A Simple Transaction I
- Thread starter Rihaku
- Start date
- Original
Lealope
Not yet invincible
- Pronouns
- She/Her
ADS + Into the Breach is a bit ??? The only purpose of the latter is to get a pick, something that would become much less likely with such a massive boost to social firepower. We may or may not get some marginal advantage in negotiations compared to Hide but I don't think that's worth Hunger's mental stability or a +Relationship.
Duquette7
I am Fire, and I am Rain
Well, that's good to know! Less then I hoped for, but more then I expected.
ADS is 14, OaF is 22, and we sit at 17, rounded up, that leaves us just a bit more then 5 Arete and one pick short of OaF, or 2.5 Arete by the old metric.
That is certainly doable by the next update! Though not casually, thread activity has been down over the last couple of updates as people recover from generating 50 Arete, and purge their Salt intake back below lethal levels.
ADS on its own is probably enough to risk a decapitation strike on the Protector, making Cut Through more viable, the magic defense is particularly important here, as even with OaF I would hesitate to beard the Wizard on prepared ground.
The flip side is that OaF is one update away, and negotiating with the Princess would be a very thematic time to unlock King of Winter. We would still need to get magic defense, but the closest is likely Iridescence, 2 picks and 2 Arete away. If we negotiate here, then deal with our Cures, and only then hit the Protector, we would be well placed to stomp him.
That does give the Wizard time to act though, and worse, to prepare.
Difficult choices.
Hm.
Rihaku
The Internet
ADS would help improve your odds with Into the Breach, since you'd likely get the benefits of Holy Shit, and you do have that additional +.2 Rank from Bastions of Myth to (weakly) compensate for the lack of OaF... it would certainly be the stronger build if the LP actually managed to scrounge up an anti-Rank specialist to contest you, though one wonders why he'd bother if Hunger doesn't demonstrate overwhelming Rank in the first place!
It might cut your picks gain down from (2-3) to (1-2), though. That's certainly possible. But maybe you don't care, since you only need one pick for OaF anyway? That would presuppose a large surfeit of Arete generation, of course.
On the other hand, if Adorie convinces either Hunger or Gisena that even one more day of the Lord Protector's dealings is more dangerous than resolving the Decimator's Affliction with utmost haste, would you guys be okay with Hunger letting the Decimation ride for a number of days while they focus on the campaign against the Lord Protector? If not, you've got to win that negotiation, and hiding behind Gisena's very much your best bet to do so! Winning the negotiation into buying OaF still gives Hunger the strongest odds overall of simply being powerful enough to do it all, but generating 7-8 more Arete in one day isn't trivial.
It might cut your picks gain down from (2-3) to (1-2), though. That's certainly possible. But maybe you don't care, since you only need one pick for OaF anyway? That would presuppose a large surfeit of Arete generation, of course.
On the other hand, if Adorie convinces either Hunger or Gisena that even one more day of the Lord Protector's dealings is more dangerous than resolving the Decimator's Affliction with utmost haste, would you guys be okay with Hunger letting the Decimation ride for a number of days while they focus on the campaign against the Lord Protector? If not, you've got to win that negotiation, and hiding behind Gisena's very much your best bet to do so! Winning the negotiation into buying OaF still gives Hunger the strongest odds overall of simply being powerful enough to do it all, but generating 7-8 more Arete in one day isn't trivial.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
makes sense to me
Duquette7
I am Fire, and I am Rain
I thought we had 16.7 Arete?
OaF is only 22 Arete after Bastions discount, so only 5.3 rather then 7-8. at least I thought so? Math Nerd I'm not, but I thought I was at least competent at Arithmetic...
Tyrant_Rayne
Probably Not Evil… Maybe
- Location
- Canada
We need Picks to get OaF next update so we need to take breach. But breach has a chance of failing so we should get ADS to give us better odds. But if we get ADS then we may not have enough Arete for OaF which is the biggest reason to take breach. So~... yeah I got nothing.
[X] Hide Behind Gisena
[X] Priority Two
Switching to Gisena for now. I'll switch back if it looks like we can generate enough Arete for both ADS and OaF but that's looking to be unlikely.
[X] Hide Behind Gisena
[X] Priority Two
Switching to Gisena for now. I'll switch back if it looks like we can generate enough Arete for both ADS and OaF but that's looking to be unlikely.
Last edited:
- Location
- US
We're 5.3 Arete away from OaF+King of Winter.
Stay the course, especially since OaF was strengthened by the greedy Eye of the Storm. Seize the opportunity we took this risk for! If we hide behind Gisena, we won't need ADS to social Adorie.
The Once and Future King of Winter will soon rise.
Stay the course, especially since OaF was strengthened by the greedy Eye of the Storm. Seize the opportunity we took this risk for! If we hide behind Gisena, we won't need ADS to social Adorie.
The Once and Future King of Winter will soon rise.
Last edited:
Duquette7
I am Fire, and I am Rain
If we hide behind Gisena we don't get picks though? We dont social Adorie, Gisena does.
- Location
- US
We can get picks at the Huntress's Moon target. No need to risk Adorie socialing us to letting Decimator run for a while to get rid of the Lord Protector, after all.
- Location
- Pindorama
I mean, if you all want Once and Future immediately, the best bet would be Breach and not spending anything. But if we just save Arete here, that one-pick can be gotten in far better circumstances. There's no need to gamble the outcome of this negotiation when we can just take the options with better odds. One pick just isn't a ton at the end of the day; the risk is completely manageable.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
Once and Future would massively increase our chances of success at whatever we try to do and it's thematic to get it here. So breach still sounds like the best choice. I also want to see some social combat, it's been a while since we had an serious one.
Have Faith in Hunger, we can take her! She's no Amouthanos!
Have Faith in Hunger, we can take her! She's no Amouthanos!
Better not bring up Amouthanos, cause the other pink-colored princess in EFB totally steamrolled us socially.
Duquette7
I am Fire, and I am Rain
Well, as interesting as this is, my main point of contention is with our path going forward, namely our response to Chains.
I too worry about the Human Sphere, we've left it too long, and certain plot lines are about to trip.
But as a counter point, what would we do once we got there? We are in the unenviable position where combat wise we kind of fall through the cracks.
None of our power is usable in an orbital theater, so fleet actions are out, and planet side we can likely stomp anything short of an Armament, but it would be suicide to face one at this time. Unfortunately that makes us an acceptable target to turn an Armament against, Mages are a well known phenomenon in this verse, and one that can wipe teams of prototypes is a priority target.
Just by taking the field at this juncture we invite a response we cant survive, sharply limiting our options for action in the sphere.
Our prospects for social combat are a joke, do to Tyrant we cant do subtle, either we are in a position of power, or we cant talk to anyone who might give us orders, and as an asset with so much power, they would feel the need to have us in their chain of command.
What it comes down to is I think we've leveled past the point of easy insertion into the Sphere, but have yet to reach a level where we can survive that fact.
So, stay in the VR until we can solo an Armament, then take the field.
Things will have progressed, but it almost doesn't matter how things are going in the sphere, we have to conquer them anyway.
I too worry about the Human Sphere, we've left it too long, and certain plot lines are about to trip.
But as a counter point, what would we do once we got there? We are in the unenviable position where combat wise we kind of fall through the cracks.
None of our power is usable in an orbital theater, so fleet actions are out, and planet side we can likely stomp anything short of an Armament, but it would be suicide to face one at this time. Unfortunately that makes us an acceptable target to turn an Armament against, Mages are a well known phenomenon in this verse, and one that can wipe teams of prototypes is a priority target.
Just by taking the field at this juncture we invite a response we cant survive, sharply limiting our options for action in the sphere.
Our prospects for social combat are a joke, do to Tyrant we cant do subtle, either we are in a position of power, or we cant talk to anyone who might give us orders, and as an asset with so much power, they would feel the need to have us in their chain of command.
What it comes down to is I think we've leveled past the point of easy insertion into the Sphere, but have yet to reach a level where we can survive that fact.
So, stay in the VR until we can solo an Armament, then take the field.
Things will have progressed, but it almost doesn't matter how things are going in the sphere, we have to conquer them anyway.
Last edited:
- Location
- Pindorama
Hmm, based on current activity, I expect our multiplier for this cycle to be low. Having the story updates be on a 4-day cycle right after a contentious vote seems to have done quite a bit of damage to the momentum of the quest.
This is most relevant if we do actually choose Breach here; while I'm sure we can make up the five remaining Arete in two update's time, getting a good multiplier this cycle might be the difference between walking away from Breach with OaF plus Iridescence or just baking the two picks towards a DA. Either could be good, really, even if Iridescence is more valuable than ever nowadays.
But anyway, I really don't think we need to enter negotiations we are so disadvantaged towards we have more effective alternatives on offer. It's a needless risk in my opinion. It's more greed on top of greed. While I suppose that's fitting given what we chose, we don't need to be bound by such things; one might even say not being so is a good idea! I really recommend a safe option here, given we stand to get little immediate gain while possibly committing ourselves for a long time with Breach.
Right now is basically the perfect time to play it safe, so let's go for it.
This is most relevant if we do actually choose Breach here; while I'm sure we can make up the five remaining Arete in two update's time, getting a good multiplier this cycle might be the difference between walking away from Breach with OaF plus Iridescence or just baking the two picks towards a DA. Either could be good, really, even if Iridescence is more valuable than ever nowadays.
But anyway, I really don't think we need to enter negotiations we are so disadvantaged towards we have more effective alternatives on offer. It's a needless risk in my opinion. It's more greed on top of greed. While I suppose that's fitting given what we chose, we don't need to be bound by such things; one might even say not being so is a good idea! I really recommend a safe option here, given we stand to get little immediate gain while possibly committing ourselves for a long time with Breach.
Right now is basically the perfect time to play it safe, so let's go for it.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
I mean since we are getting both artifacts either way, the risk here is pretty damn minimal. I would say it's the opposite of greed. We rarely get an chance at 2/3 picks(?) with no risk to Hunger.
The alternative is fighting something that potentially comes with actual death chances to get those picks ya know. Hunger need to get experience at social combat so that he can get picks that way in the Human Sphere, so this sounds like an good start to that as well.
Last edited:
- Location
- Pindorama
A bigger commitment here may actually mean increased death chances in the future though, even if we both agree to fight the Lord Protector. She might ask for the completion of dangerous missions, for example. She might also force us to prioritize fighting the Tyrant over Mitigating the Decimation as well. Really, any agreement that tampers our latitude of action could be really unpleasant for us.
If we do try to get those picks on our own, it will be done on our own terms. A loss to Adorie here could quite literally take the matter out of our hands, and we might not even get the picks! It's not immediate risk, sure, but you can't say it's not risky.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
Doesn't change the fact it's not greedy at all especially with us getting an chance to get Once and Future.
What's greedy is losing an chance at getting picks and OaF because we are afraid of Social combat against someone actually mostly aligned with us while hoping to get picks against the Moon Huntress target or Tyrant. I would rather take our next step with ADS or OaF + Winter King at hand. That's far safer.
Last edited:
Talace
It must be raining somewhere else!
Hmmm... I think that the Decimation might also be a very compelling argumentative tool for us. How could Adorie conscience a life force drain on that scale in her kingdom, let alone anywhere in the world? Thus, the most moral contract is one that gives us the leeway to pursue mitigation before going back and blamming the Tyrant.
DkArthas
CAPITAL IS TO BLAME
- Location
- Earth
- Pronouns
- They
We choose Tears(Adorie), so that's also something we can use, instead of taking her family heirloom, we are willing to empower her with it as well in exchange for good terms. She should be plenty happy with that "concession".
Last edited: