Sandy River DL
(Verified Destroyer Leader)
- Location
- Lake Michigan
- Pronouns
- Her/She
I think the comparison is in the being bought by former rivals, not that Russia is comparable to the Persian Empire.
The Sparta Myth and the Far Right
- Thread starter Yeangst
- Start date
- Historic
Jemnite
CVN-69 Fella
- Location
- 清源书院
The prestige provided by the military bravado actually was part and parcel of the reputation that allowed Sparta to continue as a dominant power in the Greek sphere so long. Unsurprisingly the propaganda worked.
Triggerhappy
Stick with Trigger and You'll Make it Through
- Location
- SoCal
The real power of the Spartans was their AMAZING ability for self promotion.
So good people are still buying their bullshit thousands of years later.
stormbringer951
Against Eternity
That framing doesn't really capture the dynamic either. The Greek city states were small powers on the periphery of an Achaemenid empire an order of magnitude larger and richer, and both the Athenians and Spartans would solicit the aid of the western satraps during the Peloponnesian War, who eventually adopted a policy of divide and rule to prevent the rise of any regional power strong enough to encroach into Anatolia.
They decided to front ships and cash to build Sparta a fleet in the Peloponnesian War to weaken the Athenian empire (nee Delian League). This backfired horribly when the Spartans won, helped their backer the western satrap Cyrus in his unsuccessful bid for the throne, and then got real uppity about their own imperial ambitions in Ionia (partially to reclaim their own self-image as defenders of Greece). The western satraps then opened their purse strings to convince a coalition of Greek states unhappy with the status quo - Thebes, Corinth, Athens and Argos - to fight Sparta, and built Athens a new fleet with which to fight the previously Persian-built Spartan fleet. The Athenians smashed the Spartans, and immediately about-faced to try and rebuild their empire, so the Achaemenids splashed the cash again and built the Spartans another new fleet
, and managed to wrangle out the King's Peace, a favourable settlement between all the combatants of the Corinthian War where everyone agreed to play nice and keep their grubby mitts off Ionia.
- Location
- East Coast
That framing doesn't really capture the dynamic either. The Greek city states were small powers on the periphery of an Achaemenid empire an order of magnitude larger and richer, and both the Athenians and Spartans would solicit the aid of the western satraps during the Peloponnesian War, who eventually adopted a policy of divide and rule to prevent the rise of any regional power strong enough to encroach into Anatolia.
They decided to front ships and cash to build Sparta a fleet in the Peloponnesian War to weaken the Athenian empire (nee Delian League). This backfired horribly when the Spartans won, helped their backer the western satrap Cyrus in his unsuccessful bid for the throne, and then got real uppity about their own imperial ambitions in Ionia (partially to reclaim their own self-image as defenders of Greece). The western satraps then opened their purse strings to convince a coalition of Greek states unhappy with the status quo - Thebes, Corinth, Athens and Argos - to fight Sparta, and built Athens a new fleet with which to fight the previously Persian-built Spartan fleet. The Athenians smashed the Spartans, and immediately about-faced to try and rebuild their empire, so the Achaemenids splashed the cash again and built the Spartans another new fleet
Really sets the whole "Western civilization was saved" rhetoric in proper contrast to the reality, don't it?
I too remember the woeful year when Tsar Putin funded a navy of missile boats for the Republic of Texas to use in her interminable wars with the Dominate of New York and her vassal-states.
- Location
- East Coast
Or when the New Yorkers hanged the tyrants Texas appointed over them...
The only way you could compare Russia to the Persian Empire at that time, is if you only look at Eastern Europe and had no interference from Western Europe, or America. So the situation is obviously not identical.That framing doesn't really capture the dynamic either. The Greek city states were small powers on the periphery of an Achaemenid empire an order of magnitude larger and richer, and both the Athenians and Spartans would solicit the aid of the western satraps during the Peloponnesian War, who eventually adopted a policy of divide and rule to prevent the rise of any regional power strong enough to encroach into Anatolia.
They decided to front ships and cash to build Sparta a fleet in the Peloponnesian War to weaken the Athenian empire (nee Delian League). This backfired horribly when the Spartans won, helped their backer the western satrap Cyrus in his unsuccessful bid for the throne, and then got real uppity about their own imperial ambitions in Ionia (partially to reclaim their own self-image as defenders of Greece). The western satraps then opened their purse strings to convince a coalition of Greek states unhappy with the status quo - Thebes, Corinth, Athens and Argos - to fight Sparta, and built Athens a new fleet with which to fight the previously Persian-built Spartan fleet. The Athenians smashed the Spartans, and immediately about-faced to try and rebuild their empire, so the Achaemenids splashed the cash again and built the Spartans another new fleet
Tankette
Inquisitive 6-Year-Old Aunt
- Location
- Daikichi said to not tell strangers where I live
...oh, how I hate to live in that timeline.
I may be forced to root for the Yankees at gunpoint!
Meanwhile, the New Californian Republic is finishing up the unification of the Pacific Coast under a rather decent President. And his Speaker is even more brilliant and even more popular individual.
- Location
- East Coast
Yankee hate is such a silly thing to indulge in when you live with the Modern Era Red Sox.
They're having a poor season this year. This makes me happy.
Tankette
Inquisitive 6-Year-Old Aunt
- Location
- Daikichi said to not tell strangers where I live
The team I'm rooting for lives in the old-fashioned league know as the National League, so I really don't give a shit about the Red Soxs (except that we swept them a few days ago, so I'm delighted).
But fuck the Yankees and fuck the Mets.
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- Location
- East Coast
The Red Sox have won four World Series titles in the 21st century.
The Yankees have won one.
The Mets have won none.
Tankette
Inquisitive 6-Year-Old Aunt
- Location
- Daikichi said to not tell strangers where I live
Droman
𐤊𐤍𐤏𐤍
Well now I'm just wondering about an alternate history where Sparta is Antiquity! Starship Troopers style stratocracy, with service squalling citizenship.