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Even Further Beyond [Complete]

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Rask said:
[X] Justice

Because, well, it's justice. The Fates get what they deserve. (and remain vaguely useful)

More importantly, Nameless is now basically God. Having the world ruled by a just - if lazy - god, rather than a cruel tyrant, is the best outcome.

Justice: one Lich is mildly discomforted by his dreams not coming true exactly the way he wants them to.

Vengeance: uncountable trillions of people have to live under an unstoppable ruler who is capable of boundless cruelty for petty reasons.
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Ah. That's false. Nameless has no interest in actual ruling.
 
Corripere said:
Also, as a worthless Diagram whore, I am really desperate to know what Logos is.
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There was some stuff hinting that Logos is mastery of underlying concepts reality is built off, allowing us to marry new concepts to the Diagram; expanding Diagram's potent-but-limited spell list into DnD-esq infinitive Solars Pun Pun nonsense.

Like, Rings of [Word], Dao of [Whatever] - Logos is probably the [Word] part and mastery of it theoretically pretty silly.
 
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Wolfy said:
Can we ress and vamp Lich daddy and then offload entire torture business to him?

Letting others do our job is how we roll.
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Honestly, in the Vengeance ending, once we rez Lix we'd probably have to physically stop him from taking part in the torture, if we cared to. He'd be on that shit as fast as Deliberation makes possible.
 
Prospalz said:
There was some stuff hinting that Logos is mastery of underlying concepts reality is built off, allowing us to marry new concepts to the Diagram; expanding Diagram's potent-but-limited spell list into DnD-esq infinitive Solars Pun Pun nonsense.
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So, what, infinite signs? 500 spells? I guess that is pure potential--I mean, if one spell elevated our stage by 1, and we had 500...
 
[X] Justice

Frankly, Vengeance is going overboard for a lich we barely knew and a promise we never made. Just killing them would be my preference in fact, to remove even the minimal threat of their continued existence... but I'm curious. It came up way back in the beginning of the thread (or one of the negaverses), but we don't actually know why the Fates act the way they do, just that at least some portion of a massive history of suffering is both pointless and their fault, and that they are a threat to Nameless.

If there is anything that could force their behavior in anyway? That seems kinda pertinent even at our power-level, and solutions start with knowledge. Which will be easier to aquire by having access to the only witnesses around that may pre-date Cycle bullshit.

And hey, if they really were just screwing around for their own entertainment and nothing else, we can just kill them later.
 
Corripere said:
So, what, infinite signs? 500 spells? I guess that is pure potential--I mean, if one spell elevated our stage by 1, and we had 500...
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Real good shit probably still was going to be somewhat limited by BP and need to research stuff, like Truth and Essence signs were.

Less limited for Nameless with Logos than for our Nameless, but still.
 
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inawarminister said:
[X] Vengeance

Ave, Fates. The world has arrived to avenge its victims.


Please tell me of a Xianxia novel with a lazy protagonist that empower his losing love interest to slaughter the gods though? :p
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Let me get back to you in a couple months after I've gotten one of my translator friends to translate this quest into chinese...
 
Guys, do you really think doing so much potential torturing is not going to leave a mark on Nameless? I would rather not make our ending somewhat bittersweet at this point.

He is many things but fortunately cruelty is not of his Flaws.
 
Vengeance is pointless. Justice already heaps as much punishment on the Fates as they deserve for their crimes. There's also nobody strong enough to challenge Nameless who could be deterred by making an example out of them.

Going further just turns Nameless into a horrible person, all in order to avoid mild inconvenience to another horrible person.
 
[X] Justice

Mostly because our waifu and entirety of Elven Nation will rrrreally not like Vengeance, which will result in difficulties of leveraging our stage 14 Blood Elves to get infinitive artifice and uber-quick cultivation.

Also, wife will be incredibly disappointed with Nameless. That would be just the worst, I guess.

It is a pity - I wouldn't mind a last ditch effort to grab some spectacular EFB nonsense like Logos or Broken Kaleidoscope as our one last hurrah story.
 
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DkArthas said:
Guys, do you really think doing so much potential torturing is not going to leave a mark on Nameless? I would rather not make our ending somewhat bittersweet at this point.

He is many things but fortunately cruelty is not of his Flaws.
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But Vengeance is his Heroic Passion. It's slumbered for much of the quest, save for flareups with the Extrusion, but we chose to build an Overlord with passions as grand as his powers. The suffering of the Fates is not some fly in the ointment of our victory; their deaths have been the goal we've been working toward all this time. With a single choice, we gain power enough to bargain with Zang from a position of strength and can bring about a better future. Not an Age of the World, but something without cycles.
 
Also, we've got confirmation that Blood Elves have Huge Essence, which means that hypothetically they could pool it all to create some kind of serious combat/diplomacy panoply, strong enough to maybe convince Nameless it was unbecoming of him to do a Vengeance upon the Fates. That would only happen if they cared a lot about it though, and the Fates do seem to be pretty awful.
 
Orm Embar said:
But Vengeance is his Heroic Passion. It's slumbered for much of the quest, save for flareups with the Extrusion, but we chose to build an Overlord with passions as grand as his powers. The suffering of the Fates is not some fly in the ointment of our victory; their deaths have been the goal we've been working toward all this time. With a single choice, we gain power enough to bargain with Zang from a position of strength and can bring about a better future. Not an Age of the World, but something without cycles.
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So what you're saying is that we can take this opportunity to overcome a Flaw that never really affected Nameless's character all that much? That's worth BP all by itself.
 
Rask said:
Except by making that choice, Nameless shows that he is someone cruel who wouldn't be particularly interested in bargaining with Zang or a better future for anyone but himself.
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On the contrary, Nameless is not merely Cruel (as I was planning to have the Reaper Man become). He is Vengeful. And Rihaku himself has said before that the only thing that Zang has done to harm Nameless is to slaughter Suizhen's family, an act which Nameless himself could undo with little more than a wave of his Scepter.

e-
Deathbybunnies said:
So what you're saying is that we can take this opportunity to overcome a Flaw that never really affected Nameless's character all that much? That's worth BP all by itself.
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This! This is a perfectly formed argument against Vengeance. I still disagree, but this is a really good reason to not vote for it, if you aren't committed.
 
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[X] Vengeance
The Fate's eternal suffering as batteries.
Fulfills a Heroic Passion, makes Baelixnaire proud, and if we go wipe out Vane right now, we can probably EFB again!
(okay Nameless probably isn't going to wipe out Vane for that last bit of power, but it's a fun thought)
Anyway, it also strengthens our position when negotiating with Zang Kong, upon which hinges theoretically infinite utility. I guess that's important?
Compared to Mercy, we also don't lose the Fate sign, which is good. If we were going to lose the Fate sign anyway, one of the major drawbacks of Rain would have been resolved and it would really feel like a cop-out.
Though I do suppose servitude would be entertaining.
 
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