Okay, so you're saying that, rather than take the chance (yes no matter what you say, it's still only a chance) that the mercs will kill everyone anyways, you'd let two completely innocent people die, one of which is only in this situation because you he came with you, and the other would have been a sex slave but at least a living one if it wasn't for this. You're really saying that?
The Steep Path Ahead [Familiar of Zero AU]
- Thread starter shadenight123
- Start date
Ah, that may be true the first time, but betting on that after you've betrayed, beaten, and humiliated them (and they have just returned the first) is a horrible idea. It's also important to remember that Saito was betraying Louise by ripping her wand from her hand and stomping on it.
I'm concerned that the characters seem to have completely forgotten about Wardes claiming to be killing them for crown and country. Not to mention the incredibly suspicious timing and power of the 'bandit.' How many square class mage bandits can there possibly be? Why on earth are they trusting the cardinal about Siesta either? Louise seemed to be taking the cardinals letter at face value, but it directly contradicts major points that she knows about. She didn't claim to be the daughter of the duchess. He claimed that. I get that she blindly religious, but not even thinking about how the cardinal is clearly lying and screwing her over is weird.
It's a good chance I wouldn't put my life on the line, and yes than have everyone die. He could have done anything but that naive choice.
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Oh? Do tell. You can't fight because the hostages will die. You can't run because the hostages will die. You surrender and the hostages have a good chance of not dying while your own chance at survival is admittedly iffy. No real good options. He decided to go with the most humane option that preserved the lives (or at least had the best chance at doing so) of two innocent people. That you would rather let two innocent people die than put your own life in danger is your choice. It's true that their survival isn't guaranteed if you surrender, but it's much better than if you don't.
Edit: What I'm saying is that what Saito did was reckless and perhaps not the ideal option, but frankly it was just one of many potential bad choices he could have made. Could he have made a better choice? Perhaps. Could he have made a worse one? Probably.
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Really? Seems pretty clear that a large part of the reason she trusts him implicitly is because she is a religious fanatic who takes things very seriously, and he is high up in the church for said religion. She doesn't understand religious corruption or shades of grey.
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IDK, ask someone else. I'm too tired to think it through.
The moral compass of these mercenaries (and mercs in the setting in general) are closer to militiamen in the bleakest parts of Africa than some enlightened progressive soldier from 21st century Sweden! Again, you cannot assume people are rational actors because they're not. Nor are they always moral.
Oh please. You'd be gambling your own life and Louise's on the mercy of some mercs who like you said, didn't mind delivering sex slaves for some quick cash. Oh, and the mercy of said Count who ordered the sex-slave.
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Saito's choice was stupid because his actions would have resulted in all of them being hurt and killed with zero chance of escape if not for Louise's deus ex machina.
Louise and Saito had a very good bargining chip in that Louise could knock all of the mercs out with one spell. Which he threw away without even negotiating.
Furthermore I thought it was fairly obvious they weren't going to kill Siesta, as they won't be paid for delivering a corpse! Notice how the death threat became a maiming threat once they felt they were at an advantage?
IMO Marteau was the one in mortal danger there. And Saito, instead of trying to do something productive (Saito, remember that time you nailed someone to a wall by throwing a spear at them? HINT HINT), decided both he and Louise should enter the same situation as Marteau without any leverage.
Louise and Saito had a very good bargining chip in that Louise could knock all of the mercs out with one spell. Which he threw away without even negotiating.
Furthermore I thought it was fairly obvious they weren't going to kill Siesta, as they won't be paid for delivering a corpse! Notice how the death threat became a maiming threat once they felt they were at an advantage?
IMO Marteau was the one in mortal danger there. And Saito, instead of trying to do something productive (Saito, remember that time you nailed someone to a wall by throwing a spear at them? HINT HINT), decided both he and Louise should enter the same situation as Marteau without any leverage.
Lets not forget that A: she was raised by said church, B: was planning on becoming a *Beeping* nun in said church. For as long as she can remember the church has been nothing but good to her, part of that fanaticism may simply be dinale from the shock of the Cardinal trying to get them killed.
- Location
- The Old Dominion
He's also the royal regent of Tristain and even if he wasn't being a cardinal in such as setting means you are a person of great power and influence which would command real temporal legal authority, we aren't talking about a modern western democratic political and cultural setting but a feudal/early modern setting with all the cultural and political differences that implies.
Also note that in spite of the letter and the attempt at killing them they haven't fled Tristain and are in fact continuing to adventure there in spite of the attention it might draw and the further threat of more assassination attempts.
I think you're being unfair to Louise. She's not a religious fanatic. It's more fair to say she's religious & naive by virtue of her culture & sheltered upbringing.
Schwer-Muta
A Shy Arrogance
Mazarin's face has to be slowly sliding into his hands by now.
He goes "I am going to tie up this loose end once and for all! To make sure nothing can go wrong, I will send the strongest possible assassin to make sure it works." And then it fails. And then he's probably scrambling around trying to figure out how to fix this, and he starts hearing rumors about an adventurer with pink hair, who is one of the strongest mages anyone has ever seen.
Named Louis.
At this point he has to be counting the minutes before Karin comes bursting through that door.
He goes "I am going to tie up this loose end once and for all! To make sure nothing can go wrong, I will send the strongest possible assassin to make sure it works." And then it fails. And then he's probably scrambling around trying to figure out how to fix this, and he starts hearing rumors about an adventurer with pink hair, who is one of the strongest mages anyone has ever seen.
Named Louis.
At this point he has to be counting the minutes before Karin comes bursting through that door.
Spells require chanting.
Like throwing something isn't telegraphed as hell, and besides they were one flick of a knife away from killing one or both hostages (they totally would have killed Siesta if they thought it was necessarily).
Of course giving yourselves up is a terrible idea in this case. What I'm trying to get across is that it's one choice out of a bunch of terrible ideas. Stop trying to make it sound like Saito picked the stupidest option available. Even Louise was leaning towards giving up, her reluctance primarily based off of her desire to keep the symbol of being a mage rather than the points you're bringing up.
True. She is clearly desperate to think the best of the man, but I would think that nearly dying (and saito actually dying) would shock her enough to distrust him.
The part that louise trusts and respects him for (the most) is his religious bona fides.
Yes, they are being unusually chill about having the right hand of the country after them.
You have a point. Fanatic has connotations that go too far. Being 16 and raised by in the church makes her religiosity not unusual. However she is extremely serious, literal, and close minded about the religion. All traits that make her effectively a fanatic, except that she is more likely to grow out of it.
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- Location
- Canada
It would be funny if what they read in the letter was a fake, and to read the real message you had to apply magic to the letter to see the magic sensitive invisible ink between the lines of the other letter.
The way I see it, Louise and Saito had two choices. They could have ran away abandoning Siesta and Martou or, Surrender and go talk to Count Mott.
This Saito seems to believe in going for the best ending or at least trying for saving everyone.
Louise got angry and choose the third path, blow them all up.
The way I see it, Louise and Saito had two choices. They could have ran away abandoning Siesta and Martou or, Surrender and go talk to Count Mott.
This Saito seems to believe in going for the best ending or at least trying for saving everyone.
Louise got angry and choose the third path, blow them all up.
Really, they've been fucking up the entire time. It would have been better if they stayed out of it, or took the deal the first time.
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Fourth path: attack now, relying on speed and good tactics to rescue the hostages before they're harmed.
Fifth path: retreat and attack again while the mercs are en route to Mott
Sixth path: retreat and get backup... such as a certain dragon + square mage. The dragon massively outpaces horses, so the time lost is not a big deal.
And so on. There are far more than two options if one bothers to explore them.
Saito didn't even confirm if the merc were going to kill them or not before disarming. And did you miss the part where the mercs immediately move to start torturing them when they surrender? His decision is stupid because it made things massively worse for everyone on his side without any chance of benefits.
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Every one of these ends in the mercs killing the two; I don't care how fast you are, a knife as someone's throat (or even near it) is going to result in their deaths. They might as well just run and abandon them for dead.
I'll give you that one. He probably should have tried to figure that out first.
Oh I don't know. It certainly didn't make it worse for Siesta or Marteau because, well, it couldn't get much worse for them. And the potential benefits included saving Marteau's life at the very least (and possibly Siesta, because I can totally see her getting killed if Team Void fought back). That's something worth considering.
Gandalfr didn't have that problem in this fic when he was in the spooky mansion.
... Okay, you actually have a point there. Still, I doubt he could do it to two people before the second one reached his target's vital areas.
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Marteau was just being beaten, he didn't have a knife to his throat.
True. Okay, so maybe there were better options, but neither Saito nor Louise is a trained fighter. They have limited experience with combat situations, especially against hardened mercenaries. Saito panicked. Someone accused me earlier or projecting my detachment as a reader onto the situation, but in a way that's what you and the others are doing. If you were them, could you really say with utter certainty you would judge the situation calmly and decide the best course of action with the greatest chance of success?
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They are fairly battle-hardened by this point, so I think it is unfair to say they are untrained fighters as they clearly have experience fighting.
Judging the situation at all would be a good start. My issue with Saito is that he literally didn't think at all before chosing one of the worst options possible. Which is made more glaring by the fact that he was in an extremely similar situation before (haunted mansion), chose a risky option, and was rewarded for it. He chooses to surrender here because they baited him into it, not because he thought it was the best option.
Mercs: "Oh we'll probably stop torturing Siesta and Marteau if you surrender. No guarantees tho."
*Saito surrenders*
Mercs: "Well we're definitely going to torture you and Louise now. Also if our boss is annoyed we'll kill you all!"