 5 GB of cloud storage space.

    From what I can tell, the only usage limits that have even a slight chance of ever being an issue are that the free version is capped at 28 instance-hours per day (total time that the webapp isn't idle) and 1 GB of outgoing bandwidth per day.
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    Theoretically that could work with the Class-Arnosurge-Proto novel, but I don't think that'd be the case for the Flash Cosmospheres due to them being written (as their name indicates) in Adobe Flash.

    Plus, I need to know the exact URL where the files will be located because the addresses to the wallpapers gotten as prizes from the 5th Anniversary Flash Cosmospheres are hardcoded in the swf file, and I need to change them and recompile it whenever I move them to a new host.
     
    aquagon said:
    Theoretically that could work with the Class-Arnosurge-Proto novel, but I don't think that'd be the case for the Flash Cosmospheres due to them being written (as their name indicates) in Adobe Flash.

    Plus, I need to know the exact URL where the files will be located because the addresses to the wallpapers gotten as prizes from the 5th Anniversary Flash Cosmospheres are hardcoded in the swf file, and I need to change them and recompile it whenever I move them to a new host.
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    From what search results are telling me, it's possible to embed a swf file inside of a page hosted in App Engine, the same way that you would embed it inside an HTML page.
    How do I embed a .swf file into my Google App Engine app?

    From my experiences using App Engine in a university course, I can say for certain that the URL thing won't be an issue. They give you a unique domain name for every webapp you make there, using the following format, with the option to add as many pages as you want within that domain.
    Code: 
    http://your-app-id.appspot.com/
     
    justinkal said:
    From what search results are telling me, it's possible to embed a swf file inside of a page hosted in App Engine, the same way that you would embed it inside an HTML page.
    How do I embed a .swf file into my Google App Engine app?

    From my experiences using App Engine in a university course, I can say for certain that the URL thing won't be an issue. They give you a unique domain name for every webapp you make there, using the following format, with the option to add as many pages as you want within that domain.
    Code: 
    http://your-app-id.appspot.com/
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    Hmm, in that case it's worth a shot. I'll try playing around with it later to see if I can make another mirror for them.
     
    I had assumed that aquagon wasn't interested in managing the detailed hosting scheme.

    If it's just a lot of static files, then yes, you can put them on <any of a number of possibilities> and it won't cost you anything--this is true whatever the filetype, swf is no exception--but you'll still need to keep an eye on it, and replace the hosting when it inevitably disappears. A good backup system is needed, too.
     
    Sweet! After a ton of trial and error, I finally found a site that converts web pages to PDFs that doesn't bug out for wikis! The only real flaw with this one is that it inserts a tiny footer at the bottom of every page (images sometimes getting split between two pages is kinda to be expected with this sort of thing).
    Convert HTML to PDF online, Web/HTML to PDF API

    That will make reading the light novel translations a ton easier.
     
    And for something different this time:

    ARM Backup/Ar Portal translation/Hymmne Chronicle/Issue 5

    That's an issue of an Ar Portal column where Tsuchiya explained some out-of-universe secrets about the AT1 Hymmnos Songs. This particular issue is also interesting due to the third voice message: make sure to download and listen to it even if you can't understand Japanese, as there's something it that any Ar tonelico fan should listen to.
     
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