She's also an invader and we're a lawfully elected official.
I actually find this sentiment hilarious.

The Association fielded a candidate, but unlikely inconveniences kept piling onto his campaign. First their database of voters got wiped by simultaneous solar flares on seventeen different planets, then the candidate's pleasure barge released itemized expense reports. The entire campaign's chat history was leaked. Twice. And anytime they set up a debate with Candidate Hunger, songbirds and baby animals would flock to one side of the auditorium to sing and chirp in response to Hunger, but hiss and scurry away from the Association candidate.
 
Really the better way for Rank to tip the scales would be "The Association fielded a candidate, but he was by comparison dim-witted, incompetent, and vaguely reprehensible.". just one unlikely inconvenience, compounded by subtle pressure amplifying those negative qualities, looks much less suspicious if you aren't already suspicious, whereas 'database wiped out by 17 simultanous solar flares' is a bit... tipping your hand.
 
Really, at this point it might be more like "The Association fielded a candidate but then they didn't and never did in the first place." Not that it would even be necessary: after you save the galaxy from getting eaten by an aggressive, hegemonizing swarm, I'd imagine you'd get close to a 100% approval even without Rank.
 
Really, at this point it might be more like "The Association fielded a candidate but then they didn't and never did in the first place." Not that it would even be necessary: after you save the galaxy from getting eaten by an aggressive, hegemonizing swarm, I'd imagine you'd get close to a 100% approval even without Rank.
You can probably get close to 100% approval, but would you get close to 100% votes-in-favor? if your protection is conditional on being the elected leader, maybe, but I don't think the combat chops would equate to people-convinced-you-make-a-good-leader and I'd think at least 1% of people would care about that.
And 'nobody else ran' is a bit suspicious-Rank Could micromanage everyone to make nobody worry about it, but wouldn't it be better to... not?
 
Always reaction (1849 Words)
An infinity before, she had been Ceathlynn. Now, she was the Maiden in full: wax and wick both melted away, leaving only the flame imperishable. Endless eons of preparation had culminated in this single moment.
Why did we chose to give the Maiden infinite training time again? All the options available gave the Maiden a lot of power but, outside of Flower of Victory, Giving the Maiden literally infinite training time really feels like it was the worst option we could have taken. And we didn't even know about Inheritance/Blood Halo/Imperishable Night at the time! Without them we'd have just lost and it wouldn't have been even remotely close...
With an exercise of her Grace, the Epistolary Realm unfurled around her: falling to pieces like the petals of a lotus, become so much fuel and dross before the infinite emanation of wonder that was her heart. It was not in her nature to hesitate, only to prevail.
And the Maiden just consumes the entire Epistolary Realm for fuel, a place whose greatest depth lies far into the Realm of Form...
From the realm of unsparing Daylight she strode forth: blazing sun of halcyon white before which even the starry void itself could but retreat into noon-bleached impotence. The universe was cast instantly into refracted luminance, moon to the sun of her yet-veiled visage.
Yeah, we're way way way above universe-level at this point. I mean, even armaments are capable of tanking merely infinitely powerful physical attacks and, during the fight against Aobaru, Hunger hit Aobaru so hard it briefly disrupted the very concept of fire, so what is the universe, but ephemeral dross, compared to the Maiden?
And yet, some fraction of this realm did not leap implicitly into her service, but interdicted her: a territory chained by its bedrock axioms to a lord that presumed himself above even the Foremost. Upon his throne of midnight, the Imprisoner reigned still, embryonic spark that threatened ignition into the Forebear of Dynasties once more.
Hunger has come so far in so little time... Remember when we had to be afraid of random encounters in the Voyaging Realm?
How strange it seemed, to one of her matchless span, finally to face the enemy who she'd labored against for so long. A veritable eternity had been spent in the mustering; millenia beyond number passing with eyeblink quickness, and yet it had seemed at times that she would merely be preparing for ever.

In her heart of hearts, she was tired, and yet could not help but surge with vigor at the contest come at last. Like first break of dawn after a wholly-sleepless night, a second wind came over her: senses bleary but radically sharper, every nerve tuned to crackling readiness.
I can't even imagine the kind of mindset it would take to be willing to train for a literal eternity, without any rest, just so you could defeat one specific enemy... who's not even particularly bad from any kind of objective point of view! Apocryphal is one hell of a drug...

And then to finally get to fight that enemy after all that time spent training... No wonder she's finding herself full of vigor, this is what the quasi-totality of her lifespan have been consecrated to accomplishing, defeating Hunger is literally her life work. Though hopefully it will all end up being a waste...
Behind her veil, she frowned minutely. Her power could not reach directly into the Human Sphere. It was not an unexpected outcome, yet she had hoped that the Praehihr would avoid this path, if only to expedite matters for them both.

In any direct contest, it was unquestionable that her Grace would evade the grasp of his Law - yet such was his dominion over Space that, within his proscribed territory, the very concept of evasion lost coherence. An effect she could counter by sheer weight of findross, but only if she entered the territory in question.

It was, of course, impossible to breach such a realm by conventional means, or even to conceive of its relative location. To her, such minute forbiddings were little better than tinsel, yet it would still be an exertion of her stamina - unthinkably vast, but finite - to cut through, and what was to stop him from immediately raising another?

Only her direct attentions.

She had anticipated this. It was one scenario of countless she'd simulated, and yet every victory along this path carried some measure of risk. The Praehihr had embraced imprisonment entirely; sacrificing all influence outside his fortress to become nigh unassailable from without. The path of Grace alone would not suffice. There would be no triumph by indirect means here, no usurper consigned to irretrievable oblivion by sheer cleverness alone. He would be undone from within his sanctum, or not at all.

So be it. She had hoped for a brisk execution, but would not shirk a proper war. It would only delay the hour of her victory in the end.
Well at least we didn't lose instantly! Which was certainly not a guarantee when people voted to empower the Maiden with infinite training time... We really got bailed out by the Finality power up vote, didn't we?
A moment, and she reached the borders of his sanctum.

The Human Sphere stood arrayed before her, war-machines of her errant governess bristling across the entire circumference of its bound, unseemly science perfected and turned towards the brazen annihilation of all intruders. Sorceress Allria had plumbed great depths of mortal prowess to bring forth the Human Sphere's outer rind: a septillion dreadnaught-Implements incubated across the Voyaging and Industrial Realms, fueled not by Curseweft but indestructible nuclei of Foremost Art. Each more than a match for a thousand of the incomplete Ereadhihr left to this domain, yet worse than hapless against a proper Maker.

With a single step she bypassed the shield-moat of their combined Pressure, and prepared to banish the Human Sphere in its entirety. Its departure would see the swift removal of the Cursebearer whose Geas anchored him therein.
A septillion machines of destruction, each more than a thousandfold greater than an Armament... and they aren't even a speed bump. And I'm not even surprised! We're way past the level where such things could conceivably be relevant.
She spoke two words.

Light came forth, scouring brilliance that left no remainder, as surely as the naked sun blanketed the eye: cataclysm that unopposed would see the Sphere reduced to naught; and yet the Praehihr did not act.

Instead she witnessed her destroying light pooling harmlessly in the palm of a red-haired child, the Chosen of the Voyaging Realm who with laughable hubris presumed to defy her. Empowered by the fury of his patron he was not inconceivably below her, and certainly impervious to her powers of light and heat; but that did not render him a serious obstacle to her like.
Aobaru interrupt! Yeah, light and heat are definitely no the attack vectors you want to use against Aobaru unless you're incomparably above his current power level and are just trying to style on him.

Thankfully for Aobaru he's been empowered to the point where his raw power is at least comparable to that of the Maiden, sadly for him she possess abilities far more appropriate to deal with him...
With a gesture she removed her veil. She was the Maiden: her Grace was absolute, save that it was rivaled by her Beauty.

It was not in her nature to hold back, or contain her powers out of some misguided sense of responsibility. Her Grace was a force mastered utterly, and would not impinge upon even the indirect volition of a being unless so willed. But her Beauty by its nature was impossible to contain. It could only be concealed, and she despised the idea of unintentionally holding another in thrall. Nonetheless hypocrisy could be no impediment to victory.

Even her barest moue distress was so shatteringly exquisite that Chen Aobaru fell to her feet awestruck, and three-quarters of her enemy's Implements rose immediately in fervent and unthinking rebellion. Helplessly they discarded the crimson panoplies of their Overlord to take up her sunbeam-and-lace banner, their master's influence waning as night retreated before the dawn.

She was the Maiden, her beauty preeminent and impossible, unreachable and unutterable; guiding Archetype towards which every Sorceress evolved, yet none could ever attain. It was so tiresome a weapon to utilize, yet she could not disdain a sword of this sharpness in the contest to come. The stars and Realms of this cosmos genuflected to her in hapless submission, trembling as they pledged to her service, aching as the very laws of reality followed to do the same.
Good on the quarter of our Implements who did manage to not instantly betray us? I'm curious about how they managed it! I suppose Aobaru did also manage to not betray Hunger, even if he did get instantly get taken down...

But yeah, ISH 5+ beauty is one hell of a power... Well ISH 5+ anything is going to be bullshit, really!
At this provocation, finally, the Overlord appeared.

The merest glance at her close presence and he struck out his own eyes; unhealing wounds bleeding crimson to match the halo of light at his back. Gone his sight and his very capacity to appreciate beauty; ruthlessness worthy of her foe.
We worked so hard to get back one of Hunger's eye, refusing any power up that came with the cost of making his one-eyedness permanent and now he's stuck with no eyes with no prospect of getting them back anytime soon, given the unhealing nature of his wounds and the massive penalty to any form of healing that comes with Blood Halo (-1 ISH, ouch). And that's the price to pay to even be able to fight the Maiden at all, rather than instantly losing to her beauty...
In his hands was the Forebear's blade, his armor pitted steel of similarly dull make. Upon his shoulders was the three-headed visage of his former Armament Verschlengorge, taxidermied now in perfect lunging voracity. In their half-opened maws was held a cloak of the night sky, velveteen dark teeming with stars and nebulae - as if the contents of the cosmos had, fleeing her light, now taken asylum within. She frowned, tears of blood falling from her eye. Even an Emperor ought show some restraint.
The fact that it makes a sufficiently garish appearance is a valid attack vector is possibly one of the most hilariously awesome thing about Blood Halo. Though honestly, Hunger appearance just seem incredibly cool to me?

I was incredibly unenthusiastic about the aesthetic of Blood Halo, crimson Praxis just seemed like a cliched villain aesthetic but I must admit that the image of Vershlengorge's head Hunger's shoulder holding in their maw the cloack of the night sky just seem like an incredible image...
Without a word of preamble, he struck.

Fell the Forebear's blade as if gravity itself were the hilt; shear of its passage a scream across the world, canvas of reality shredding like tissue in its wake. This was destruction embodied in an uncaring slab: not even a bludgeon but raw unliving force, total ruin before which her defenses of light and grace would crumble as thistle beneath a mountain falling.
Interesting... that was never my perception of the blade of the Forebear before now. Cut Through always gave me the image of a precise cutting instrument, not a blunt force of pure destruction! And certainly it can be used with great finesse...
But Lord Hunger was newly blind, and his accuracy a hair from faultless. With inherent perfection she parried his blow, accepting the implosion of her arm into splintering bone to lash out with a lance of sunlight at his heart. Her equal in skill, he leaned at the last moment to turn her strike into a graze. The grey steel of his armor shimmered, melting before that heat; the skin beneath boiled.
I really like how visceral Rihaku's fight scenes are. Though it's kind of strange to have such a seemingly mundane form of fighting coexist with all this talk about entire layer of realities collapsing particularly when we're at ISH ~5.

But I guess that's a consequence of how we built Hunger: he, like the Forebear he once was, is first and foremost a swordsman so it's no surprise that whenever he can impose his chosen battlefield to his opponents it ends up coming down to a melee fight in the end.

Though given the existence of Sanctum, I would have thought the Maiden would have avoided getting within 3 meters of Hunger at any cost, but maybe our mastery of space is such that it would be completely impossible for her to hit Hunger otherwise...
And yet. While she had merely singed him, her arm was already reforming; his burn healed not at all.
Yeah that's one of the biggest problem with Blood Halo... We were supposed to have escaped the problem of death spirals long ago and now we're back in one again...
Interesting. Perhaps the outcome would have differed if he'd struck her directly, but she had exerted her arm to destruction precisely in order to redirect, rather than match, the power of his blow. Nonetheless the gap in pure strength would have to be accounted for.
At least we're physically stronger than the Maiden? Not that surprising, given that BH came with +100k Might, but pretty nice to have given that the conflict has turned into melee combat!
Already the astral plane was an eviscerated ruin, and the meta-texture of the realms above and beneath slowly disintegrating. All this was the mere inclement shock of Lord Hunger's first strike. As if breathing raggedly after tremendous exertion, the cosmos shuddered pitifully beneath the grip of his displeasure: only his own subjects, his personal Sphere, were spared that monumental fury.
Entire layers of reality being destroyed as collateral damage is probably par for the course at this level of battle... The term of texture to designate layers of reality is originally from the nasuverse, I'm pretty sure?
Tyrant.

The Maiden narrowed her eyes, resolve hardening even in the face of such limitless strength. This man was the embodiment of all she stood against, the accession of a singular will above all others, the asphyxiation of greatness - destiny - volition - under the lowered boom of law. He would make all of the world a prison, and see nothing wrong in the doing, so long as he was master of the cage.

Did it matter that his intentions might be just?

What mattered justice, to a people who had no ability to choose injustice?

She would see his end, one way or another. Victory was a certainty; her survival had never been. Thus always to tyrants.
What a terrible take... The whole "you have to have the ability to chose evil for good to mean anything" thing was always bullshit. The reality is that the people living under Hunger's dominion are living incredibly good lives, far better than anyone in our world or in this world as it was before Hunger's arrival.

And for all that one can claim that none of their actions matters on a grand scale, this is true of virtually everyone in every conceivable society! Ultimately the number of people in a society which can have a meaningful impact on the scale of the entire society is of necessity going to very small. The vast majority of people just have to deal with the fact that their lives don't really matter in the grand scheme of things, the important things is that they be able to live lives in which they can find fulfilment and hapiness.

You might argue that necessity is no obstacle to the sufficiently powerful in the Rihakuverse, but blaming Hunger for creating a realm which does not (yet!) have this logic-breaking property seems pretty silly.
For a moment their wills met, each contesting the other's raw command of reality. Here too she was shocked at the depth of his power, nearly matching her own infinitely-cultivated reserves. The multiverse quaked. Stars and galaxies shivered, filaments of the real straining like bow-strings under tension. Entire subrealms snapped, ruptured and fell into disarray, infinite chains of being unraveling, whole hierarchies of cardinality schisming or outright invalidated by the paradox of their strife.
Their strife is so powerful it creates actual logical paradoxes which destroy entire hierarchies of infinite cardinalities... That is some A-grade bullshit!
She grasped the shape of their respective dominions. Hers was the sharper and greater, his broader in scope. This was beyond the scope of her calculations; there was an aberrant factor she had missed.
I'm kind of surprised that Hunger's dominion is broader than the Maiden? Certainly Hunger's dominions are broad: Battle, Space and Law covers a lot of conceptual ground... but the Maiden has so many more abilities which would seem to together cover far more possibilities... Though admittedly each of the Maiden graces is far more specific and a lot of them are probably not relevant at this level, so maybe that explains it?
In time she would prevail regardless, but it would be long seconds before his defenses were pierced fully. At present, with each of their domains nullifying the other's, the battle would long be decided by other means.
Yeah, seconds is a veritable eternity at this level of combat. Though, i'm kind of surprised time is even a relevant concept in this fight, particularly when I'm pretty sure both side have causality alteration. We definitely saw Letrizia altering the timeline...

Though I suppose any such effect might have too low an elevation and get cancelled by higher ISH abilities.
Even blind he was not unaffected by her beauty, for it was allure irresistible; perfected loveliness of movement and vibration, of voice and scent, that preyed upon the secondary senses unmercifully. The Forebear of Dynasties might be impervious to such temptation, but Lord Hunger was not the Forebear reborn. Not wholly.

Not yet.
Rubbing in the fact that Inheritance didn't win, uh? But with Birdsie completely overwhelming Omake production, Inheritance was doomed the second Birdsie voted against it, sadly...
As he wound up the return-stroke, Hunger spoke. "I see. I am what you fear you'd become. Fear not. My Rank is not as cruel a yoke as your form. And my wisdom, exceeds yours greatly."

Impertinence. Her throat heaved as if cut, his words themselves opening a wound upon her neck. Her essence spilled out at unnatural pace, but mustering herself she quelled the injury. Keeping it closed was a continuous strain. Modest, compared to the extremes that would be required if she sustained a blow from the blade proper.
Do our wisdom actually surpass the Maiden? BH does not actually boost wisdom...
Yielding an inch in their contest over reality, she redirected the output to strategically sever the chord of communication between them, removing rhetoric as a vector of attack while retaining her ability to comprehend her foe.

This was the gulf between them: Lord Hunger had to mutilate his own eyes merely to hold off her memetic valence, while she could simply filter his. But with each such expression of material advantage, each stream of findross reified from potential to form, the magnitude of that vantage diminished.
Yeah, the penalty to healing from BH is really hurting us. At least the Maiden has to pay some price to cut off our attack vectors but we're still on the losing side of a prolonged fight unless we can get some form of powerup.
Hunger's second cut turned out to be a feint; closing the distance he shifted his grip to deliver a bone-crushing strike with the hilt at her temple. Pulverization of the essence and soul - space crinkled like shattering glass as she half-ducked beneath that assault, feeling eye and orbital crack from its mere passing weight.

Her hands were not idle, manifesting a blade of crystal findross to slice through his knee. The cloak of sky fouled her stroke, wrapping tenaciously around her wrist as that selfsame knee snapped up to catch her in the face.
Well, we may be down our two eyes but she's down one and in general we're still doing pretty good damage, it just won't be sufficient, unfortunately...
She twisted off her own arm rather than let the blow land, hollow stump trailing blood as she fell to the middle distance and began to heal again. Her mind raced. How was Hunger able to withstand the power of her supreme Grace with only his Rank and magics alone? All else proceeded as she had anticipated, save this miscalculation that might be her undoing. But the perfection of the Maiden, extended to genius as well.

The answer lay in Chen Aobaru, imbued with a fraction of his might.

She was well familiar with the legend of the Foremost Shogun. Chief among their purported abilities was the empowerment of their subjects en masse, freely and without precondition.

Somewhere in this realm was an Army of the Shogun whose sole purpose was re-channeling their distributed power directly into Hunger's Rank. The encirclement of Implements was merely a distraction from that, as well as Aobaru's presence itself. An inefficient means of opposing her dominion, but likely the only viable method they had.
So we're actually using BH's ability to buff our subordinates to a 100 times our own power to inefficiently buff our Rank instead so we don't instantly lose the Maiden's dominion... I've been wondering about that.

Wouldn't it be nice to not have to do that and instead just have infinite Rank? Wouldn't that be nice? Inheritance was just so good...
Where would such an army be located? She cast her mind out, all-revealing Daylight piercing even the murkiest shroud of Nullity - ah. The Voyaging Realm. A kingdom called Nilfel, part of the Arcanist's domain.
Yeah, Gisena doesn't stand a chance of concealing anything from the Maiden at her current power level. We do have the chance to empower her, though...
Her opponent pursued relentlessly, opening with a cross-cleave that also obliterated the Astral entirely, causing the uppermost textures to pancake down and shake the universe to its fundaments. Consequently the timing of her evasions was imperfect; her left shoulder was caught and reduced to a ragged mess, bleeding so profoundly even she couldn't afford to staunch it.
Rip everything in the Astral. No that I expect them to remain dead after the conclusion of the battle, this is the kind of problem both side of this battle should be able to deal with. Even if Hunger can't do it himself anymore, there's always Gisena.
But this too was within her calculations. She could not directly witness the future of a Cursebearer, but her insight in matters of war was more than sufficient. Even as her left side collapsed into a grisly ruin, the knife-hand of her right plunged into Lord Hunger's chest, through the opening melted by her previous strike and directly into his heart. With her left arm useless, her leg shifted upwards, vertically flush against their bodies to point a shapely foot in the direction of the Voyaging Realm. From it leapt a spear of uncontrolled findross: simple bolt of self-propagating annihilation, which none of his allies would have the power to deflect.

Mere proximity to Lord Hunger was nearly lethal; at this range, the blade-light of his crimson halo sliced countless wounds into her face and limbs, her veil of lace repealed by one of blood.
And now we're down our heart. We're accumulating damage at a rather alarming rate... And Nilfel is getting treathened.
Rivulets of red traced like rain from her pale flesh as Chen Aobaru hurled himself before the Voyaging Realm; bolt and hero both disappeared in a flash of flame.
Thankfully Aobaru is here to tank the blow!
Clever. Her features briefly obscured, and the Chosen of the Voyaging Realm had mustered the will to defy her indirectly, if only to fulfill his given purpose of defending his home. Now her initiative was lost.
I'm not sure "clever" is the term I would use to describe throwing oneself in front of the enemy attack, but it sure is better for us than the alternative here.
Despite his own injury Hunger spared not even a moment; his forehead crashed down with thunderous severity to impact against hers, even as the Armament-heads on his shoulder pauldrons released the cloak to swivel and bite down on her arms. Skull ringing, she tossed her hair with a savage burst of findross; impossibly fair the golden halo sliced through Hunger's face, claiming half his jaw and nose as she twisted aside.
And more of our body parts are gone... This is not sustainable!
With her remaining hand she tenderly pet the nearest Armament-head; all three went slack in bewildered rhapsody, and she leap free. Her bleeding left side she gave up for lost - a moment's will and it slid off her frame, a single clean cut seared closed by daylight. Fresh waves of findross repulsed his lingering influence, wounds sealing flawlessly as her blood slowly began to replenish.
The terrifying power of headpats... The fact that we did manage to remove half of the Maiden's body would be a lot more reassuring if she couldn't just heal it back...
I have him.

Victory in twelve exchanges at the current pace. She dared not underestimate this foe; the depths of his will were bottomless, but neither his body nor essence could sustain combat at this level for long. The Praxis was his advantage, but its cost was grievous. Each blow from him was an uttermost exertion, while she had only begun to fight. The wounds she sustained would recover, if slowly, while his own injuries remained static at best. Now to close the circle against any desperate maneuvering from his quarter.

With the pace of his offense she was best suited to evasion and counterattack; the angle of his body now shielded the Voyaging Realm from future attempts. Even so it was only a matter of time. If she did not wear him down in direct battle, or land an errant strike on the Voyaging Realm, then eventually she would prevail in their contest of dominion.
Yeah, time is really not to our advantage. We need to do something and fast. Sadly the Maiden has trump cards of her own...
And, if all else failed… she had her final recourse still. She prayed it would not come to that.
Including what sounds like an equivalent to our shattering blow...
Win. That's all that matters.
And it all comes full circle, doesn't it? The Maiden's resolve would be quite admirable if it wasn't so misguided! And the voterbase probably doesn't have the same kind of resolve when it comes to his own victory against the Maiden... Which could even be justified: there is a large asymmetry between the positions of the Maiden and Hunger.

For the Maiden, Hunger is her ultimate enemy, which she has spent a literal eternity training to defeat, for Hunger she's just another challenge on his path to defeat the Hidden Masters. For Hunger winning against the Maiden isn't all that matters, he also need to end up in a good enough position to give him a shot at his ultimate ambitions.

Overall I really enjoyed this update. I really enjoy well written high power fight scene and there's just so few of them out there and this might well be the highest power well written fight scene in existence! I think I still prefer the general flavor of the final fights of EFB, but those fights were a lot shorter than this one and its not even over yet!
 
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...I WANT IT.

[X] Vendetta

Question: for Arete generation purposes, is posting builds for non-thread CYOAs valid? Obviously, linking said CYOAs would also be entailed.

Yes. There's a penalty if it's not related or less related to the actual Threadmarks/story/setting, but it's still valid. Am I correct in assuming the CYOAs I posted and you provided proper links for are what you're referring to?
 
Yes. There's a penalty if it's not related or less related to the actual Threadmarks/story/setting, but it's still valid. Am I correct in assuming the CYOAs I posted and you provided proper links for are what you're referring to?
Potentially! One of those authors actually has, like, a shitload of others too. This one was one of my favorites: Borderworlds CYOA. Most CYOAs are some form of power fantasy, but this would be more accurately described as a kind of "survival fantasy" IMO. It's really interesting to think about when the difficulty is ratcheted up so high!
 
Alright. After thinking about it in the shower, I have come to a conclusion. I'm going to make an argument... In favor of Hour of Destiny.

Now, I know what you're all thinking. But I have come to the conclusion: the fact that we have Hour of Destiny does not mean we need to actually use it. Right now at least. My idea is as follows: we go Closing the Fist, spending 25 arete for two finishers. We take either invincible vigor or living legend - and hope that Closing the Fist's default +0.3 ISH and 40x stats plus one of the two finishers is enough to kill her. If not, then at the last moment we can trigger Hour of Destiny, purchased as our second finisher. If we don't need Hour of Destiny, we can save it. Get-out-of-death cards never go out of style, and we didn't take Haeliel's friggen once-per-task protection so this is the best we can get. If we do need Hour of Destiny, it's better then dying and not even Perfect Merger guarantees victory, assuming we can afford it. Dangerous assumption there.

The fact of the matter is, while losing max Apocryphal mitigation is bad, knocking her down to 37.5% is both good and also totally out of the scope of this quest. Even fifth stage mitigation is so far out of reach as to be laughable, why are we worrying so much about the sixth? Also, even if Hunger is forced to use an Hour of Destiny here, that doesn't mean he'll need to use the other two. He could potentially get Apo-chan down to 25% or even 12.5% if the epilogue goes well enough, and if the epilogue doesn't go that well then he was probably dead without the Hours of Destiny anyway.

I know everyone's excited about Perfect Merger Sasuga Gisena-Sama, but if we can't make the arete then Hour of Destiny is honestly one of the better options IMO. Unless we want to vote 02 for the soup update reference. Imagine if not spilling the soup ended up saving the quest, the memes would be legendary.
 
also, the last time we got the option to fuse with Aobaru it mentioned that our element would be fused into Vigordross too. I'm not sure what exactly that'd mean but it sounds cool, at least.
 
[X] The Cavalry

I have been convinced by the efficiency of Fields of Blood, and I don't see a problem with people volunteering to risk their life for this, since we are doing the same. The Maiden will just call them deluded and seduced by tyranny whether they fight or not anyway.
 
So. I had a thought. We know Caethlynn had an a nearly maximum affinity for Lucenthorne based on All That Matters, and that Apocryphal could have handed it to her to power her up to peer level with where Hunger was at when Mordred happened, with a little help from a Close the Fist with Hunger's wife. As a Maker/Sorceress, the maiden with modified maxed out Archsmith and Porcelain Graces, alongside any other synergistic Graces, could probably make a supportive Panoply to synergize with Lucenthorne. She considers herself the hero of this story, and the hero always has a Panoply of artifacts. Heroes have a type advantage over Tyrants, so if she wanted to give herself a major boost against Hunger, that would be the sort of gambit I might try.

You may be wondering why this would be a trump card she'd be reluctant to use. Why would the maiden not be willing to use the Justice Blade? Well, ignoring the obvious issue with trying to swordfight Hunger as anything besides the depths of desperation tactics, Justice and Freedom are not the same thing, so there's a chance so tightly binding the explicitly sapient Justice Blade to herself would corrode her purity of purpose, and we all know how important purity is to Sorceresses, especially their progenitress. She might hold Freedom on a such a high pedestal it approaches Shirou-tier inhuman madness, but she doesn't literally embody it the way Lucenthorne would, and with Archsmith-generated artifacts complementing it combined with the level of binding necessary to qualify as a Panoply, it may well inflict Mental Corruption/Pollution. If anything could pierce her mental defenses, it would be an artifact buffed by her own powers.

She may be worried that unseating Hunger is the Freedom choice, but not the Just choice. After all, she mentioned a deep weariness lingering from her time in the Daylight Estate. As has been mentioned upthread, there are many morally worse threats compared to Hunger. Might Lucenthorne try to persuade her to stay her hand in favor of these more unjust situations? Even ally with Hunger against them? Hunger is a Progression Cursebearer. Giving him time to train/prepare is always a bad idea, and the maiden would know that. Even if she hasn't exhausted any easy means of further empowering herself, under the assumption that at least some of the other options to empower her were things she could potentially still do despite having had infinite training time to try them, there's always the chance he stumbles across something that makes him impossible for her to catch up to. Maybe he discerns a means of hard-countering Daylight like it's supposed to do for Evening, and suddenly her victory in a contest of reality control becomes uncertain, especially since he has such a ludicrous training rate thanks to Linear, now without the Ring debuff. Lucenthorne doesn't care because there are so many bigger fish to fry than the benevolent dictator who is bringing up the quality of life for his people and whose worst crimes are mindbreaking Sten(who was a monster who callously killed his own children in a fit of pique under the logic that they could always make more) and... killing people who tried to kill him first, who he is by and large bringing back now that they can't cause him problems.

See, unlike Freedom, a Tyrant is not inherently unjust. A benevolent dictatorship is the best possible form of government, and Hunger certainly qualifies. He just doesn't incite a negative reaction in Justice the way he does Freedom, and Apocryphal isn't pushing Lucenthorne towards killing Hunger like it is with Caethlynn.

Speaking of Blood Halo, does our permanent victory in Ring Wars mean we can just take all the remaining Rings for ourselves? If nothing else, feeding them to our own Ring could have interesting effects for Archmage. I'd be interested in what Domains the other Rings could add. Do we know what the others were? I think Truth was one of our candidates because they seemed based on a modified version of EFB.

Hey, there's an Omake idea. Aerie and Letrizia are off gathering the remaining Rings so Gisena can feed them to our Ring and by extension Archmage. Nobody said that the Shogun-ritual to empower Hunger's Rank had to be all that she was doing. We're already broader in scope than the maiden. Imagine adding another 7-21 Domains, plus possibly a couple more Metas like Magic. Sure, they'd be fresh and at zero in regards to training like basically all of them but Space and Law, but even a few minor extra benefits for Hunger and attack vectors she couldn't possibly have known we'd have because even we didn't know we had them until that moment could change the calculus a lot.

I'm imagining Truth laying her plans bare and countering her Beauty by laying her mind bare, with a little help from Mind. Her body might be of transcendental Beauty, but her mind is not.
 
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With Hunger, the Maiden's beef is that he's two steps from becoming the Forebear in full. By avoiding Inheritance, he's not guaranteed to go down the Absolute Rule by Absolute Sword route, but the possibility is still terribly real.

There are innumerable means of influencing a Progression-type Cursebearer. Resources, companionship, psychological reinforcement - in some ways they do it to themselves. Constant pursuit of new conflict galvanizes the old supports. The Maiden has shown up late to the party, with Gisena and Adorie doing most of her routine for her - but she is also Ceathlynn. It could be done.

Hunger could seriously just Close the Fist with the Maiden, offering to tolerate notable influence over his mind in exchange for her polity integrating with his greater regime. It's not like the act of ruling was ever important to him anyway.
 
Hunger could seriously just Close the Fist with the Maiden, offering to tolerate notable influence over his mind in exchange for her polity integrating with his greater regime. It's not like the act of ruling was ever important to him anyway.
I don't know if this is actually compatible with our Doom of the Tyrant, but it's an objectively hilarious idea. Just imagine the memes.
 
I don't know if this is actually compatible with our Doom of the Tyrant, but it's an objectively hilarious idea. Just imagine the memes.
More difficult would be coaxing out a deal despite the chord of communication being severed. Maybe Arcanist Gisena could officiate?

It's not a bad deal for the Maiden, either. Findross is the perfect medium for Foremost Runes, but she's a total script kiddy because of her lady-boner for personal destiny. Hunger, meanwhile, is a literal sword calligrapher using an inferior medium with impossibly good technique. Staple the Power of Ruin to Maidengrace and she gets back her original technique, but even better because it's now it's indestructible and self-propagating, as much an extension of her will as the blade is Hunger's.

Or how the Sanctum's intrinsic conflict of interest disappears entirely if the realm of Daylight were suddenly no longer shuttered from conflict, but instead its borders spread by it. For all the training benefits Hunger would receive, the psychological benefits the Maiden might obtain are far and away greater. Her eternity of ceaseless training would not be spent within the next few seconds, but invested further into an epoch of glory.
 
Alright let me shill for Chadvalry a bit more.
[ ] The Cavalry - They risk their lives and very existences to do so, but his lieutenants combined may be able to distract, disorient, diminish or delay the Maiden enough for Hunger to wind up an exsanguinating blow. Risks Aeira, Letrizia, Adorie, Aobaru and Novakhron.

*Dismiss half the Channeler Legions to instead empower each lieutenant's personal division instead, then have the entire lot outflank and assault the Maiden directly. If this fails, such grossly diminished Rank means the Maiden's Supreme Grace will exert effectively total control over reality in nanoseconds rather than minutes. Brief enough that she may theoretically be able to realistically stall for a victory regardless of what Hunger otherwise achieves. Also, the brigades involved may well die in this terrible charge against the princess of light.
*The potential loss of his companions hardens Hunger's resolve. +++Willpower, ++Lethality.
*Even more aggressive than Close the Fist, literally just try to distract her so Hunger can Cut Through. Good risk-reward given Blood Halo's Arete bonus; the kids' chance of success is unknown, but they're very unlikely to actually die.
  • just Cut Through Maiden
  • Gives screen time to Nova and Aerie!
  • Completely excludes Gisena out of the final fight giving her a well deserved reality check
  • Fully uses hundreds of thousands words of Arete we have generated through the last year instead of just ignoring it like the other options
  • Should it work we completely ignore Maiden's trump card, completely removing the question of what she had ready
  • In hilarious turn of the events Tyrant uses power of friendship to defeat the Hero(or Maker, as it were)
  • Lethality is very pog
  • We cuck Gisena out of screen time and Maiden out of her trump card, that's just hilarious
  • No seriously imagine being Maiden and spending infinite amount of time preparing you trump card and thinking how you will use it and imagining your victory etc just to get stab in the face before you can proc it kek
  • We might even mutual kill ourselves with Maiden and then have others revive us via Companions, that would be cool
[ ] Fields of Blood [10 Arete] - An endless wave of ready combatants to drown the Maiden in blood. An octillion legions of pre-configured warriors none of whom have ever served under Hunger's direct command; company by company they enter his service to receive the Armies of the Shogun bonus, and only when destroyed are replaced by another. Thus, the Armies of the Shogun grant not only a hundredfold his personal power, but infinite combat endurance so long as his territories can absorb the cost. And the Voyaging, Industrial, and Epistolary Realms are vast indeed… Of course, this still runs into the issue of the Maiden's victory in the contest of dominion, but that will still take several nanoseconds, long enough for Hunger to sacrifice countless subjects and constructs to the Maiden's sword! ++Victory chance.
  • Direct upgrade over previous option
  • Literally just Victory+, no bells and whistles, it just works
  • Literal trillions choosing to sacrifice themselves to stop Maiden's schema how's that for freedom of choice kek
  • Endless stamina means that our finally attack while Maiden is distracted can be at full power
  • With only 10 Arete, we minimally compromise safety of our friends
  • And in addition to that they too get infinite stamina from armies feeding them power
  • As per above, this option too is about Cutting Through Maiden before she can use her trump card
  • Cut Through, even when it can't be Cut
  • but also: Cut, when the opportunity to Cut Through is given
  • Literal randos have more impact in the final battle than Gisena lol
 
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I see instant win button.
There are no sure-win options.

...I WANT IT.

[X] Vendetta

Question: for Arete generation purposes, is posting builds for non-thread CYOAs valid? Obviously, linking said CYOAs would also be entailed.
It's been stated at some distant point before that omake needs to possess some level of actual relevance to the thread itself. The likelihood of that giving you much benefit is doubtful.

---

The Accursed may be the End of All Stories, but until such a time the Accursed wins, these Stories are going to keep existing. Originally, the Story of A Simple Transaction began with the Hero and the Tyrant. It was the duality and conflict of these beings that kickstarted the narrative. Whether you perceive that as one of the origins of the idea, the Fellowship against Sauron, or the cosmic origin in this verse, the Forebear against the Accursed, as the very first non-title line of this thread's story declares, every story has been spoken before. In that case, what is the original scenario of Heroism against Tyranny we've faced? The one described, also, in the beginning.

The Hero and the Tyrant. By destiny and ideals; prophecy and reasoning; men who'd been made into foes. The Tyrant's rising apex represented an unacceptable outcome in the Hero's eyes; domination of a single great being over simple human freedoms. And so, the Tyrant had to be opposed by the Hero, and they came to blows.

A season's dalliance becomes a grim slog of years, and the Hero's many companions die away like wilted flowers until the final battle in which everything was resolved. The Hero prevailed, although barely, and he'd become a thin figment of what he used to be. He was betrayed and nearly died.

Do you see the parallels to the Accursed and Forebear yet? The Forebear is the Tyrant; the Accursed is the Hero. The moment in the prologue in which Hunger is lying on the floor, broken and bleeding, and the Accursed appears to him, is the moment in which the Accursed was made into himself; in which Hunger is made into a Cursebearer. All of it reflects. The only difference between them is that the Accursed didn't have any higher being to aid him, and Hunger was lucky enough to be cursed by a single being. As Hunger is the Hero made into the Tyrant, who used to be the Forebear, only that one aspect of the tale is to any noticeable degree relevant to him.

Every story has been spoken before. The wheel of narrative turns. The Forebear (Tyrant) cursed the Accursed (Hero) and was destroyed for his temerity, and the Tyrant managed to burn away what remained of Hunger (Hero) before also being slain. The Forebear's ironic punishment was taking the narrative place of the being he'd opposed; now his tyranny is turned towards brighter ideals. But the Forebear alone didn't engineer the Accursed's being.

Consider: Hunger(/Accursed) had his fate engineered (was cursed) by a large group of beings. The Hidden Ones are the other curse-givers, narratively. The beings responsible for Hunger's dark fate narratively reflect the beings that cursed the Accursed. Hunger taking vengeance on the Hidden Ones, storywise, represents the Accursed's victory, in defeating the curse-givers and becoming the true omnipotent. And we know this to be inevitable, as the Accursed already transcended the beings that cursed him.

Let's return to that moment in which the Tyrant and Hero fight. There was, as you might remember, a third person there. She said, back then, as she says right now, "Win. That's all that matters." The room had, in actuality, the Hero, the Tyrant, and the Maiden. Once again, the wheel has turned.

Now, we have the Hero, the Tyrant, and the Maiden, again telling us the same story. Maybe the actors behind them have changed (Hunger, the former Hero is the Tyrant; Aobaru is the Hero, and the Maiden is played by two actresses acting in unison,) but at the core, it's the same characters.

Only, it's been changed, because the Accursed is the End of All Stories. Now the Hero and Tyrant have made peace and agreed on a fate satisfactory to everyone, and they're fighting together against the Maiden, who believes still the Tyrant must perish and his reign must end. By the Accursed's power, we get to write a new ending to the story.

The endings, as given to us, are:
*The Hero and Tyrant unite to defeat the Maiden together.
*The Tyrant's companions arrive to aid him in defeating the Maiden alone.
*The Arcanist arrives and aids the Tyrant in defeating the Maiden.

The reason why I perceive Cavalry as the least satisfying and desirable ending, aside from the fact that it's been stated as the riskiest (and we've been taking risks, frequently at terrible costs, the entire quest,) is that the Hero's companions weren't highly effective against the Tyrant, except in the Maiden's case, as a shield against a blow. Even in the end, it still comes down to the Tyrant, the Hero, and the Maiden (now a lone agent, instead of a companion.) The shifting of the roles indicates this might be effective, but it's an equally risky move for similar reasons.

The reason why I perceive Vendetta as the second best choice is that it's something of a deus ex machina; "a cop-out." Although it makes sense in context, and it's almost appropriate for a Cursebearer/the Accursed to break the story utterly with something as unexpected as this, it's not, in my eyes, as satisfying as...

Closing the Fist, which also, coincidentally, Closes the Narrative. It closes the infinite loop of Heroes and Tyrants (and Maidens) that we're immersed in. The Hero and Tyrant come together, in a duality like yin and yang, to defeat the only remaining hostile element in the narrative. The interesting times, the law of antagonism, is overcome through the union of simple principles and domination; its agent, the Maiden, is laid low by the union of these foes who were meant to fight and war against each other eternally. The story ends as in any other proposed ending, but it ends via the movements of its own brush, rather than a sword taken from some distaff place.

Thank you for coming to my TED Talk.
 
And unlike other options, Cavalry actually leverages that Arete into something useful, as it proactively exposes our companions to risk they are already insured against.
Them surviving doesn't equal them winning.

Can be relatively easily circumvented, especially by the Maiden.

Edit: basically, it may make use of the arete for Blood Halo, but does it make us more likely to win?
 
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And unlike other options, Cavalry actually leverages that Arete into something useful, as it proactively exposes our companions to risk they are already insured against.
Close the Fist does that as well and does it far more expediently than Cavalry. As I've said before, Aobaru himself benefits from higher survival chances, so merging Aobaru and Hunger would grant a similar boon to Hunger. Bringing companions into the field of battle risks the Maiden simply disabling them non-lethally in various ways.
 
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