Larissa is going to want to seize power herself, and the citizens will follow her lead automatically since Hunger himself isn't interested in dealing with it.

I mean what's wrong with some righteous influence? They still want to save the ring so much so that they were willing to go against there entire society, all they are likely to ask for in the aftermath is for Hunger to help the survivors with the Ring of Blood. I see it as an good thing. Hunger doing more heroic stuff and helping people is good for his mental health.

Anyway, Fairbright might also open up some unique picks in the aftermath.


From here apparently Hunger plans to just bail on the civilization after getting the ring. Also from here if we take Larissa we don't get involved in managing the civilians.


Yeah, If you actually want Hunger to help the civilization in the aftermath, Fairbright is probably your best bet and it comes with Hunger becoming more mentally healthy...



Picking the option that would most guarantee that the lives of potentially millions of people are not lost in the aftermath of taking the ring, that is explicitly stated to minimize civilian causalities among it's benefits, is actually a million times more heroic then picking the options that only assuage his personal mental health because it reminds him of his old freedom fighters day or pecks at his sentimentality. It is extremely, extremely easy to get so caught up in the appearance and aesthetics of being morally rightous that you care more about the good feeling and psychological soothing it provides at the expense of bettering or protecting the lives of the vulnerable. It happens all the time in real life. Choosing Fairbright over Larissa would be one of those moments.

Considering one of the listed benefits was being able to carry out a evacuation that wouldn't cause a apocalyptic death on these people, at the expense of furthering his own personal power by having less picks, I would in fact say that choosing this very option is us being able to choose to what degree he actually cares about the livelihood of these people, with throwing the Silver Hordes of the Elderly by abusing them at their most vulnerable being the opposite extreme.

Even if we assume your worst case scenario, I 100% guarantee you that most Temple people would rather we secure the lives of their loved ones rather then allowing more of them to die.

However, I 100% do not buy that any option to influence the structure of this society is locked entirely behind choosing fairbright over Larissa despite all the repeated options we've taken to become ensconced in it and the benefits to working with it that come from a post Temple Crimson Flare such as mass empowerment, just like I didn't buy that their would be zero relevant allies for us to make use of if we picked Foment. While Hunger can respect people who try to the right thing against impossible odds, he also calls them a bunch of Naive fools of the type that he stopped being even while he was fighting the Tyrant. I think it's far more likely that Hunger will be convinced to stay by people who would use practical srguements over moral ones, as well building comradeship with people more enmeshed in the current ongoings of their civilization then people who have been in a prison for who knows how long.

But let's say this isn't the case and Hunger just up and leaves, which Rihaku also implied was a possibility for the Fairbright option. Lady Fairbirht is not being written out of existence unlike Selune. She and her followers will still be their after the Inner Temple is dealt with, with the Temple Civ having lost it's magic. Fairbright bloodline power possibly being different from Soul Evocation would guarantee her a incredible advantage over any other political faction thats crops up, and even if it doesn't not only is she a hypercompetent person with heavy ties to the Adventurers in the encampment through her daughter that would still have incredible power. Unless Hunger puts his thumb on the scales, I highly doubt that Larissa would win any political or military fights against Fairbright now that Larissa's Soul Evocation users are much less useful.

Sometimes, doing the moral or Heroic thing doesn't involve doing the thing that makes you most mentally or emotionally comfortable or even the best decisions for your mental health. Sometimes it doesn't involve taking on every responsiblity yourself like a gloryhound for the purposes of feeling 'heroic and instead allowing many more lives to be saved by letting people more suited to it handle it. Sometimes it's hard rather then easy on you, involves being humble enough to realize where other people's efforts are more useful, and making realistic, pragmatic decisions that keep other people's best interests at heart. That is what Lord Hunger understood when fighting the Tyrant, that is what caused him to fight the tyranny of Feudalism to his death sans the intervention of the Accursed, and that's what actually made Lord Hunger a hero.
 
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Alayn can actually keep the order after we take the Ring, make sure evacuation is successful as well. Fairbright is a hero and has good intentions but we saw what happens to those people when they try to lead(*cough*Hunger in first chapter*cough*)

EDIT: Curse of hindsight - we could have taken Shameless, now take Vigor and a stance and could have fixed three of our main issues - Ranklet, protection and magic defense
Fairbright is a living legend and also a member of the ring civilization so she should be able to help keep order as well.
 
I'm more worried about Soul Evokers with magic than I am direct combat. Gisena can't cover everything, especially if she's avoiding friendly fire, and Hunger is just quicker too.
Their magic could not always be the direct kind anyway. Curses, debuffs and all other nasty shit is subtler that a wall of fire that we can avoid or nullify.
Gisena`s Nullity is powerful but it is an active ability that has to be aim and also avoid hitting us. MDS is a passive ability that works constantly and it is probably a bit weaker than Nullity as magic defense but it is a lot more reliable. MDS provides Curse mitigation as well and also makes our attack destroy magical constructs like no tommorow (5x Ruin vs magic)

Honestly I don`t know why the thread is so averse to taking MDS and went towards WeDS. It was my second choice and actually SAVING or not investing in Stance in the endgame of the temple seems suicidal.
 
Alayn can actually keep the order after we take the Ring, make sure evacuation is successful as well. Fairbright is a hero and has good intentions but we saw what happens to those people when they try to lead(*cough*Hunger in first chapter*cough*)

EDIT: Curse of hindsight - we could have taken Shameless, now take Vigor and a stance and could have fixed three of our main issues - Ranklet, protection and magic defense
I am well aware of that. What I am talking about is Hunger helping the civilization through the Ring of Blood. I think that's far more likely with Fairbright.

Picking the option that would most guarantee that the lives of potentially millions of people are not lost in the aftermath of taking the ring, that is explicitly stated to minimize civilian causalities among it's benefits, is actually a million times more heroic then picking the options that only assuage his personal mental health because it reminds him of his old freedom fighters day or pecks at his sentimentality. It is extremely, extremely easy to get so caught up in the appearance and aesthetics of being morally rightous that you care more about the good feeling and psychological soothing it provides at bettering or protecting the lives of the vulnerable. It happens all the time in real life. Choosing Fairbright over Larissa would be one of those moments.

Considering one of the listed benefits was being able to carry out a evacuation that would cause a apocalyptic death on these people, at the expense of furthering his own personal power by having less picks, I would in fact say that choosing this very option is us being able to choose to what degree he actually cares about the livelihood of these people, with throwing the Silver Hordes of the Elderly by abusing them at their most vulnerable being the opposite extreme.

Even if we assume your worst case scenario, I 100% guarantee you that most people would rather we secure the lives of their loved ones rather then allowing more of them to die.

However, I 100% do not buy that any option to influence the structure of this society is locked entirely behind choosing fairbright over Larissa despite all the repeated options we've taken to become ensconced in it and the benefits to working with it that come from a post Temple Crimson Flare such as mass empowerment, just like I didn't buy that their would be zero relevant allies for us to make use of if we picked Foment. While Hunger can respect people who try to the right thing against impossible odds, he also calls them a bunch of Naive fools of the type that he stopped being even while he was fighting the Tyrant. I think it's far more likely that Hunger will be convinced to stay by people who would use practical srguements over moral ones, as well building comradeship with people more enmeshed in the current ongoings of their civilization then people who have been in a prison for who knows how long.

But let's say this isn't the case and Hunger just up and leaves, which Rihaku also implied was a possibility for the Fairbright option. Lady Fairbirht is not being written out of existence unlike Selune. She and her followers will still be their after the Inner Temple is dealt with, with the Temple Civ having lost it's magic. Fairbright bloodline power possibly being different from Soul Evocation would guarantee her a incredible advantage over any other political faction thats crops up, and even if it doesn't not only is she a hypercompetent person with heavy ties to the Adventurers in the encampment through her daughter that would still have incredible power. Unless Hunger puts his thumb on the scales, I highly doubt that Larissa would win any political or military fights against Fairbright now that Larissa's Soul Evocation users are much less useful.

Sometimes, doing the moral or Heroic thing doesn't involve doing the thing that makes you most mentally or emotionally comfortable. Sometimes it doesn't involve taking on every responsible yourself like a gloryhound for the purposes of 'feeling' heroic and instead allowing many more lives to be saved by letting people more suited to it handle it. Sometimes it's hard rather then easy on you, involves being humble enough to realize where other people's efforts are more useful, and making realistic, pragmatic decisions that keep other people's best interests at heart. That is what Lord Hunger understood when fighting the Tyrant, that is what caused him to fight the tyranny of Feudalism to his death sans the intervention of the Accursed, and that's what actually made Lord Hunger a hero.

Except, Fairbright is likely getting written out of existence. You don't seem to understand that this is an OOC decision to some extent.
What was the nature of the potential allies Hunger encountered? Choose one. The options unchosen may not exist in-universe.
 
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Picking the option that would most guarantee that the lives of potentially millions of people are not lost in the aftermath of taking the ring, that is explicitly stated to minimize civilian causalities among it's benefits, is actually a million times more heroic then picking the options that only assuage his personal mental health because it reminds him of his old freedom fighters day or pecks at his sentimentality. It is extremely, extremely easy to get so caught up in the appearance and aesthetics of being morally rightous that you care more about the good feeling and psychological soothing it provides at bettering or protecting the lives of the vulnerable. It happens all the time in real life. Choosing Fairbright over Larissa would be one of those moments.

Considering one of the listed benefits was being able to carry out a evacuation that would cause a apocalyptic death on these people, at the expense of furthering his own personal power by having less picks, I would in fact say that choosing this very option is us being able to choose to what degree he actually cares about the livelihood of these people, with throwing the Silver Hordes of the Elderly by abusing them at their most vulnerable being the opposite extreme.

Even if we assume your worst case scenario, I 100% guarantee you that most people would rather we secure the lives of their loved ones rather then allowing more of them to die.

However, I 100% do not buy that any option to influence the structure of this society is locked entirely behind choosing fairbright over Larissa despite all the repeated options we've taken to become ensconced in it and the benefits to working with it that come from a post Temple Crimson Flare such as mass empowerment, just like I didn't buy that their would be zero relevant allies for us to make use of if we picked Foment. While Hunger can respect people who try to the right thing against impossible odds, he also calls them a bunch of Naive fools of the type that he stopped being even while he was fighting the Tyrant. I think it's far more likely that Hunger will be convinced to stay by people who would use practical srguements over moral ones, as well building comradeship with people more enmeshed in the current ongoings of their civilization then people who have been in a prison for who knows how long.

But let's say this isn't the case and Hunger just up and leaves, which Rihaku also implied was a possibility for the Fairbright option. Lady Fairbirht is not being written out of existence unlike Selune. She and her followers will still be their after the Inner Temple is dealt with, with the Temple Civ having lost it's magic. Fairbright bloodline power possibly being different from Soul Evocation would guarantee her a incredible advantage over any other political faction thats crops up, and even if it doesn't not only is she a hypercompetent person with heavy ties to the Adventurers in the encampment through her daughter that would still have incredible power. Unless Hunger puts his thumb on the scales, I highly doubt that Larissa would win any political or military fights against Fairbright now that Larissa's Soul Evocation users are much less useful.

Sometimes, doing the moral or Heroic thing doesn't involve doing the thing that makes you most mentally or emotionally comfortable or even the best decisions for your mental health. Sometimes it doesn't involve taking on every responsible yourself like a gloryhound for the purposes of 'feeling' heroic and instead allowing many more lives to be saved by letting people more suited to it handle it. Sometimes it's hard rather then easy on you, involves being humble enough to realize where other people's efforts are more useful, and making realistic, pragmatic decisions that keep other people's best interests at heart. That is what Lord Hunger understood when fighting the Tyrant, that is what caused him to fight the tyranny of Feudalism to his death sans the intervention of the Accursed, and that's what actually made Lord Hunger a hero.


Fairbright is a living legend and also a member of the ring civilization so she should be able to help keep order as well.

Then she won't actually need help taking over the remnants if Hunger up and leaves.


I am well aware of that. What I am talking about is Hunger helping the civilization through the Ring of Blood. I think that's far more likely with Fairbright.

The Larissa option literally involves him choosing to save as many civilian lives as he possibly can. If you want Hunger to help the civilization, the best step towards steering him that way is the one where he takes the first step of doing so by default even if it doesn't feel as good.
 
Picking the option that would most guarantee that the lives of potentially millions of people are not lost in the aftermath of taking the ring, that is explicitly stated to minimize civilian causalities among it's benefits, is actually a million times more heroic then picking the options that only assuage his personal mental health because it reminds him of his old freedom fighters day or pecks at his sentimentality. It is extremely, extremely easy to get so caught up in the appearance and aesthetics of being morally rightous that you care more about the good feeling and psychological soothing it provides at bettering or protecting the lives of the vulnerable. It happens all the time in real life. Choosing Fairbright over Larissa would be one of those moments.

But let's say this isn't the case and Hunger just up and leaves, which Rihaku also implied was a possibility for the Fairbright option. Lady Fairbirht is not being written out of existence unlike Selune.
Hunger already decided that the suffering of the ring was more important to him than the lives of the civilians that depend on it to live. If we leave it up to him he'll nab the ring and yolo out of here. The Fairbright option probably gives mental health since he's at least saving the people who thought the way their civilization lived was wrong, rather than condemning them to death as well.

The update says options unchosen may not exist in universe, so if we don't choose Fairbright she has good chances of never existing. Even if she did exist without Hunger freeing her she's currently in prison in a pocket dimension that will collapse when we take the ring. I hardly think Larissa priorities when evacuating are going to include prisoners.
 
I am well aware of that. What I am talking about is Hunger helping the civilization through the Ring of Blood. I think that's far more likely with Fairbright.

Can't help a civilization with the Ring of Blood if there's no civilization to help.

My being obtuse aside, I can't see a compelling reason that makes Fairbright more convincing than Larissa when it comes to Hunger buffing the survivors. The Ring has been saved. The Temple done. Now there's a bunch of people who, with little effort, could be raised up to a level that could keep them hale and healthy for the coming days.

I'd even guess that we'd be allowed to vote on how long we want to stay with them. Do we pursue Letrizia's home realm? Or do we stay here a bit longer to keep the buffing up? What's more important at the moment, anyway, is the increasing of our chances of winning the dungeon. Larissa provides that better than Fairbright would, due to the firepower she can put on the table.
 
From here apparently Hunger plans to just bail on the civilization after getting the ring. Also from here if we take Larissa we don't get involved in managing the civilians.
That's interesting, but I still rather limit the amount of casualties with Larissa's forces (and avoid having to fight the entire contingency of Immortals if we're quick) than hedge my bets on Farbright. Though I will...

[X] Larissa of House Alynne
[X] Heartpiercer

I know the two votes are technically not compatible, but Fierce Quickening already looks to be up ahead and I'd rather increase the chances of an option that would go splendidly with Who Walked Away if it ends up overtaking House Alynne.

EDIT: Curse of hindsight - we could have taken Shameless, now take Vigor and a stance and could have fixed three of our main issues - Ranklet, protection and magic defense
Please don't remind me, especially since I had taken into account this very same possibility... Stings a bit.
 
Hunger already decided that the suffering of the ring was more important to him than the lives of the civilians that depend on it to live. If we leave it up to him he'll nab the ring and yolo out of here. The Fairbright option probably gives mental health since he's at least saving the people who thought the way their civilization lived was wrong, rather than condemning them to death as well.

It explicitly doesn't do that, because the choice to minimize the loss of life to non combatants is the one where he takes Larissa. The mental health is coming from him feeling sentimental about fighting alongside a bunch of idealistic fighters again. It is explicitly not the choice that saves the most amount of people. If you think him consciously choosing to save people is the one that will lead Hunger to decide to stay with Temple Civ anyway, I agree with you, but that is the decision where we pick Larissa.

The update says options unchosen may not exist in universe, so if we don't choose Fairbright she has good chances of never existing. Even if she did exist without Hunger freeing her she's currently in prison in a pocket dimension that will collapse when we take the ring. I hardly think Larissa priorities when evacuating are going to include prisoners.

If their's literally any non picked option able to get themselves out of that, it is her. Also, without potent Soul Evocation, Larissa and the former rulers lose a enormous deal of what put them on top in the first place, and the more people who are still around the less Larrissa's remaining forces actually matter.
 
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I am well aware of that. What I am talking about is Hunger helping the civilization through the Ring of Blood. I think that's far more likely with Fairbright.



Except, Fairbright is likely getting written out of existence. You don't seem to understand that this is an OOC decision to some extent.

Also, while I put my rebuttal to that in my response to Lordofmurders, i'll point out the entire rest of that post you quoted essentially remained completely unchallenged there.
 
Except, Fairbright is likely getting written out of existence. You don't seem to understand that this is an OOC decision to some extent.
Do you know who is not being written out of existence - Wyvernford . So in the short term, getting a House of the defenders to defect to our side is better than recruiting a Hero unit with shitty adds(Rihaku described them as chaff)

Also, while I put my rebuttal to that in my response to Lordofmurders, i'll point out the entire rest of that post you quoted essentially remained completely unchallenged there.
Secret Art #1:Cherry picking
Secret Art #2:Willfull Ignorance
 
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While Hunger can respect people who try to the right thing against impossible odds, he also calls them a bunch of Naive fools of the type that he stopped being even while he was fighting the Tyrant.
Hunger calls them naïve because he's bitter and jaded. They're idealistic freedom fighters who rebelled and were jailed for it when they found out their civilization was powered by the Azure rings suffering.

It explicitly doesn't do that, because the choice to minimize the loss of life to non combatants is the one where take Larissa. The mental health is coming from him feeling sentimental about fighting alongside a bunch of idealistic fighters again. It is explicitly not the choice that saves the most amount of people. If you think him consciously choosing to save people is the one that will lead Hunger to decide to stay with Temple Civ anyway, I agree with you, but that is the decision where we pick Larissa.

If their's literally any non picked option able to get themselves out of that, it is her. Also, without potent Soul Evocation, Larissa and the former rulers lose a enormous deal of what put them on top in the first place, and the more people who are still around the less Larrissa's remaining forces actually matter.
What was the nature of the potential allies Hunger encountered? Choose one. The options unchosen may not exist in-universe.
It's hard to survive not existing in the first place.

Larissa is good at saving civilians because she's got one of the major houses backing her and can thus use it's resources to organise them. But the problem is she's rebelling not because she has an issue with them using the ring like Fairbright, but because she's feeling spiteful after being marginalized recently. It's hard to say how nice a society the ring civilization was since we lack a lot of information but what we've seen implies some pretty harsh divides in social casts. Inner temple residents literally get 10X the lifespan than those in the middle temple! Hunger wanted to change his first isekai world's system even when it would have been hard but because it inconvenienced the ruling nobles he was betrayed. I don't want to see that replay with the Ring Civilization.

I can't argue against assumptions about things we have no information on or moral arguments. I don't think Hunger cares about the civilians as much as you think he does, nor are either of these options likely to change his mind. I'm voting for the option I think most likely to force him to care about them and which gives mental stability presumably leading towards a more healthy mindset.

This vote can't be about how hunger feels about things because we're not voting on who hunger choose to side with, we're voting on who appears that hunger can side with.
 
Also, while I put my rebuttal to that in my response to Lordofmurders, i'll point out the entire rest of that post you quoted essentially remained completely unchallenged there.
That's because your entire argument is based on the premise that Hunger himself is deciding between the three options. Once you remove that assumption, it falls apart.

Currently, Hunger doesn't give much of a shit about these people and that is not going to change unless he is shown that there is something worth helping here.

Hunger is not going to respect some noble that is revolting against the system out of opportunistic spite, he is not going to listen to entreaty for help or care for it from someone like that. Because he knows someone like that doesn't give a shit about the common folk. He is going to use them to save the Ring, evacuate the people and than leave.

An actual hero and some other people on the other hand who rose up against the system because it was the right thing to do? That might actually make him change him mind and ennoble his people to give them a chance in the aftermath.
 
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I mean, you kinda are right in worrying over that statement by Rihaku, it could totally mean that unless we vote for Larissa now she gets retconned into an old man at the head of House Alynne and we won't get to seduce her into helping us anyway by taking Heartbreaker even if we ally with someone else first. :V
 
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Larissa is good at saving civilians because she's got one of the major houses backing her and can thus use it's resources to organise them
But the problem is she's rebelling not because she has an issue with them using the ring like Fairbright, but because she's feeling spiteful after being marginalized recently
Fairbright is a living legend and also a member of the ring civilization so she should be able to help keep order as well.
The most efficient option for saving civilians (confirmed by Rihaku) is not taken because Larissa is spiteful? And instead you choose Fairbright because she is a hero and *hope* she can actually save them?
 
The most efficient option for saving civilians (confirmed by Rihaku) is not taken because Larissa is spiteful? And instead you choose Fairbright because she is a hero and *hope* she can actually save them?
I don't care about the civilians at all. I care about Hunger and seeing what I want in the quest. Hunger gets mental health from Fairbrights option and I think it's the option more likely to show Hunger interacting with the ring civilization since he'll have to pay attention to what he's done rather than palming it all off to Larissa to fix.


I mean, you kinda are right in worrying over that statement by Rihaku, it could totally mean that unless we vote for Larissa now she gets retconned into an old man at the head of House Alynne and we won't get to seduce her into helping us anyway by taking Heartbreaker even if we ally with someone else first. :V
If taking heartbreaker means Hunger will actually go around seducing people I will reject it with the fury of a thousand suns.
 
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Hunger calls them naïve because he's bitter and jaded. They're idealistic freedom fighters who rebelled and were jailed for it when they found out their civilization was powered by the Azure rings suffering.

Yes, that is exactly what I'm saying, the fact that he's like that makes me believe that their appeals will be less likely to sway him then more practical ones. This is the man who fought against the kings of his world to all but his death in order to reinstitute actually possible and life changing reforms rather then toppling over the entire system despite coming from a 1st world democracy.


It's hard to survive not existing in the first place.

Larissa is good at saving civilians because she's got one of the major houses backing her and can thus use it's resources to organise them. But the problem is she's rebelling not because she has an issue with them using the ring like Fairbright, but because she's feeling spiteful after being marginalized recently. It's hard to say how nice a society the ring civilization was since we lack a lot of information but what we've seen implies some pretty harsh divides in social casts. Inner temple residents literally get 10X the lifespan than those in the middle temple! Hunger wanted to change his first isekai world's system even when it would have been hard but because it inconvenienced the ruling nobles he was betrayed. I don't want to see that replay with the Ring Civilization.


Yes, and his method of changing the first isekai's world system involved him using his influence to push for realistic reforms that would better the lives of the peasants, but also notably didn't upend the whole system. He is explicitly willing to work with nobility to better people's lives when he has too. Moreover, the reason that the Inner Temple's society is like the way it is has to do with the Ring existing. Fuedalism is a state of affairs that arise from specific material conditions. Their's no reason to believe that the Temple civilization sans the ring would stay exactly the same when the basis of it's power structure is gone.


I can't argue against assumptions about things we have no information on or moral arguments. I don't think Hunger cares about the civilians as much as you think he does, nor are either of these options likely to change his mind. I'm voting for the option I think most likely to force him to care about them and which gives mental stability presumably leading towards a more healthy mindset.

This vote can't be about how hunger feels about things because we're not voting on who hunger choose to side with, we're voting on who appears that hunger can side with.

It can absolutely be about his feelings even if that was the case, which the fact that people we don't choose might not exist is absolutely not the same as saying we Hunger won't have to ICly choose between multiple options. Also, it absolutely could be due to his feelings even if that wasn't the case. Those would be the people he spends time with after the choice, after all.


That's because your entire argument is based on the premise that Hunger himself is deciding between the three options. Once you remove that assumption, it falls apart.

Currently, Hunger doesn't give much of a shit about these people and that is not going to change unless he is shown that there is something worth helping here.

Hunger is not going to respect some noble that is revolting against the system out of opportunistic spite, he is not going to listen to entreaty for help or care for it from someone like that. Because he knows someone like that doesn't give a shit about the common folk. He is going to use them to save the Ring, evacuate the people and than leave.

An actual hero and some other people on the other hand who rose up against the system because it was the right thing to do? That might actually make him change him mind and ennoble these people to give them a chance in the aftermath.

First off, that some of thes eoptions might not exist does not preclude the idea that Hunger will not be doing some IC decision making over who he throws in with. Even if literally none of them exists, which seems implausible for the Silver Hordes, If Hunger absolutely did not care or see any benefit whatsoever in meaningfully minimizing civilian deaths it wouldn't come up as a benefit. Plus, even were that the case it makes sense that Hunger could take that into account when deciding who to try to get on his side. He's still seeking allies via the Foment option, it's not like they pop out of the Ether, he has to find them first.

I really don't think he's the abject monster your making him out to be just because his personal goals, that he is putting off to a extent to save the suffering of a sapient being, are more important to him at the exact moment of the update then taking on the immense task of helping rebuild a civilization of millions.


I don't care about the civilians at all. I care about Hunger and seeing what I want in the quest. Hunger gets mental health from Fairbrights option and I think it's the option more likely to show Hunger interacting with the ring civilization since he'll have to pay attention to what he's done rather than palming it all off to Larissa to fix.

He absolutely would not have to do that. If he really as bad as you say he is, he could just leave them to die. In fact, given Fairchild is the one most likely to antagonize or try to stop him if he actually tries to go off with the ring, this could have the exact opposite effect on him if it ends with him slaughtering her and her following while still running off which it very likely could.
 
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If taking heartbreaker means Hunger will actually go around seducing people I will reject it with the fury of a thousand suns.
Was a joke don't worry, mainly referring that a quick way to justify Alissa not helping this broody hero she would totally fall for is retconning her existence or otherwise not having her as the head of the House. For Farbright it's far easier to justify that, she is literally in jail.

I don't care about the civilians at all. I care about Hunger and seeing what I want in the quest. Hunger gets mental health from Fairbrights option and I think it's the option more likely to show Hunger interacting with the ring civilization since he'll have to pay attention to what he's done rather than palming it all off to Larissa to fix.
Personally, I primarily care about Hunger or his close companions not dying and an option that doesn't require us to stand our ground against each and every Immortal lowers those chances considerably. Also while a + surely signifies a large increase in mental stability for Hunger, I don't think that's the only way to improve (or worsen) his condition.

A lot of innocent people dying because of his actions would deal a tremendous blow to his mental health, no matter how much he tries not to care about these things, and I still hope we can increase it in lower increments by voting in a future update to use our soon to be acquired acquired abilities to improve their condition (and in my opinion it wouldn't make sense for Rihaku not to offer us that option).
 
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That's because your entire argument is based on the premise that Hunger himself is deciding between the three options. Once you remove that assumption, it falls apart.

Currently, Hunger doesn't give much of a shit about these people and that is not going to change unless he is shown that there is something worth helping here.

Hunger is not going to respect some noble that is revolting against the system out of opportunistic spite, he is not going to listen to entreaty for help or care for it from someone like that. Because he knows someone like that doesn't give a shit about the common folk. He is going to use them to save the Ring, evacuate the people and than leave.

An actual hero and some other people on the other hand who rose up against the system because it was the right thing to do? That might actually make him change him mind and ennoble his people to give them a chance in the aftermath.
Have you considered that maybe Fairbright would talk Hunger into caring but, since she doesn't bring the resources for an evacuation, it will nonetheless come down to a choice between evacuation and winning? At which point of course he chooses winning and murders 10 million people and feels bad about it for eleventy octillion years. Whereas, if his win includes successfully avoiding killing millions of people he still has enough dregs of humanist principles left that he'll take satisfaction from that even though he doesn't care about them.

Let's be clear though, whatever Hunger's attitude the overwhelming majority of the survivors will hate him for ruining their lives. The nature of the Voyaging Realm is such that a few days walk with Big V would let us find a population in at least as much need who don't hate Hunger and they'd be more worth the time spent mass Ennobling.
 
He choose to try to work with the nobility for small reform because he was completely crippled in the aftermath, upending the system wasn't even an option. That was the only path with an chance for success. And you know what the nobility did to him for even that much? They killed him. Doesn't sound like something that would make him like selfish nobles. Quite the opposite in fact.

Yes, but your missing underlying reasoning there. He chose to do what he was not a fan of because it was the best available option to him to save or improve the most of lives. That's the moral calculus that Lord Hunger held onto even as the Hero, not high minded ideals sans any pragmatism or care about how those ideals actually affected peoples lives.

As for the appeal part? It's explicitly stated that he would respect the idealists more. Do you really think Hunger is more likely to listen to someone like Larissa over an living legend like Fairbright?


Yes, he absolutely would respect them more, but respect isn't the same as agreement. Their are a great many people I respect who I heavily disagree with the moral reasonings of, and a great many people I have zero respect for whose arguments I'm more inclined. Considering he literally calls them a bunch of naive fools in the same line he says he respects them, this sounds like one of the former situations. My thinking that Larissa's faction might be able to make better appeals to Hunger to stay are twofold and having nothing to do with respect. One, their appeals are likely to focus far more on pragmatism then morality, which in turn makes them far more likely to sway Lord Hunger then purely or mostly moralistic ones.

Two, and perhaps more importantly, not only is the civilization more useful to Hunger the more people he saves, the more that he's tied to a better evacuation effort the less the ill will he's likely to generate among the population, perhaps that maybe by offering more to the common man via his ring he can earn some measure of appreciation, which acts as a further incentive for him to stay. The latter is probably one of the hugest barrier to entry to having to do with doing something heroic for the Temple civilization, how much all of them would rightly hate him unless we take measures to fix that.
 
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