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Taika Waititi to direct new Star Wars film

If the director takes some risks, does something new and sticks by his decisions then he will have tried, and that will be enough right now.

As for the whole "retcon the ST", it simply isn't possible in most media without doing even more damage than a bad run did. Comics are the exception, not the rule.
 
Arthur Frayn said:
...but you can do that anyway without erasing the ST
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I imagine more people want to play in a Star Wars future where Luke Skywalker succeeded in building a new and improved Jedi Order in a new and improved Republic.

Because people really liked Luke Skywalker, the hero who showed them they could succeed against the odds and win through forgiveness instead of hatred.

Then the sequel trilogy tells us that Luke accomplished nothing. He failed to defeat the emperor, the empire was immediately replaced with another empire, and he failed to make a new Jedi Order because he tried to do unto his nephew what he refused to do to his father.

Way to make people feel like their time was wasted on the original trilogy, if they had to wait for Rei Palpatine to come along and get anything done.


It doesn't matter how much money Disney spent on the Sequel Trilogy if the old fans just give up and stop paying for anything. The new fans sure as hell aren't buying the new toys, while the old toys still fly off the shelves, and Galaxy's Edge was a massive failure that they're already planning to change to reflect the original trilogy.
 
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Sunder the Gold said:
I imagine more people want to play in a Star Wars future where Luke Skywalker succeeded in building a new and improved Jedi Order in a new and improved Republic.

After the sequel trilogy, Luke accomplished nothing. He failed to defeat the emperor, the empire was immediately replaced with another empire, and he failed to make a new Jedi Order because he tried to do unto his nephew what he refused to do to his father.

Way to make people feel like their time was wasted on the original trilogy, if they had to wait for Rei Palpatine to come along and get anything done.
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I'm gonna be blunt - the odds of Disney deciding to just dump the film series that made them nearly $5 billion in box office returns alone (not to mention the billions more made from merchandising) because some fans didn't like the new films is zero. It's literally zero.

There is zero chance of Disney dumping the ST (again, a franchise that they spent a lot of money to develop and produce and made them billions and billions of dollars) to satisfy a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of fans who don't understand how the entertainment industry works.
 
Arthur Frayn said:


I'm gonna be blunt - the odds of Disney deciding to just dump the film series that made them nearly $5 billion in box office returns alone (not to mention the billions more made from merchandising) because some fans didn't like the new films is zero. It's literally zero.

There is zero chance of Disney dumping the ST (again, a franchise that they spent a lot of money to develop and produce and made them billions and billions of dollars) to satisfy a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a percentage of fans who don't understand how the entertainment industry works.
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I mean if they were willing to do that they would have decanonized and remade the prequels already.
 
Staff Notice: Please do not Spaghetti post.
Arthur Frayn said:
*cute image*
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That doesn't address a single point. You don't explain at all why fans of the original trilogy shouldn't be unhappy, or why they should care about anything built on the sequel trilogy.

You don't explain how a sequel that cheapens the original is a good sequel.


made them nearly $5 billion in box office returns alone
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But how much did it cost them to make (and remake, and remake, and remake, in the case of the last one) and market them?

Profit is the revenue left over after expenses. Expenses are what get you.


(not to mention the billions more made from merchandising)
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Why are toy companies backing away from producing more new trilogy merchandise if that stuff sells so well?

Do you remember how hilariously behind the ball Disney was with Baby Yoda toys? Entrepreneurs were making their own to sell to people. People DEMANDED those toys and couldn't get enough of them.


because some fans didn't like the new films
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And that's where you confuse "fans" with "people who just want to watch any movie to kill some time".

People who just watch movies aren't fans. They don't buy the merchandise. They don't visit the theme parks.

Fans are the core audience who keep a franchise alive between movies, and after the movies are over.

Disney didn't want the Star Wars fans. They wanted new fans. The merchandise sales and the figures for Galaxy's Edge reveal that they failed to find those new fans.
 
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Sunder the Gold said:
That doesn't address a single point. You don't explain at all why fans of the original trilogy shouldn't be unhappy, or why they should care about anything built on the sequel trilogy.



But how much did it cost them to make (and remake, and remake, and remake, in the case of the last one) and market them?

Profit is the revenue left over after expenses. Expenses are what get you.



Why are toy companies backing away from producing more new trilogy merchandise if that stuff sells so well?

Do you remember how hilariously behind the ball Disney was with Baby Yoda toys? Entrepreneurs were making their own to sell to people. People DEMANDED those toys and couldn't get enough of them.



And that's where you confuse "fans" with "people who just want to watch any movie to kill some time".

People who just watch movies aren't fans. They don't buy the merchandise. They don't visit the theme parks.

Fans are the core audience who keep a franchise alive between movies, and after the movies are over.

Disney didn't want the Star Wars fans. They wanted new fans. The merchandise sales reveal that they failed to find those new fans.
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I'm not saying that fans shouldn't be unhappy, I'm saying that Disney doesn't give a shit. Disney made money, the shareholders made money, everyone wins. Disney is a giant soulless megacorporation that could give less of a fuck about you outside of your wallet. You already paid to see the ST movies, they have your money, they could care less if you didn't like the films. Disney is so giant that even if the ST somehow lost money (which, again, it did not) they'd be fine because they have every other franchise on Earth.

And I'd like to see some actual numbers on "the ST didn't make money", preferably not from a YouTube video that blames it all on wonderful people or some shit.
 
Sunder the Gold said:
That doesn't address a single point. You don't explain at all why fans of the original trilogy shouldn't be unhappy, or why they should care about anything built on the sequel trilogy.
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If that's the actual argument you were having, why were you having it by arguing that Disney should decanonize the sequels?

Arguing that fans should be unhappy or that they shouldn't care about this Waititi-helmed film isn't the same thing as arguing that Disney should piss off everyone who did like the sequels, totally retheme Galaxy's Edge, partially but not entirely reboot the Star Wars films, scrap whatever sequel merch they have, re-wrangle any/all of the returning actors who probably don't want to do a whole new sequel trilogy (and probably some very fucking annoyed ST actors), and then sell a new sequel trilogy that we should invest in because they definitely won't just do that again, all to please the fans who are already so burned by Disney's handling of Star Wars as to be declaring that it's Ruined Forever and nothing built on Disney's work with the universe could ever be good.
 
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I don't want to get into another Star Wars debate, I've already broken one thing i said I'd try to lay off today, but in terms of net profits for each movie:

deadline.com

‘Star Wars: Rise Of Skywalker’ Lowest Profit Of Disney Trilogy Titles: No. 9 On Deadline’s 2019 Most Valuable Blockbuster Tournament

'Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker' see $300M profit, but it's the lowest next to 'Last Jedi' and 'Force Awakens'
deadline.com deadline.com

(Rise of Skywalker had a) $275M production cost and total global costs of $627M — versus Force Awakens ($259M production, $776.5M total) and Last Jedi ($200M production, $578.3M total). This resulted in net profits of $300M for Rise of Skywalker, which were lower than spinoff Rogue One: A Star Wars Story ($319.6M) but much better than Solo: A Star Wars Story which lost close to $77M. The last two Star Wars trilogy movies from Disney actually led Deadline's profit tournaments: Last Jedi in 2017 with $417.5M and Force Awakens in 2015 with a massive $780.11M.
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Honestly, this conversation seems to be something revolving around our larger media consumption in the modern age, more than anything, and that would be a genuinely interesting discussion to have. In a more relevant thread, of course.
 
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Lunatic350 said:
If that's the actual argument you were having, why were you having it by arguing that Disney should decanonize the sequels?

Arguing that fans should be unhappy or that they shouldn't care about this Waititi-helmed film isn't the same thing as arguing that Disney should piss off everyone who did like the sequels, totally retheme Galaxy's Edge, partially but not entirely reboot the Star Wars films, scrap whatever sequel merch they have, re-wrangle any/all of the returning actors who probably don't want to do a whole new sequel trilogy (and probably some very fucking annoyed ST actors), and then sell a new sequel trilogy that we should invest in because they definitely won't just do that again, all to please the fans who are already so burned by Disney's handling of Star Wars as to be declaring that it's Ruined Forever and nothing built on Disney's work with the universe could ever be good.
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Seriously, good luck explaining to Oscar Isaac or John Boyega's agent that actually Disney's done with them and that they won't be receiving any residuals moving forward. See how long it takes before every talent agency blackballs Disney for shredding contracts just like that.

Though, to be fair, agents are awful people so making their collective heads explode might be a good thing.
 
Marco said:
If the director takes some risks, does something new and sticks by his decisions then he will have tried, and that will be enough right now.

As for the whole "retcon the ST", it simply isn't possible in most media without doing even more damage than a bad run did. Comics are the exception, not the rule.
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Actually, Rebels already introduced time travel. So we can just have Rey travel back in time next film once Palpatine III shows up with his World Devastators and destroy the cloning tanks, preventing him from coming back to life in the first place and creating a new timeline.

We can have Abrams do it again, too, so we can bitch that he's ripping off his own Star Trek films.
 
Glassware said:
Actually, Rebels already introduced time travel. So we can just have Rey travel back in time next film once Palpatine III shows up with his World Devastators and destroy the cloning tanks, preventing him from coming back to life in the first place and creating a new timeline.

We can have Abrams do it again, too, so we can bitch that he's ripping off his own Star Trek films.
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Suzu said:
I heard at the end of this movie The Flash would run back to the past to prevent himself from saving his mother, thus resetting the universe :V
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Glassware said:
Actually, Rebels already introduced time travel. So we can just have Rey travel back in time next film once Palpatine III shows up with his World Devastators and destroy the cloning tanks, preventing him from coming back to life in the first place and creating a new timeline.

We can have Abrams do it again, too, so we can bitch that he's ripping off his own Star Trek films.
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Suzu said:
I heard at the end of this movie The Flash would run back to the past to prevent himself from saving his mother, thus resetting the universe :V
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I'm sure in the dark depths of the internet someone has seriously pitched this as an idea. But we must never open that box, it's just too silly.

Even for a campy 1970's space opera.
 
No, we just did the Dark Empire trilogy. Now we need to do one that's a bunch of straight milscifi but with giant ridiculous doomsday weapons. Then we do the Yuuzhan Vong. Then we do one where the hero of the YV trilogy goes evil, and then one where all the Jedi start going mad because of an evil space goddess-monster-thing.
 
Lunatic350 said:
No, we just did the Dark Empire trilogy. Now we need to do one that's a bunch of straight milscifi but with giant ridiculous doomsday weapons. Then we do the Yuuzhan Vong. Then we do one where the hero of the YV trilogy goes evil, and then one where all the Jedi start going mad because of an evil space goddess-monster-thing.
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Look, it's very simple. There is a singular element that we can use to tie all these stories together-one character that always recurs. The ultimate in political success stories.

Two-time dictator of the Corellian system Thrackan Sal-Solo.

It's perfect. Every trilogy he does something horrible and over-the-top evil, like threatening the lives of his infant nephews and niece live on holovision, or selling out to the insane BDSM aliens who whip people to death with snakes, or starting another galactic civil war for no apparent reason and getting Wedge Antilles on side somehow, and is defeated. Then in the next trilogy we reveal that he has once again managed to claw his way back up to relevance via what can only be described as political black magics, so we have a thread of continuity tying everything together.
 
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Sunder the Gold said:
I imagine more people want to play in a Star Wars future where Luke Skywalker succeeded in building a new and improved Jedi Order in a new and improved Republic.

Because people really liked Luke Skywalker, the hero who showed them they could succeed against the odds and win through forgiveness instead of hatred.

Then the sequel trilogy tells us that Luke accomplished nothing. He failed to defeat the emperor, the empire was immediately replaced with another empire, and he failed to make a new Jedi Order because he tried to do unto his nephew what he refused to do to his father.

Way to make people feel like their time was wasted on the original trilogy, if they had to wait for Rei Palpatine to come along and get anything done.


It doesn't matter how much money Disney spent on the Sequel Trilogy if the old fans just give up and stop paying for anything. The new fans sure as hell aren't buying the new toys, while the old toys still fly off the shelves, and Galaxy's Edge was a massive failure that they're already planning to change to reflect the original trilogy.
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You know it's funny, I've seen one fandom after another claim some entry into the series was the final straw and that they'll never return to the series, and yet they always come back. If Star Wars survived the twin body blows of The Phantom Menace and The Clone Wars I think that sort of proves that Star Wars fans will consume anything with the words "Star Wars" in the title.
 
Glassware said:
Look, it's very simple. There is a singular element that we can use to tie all these stories together-one character that always recurs. The ultimate in political success stories.

Two-time dictator of the Corellian system Thrackan Sal-Solo.

It's perfect. Every trilogy he does something horrible and over-the-top evil, like threatening the lives of his infant nephews and niece live on holovision, or selling out to the insane BDSM aliens who whip people to death with snakes, or starting another galactic civil war for no apparent reason and getting Wedge Antilles on side somehow, and is defeated. Then in the next trilogy we reveal that he has once again managed to claw his way back up to relevance via what can only be described as political black magics, so we have a thread of continuity tying everything together.
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And Harrison Ford can play him, it's a win-win.
 
VolantRedX said:
You know it's funny, I've seen one fandom after another claim some entry into the series was the final straw and that they'll never return to the series, and yet they always come back. If Star Wars survived the twin body blows of The Phantom Menace and The Clone Wars I think that sort of proves that Star Wars fans will consume anything with the words "Star Wars" in the title.
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Was a big fan, had the games, toys, even the tabletop rpgs. Still haven't seen the last two movies because that rehash of New Hope pissed me off so much.
 
Arawn_Emrys said:
Was a big fan, had the games, toys, even the tabletop rpgs. Still haven't seen the last two movies because that rehash of New Hope pissed me off so much.
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I never understood why people hated that. Like sure it was samey but why does that matter? So many people complain that TFA is a rip off of a New Hope but also claim to love A New Hope. I could understand if someone didn't like Star Wars and gave the new films a try but hated how similar it was, but I don't get people who say "This thing is similar to something I love, therefore it sucks".
 
VolantRedX said:
I never understood why people hated that. Like sure it was samey but why does that matter? So many people complain that TFA is a rip off of a New Hope but also claim to love A New Hope. I could understand if someone didn't like Star Wars and gave the new films a try but hated how similar it was, but I don't get people who say "This thing is similar to something I love, therefore it sucks".
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Because it showed that they had no intention of trying anything new, that what they planned was a supersafe paint by numbers cash grab. Which has been borne out by the 3rd film
 
Arawn_Emrys said:
Because it showed that they had no intention of trying anything new, that what they planned was a supersafe paint by numbers cash grab. Which has been borne out by the 3rd film
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But again if you like the old stuff why wouldn't you just want more of that? Like I'm not a fan of TFA simply because I'm not a fan of ANH. Especially since when Star Wars tries new things they're almost always terrible.
 
Because it invariably leads to inspired messes like ROS.

People don't know what they really want, not deep down.
 
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