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General Exalted Thread

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Frakir's brother said:
Let me ask you a question. In Exalted, do people get good at what they do often? Are farmers good at farming, mending folks what sawbones do? If someone does a task five times a day for a minute each, are they going to be good at it? That's how much done people pray irl, and in a world gods might listen? People gonna git gud.
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Oh, I'll answer your question! "Good" for a non-heroic mortal is 2 dots. And this isn't an elder scrolls game, a minute of sneaking five times a day will not give you Sneak 100 in a year's time. If you don't know how to juggle, five minutes of practice spread throughout the day won't make you any better at it. As mentioned above, there's actual mechanics for prayer rolls, it's not a matter of beating a MDV to convince the god to help you, but to get the god to hear you in the first place.

And my point about corruption is this: breaking the law of heaven is going to get you just as punished if you did it because you wanted to save a village because your compassion compelled you as it would if you did it because you were a greedy shit. Once you start being corrupt, you have to steadily become more corrupt to be able to afford to keep bribing the people you have to bribe to keep Johnny Law off your back, all the while your enemies and any god who wants your job will try to throw you under the bus for their own purposes. Every bit of political capital you spend making the lives of a village better because you're a virtuous person is a bit of political capital that you aren't defending yourself with.

Yes, there are spirits everywhere in creation. Mortals, in general, are not palling around with them. When a mortal meets something that is magical, the smart ones keep their heads down and figure out the best way to appease them. When a mortal can not possibly get something they want done any other way, they will consider going to a spirit and begging it for help, but they have to weigh the risk of it killing or taking something precious from them in some manner. When the baker has to beg the frog spirit in the local swamp to save his wife from the fever that is killing her, he counts himself lucky if it only demands his unborn child as payment. Even seemingly benign spirits worry mortals, if the mountain spirit gets too drunk on the liquor it brews to drink on feast days, it might make the local mine collapse in a drunken fit. An air elemental might take a fancy to some youth and sweep them up into the sky... and then drop them off a hundred miles away with no way to get home when it gets distracted.
 
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Unbanshee said:
An air elemental might take a fancy to some youth and sweep them up into the sky... and then drop them off a hundred miles away with no way to get home when it gets distracted.
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And he's lucky if he get's 'dropped off' at ground level. It's much more likely he'll become a thin layer of bloody paste across the side of some mountain.
 
Gamerlord said:
And he's lucky if he get's 'dropped off' at ground level. It's much more likely he'll become a thin layer of bloody paste across the side of some mountain.
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Sure, possibly. I meant the example to be a more or less benign consequence where the mortal survives... but because they're farther away from their village than anyone else from their village has ever been and entirely unprepared for the kind of travel needed to get back, they're effectively dead to everyone that knew them. It's no big deal for an air elemental to travel that far that quickly, sometimes they forget that mortals can't do the same.

And like, there's nothing wrong with there being someone who isn't afraid of spirits every once and awhile, or a town where spirits are chill and kind and helpful. They just aren't the norm. But you know what else isn't the norm? Player Characters.
 
Accelerator said:
So the problem with the gods and elementals is their.... lack of understanding of mortal life?
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Now you're just fucking with us.

Anyway, onto a more appropriate topic, I've ran into a problem. I have absolutely no derogatory word to call Terrestrials. You've got Dragonbloods, Terrestrials and Dynasts. These don't really help convey a hateful, angry tone do they? My question is, are dragons in Exalted associated with reptiles? Would it make sense for enemies of the Realm to refer to their leaders with words like 'scaleface'?
 
Mamluk
The Tireless Jument
Demon of the First Circle
Progeny of The Ceaseless Caravan
Hell is not so different from Creation; underneath their green sun, the demons of Hell toil. They trade, goods and services flowing from one direction to another and stone and metals must be hauled for industry and fields need to be plowed and barges pulled. It is for this reason that the Mamluk were created, to act as creatures of burden that were smarter than mere animals and that were hardier than most other demons, with a temperament suited to their duties. In manner; they are patient, not easily bored and slow in thought, though not stupid or foolish, merely deliberate and methodical.

In terms of appearance they are hairless camels with hides of either red, silver or green and the mouths of ants and the head of camel with the eyes of man. Often they have brightly colored feathers along their neck and back.

Uses: They haul barges along quicksilver canals, carry good on their backs through the Endless desert and drag trains of caravans and war-machines behind them. There are few Demons of the First Circle who have strength and endurance of the Mamuk. They see little use in direct combat, for all that their kicks could crack the skull of Blood-Ape, they don't have have the temperament or speed of thought to make good frontline fighters. Though more than one enterprising general has used them to pull down fortress gates with their brute strength by harnessing them with chain that hook onto the gates.

According to some, they do not stop growing after their birth, though the Hellscape of Malfeas kills most of them long before the reach old age. Those that do survive, grow to a massive size indeed; their are elders who are centuries old who are the size of elephants, and there are rumors of the first of their kind still lives deep underground, a giant of monstrous proportions.

They gain a point of limit when they're labours are insulted and may escape from Hell when a draft animal or carriage horse dies from over work, the corpse twisting into the form of a Mamluk.

Obscurity:1/1 these demons are well known by Sorcerers, and as such their ins and outs are well known.
 
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Gamerlord said:
Now you're just fucking with us.

Anyway, onto a more appropriate topic, I've ran into a problem. I have absolutely no derogatory word to call Terrestrials. You've got Dragonbloods, Terrestrials and Dynasts. These don't really help convey a hateful, angry tone do they? My question is, are dragons in Exalted associated with reptiles? Would it make sense for enemies of the Realm to refer to their leaders with words like 'scaleface'?
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Dragonspawn!
 
Gamerlord said:
Now you're just fucking with us.

Anyway, onto a more appropriate topic, I've ran into a problem. I have absolutely no derogatory word to call Terrestrials. You've got Dragonbloods, Terrestrials and Dynasts. These don't really help convey a hateful, angry tone do they? My question is, are dragons in Exalted associated with reptiles? Would it make sense for enemies of the Realm to refer to their leaders with words like 'scaleface'?
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Accelerator said:
Dragonspawn!
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No, because that sounds cool. Just use insults for nobility and upper class twits. Toff, bloody-handed bastards, chinless wonders, etc.
 
Gamerlord said:
Now you're just fucking with us.

Anyway, onto a more appropriate topic, I've ran into a problem. I have absolutely no derogatory word to call Terrestrials. You've got Dragonbloods, Terrestrials and Dynasts. These don't really help convey a hateful, angry tone do they? My question is, are dragons in Exalted associated with reptiles? Would it make sense for enemies of the Realm to refer to their leaders with words like 'scaleface'?
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A insulting-yet-true nickname for the Scarlet Dynasty?

Inbred rednecks.
 
Gamerlord said:
Now you're just fucking with us.

Anyway, onto a more appropriate topic, I've ran into a problem. I have absolutely no derogatory word to call Terrestrials. You've got Dragonbloods, Terrestrials and Dynasts. These don't really help convey a hateful, angry tone do they? My question is, are dragons in Exalted associated with reptiles? Would it make sense for enemies of the Realm to refer to their leaders with words like 'scaleface'?
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Jumped up elementals?

Damp lizards, oversized pieces of driftwood, cracked cornerstones, the backwind dragons. I couldn't find a good way to imply impulsive stupidity fore fire aspects, maybe tinder brained geniuses?
 
Accelerator said:
So the problem with the gods and elementals is their.... lack of understanding of mortal life?
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The problem is that when I say, in regards to binding demons towards moving a village's millstone for eternity, mortals will be freaked out by this because spirits (especially demons) are scary, people jump out of the woodwork to "nu-uh" me with "it's an animistic setting" like they seem to think every single mortal has Occult 3+ and is super chill with spirits.

Here's what everyone knows about spirits. Spirits are, unless you can get another spirit or exalt or hero to step in somehow, beyond any consequence that most mortals can bring against them. This also exists in the real world, where the rich and/or powerful can get away with a whole lot of shit simply because they are rich and/or powerful. In both cases, when you are a penniless farmer who spends most of your time farming and hoping that war doesn't sweep over your village, your best defense is to keep your head down, keep it happy, and hope that it doesn't single you out for some reason. Villagers aren't going to want demons involved in their flour milling process, because they are going to worry that it's going to curse them somehow, or that it will break free (since they don't know how the bindings work) and eat them, or that some other god is going to get offended.
 
Unbanshee said:
The problem is that when I say, in regards to binding demons towards moving a village's millstone for eternity, mortals will be freaked out by this because spirits (especially demons) are scary, people jump out of the woodwork to "nu-uh" me with "it's an animistic setting" like they seem to think every single mortal has Occult 3+ and is super chill with spirits.
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You use an actual demon, and yeah, they'll be freaked (unless you've spent a while convincing them that you're a badass who knows what he's doing, anyway). But if you use a tiny windmill-spirit who doesn't seem to wield anything more threatening than a stiff breeze, it's another matter entirely.

Here's what everyone knows about spirits. Spirits are, unless you can get another spirit or exalt or hero to step in somehow, beyond any consequence that most mortals can bring against them. This also exists in the real world, where the rich and/or powerful can get away with a whole lot of shit simply because they are rich and/or powerful. In both cases, when you are a penniless farmer who spends most of your time farming and hoping that war doesn't sweep over your village, your best defense is to keep your head down, keep it happy, and hope that it doesn't single you out for some reason. Villagers aren't going to want demons involved in their flour milling process, because they are going to worry that it's going to curse them somehow, or that it will break free (since they don't know how the bindings work) and eat them, or that some other god is going to get offended.
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There you go again, pretending that the tiny harmless house-gods don't exist. They do. Keeping your head down is probably your best bet for dealing with river gods, or mountain gods, or even the God of Frogs in the Anaruma Fens. It's not your best bet for dealing with the god of your own village. That guy's not much more powerful than a mortal, and moreover he can't screw the village over without screwing himself over in the process, since his power and standing are tied directly to the village's importance. You don't need Occult 3+ to know that he's down at the bottom of the totem pole with you.

Shoemaker elves are totally a thing that can happen in Creation, albeit with way more self-interest involved. If your family has been running a cobbler's shop for generations but now faces ruin, just when the god of the shop was trying to convince his boss that they need a God of Cobblers in the city now that there are three shops in town and hey, I've got way more seniority than those other two, he might just resort to making some damn shoes.
 
Accelerator said:
Lets say there's a dead tree. No leaves. No flowers. Bare. But still standing. Can you resurrect it?
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Hmm. Animals, definitely not. You might actually be able to do it with plants, though; I don't think they have souls. For an ordinary oak tree or whatever, you can definitely either resurrect the tree or create a new living tree out of the old dead one, and I don't think there's really a difference. A legendary magical tree, probably not so much.
 
Accelerator said:
Lets say there's a dead tree. No leaves. No flowers. Bare. But still standing. Can you resurrect it?
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Basically the question you're asking is 'Can you get the Exact Same Soul back from the dead if you kill it' and the answer is categorically No.

Now, this really only matters metaphysically because the Po animal soul (which pretty much everything has in some form or another) is more or less created and inhabits the meatbody at birth. Plants don't actually have souls, they have least gods tending to them as domains. So when a plant 'dies' that god likely either dies with it, or moves on to another plant in the same species that's nearby/a new plant.

So... Basically let's say a man's horse dies. That Po soul is gone forever, and I don't want to say that Animals can't create Hungry Ghosts, but it's not an assumption I'd run with. Anyway, Horse Soul A is Gone Forever. Everything that made Horse A and Soul A 'A' is now gone. Can't be recovered.

You can restore the tissue, coax a new soul into the body and any number of arbitrary things, but you will never get 'Horse A + Soul A' back together perfectly. Now in practice, Horse A and Soul A.1 can be functionally identical, maybe you recover it's personality enough that only someone who tries with equal awesomeness can ever tell it happened... but the evidence is still there.

Mortal humans have the Hun/Po soul structure, and the above is even More true for them. The process of Death is irrevocable and leaves lasting marks on both halves of the soul structure, which in turn makes resurrection impossible. You can get 'close enough', but there's always going to be hints that they Came Back Wrong.

Plants, generally being Living Objects as opposed to Mortal Beings, skate on this.
 
Shyft said:
So... Basically let's say a man's horse dies. That Po soul is gone forever, and I don't want to say that Animals can't create Hungry Ghosts, but it's not an assumption I'd run with. Anyway, Horse Soul A is Gone Forever. Everything that made Horse A and Soul A 'A' is now gone. Can't be recovered.
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For what it's worth, someone asked a similar question about wolves on the OPP forums, and Vance's reply was "...ghost wolfs sound raw as heck, and I'm a big sucker for stories involving the ghosts of animals, so if I can find I way to make it work, I probably will." So, there's a chance animal hungry ghosts end up being a thing eventually.
 
SerGregness said:
For what it's worth, someone asked a similar question about wolves on the OPP forums, and Vance's reply was "...ghost wolfs sound raw as heck, and I'm a big sucker for stories involving the ghosts of animals, so if I can find I way to make it work, I probably will." So, there's a chance animal hungry ghosts end up being a thing eventually.
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Hell, I think it's metal as all getout too. I suppose what I'm getting at is that It's totally possible to make an animal hungry ghost with like necromancy or whatever, but I don't know if culturally and metaphysically the setting says 'respect the dead animals' as much as 'respect dead people' for the same reason. I would assume/prefer it does though, even if say your loyal dog does not make a regular ghost- it can't, not without being specially prepared or attatched to their also-dead-owner somehow.
 
Shyft said:
Basically the question you're asking is 'Can you get the Exact Same Soul back from the dead if you kill it' and the answer is categorically No.

Plants, generally being Living Objects as opposed to Mortal Beings, skate on this.
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Um.... not exactly.

Remember the story of 'The old man who made the withered trees blossom'?

Yeah, like that.
 
Accelerator said:
Um.... not exactly.

Remember the story of 'The old man who made the withered trees blossom'?

Yeah, like that.
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That sort of thing happens as a byproduct of Wood Aspect Animas flaring, to say nothing of concerted efforts like Solar Sorcery: Benediction of Archgenesis.

Short-version: You can do whatever you want to plants and not violate No Ressurections. Animals (anything with a Soul really) is blocked. There are no more edge cases.
 
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