So, now that we've got RoB, we are suddenly almost back at having full Ruin build to go along with our full Rank build. This has obvious offensive and defensive implications when combined with ADS auto-defending against everything. As such, it's important to understand the math behind Ruin and which Advancements will improve it.

Courtesy of Sharkey, this is current Ruin math: (50x2.1+22x1.6)x17.5x14 = 34349

As you can see, we are currently sitting at 35k Ruin before ISH boosts, which is pretty sizable amount. Now, lets us go through that math, just this time explaining what numbers actually are:

(Base Str(50) x Str Mod(210%) + (Str from Willpower(22x1.6)))x RoB(14) x Ruin damage boost(17.5). Now, lets go piece by piece
  • Base stats: As always, remember that base value is multiplier too. Tripling our total Str would also triple our total Ruin. As such, simply gaining more Str is fastest way to boost our Ruin. There are few ways to facilitate that - we've already gained Pillars, which give us Echos per unit of time, and we have access to upgrades such as Ruling Ring or EBA which double value of Echos. To put this in perspective - right now we have 50 Str. With a year or 20 Echos per Pillars, this can easily turn into 300 Str, increasing our overall Ruin to about 200k
  • Another thing we could do is increasing multipliers. Currently we have the following - Penitent, Uttermost, Aobaru and Edeldross. We have multiple options to improve our % bonus, such as investing into Aobaru or Edeldross or getting something like Outer Darkness or SJUC
  • Of course, we can always get Refinement of Purpose to massive burst of Willpower and, via Cut Through, Str
  • RoB naturally improves over time, but we can choose actions that would let it improve faster(or at least I believe so). In fact, this natural improvement of both RoB and Echo is a big plus of Ruin when compared to Rank, which requires much more work to keep scaling
  • Then there are Ruin and damage bonuses, such as Winter King, which act as last multiplier. Advancement such as Pitless Maw improve this multiplier
  • Finally, there is additional multiplier we don't have, but one we can get. Upgrades such as Threefold or Avenger multiply our Str after everything else is said and done, so getting one is somewhat crucial to this build

Now, let us consider possible Advancement:

  • Ruling Ring - I've already talked about insane value we'd get out of RR Echoes, and that it still true. We just need to get this. EBA does something similar, but it's mutually exclusive with RR and RR is just better when it comes to buffing picks.
  • Pitless Maw - Adds +3 to our Ruin damage multiplier. Likely not valuable enough at this point.
  • Stranglethorn - Double the value of Strength and Constitution +s. There was some discussion about what this means, but it could fully stack with everything else, or it could be just +100% multi, who knows. Either way, a relevant increase.
  • Outer Darkness - Both this and upgrade to Outer Shadow give more Str
  • SJUC - The king is here bois. When not giving us insane amount of Rank or unlocking more DAs or being so chad that losing half of its effect doesn't even mater, SJUC also gives 100(or even 150%) to stat of our choice. So you get SJUC for Rank, and you also get massive STR boost as a bonus. Whats not to like?
  • Arisen Blood - Basically just double our power of Ruin while at full hp, no question asked. Stacks with everything. It is somewhat pricey at 3 picks, but this is by far the most efficient Ruin Advancement we can currently access.
  • Stances - Stances generally work of Ruin, so it might be valuable to pick up FDS Stances now that we have a lot of Ruin
  • Hateful Might - YOU. Yes, you! Did you look for a reason to actually, unironically pick passion? Well, look no more, because Hateful Might is here. Simply put, we get to directly apply Ruin to enemies blood and souls because fuck our enemies.
  • Avenger - While Threefold and Form of :rage: are long gone, Avenger is still there to provide us with double stats and guaranteed crits. Very powerful with Ruin, but we need to actually proc it, which is not all that easy, or pleasant.
  • Refinement of Purpose - gives us a ton of Str via Willpower, allowing for pretty serious burst in Ruin power right now
 
Armor of Midnight gives +1000 PROT, which is enough to block a tier one infinity yeah. (Though, this is assuming universe-level = infinite instead of arbitrarily large.)

However, given that our base PROT is currently like 1400 post RoB, ignoring the bring-to-our-level passive Pearlescence would give to that as irrelevant would be a bad move, I think. That would mean that despite our Rank rising at breakneck speeds, our PROT would remain at an appropriate level.
 
Say, @Rihaku. I've been wondering. If Red is Essence-based, Gold is wealth-based, Green is age/time-based, and Violet is death-based, is Blue information-based? I mean, the Fish Beric was using to empower himself suggests that advancement has multiple factors, like Gold being reliant on both skill and advancement, but perhaps Blue is more about using your power more efficiently than growing in power?

So, is it data-based, logic-based, or some of both? Though, I'm not sure how the Fish fits into this. I'm just very confused, because if it works how I think it does, then I'm thinking the Skeleton King antagonist in my Omakeverse has Blue Color Magic, as a booster for his casting. I don't know much about any other hypotehtical Colors as well, so any workings of, say, Orange are lost to me. Further, there's no guarantee that Gold is in fact filling in for Yellow, which would suggest a Silver Color Magic if it isn't. Have they appeared elsewhere in your setting?
 
Extending on my deductions about Gisena's current Physical Capabilties, here are physical stats accounting for buffs/debuffs after

Sten(In Wake of Silence)

35 Agility(1.25 multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 51.8
41 Strength(1.25 Multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 59.3
37 Constitution(1.2 Multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 52.45

For Comparison, Gisena's speculated current stats, combined with Aobaru's Vigorflame buffing her
37 Agility, 62.9 Under Aobaru's Vigorflame,
41 Strength, 69.7 Under Aobaru's Vigorflame,
37 Constitution. 62.9 Under Aobaru's Vigorflame,

With Aobaru buffing her, Gisena would be a worthy opponent for Sten physically speaking or utterly curbstomp him.

The Rotbeast fight(A Fire Woken)

41 Agility(1.25 Multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 59.3 Agility
41 Strength(1.75 Multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 79.8 Strength
37 Constitution(1.7 Multiplier)+7 Willpower(1.15 Multiplier) = 70.95 Constitution.

With Aobaru buffing her she's established as faster than post Rotbeast fight Hunger, though Hunger still has her beat in the Strength/Constitution departments.
 
Quick maffs.

Refinement of Purpose would give us a burst of Willpower to Ruin that would put our total Ruin at about 80k. Then, getting additional 100% from SJUC would, on top of Rank, also get our Ruin to 100k. We could then get Arisen Blood to double our Ruin to 200k. And at that point we should probably get our first RoB improvement, putting our total Ruin at 260k.

Pretty decent.
 
[X] Vanquisher's Grace + Auspice Temporal
[X] Flight of Falling Stars
whatever praxis ig
 
[X] Vanquisher's Grace + Auspice Temporal
[X] Build Cleanup


Well, as long as the Sword isn't going to shatter like glass the distant we hit something sturdy with it, I suppose this is fine to.
 
Adhoc vote count started by ilbgar123 on Dec 15, 2020 at 2:27 PM, finished with 209 posts and 51 votes.


Looks like Build Cleanup is in the lead by one vote, and Vanquisher's Grace and the Make/Sealing build are also neck-in-neck, though the latter is actually in the lead because the version with (The Grace of the Glaze) and without are counted separately.
 
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Looks like Build Cleanup is in the lead by one vote, and Vanquisher's Grace and the Make/Sealing build are also neck-in-neck, though the latter is actually in the lead because the version with (The Grace of the Glaze) and without are counted separately.
You can use "vote management" to combine vote lines that should be counted as support for the same option!
Adhoc vote count started by ilbgar123 on Dec 15, 2020 at 2:27 PM, finished with 209 posts and 51 votes.
 
I realized something that makes me wish I had my realization about Aobaru's buff multipliers sooner.

Let's say Aobaru has 7 Base Might from a mix of Ennobling and personal training.

A Burning Spirit has the line "elevating his personal buffs to levels capable of rivaling Hunger's own Attributes" which is weird to parse, but if you use this to say that Aobaru's physical stats after buffs rival Titanomachy(Very close to Phoenix Rising) Hunger's pre buffs(55 Strength and Agility, 51 Constitution), then Aobaru's got a 600 percent physical stat multiplier. 7x. (Edit: Clarifying, Aobaru post buffs would have 50 Strength/Agility, 46 constitution. That's what I'm defining as rivaling pre-buffs Titanomachy hunger)

100 percent buff is 2x
300 percent buff is 4x
500 percent buff is 6x
600 percent buff is 7x

Now remember Heroic Crimson Flare?

*First Flaring: To those who directly witness the first Heroic blaze of the Crimson, Ennobling now grants +30 Might, +25 Agi, +20 Wits, +15 Will, +10 Other Attributes, eternal youth, immense longevity and elevates Rank to a minimum of 4.5. Those of higher Rank see a +2 bonus to their Rank, to a maximum of 8. All of Hunger's current companions are in a position to witness this, and power such as this will serve Nilfel well in Adorie's absence.

The 3 points from ennobling that bring Aobaru's speculated base might from 4 to 7 become 30.

Aobaru would have had 34 might with a 7x multiplier. That's 238 Strength. HOLY SHIT.
 
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Since Tide of Glory doesn't seem to be getting anywhere...

[X] Vanquisher's Grace + Auspice Temporal
[X] Flight of Falling Stars

Well in that case...

[X] Make Whole + Sealing Protocol Level I

Even without the Blade-repair, the potential resurrection is very useful, not to mention it's likely to basically make her a White Mage in general.
 
Close
Adhoc vote count started by Rah13 on Dec 15, 2020 at 3:51 PM, finished with 219 posts and 52 votes.
 
Well in that case...

[X] Make Whole + Sealing Protocol Level I

Even without the Blade-repair, the potential resurrection is very useful, not to mention it's likely to basically make her a White Mage in general.

It's also likely to give her more stat points. True perfecting blade gave her what I deduced as 20ish stat points for her physical stats immediately with passive stat improvements over time. What happens if you unseal the first protocol though? It gives a strong improvement on that. So that's what. Another 10ish stat points, bringing her Physical Stats into the 50s and wits into the 40s, combined with an improvement to Gisena's passive stat gain over time?

You might be able to get so much more out of it with COTK though.

52 Agility*(1.7(Vigorflame)+.5(COTK)) = 114.4
100 Agility*(1.7(Vigorflame)+.5(COTK)) = 220+.1 ISH(It's probably needed for her to have more Agility post multiplier given Hunger's ISH Advantage)

I just wish I had more insight into how the math for Gisena's stats worked out. Like whether or not some of those blurbs I was referencing were taking Vigorflame into account or not.
 
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[X] Make Whole + Sealing Protocol Level I

[X] Flight of Falling Stars


Cute update. Sharkey bamboozled me real good. Still enjoyed it, even if it raised more questions than answers.

We did get a bit of Aeira's motives out there, which is what I wanted from ???.
 
  • Ruling Ring - I've already talked about insane value we'd get out of RR Echoes, and that it still true. We just need to get this. EBA does something similar, but it's mutually exclusive with RR and RR is just better when it comes to buffing picks.
Hm? Do you mean mutually exclusive as in "costs the same, so we need to buy one before another"? EBA doesn't block RR otherwise.
 
[X] Vanquisher's Grace + Auspice Temporal
[X] Build Cleanup

The Broken Sword in its description only hurts us in long engagements. I don't think we need it fixed quickly at all if we are getting Falling Star and have the freedom to spam Star and not worry about saving it for a stronger enemy.
 
Hm? Do you mean mutually exclusive as in "costs the same, so we need to buy one before another"? EBA doesn't block RR otherwise.
*Upgrades Echo of the Forebear: Now grants ++Might, ++Agility. Applies to existing purchases, though does not stack with other sources of +Progression.
Basically you can have only one of them buffing our Echoes. As such, form the standpoint of RR build, getting the other does nothing for you.

EBA buffs previous purchases while RR buffs non-Echo picks.
 
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