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Even Further Beyond [Complete]

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I mean, what's not to like? We get 3BPs for Lich - if there's something fucking amazing, we get it. If there isn't, we're suddenly halfway through to Truth.

It's a win-win situation either way.
Alratan said:
We can't. The downside that Rihaku told us about the Scam approach is that it takes a month and the other options don't spend that time. That means that Scamming earns us an extra Mastermind point compared to the others. They presumably take a few days and then we switch back into timeskip, with less mastermind points gained.
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Or we keep searching for Liches, which is entire point of this choice.
We now have the choice to multi-task to get some useful Cultivation materials while chasing the pot of Diagram spells at the end of the rainbow.
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And to waste six months of subjective time. Hard pass, that one.
And scamming is a way of focusing on the task on hand. It's a slower, but I think more reliable way of gaining access to the Lich, if there is one.
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... are you even reading your own posts? You are ready to sit on your ass for a month and you don't even think that Lich is there? We don't have time to fuck around for month for MM.
 
I want an attempt at finding the heroine before moving on. It was one of the reason Nameless came here.

Once we leave the Border region, it's time for the vale Court.
 
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I'm not sure when it started, and I'm totally guilty of it, but maybe we might want to keep the Spaghetti-Quoting (dividing a quote into several parts) to a minimum since it seems more aggressive and is harder to respond to, since it encourages spaghetti-quoting of a spaghetti-quote.
 
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Alratan said:
It might take many, many objective years to research Sarcophagus though. No one else knows the spell.
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I don't think that's true actually. Our mentor was researching it independently, but the spell was developed and deployed beforehand by some Pharaoh Lich. Though the odds of this particular Lich being one who knows some time related spell that the Chronarch himself didn't is very very low.
That said an extra 80-140 years of cultivation and training, I'm not convinced yet that pursuing such a thing even at the cost of a few years objective time isn't worth it. Decades of research to a regular mage is months to us stumbling upon it from the first principles after all, and we've already initiated into the Sign with Quickening.
 
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[X] Stealth Insertion
[X] Take Out a Loan
[X] Eyes of Kong [Diagram]

Scamming people costs time, our second most precious asset. Let's stay focused.

Eyes of Kong interest me a great deal. Being able to see diagram energy is great and will help us a lot with finding the other liches, greatly speeding things up. And while it's unlikely, I'm hoping that unlocking this ability will push us closer to discovering any other powers her eyes have, such as the ability to remotely disrupt an ego barrier.

I considered a direct investigation, but my real goal is scamming the lich for everything he's worth, and getting into a fight is just a distraction from that. Also, getting into a fight means a potential ring loss.

For tactics, given that we're a diagram Lich we can make it appear that the lich is attempting to escape from his hideout. Throw out some illusions, a bit of mordant flames, and the Cultivator will distracted and we can walk right in.
 
RedV said:
We learned Forbidden Techniques from our Mom in DLYW, and also spent a BP on in perfect Ego Barrier. No effects on Foundation.

(Also, if Suizen gets triggered by our Mom or something, it's going to be pretty bad. We need to work in mitigating that soon)
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Dude... we didn't get DLYW. We got Throne of Stars, and never spoke to our poor yandere mom at all.
 
Rihaku said:
Diagram ruins, enemy Liches, as well as the Legacies of Ages more ancient still all riddle the South.
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Note Legacies of Ages more ancient. Sounds awfully like the Legacy Zones our Ring gives a bonus too, doesn't it? There may be more secrets yet in Vane...

Enohthree said:
Though the odds of this particular Lich being one who knows some time related spell that the Chronarch himself didn't is very very low.
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I think Chronarch is just a ceremonial title, not a title reserved for a single person, that indicates who specializes as an Archmage in a subject, although I could be wrong.
 
somewhatLazy said:
Dude... we didn't get DLYW. We got Throne of Stars, and never spoke to our poor yandere mom at all.
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I was responding to a post which said that Forbidden Techniques had harmful side effects and so would not be of any use in getting a perfect foundation amd would be detrimental to such a goal.

I mentioned the failed plan DLYW in that context, since it involved both 1) learning a forbidden technique and 2) going Beyond for a stage, and didn't mention any harm to our core.

To further clarify, I know Throne won and we did not take DLYW.
 
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Corripere said:
We're staying in Vane for a year and half, as Rihaku mentioned, with options to extend as needed. So they'll necessarily be more relics of the past to access. This'll take at most half a year, I think, so we'll still have 2 major choices left, if this trend continues.
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We've already spent six months of our first year of adventuring getting to this location. It will take two months to travel from here back to Vane's capital. That's eight months. I could see at most one more adventure here, as we know each adventure can take several months.

Wolfy said:
I mean, what's not to like? We get 3BPs for Lich - if there's something fucking amazing, we get it. If there isn't, we're suddenly halfway through to Truth.
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Then we've wasted substantial amounts of time when we should have invested those points in something that gives us more time and have nothing to show for it.

Wolfy said:
Or we keep searching for Liches, which is entire point of this choice.
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That probably means moving back into time skip mode as we travel to look for them.

DkArthas said:
I want an attempt at finding the heroine before moving on. It was one of the reason Nameless came here.
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I'm pretty sure we know OOC that finding her is impossible, and that Baenlixnaire was simply wrong.

Enohthree said:
I don't think that's true actually. Our mentor was researching it independently, but the spell was developed and deployed beforehand by some Pharaoh Lich. Though the odds of this particular Lich being one who knows some time related spell that the Chronarch himself didn't is very very low.
That said an extra 80-140 years of cultivation and training, I'm not convinced yet that pursuing such a thing even at the cost of a few years objective time isn't worth it. Decades of research to a regular mage is months to us stumbling upon it from the first principles after all.
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In the write-up for the spell it says that the spell was never developed, so it's unknown what it's true effects actually are. If Baenlixnaire was reimplementing something that someone else had actually finished, he should have known that.

vali said:
Eyes of Kong interest me a great deal. Being able to see diagram energy is great and will help us a lot with finding the other liches, greatly speeding things up. And while it's unlikely, I'm hoping that unlocking this ability will push us closer to discovering any other powers her eyes have, such as the ability to remotely disrupt an ego barrier.
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How does letting her see diagram magic help her find the entrance to a subspace realm buried under a few kilometers of rock with the overflow from the Overgrowth on top

Corripere said:
Note Legacies of Ages more ancient. Sounds awfully like the Legacy Zones our Ring gives a bonus too, doesn't it? There may be more secrets yet in Vane...
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If we'd wanted to explore that option then the option to actually go raiding dungeons for treasures would have needed to win. It lost, so we're not going to do that. We're looking for liches instead.
 
Alratan said:
If we'd wanted to explore that option then the option to actually go raiding dungeons for treasures would have needed to win. It lost. We're looking for liches instead.
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We could do that simply next. Plus, I think the 1.5 years Rihaku mentions doesn't include traveling to Vane and back, so, if I'm correct, we still have some time. I really doubt Nameless would travel all this way for just one thing.
 
RedV said:
It wouldn't have made her willing to change the backbone of her thought for us, though? It's a nice gift, but it is equivalent to getting a custom designed laptop or something. Nice, and useful, but not the thing that changes you as a person?
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I did not mean it'd make her ok with forbidden techniques. I meant that with increased loyalty she'd just do her best not to cause any trouble out of respect for us.
 
Corripere said:
Note Legacies of Ages more ancient. Sounds awfully like the Legacy Zones our Ring gives a bonus too, doesn't it? There may be more secrets yet in Vane...



I think Chronarch is just a ceremonial title, not a title reserved for a single person, that indicates who specializes as an Archmage in a subject, although I could be wrong.
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I always thought that Chronarch is lesser title. Somethingarch is second best while Arch Something is the best - i.e. Arch Diviner > Divinarch. It always made sense to me that Bae focused on Fate and Knowledge, not Time, especially with signature Diagram being Knowledge.
Alratan said:
Then we've wasted substantial amounts of time when we should have invested those points in something that gives us more time and have nothing to show for it.
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Oh gosh, we might not immediately spend a BP point! :(
 
DarkKing98 said:
I did not mean it'd make her ok with forbidden techniques. I meant that with increased loyalty she'd just do her best not to cause any trouble out of respect for us.
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Well, fair enough. I'd prefer not to spend nearly an objective year of Cultiavtion to have our Lackey not blow up at our mom, but it would work.
 
Corripere said:
We could do that simply next. Plus, I think the 1.5 years Rihaku mentions doesn't include traveling to Vane and back, so, if I'm correct, we still have some time. I really doubt Nameless would travel all this way for just one thing.
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Can you say, in complete confidence, with reflection of previous choices, that the voters won't simply go looking for more Liches instead of adventuring for quite literally anything else?
 
[X] Stealth Insertion
[X] Take Out a Loan
[X] Eyes of Kong [Diagram]

We don't fucking know either OOC or IC, our Lich mentor was wrong.
 
DarkKing98 said:
Can you say, in complete confidence, with reflection of previous choices, that the voters won't simply go looking for more Liches instead of adventuring for quite literally anything else?
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If we get a Legacy Zone, I will vote for it like I originally voted for Vane legacy. If we are given option to hunt Forbidden Technique Cultivators I will vote for it.

However, I will not vote to go for something like hunting bears/grinding type options.
 
DarkKing98 said:
Can you say, in complete confidence, with reflection of previous choices, that the voters won't simply go looking for more Liches instead of adventuring for quite literally anything else?
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No, I can't. But I can guarantee that what's I'll argue for (unless we get a really fucking amazing spell this time).
 
Corripere said:
We could do that simply next. Plus, I think the 1.5 years Rihaku mentions doesn't include traveling to Vane and back, so, if I'm correct, we still have some time. I really doubt Nameless would travel all this way for just one thing.
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Rihaku never mentioned one and a half years at all. He said one to two years. Given the many opportunities elsewhere in the Empire, and the very real necessity of doing something to actual improve its stability so that the Heroine can't just nibble it to death by sparking internal conflict or economic ruin, then we should be looking to move on as soon as the year is up.

We'll have given Vane it's chance.

RedV said:
However, I will not vote to go for something like hunting/grinding type options.
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We're a cultivator. We literally have to do an enormous amount of this over the next four years, particularly as we get more powerful. It's basically a non-negotiable fundamental conceit of the setting. It's part of why you pay a xianxia quest, so you can do oriental themed dungeon crawling and wilderness adventures.

Corripere said:
No, I can't. But I can guarantee that what's I'll argue for (unless we get a really fucking amazing spell this time).
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Whatever happens, we'll have given looking for liches its chance, and it will be time to move on. We can't keep eternally doubling down on this field.
 
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Alratan said:
Rihaku never mentioned one and a half years at all. He said one to two years. Given the many opportunities elsewhere in the Empire, and the very real necessity of doing something to actual improve its stability so that the Heroine can't just nibble it to death by sparking internal conflict or economic ruin, then we should be looking to move on as soon as the year is up.

We'll have given Vane it's chance.
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Well, we'll just have to disagree for now and debate if that option ever comes. I think there's far more secrets to be found here, and I'm unwilling to leave with only finding Liches. As I said, I'm likely going to argue for finding the Legacies of previous Ages.
 
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