Now You Feel Like Number None [Bleach Arrancar Quest]
- Thread starter Omicron
- Start date
- Users' Choice!
Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
Diomedea
A piece of the continent
- Location
- The interblag
- Pronouns
- She/Her
All the choices are about debt really. Nemo has a debt to all three. Yammy is suffering due to her actions, has she done enough to assuage her guilt there? Sun-Sun helped Cirruci and Nemo when she didn't have to, and Cirruci gave her word. Finally, Grimmjow's pack is injured because of Nemo's actions, because normally they would have been fixed up already. Nemo has made it so she is the only person in Los Noches who can help, and so she has a debt to pay out there.
How does she prioritize?
How does she prioritize?
Romv
A Memory of TREES
I want them all.
But, while there are some very good reasons not to take it, I can't not vote for Brujeria. I was disappointed when Omicron seemed to imply that we wouldn't be able to get it.
There's been talk about the Arrancar being disadvantaged compared to the Shinigami because they lack institutional knowledge, with Kido being a major example. Well, this is a possibility to do something about that. For now Brujeria is locked away in the minds of the Bestias, some nice tricks for a few Fraccions. It needs to spread to others for it to grow, and maybe one day become a tool for Arrancar society as a whole. And Nemo is trying to help build that society already.
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I was worried about including the mechanical benefits because I was afraid they would overshadow the whole "how do you affect other people" aspect of the vote, but ultimately it didn't seem fair to leave them unsaid and let you make the choice uninformed. But yes; whether you help complete the Sarcophagus, teach another Fraccion the Gran Rey, or help Grimmjow and put him in your debt, the impact is significant beyond just what you get out of it.
- Location
- somewhere over there.
- Pronouns
- They/It
Hmm. Ignoring the secondary benefits in parenthesis, we have interesting choices here. The growing friendship with whatever group is obvious, but there are also other effects. Teaching Sun-Sung means she has the gran rey for whatever fight the tres bestias are in, and probably wins it for them, possibly freeing them to tip the scales in another fight as well. Working with Szayel probably won't make what was once Yammy very much stronger, but perhaps it means that the Sarcophagus can be something that Nemo doesn't have to be ashamed of, something that doesn't tarnish the joy she takes in La Maranja. And healing Grimmy's pack means that they're at 100% and makes them far less likely to die because of something Nemo could have prevented. Personally, I favor teaching Sun-Sung, because I think offensive boosts to units are more effective than defensive ones in large-scale combat like this will be.
Then, we have the interpersonal effects. We can become closer to one of the three groups. I don't think buddying up to Szayel is quite as good as the other two, since between colaborating and Curruci's examinations he probably already likes us better than most anyone. Grimmy's group is on mildly good terms with us over all, and Luppi's doing his best to work on that, so while I think it's close, I'd again give Sun-Sung the edge here. We know Harribel is doing some soul searching because of all the changes going on from that canon omake about her looking at dead coral in a flooded cave, and she's already helped us once. In addition, while the Bestias like us she's much more ambivalent, so I feel like strengthening ties with her group is most helpful, and now is the perfect time for it.
Last, we have the shinies. The confirmed power-ups. Maranja is so tempting here, but we're already damn close on it. It hurts, but I think we have to take the unique opportunity here and buy this at the end of the arc as planned. Then, we have the healing supplies, which means that after our rendezvous with Ururu we can probably get Esmerelda to fix us. Which...yeah, that's the best payoff in this category. Buuuuuut...I wanna learn magic. It's not as useful as the healing supplies unless we somehow don't get the time to use them for another arc, but I do think the new skill still beats out the Maranja level. And as I said, freaking magic. How can I not vote for that?
Overall, I think that Szayel is the clear loser and whether we teach a snake to shoot doomlasers or heal the kitty's friends very nearly comes down to personal preference, though I'd say that Sun-Sung just barely edges out Grimmy, since they'll probably get Szayel to heal them if it's clear we won't get to it before the war. And I think that if learning magic is tempting, then the answer is pretty easy.
Then, we have the interpersonal effects. We can become closer to one of the three groups. I don't think buddying up to Szayel is quite as good as the other two, since between colaborating and Curruci's examinations he probably already likes us better than most anyone. Grimmy's group is on mildly good terms with us over all, and Luppi's doing his best to work on that, so while I think it's close, I'd again give Sun-Sung the edge here. We know Harribel is doing some soul searching because of all the changes going on from that canon omake about her looking at dead coral in a flooded cave, and she's already helped us once. In addition, while the Bestias like us she's much more ambivalent, so I feel like strengthening ties with her group is most helpful, and now is the perfect time for it.
Last, we have the shinies. The confirmed power-ups. Maranja is so tempting here, but we're already damn close on it. It hurts, but I think we have to take the unique opportunity here and buy this at the end of the arc as planned. Then, we have the healing supplies, which means that after our rendezvous with Ururu we can probably get Esmerelda to fix us. Which...yeah, that's the best payoff in this category. Buuuuuut...I wanna learn magic. It's not as useful as the healing supplies unless we somehow don't get the time to use them for another arc, but I do think the new skill still beats out the Maranja level. And as I said, freaking magic. How can I not vote for that?
Overall, I think that Szayel is the clear loser and whether we teach a snake to shoot doomlasers or heal the kitty's friends very nearly comes down to personal preference, though I'd say that Sun-Sung just barely edges out Grimmy, since they'll probably get Szayel to heal them if it's clear we won't get to it before the war. And I think that if learning magic is tempting, then the answer is pretty easy.
TheLurker
Random Omnipotent Lazy-As-Fuck Being
- Location
- The space beyond the stars
I really do care about tying up our debt to sung-sun, but...it is literally our fault grim's pack are so badly hurt and can't recover quickly, and there is a strong chance that they will literally die if they go into the coming fights injured. I think the tres will be fine, and I can only imagine what kind of soul-crushing guilt nemo will feel if the pack gets wiped out as a result of her choices.
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- Location
- Should be a bit higher
I hope that's a typo and you meant to say guts...
NSMS
Probably evil, unfortunately.
- Location
- A rapidly widening tear in the fabric of reality
Well, I think we actually gave Ichigo something to think about there. Showed him that no, things aren't quite cut and dried good versus evil here. Nice work with that, Omicron.
Onto the vote... Sung-Sun or the Grimmpack are both good options. We don't need to fulfil our debt to Sung-Sun immediately, but doing so would be a nice gesture and show that we're taking this seriously. People have also guessed at some of the additional effects it might have, and whilst I doubt all of them are true some of them probably are, or at least close to being. As for the Grimmpack, based on what Ilforte's said some of them won't be back on their feet without our aid for quite a while. And honestly, that's what decides it for me; restoring them to full strength greatly increases the chances of them surviving the war, we owe Ilforte for pulling our bacon out of the fire against Tessai, and we're the reason they can't get help without us.
Onto the vote... Sung-Sun or the Grimmpack are both good options. We don't need to fulfil our debt to Sung-Sun immediately, but doing so would be a nice gesture and show that we're taking this seriously. People have also guessed at some of the additional effects it might have, and whilst I doubt all of them are true some of them probably are, or at least close to being. As for the Grimmpack, based on what Ilforte's said some of them won't be back on their feet without our aid for quite a while. And honestly, that's what decides it for me; restoring them to full strength greatly increases the chances of them surviving the war, we owe Ilforte for pulling our bacon out of the fire against Tessai, and we're the reason they can't get help without us.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
The third appeals to me most.
It helps further break the isolation and ennui the Arrancar have had, helps us gain allies, and pushed us towards fixing our crippling. And it pays back having our life saved.
Number two can be acquired with XP, and number one, well, I think Sung-Sun would understand the priority.
Soooo...I'd say the talks went meh. As is, I'm not invested in Ichigo too much. Even without the fact that Lilynette obviously wasn't the right choice compared to the others, he's just not interesting. And I'd prefer a less somber get together.
It helps further break the isolation and ennui the Arrancar have had, helps us gain allies, and pushed us towards fixing our crippling. And it pays back having our life saved.
Number two can be acquired with XP, and number one, well, I think Sung-Sun would understand the priority.
Soooo...I'd say the talks went meh. As is, I'm not invested in Ichigo too much. Even without the fact that Lilynette obviously wasn't the right choice compared to the others, he's just not interesting. And I'd prefer a less somber get together.
- Location
- Inside my own head
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I would vote for Sung-Sun normally, but as I already said I really do not like leaving someone in crippling pain when we could change that soooo probably voting for what gets us possible heals. I guess I didn't vote for heals back with Szayel but I hated what he was doing and wanted nothing to do with it.
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Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
To be fair, it's not our fault that most of them got fucked up, only Illforte.
Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
You know, if you ever wanted to hype up the Primera Espada for the Alternate!Manga readers, this is how you'd do it.
Let's just hope the pay-off will be worth the hype for them as well. C:
... You know it strikes me that in the Cirucci's Saga alternate universe, Grimmjow is just about to bind several families to his side via various marriage alliances. Which is such an un-Grimmjow thing to do I can't help but crack up.
Or if she does it's solely for the dresses.
Now, as for the votes.
[ ] Complete Sung-Sun's training to master the Gran Rey. She helped save your life, and more than this, she has much to teach you in return - a simple gift of La Marana, and a sacrifice of time, and she might reveal to you some secrets of witchcraft. [Unlock Advanced Skill: Brujeria]
Much as I'd like to see the snake-laser, I don't think we can afford the opportunity cost of this. Getting low-level Brujeria is probably not going to help us much in the immediate future, and I'm not sure the Bestias' Chimera will be buffed much from the mastery of witchcraft that Sung-Sun gains from learning Gran Rey.
In short, the only Witchcraft I want Nemo to perform is the one where you use your illegal crafting skills to make tiny mod soul witches!
[ ] Bring your medical skills to Grimmjow and his pack. It is your fault that there is no more medic in Las Noches, and they could be powerful allies to both you and Cirucci, if they owed you this debt. [Leftover medical supplies will allow you to heal your lungs, once you find the time to get someone to operate on you.]
This on the other hand is very tempting. Not only are we getting our lungs cured, but we're also making sure that we get a full pack of pretty powerful Fraccion at their full strength, which will be useful when it comes to taking on the 13+Leutenants. It is probably the "correct" choice, but ultimately I think I'll have to go for something else.
[ ] Assist Szayel as he finishes crafting his terrible Sarcophagus. You have worked to make it less of an atrocity, but this is your chance to shape its final design, and to make the ever-necessary madman more fond of you. [Upgrade Advanced Skill: La Marana to Fourth Weave]
The Marana, it calls to me. I have no choice but to obey it's siren song...
Okay, seriously. My actual reasons for wanting this are four-fold:
Let's just hope the pay-off will be worth the hype for them as well. C:
And S.S. SnakeBull is still going strong.
... You know it strikes me that in the Cirucci's Saga alternate universe, Grimmjow is just about to bind several families to his side via various marriage alliances. Which is such an un-Grimmjow thing to do I can't help but crack up.
Unlike what Luppi previously suggested, it looks like Nemo does not in fact have a maid fetish.
Or if she does it's solely for the dresses.
Now, as for the votes.
[ ] Complete Sung-Sun's training to master the Gran Rey. She helped save your life, and more than this, she has much to teach you in return - a simple gift of La Marana, and a sacrifice of time, and she might reveal to you some secrets of witchcraft. [Unlock Advanced Skill: Brujeria]
Much as I'd like to see the snake-laser, I don't think we can afford the opportunity cost of this. Getting low-level Brujeria is probably not going to help us much in the immediate future, and I'm not sure the Bestias' Chimera will be buffed much from the mastery of witchcraft that Sung-Sun gains from learning Gran Rey.
In short, the only Witchcraft I want Nemo to perform is the one where you use your illegal crafting skills to make tiny mod soul witches!
[ ] Bring your medical skills to Grimmjow and his pack. It is your fault that there is no more medic in Las Noches, and they could be powerful allies to both you and Cirucci, if they owed you this debt. [Leftover medical supplies will allow you to heal your lungs, once you find the time to get someone to operate on you.]
This on the other hand is very tempting. Not only are we getting our lungs cured, but we're also making sure that we get a full pack of pretty powerful Fraccion at their full strength, which will be useful when it comes to taking on the 13+Leutenants. It is probably the "correct" choice, but ultimately I think I'll have to go for something else.
[ ] Assist Szayel as he finishes crafting his terrible Sarcophagus. You have worked to make it less of an atrocity, but this is your chance to shape its final design, and to make the ever-necessary madman more fond of you. [Upgrade Advanced Skill: La Marana to Fourth Weave]
The Marana, it calls to me. I have no choice but to obey it's siren song...
Okay, seriously. My actual reasons for wanting this are four-fold:
- We get 4th Weave Marana. I might've joked about it, but getting an additional magical item of this powerlevel is not nothing. I'd especially like to get this before the battlefield gets littered with powerful reagents that it'd take a master to coax the true potential out of. However, this is ultimately a minor point that could easily be delayed an arc, I just needed to say it out loud.
- We get to reduce Yammy's pain. We're directly responsible for his current situation, and I still kinda feel bad for the position he's in. He'll still feel pain once he gets deployed on the battlefield, but at least that's the sort of pain he can do something about!
- We get brownie points with Szayel. Let's be honest, once things settle after the Winter War there's going to be a Civil one amongst the Hollows, due to clashing ideologies if nothing else. And when that time comes we need as many allies as we can. All three options help with that, but we're already pretty good friends with both Grimmjow's gang and the Tres Bestias. I'd wager that they're still pretty likely to side with us even if we don't do this. Szayel on the other hand is much more selfish aligned. He would betray us if he felt it would benefit himself and as such we'd better make sure he doesn't want to. Because having a mad scientist who just unlocked the power of love on your side can only be an advantage.
- ... I really want to see the Sarcophagus' final form. I want to see just how much power can be squeezed out of that monstrosity and how powerful its blows will be.
And now to talk about the update. What i found very interesting about Lillynettes story is how much it seems to fit with what we know of Ulquiorras origin story.
At the beginning, there is a community of Hollows. Ulquiorra remembers them as Black beings, him being the only one different with his stark white skin. For both of them, their journey through the wastes of Hueco Mundo starts once they seperate themselves from that community - Ulquiorra recognises their struggle as pointless and simply walks away, Coyote unwittingly crushes them with its power. They wander for an indeterminate amount of time - an amount so vast it is meaningless.
Then they stop. Ulquiorra finds his Tree, and just... stops, attempting to become one with that tree, which he sees as perfect nothingness. Coyote stops, trying to supress its power into nothingness, and is found by Hollows that befriend it, only to end up killing them.
The similiarities are glaring, and the differences in their stories are clearly born from their personal themes - nothingness and nihilism for Ulquiorra, power and loneliness for Coyote.
This makes me wonder if the communities in the beginning, the wolves in their garden, the black hollows in their pit, aren't actually metaphors for the inhabitants of their Inner Worlds before they became Vasto Lorde. Maybe the act of achieving Vasto Lorde is to crush and utterly subsume the Menos component souls, fusing them together into a single horrific whole.
At the beginning, there is a community of Hollows. Ulquiorra remembers them as Black beings, him being the only one different with his stark white skin. For both of them, their journey through the wastes of Hueco Mundo starts once they seperate themselves from that community - Ulquiorra recognises their struggle as pointless and simply walks away, Coyote unwittingly crushes them with its power. They wander for an indeterminate amount of time - an amount so vast it is meaningless.
Then they stop. Ulquiorra finds his Tree, and just... stops, attempting to become one with that tree, which he sees as perfect nothingness. Coyote stops, trying to supress its power into nothingness, and is found by Hollows that befriend it, only to end up killing them.
The similiarities are glaring, and the differences in their stories are clearly born from their personal themes - nothingness and nihilism for Ulquiorra, power and loneliness for Coyote.
This makes me wonder if the communities in the beginning, the wolves in their garden, the black hollows in their pit, aren't actually metaphors for the inhabitants of their Inner Worlds before they became Vasto Lorde. Maybe the act of achieving Vasto Lorde is to crush and utterly subsume the Menos component souls, fusing them together into a single horrific whole.
Gonna go with third, husbandos!
Yeah, I did mean to talk about how amazing the update was. It just couldn't be done justice in a small post, so I gotta wait until my break at least.
Diomedea
A piece of the continent
- Location
- The interblag
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I actually really wonder how this discussion will impact Ichigo. The culmination of the canon Los Noches arc was Ichigo turning into a thing to protect Orihime, and nearly turned on his friends that he wanted to protect (Sorry about the hand, Ishida). How will this refine and change Ichigo's pursuit of power, and his self-sacrificial tendencies towards that? I really want to see in his head again.
I mean, the point about him being uninteresting isn't something I can contest, but I honestly don't think we could have gotten a better reaction from him than we did. Recognizing that his enemies are only such because circumstance forces them to fight the side he is forced into, and are essentially in the exact same position as him, may not be that unusual in real life, but to a shonen main character? He may hesitate when fights happen, and I'd say he's even likely to show mercy when he has the chance, both in his personal fights and in what little influence he has institutionally.
Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
Honestly, that's actually one of the things that speaks against that option for me.
If they're barely on their feet, it means the Shinigami can afford to overlook them and in the War there will be plenty of more threatening targets they need to deal with before they go for crippled Fraccions.
Gargulec
impact!
- Location
- a garden
Counter-point!
You know me. I've been campaigning for Marana for as long as it's been an option. I've been always on the tailor's side. But here's the thing. The 350 or so of XP is something that is going to get dumped into it sooner rather than later anyway, and the work on Sarcophagus is high enough priority for Szyael (and Nemo, too) that whether now or later, it will be finished. Meanwhile, Brujeria is a far more unique opportunity and one that opens up enormous possibilities for growth both in Marana and Szyael's mad science.
Just think of the possible weaves that also incorporate witchcraft principles into them! It is going to be wild. And now is the chance to get it.
... I'm not sure Grimmjow's pack are the type to allow themselves to be overlooked, even if still injured.
Counter-Counter-Point!
We have been crippled for a while and with the third option we can heal the Grim crew and get to see Esmerelda again, because before supplies were the only thing holding us back.
Just think if we do this less of a need to throw stuff into HSR.
We have been crippled for a while and with the third option we can heal the Grim crew and get to see Esmerelda again, because before supplies were the only thing holding us back.
Just think if we do this less of a need to throw stuff into HSR.
Urghhh
[] Complete Sung-Sun's training to master the Gran Rey. She helped save your life, and more than this, she has much to teach you in return - a simple gift of La Marana, and a sacrifice of time, and she might reveal to you some secrets of witchcraft. [Unlock Advanced Skill: Brujeria]
I am very very tempted by healing the Grimjow band because warm and fuzzy feelings and civilization and Nemo being a medic pleases me
[] Complete Sung-Sun's training to master the Gran Rey. She helped save your life, and more than this, she has much to teach you in return - a simple gift of La Marana, and a sacrifice of time, and she might reveal to you some secrets of witchcraft. [Unlock Advanced Skill: Brujeria]
I am very very tempted by healing the Grimjow band because warm and fuzzy feelings and civilization and Nemo being a medic pleases me
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NSMS
Probably evil, unfortunately.
- Location
- A rapidly widening tear in the fabric of reality
Not sure about his pack, but Grimmkitty himself definitely isn't going to let some injuries keep him out of things.
Omegahugger
Inattentive Idiot
One thing to consider regarding the Grimmjow vote.
When it comes to someone else performing surgery on Nemo, she really only has two choices: Szayel and Esmeralda. And once she visits Esmeralda in the real world to get healed, there's pretty much no way she won't try to warn her about the literal warzone that Karakura Town is about to become. And when Nemo does that, it means that the Fullbringers will not just know that a war is coming (as they already do), but also when it is. Meaning thhey will be fully capable of interfering with however they please.
I honestly have no idea whether this is an argument in favour of or against going for healing.
The Octava needs some humblemoth in his work.
When it comes to someone else performing surgery on Nemo, she really only has two choices: Szayel and Esmeralda. And once she visits Esmeralda in the real world to get healed, there's pretty much no way she won't try to warn her about the literal warzone that Karakura Town is about to become. And when Nemo does that, it means that the Fullbringers will not just know that a war is coming (as they already do), but also when it is. Meaning thhey will be fully capable of interfering with however they please.
I honestly have no idea whether this is an argument in favour of or against going for healing.
That doesn't really help much when the "later" means "after the war". And that's assuming that Szayel won't just declare it perfected before it technically is, like he did with himself during the battle with Mayuri.
The Octava needs some humblemoth in his work.
I strongly disagree there. Low level Kido is full of utility effects, and Nemo lives and dies on her utility effects and her tricks.
Nemo is a Trick Type. She's reliant on having more things up her sleeve, things her opponent hasn't seen before - and she's shown a lot of her hand against Ururu, Orihime and Tatsuki. They know about the nightmare beam, they know about slowing Bala, and they know about pretty much everything she has apart from the Gran Rey and the Resurrecion. And both of them are high power tricks Nemo hates pulling out casually. They're things she can only use when she's willing to kill an opponent. And they're also things she can only use once a fight.
Brujeria is the grab-bag of tricks Nemo needs to keep herself fresh and interesting to the manga readers.
Also, uh, Sung-Sun with the Gran Rey has a high power attack and two people who can protect her while she charges it up. Yes, the self-mastery is one part (if that's the paradigm she uses for it), but it's also a nuclear snek beam.
But maybe it's the self mastery that's most interesting.
Because if self-mastery is a thing, remember what Ilforte did when he evolved his sense of self. He came to find something beyond envying his brother, he defined himself as part of his pack. And look at what Nemo is about and what Sung-Sun was talking about. She's cynical, she's hope-less, she doesn't believe things can be better. But Nemo doesn't believe that, and Sung-Sun calls it naive, but if Nemo's going to be teaching her then the teacher influences the student.
If Number None works by shoujo rules rather than shounen rules, then if Nemo teaches Sung-Sun and helps her hope again and grow to become more than a cynical bitchy snake, then that's got a good chance of winning Sung-Sun her self-actualisation. And then not only does that mean that Illfote/Sung-Sun is HMS Self Actualisation, but it'll be a vector for the personal growth to the Tres Bestias.
... and hey, isn't that exactly what Harribel has been looking for?