WannaBee (Worm/Hazbin Hotel)

Fenfel · Dec 8, 2019

So this crossover made me think of "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" and that's pretty much what happened here isnit it? I dunno how Taylor would see it but despite her reasons she still did some horrible stuff that may have not been needed, and that's the thing. Like, I haven't read worm, but based on what I've heard and stuff her thing is to escalate quickly right? At one point here she even said that she coul have gotten the same results or better in some situations without going so crazy.
Of course she probably doesn't deserve the sin count she got, but I'm assuming she deserves a really big number still, specially from what I heard she did at the end. Again, haven't read worm so most of what I know is people's comments here and there and what some fics say.

ninjafish · Dec 8, 2019

Fenfel said:
So this crossover made me think of "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" and that's pretty much what happened here isnit it? I dunno how Taylor would see it but despite her reasons she still did some horrible stuff that may have not been needed, and that's the thing. Like, I haven't read worm, but based on what I've heard and stuff her thing is to escalate quickly right? At one point here she even said that she coul have gotten the same results or better in some situations without going so crazy.
Of course she probably doesn't deserve the sin count she got, but I'm assuming she deserves a really big number still, specially from what I heard she did at the end. Again, haven't read worm so most of what I know is people's comments here and there and what some fics say.

the thing she did at the end shouldn't have gotten her any sins at all.

if she hadn't done it all of humanity would have died.

Saving literally all of humanity everywhere is an end that justifies any means. IMO.

Isomin · Dec 8, 2019

ninjafish said:
the thing she did at the end shouldn't have gotten her any sins at all.

if she hadn't done it all of humanity would have died.

Saving literally all of humanity everywhere is an end that justifies any means. IMO.

If I recall correctly, the in-story justification was that all of Scion/Zion's sins were laid at her feet. Or that might be one of the theories of the readers, not sure.

Fenfel · Dec 8, 2019

ninjafish said:
the thing she did at the end shouldn't have gotten her any sins at all.

if she hadn't done it all of humanity would have died.

Saving literally all of humanity everywhere is an end that justifies any means. IMO.

Mmmm, not sure if I agree or not. Makes me think if that train 2 ways who you save thing. Or other sort of morality questions like that. I guess I just disagree with the end justifies the means idea, regardless of situation.

Well we'll see how things go. Regardless of the end bit, she still isn't free of consequences or responsibility of all her actions but that would be way less that what she got, that's true.

Neruz · Dec 8, 2019

Malcanthet said:
That actually makes sense. Especially with how ahe managed to kill Scion. Although with all of his accrued deals helping her as much as his sins are hindering her ... Yea I wonder how she reacts to Charlie's parents being uncomfortable and exceedingly polite around her.

Yeah that's not gonna happen. Lucifer is apparently a lot like Willy Wonka personality-wise, and is also a Fallen Angel rather than a Demon and thus operates on the Angel tier of power, which is definitively above and beyond what any Demon is capable of achieving (barring implied rules exploitations and loopholes) and is why he is the undisputed King of Hell, this is also probably why he doesn't have horns. Lillith on the other hand is either the oldest or second oldest Demon in existence (whether she predates Satan or not is up in the air) and has probably made more Deals than can be counted, along with all the other things she has no doubt accrued after multiple millennia of existence as the Queen of Hell. (Incidentally, Charlie being technically half Demon\half Fallen Angel is a possible explanation for why her Demonic Form only has one horn instead of the usual two.)

Khepri is a very powerful young up-and-comer, someone with excellent potential and a worthy addition to the entourage of the Princess of Hell, but she is not on Lucifer and Lillith's level. Even if she could match them in raw power (which I doubt) she's leagues away from them in knowledge and cunning, and that matters. A lot.

Seeing as Lillith appears to have a fairly supportive relationship with Charlie as opposed to the implied disapproval of Lucifer, Lillith would possibly approve of Khepri. Given the 'Willy Wonka' description and the fact that vivzie has said that Lucifer and Alastor would get along really well, Lucifer would probably dick around and prank the shit out of her instead.

5007 · Dec 9, 2019

Fenfel said:
So this crossover made me think of "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" and that's pretty much what happened here isnit it? I dunno how Taylor would see it but despite her reasons she still did some horrible stuff that may have not been needed, and that's the thing. Like, I haven't read worm, but based on what I've heard and stuff her thing is to escalate quickly right? At one point here she even said that she coul have gotten the same results or better in some situations without going so crazy.
Of course she probably doesn't deserve the sin count she got, but I'm assuming she deserves a really big number still, specially from what I heard she did at the end. Again, haven't read worm so most of what I know is people's comments here and there and what some fics say.

I read it once. The first ten or so chapters were difficult to get through due to the drama and the incompetence of the adults, but I read the remainder as quickly as I could. Every spare moment was spent reading it.

After I read the final chapter, I was despondent for a while - that feeling you get when you complete a book and there's nothing else to read. Of course, I know now that Ward, the sequel, had been out already, but all of Wildbow's works stray into grimderp territory. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who has serious mental issues or PTSD about school-related incidents. I'm glad I read it, but I probably shouldn't have, at least not while I was still working retail.

Kagemoto · Dec 9, 2019

Luci being all willy wonka also gives me dandy Jack Slash vibes, somehow

that said, Khepri is pretty high end on the power scale I feel

not enough that she would be a threat

but I do think Luci and Lilith would take notice of her, even if it's by her association with their daughter

I also agree with Luci pranking the shit out of Khepri

he'd probably go too far once, Khepri gets angry and Luci will show off and back off a bit in amusement and stick to the small stuff to build up her annoyance or something

Tzardok · Dec 9, 2019

5007 said:
I read it once. The first ten or so chapters were difficult to get through due to the drama and the incompetence of the adults, but I read the remainder as quickly as I could. Every spare moment was spent reading it.

After I read the final chapter, I was despondent for a while - that feeling you get when you complete a book and there's nothing else to read. Of course, I know now that Ward, the sequel, had been out already, but all of Wildbow's works stray into grimderp territory. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who has serious mental issues or PTSD about school-related incidents. I'm glad I read it, but I probably shouldn't have, at least not while I was still working retail.

I haven't read Ward yet (still reading Twig) but my acquaintances over at giantip.com assure me that it is a lot more upbeat and optimistic than Worm.

5007 · Dec 9, 2019

Tzardok said:
I haven't read Ward yet (still reading Twig) but my acquaintances over at giantip.com assure me that it is a lot more upbeat and optimistic than Worm.

While I do see that as possible, Wildbow doesn't keep notes around to make sure he's consistent. I've heard many a complaint about Wildbow and consistency/math never being in the same room together.

Tzardok · Dec 9, 2019

5007 said:
While I do see that as possible, Wildbow doesn't keep notes around to make sure he's consistent. I've heard many a complaint about Wildbow and consistency/math never being in the same room together.

I... don't see how note keeping is germane to the discussion. I thought we were talking about the overall tone of the work. :???:

5007 · Dec 9, 2019

Tzardok said:
I... don't see how note keeping is germane to the discussion. I thought we were talking about the overall tone of the work.

It's frustrating when an author clearly doesn't double check their work. It shows that the research part of their writing process is shoddy.

Tzardok · Dec 9, 2019

5007 said:
It's frustrating when an author clearly doesn't double check their work. It shows that the research part of their writing process is shoddy.

Do you have proof for your claim? If you read the comments of Wildbow's works, you'll see more praise for good research than condemnation for shoddieness or lack of consistency.

MrCogmor · Dec 9, 2019

This is not the thread to discuss the contrivances, plot holes and inconsistencies in Worm or judge its artistic merits. Take it to another thread.

Nightmare723764 · Dec 9, 2019

5007 said:
I read it once. The first ten or so chapters were difficult to get through due to the drama and the incompetence of the adults, but I read the remainder as quickly as I could. Every spare moment was spent reading it.

After I read the final chapter, I was despondent for a while - that feeling you get when you complete a book and there's nothing else to read. Of course, I know now that Ward, the sequel, had been out already, but all of Wildbow's works stray into grimderp territory. I wouldn't recommend it to anyone who has serious mental issues or PTSD about school-related incidents. I'm glad I read it, but I probably shouldn't have, at least not while I was still working retail.

Thanks for clairfying that and now I know I'm not alone in struggling to read it. Though you did better then me. I couldn't even get past the first chapter.

Kagemoto · Dec 9, 2019

SO

let's put this sort of back on track

what do you think would happen during the extermination?

like, I do think Charlie would force everyone to stay inside the Hotel

because from what I notice the Exterminators don't break into houses, just pick off demons on the streets (kinda polite innit?)

also from what the silhouettes imply, there might be a 'head' exterminator that could be a character in the story, but that is just speculation

Fenfel · Dec 9, 2019

I dunno what may happen aside from maybe the angels they send being robots that no-sell anything anyone may throw at them, and would follow just simple orders totally unfazed, get things done efficiently to a certain number, then just simply leave like nothing. Honestly if they could be taken down by Taylor and co it would be pretty lame imo. Dunno, I like the idea of an unstoppable force that isn't there to be beaten, just make sure there is no need for them, which is what Charlie wants.

Paragon_4376 · Dec 9, 2019

Taylor has a habit of refusing to back down. Even if 99.99% of Hell is made up of complete assholes, I don't see Taylor standing down an letting the extermination happen without putting up a fight. Plus, if she manages to get some angelic weapons, she can perma-kill anyone in Hell. We don't know how powerful her swarm is, either, but if she can kill an Exterminator with her bugs, it would firmly cement her as someone not to be messed with.
But we don't know how powerful Taylor is compared to the Exterminators, so it could go either way.

ninjafish · Dec 10, 2019

Paragon_4376 said:
Taylor has a habit of refusing to back down. Even if 99.99% of Hell is made up of complete assholes, I don't see Taylor standing down an letting the extermination happen without putting up a fight. Plus, if she manages to get some angelic weapons, she can perma-kill anyone in Hell. We don't know how powerful her swarm is, either, but if she can kill an Exterminator with her bugs, it would firmly cement her as someone not to be messed with.
But we don't know how powerful Taylor is compared to the Exterminators, so it could go either way.

Raw power is determined by sin level WOG.

Taylor has all of the sins.

All Of Them.

Paragon_4376 · Dec 10, 2019

ninjafish said:
Raw power is determined by sin level WOG.

Taylor has all of the sins.

All Of Them.

Then she could probably take on and win against the Exterminators. In which case, this years cleanse will be quite interesting.
Do we know how hard it is to kill an Exterminator normally? Or how hard it would be for Taylor to kill an Exterminator?

ninjafish · Dec 10, 2019

Paragon_4376 said:
Then she could probably take on and win against the Exterminators. In which case, this years cleanse will be quite interesting.
Do we know how hard it is to kill an Exterminator normally? Or how hard it would be for Taylor to kill an Exterminator?

Not a bit,

Kagemoto · Dec 10, 2019

ninjafish said:
Not a bit,

of course exterminators could be immune to damage/sin powers

or be robots that put themselves back together after being destroyed

it REALLY feels off that they would just leave weapons that can permanently kill demons around for other demons to use

Artemis_Fowl_2nd · Dec 11, 2019

Kagemoto said:
what do you think would happen during the extermination?

like, I do think Charlie would force everyone to stay inside the Hotel

because from what I notice the Exterminators don't break into houses, just pick off demons on the streets (kinda polite innit?)

also from what the silhouettes imply, there might be a 'head' exterminator that could be a character in the story, but that is just speculation

I just can't get the idea out of my head of Taylor going up to one of these things and attempting to "file a complaint" on how the system has dumped all of these unearned sins on her.
Just her being super polite, trying to get across this bureaucratic error, while it is killing everything in sight- trying to kill her but the bugs keep getting in the way.

Kagemoto · Dec 11, 2019

Artemis_Fowl_2nd said:
I just can't get the idea out of my head of Taylor going up to one of these things and attempting to "file a complaint" on how the system has dumped all of these unearned sins on her.
Just her being super polite, trying to get across this bureaucratic error, while it is killing everything in sight- trying to kill her but the bugs keep getting in the way.

Or speaking through bugs so she won't get stabbed

and giving time for the other sinners to get away

IllegibleScream · Dec 11, 2019

I'm pretty sure that the extermination is literally just 'Hey demons, tonight is a ffa.'

shade argost · Dec 11, 2019

Neruz said:
Yeah that's not gonna happen. Lucifer is apparently a lot like Willy Wonka personality-wise, and is also a Fallen Angel rather than a Demon and thus operates on the Angel tier of power, which is definitively above and beyond what any Demon is capable of achieving (barring implied rules exploitations and loopholes) and is why he is the undisputed King of Hell, this is also probably why he doesn't have horns. Lillith on the other hand is either the oldest or second oldest Demon in existence (whether she predates Satan or not is up in the air) and has probably made more Deals than can be counted, along with all the other things she has no doubt accrued after multiple millennia of existence as the Queen of Hell. (Incidentally, Charlie being technically half Demon\half Fallen Angel is a possible explanation for why her Demonic Form only has one horn instead of the usual two.)

Khepri is a very powerful young up-and-comer, someone with excellent potential and a worthy addition to the entourage of the Princess of Hell, but she is not on Lucifer and Lillith's level. Even if she could match them in raw power (which I doubt) she's leagues away from them in knowledge and cunning, and that matters. A lot.

Seeing as Lillith appears to have a fairly supportive relationship with Charlie as opposed to the implied disapproval of Lucifer, Lillith would possibly approve of Khepri. Given the 'Willy Wonka' description and the fact that vivzie has said that Lucifer and Alastor would get along really well, Lucifer would probably dick around and prank the shit out of her instead.

Kagemoto said:
Luci being all willy wonka also gives me dandy Jack Slash vibes, somehow

that said, Khepri is pretty high end on the power scale I feel

not enough that she would be a threat

but I do think Luci and Lilith would take notice of her, even if it's by her association with their daughter

I also agree with Luci pranking the shit out of Khepri

he'd probably go too far once, Khepri gets angry and Luci will show off and back off a bit in amusement and stick to the small stuff to build up her annoyance or something

No, no, Lucifer will try to prank Taylor but will find her near impossible to do so because of her local omnipresence, then as he is going too far and starts to risk actually hurting someone Taylor will threaten him with spider assisted neutering and possible eye removal.

Threats that would need to be taken seriously because if even one of Taylor's bugs survive then so does she.

Paragon_4376 said:
Taylor has a habit of refusing to back down. Even if 99.99% of Hell is made up of complete assholes, I don't see Taylor standing down an letting the extermination happen without putting up a fight. Plus, if she manages to get some angelic weapons, she can perma-kill anyone in Hell. We don't know how powerful her swarm is, either, but if she can kill an Exterminator with her bugs, it would firmly cement her as someone not to be messed with.
But we don't know how powerful Taylor is compared to the Exterminators, so it could go either way.

We don't know how powerful Taylor is period, though I see Taylor being powerful enough to at minimum drive off the Exterminators just by being an unending tide of demonic bugs and she might be able to kill one or two lower end ones if the get isolated and/or overwhelmed at best.

WannaBee (Worm/Hazbin Hotel)

oH mE, Oh My,

Consistently sleep-deprived

Rogue Spiderbanana

Y U n0 1337-5p33k?

I stand against the Infinite Horizon

Story-hoarding Dragon

Y U n0 1337-5p33k?

Story-hoarding Dragon

Y U n0 1337-5p33k?

Story-hoarding Dragon

I stand against the Infinite Horizon

oH mE, Oh My,

oH mE, Oh My,

I stand against the Infinite Horizon

I stand against the Infinite Horizon

Actually a goat.