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[MAFIA] The Aethereal Concordant

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Sorry Rosen. You deserve better. The game was lots of fun mechanically, the flavor was cool enough to be interesting separate from the game, and you handled do many crises smoothly.

Also, I want to tell everyone I love them, but that is possibly because my eyes are floating on a magical ocean of nyquil.
 
I really had no idea 1K was the jailer, and it really didn't occur to me to swap Cyri.
 
I guess I don't need to finish that post now... Should I share what I have of it so far anyways?
 
Well I was on dot about Nani and Ondine, Meso was a big wine question for me pre-game end but I figured if Nani/Terra was scum it could more safely determine Meso being scum...But I also couldn't voice that as that would have killed the wine of them not killing me.

InterstellarHobo said:
But I fucked up by being too eager.
My reasoning wasn't even wrong, and I was being entirely honest in my defence (replace 'was suspicious of' with 'was planning to fake suspicion of'), but the way I approached it was blatantly out of character.
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Agreed, you jumped too quick and too loosely. you'd likely have avoided major attention otherwise.

On a unrelated note to the events of the game I did love reading the flavor @-Rosen and I think the game was pretty fun despite the mass replacements and the issues that happened.
 
Nictis said:
Oh right, forgot for a second that Terra was the maf Nani replaced.

Sorry for making the game unpleasant, just... I can't drop when I know I've got scum.
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No, you were fine, that is how the game is played and I shouldn't have kvetched.

It mostly bugged me that I felt like I had answers to most of your points, but I couldn't concentrate well enough to get them across. I shouldn't have taken it out on you and I sincerely apologise.
 
Terrabrand tried to tell me to play like I was town and to quit trying to be tactical, but I didn't wise up and really start doing that in earnest until day 3.

I thought I would get more towncred for trying to help Absum than I did. I also legit thought Nictis was third party not town.
 
I feel like a lot of stupidity happened between you two because Nictis assumed that every player on a team with a Twin must be a Twin, and Meso did not.

And then that got bickered over, and arguments were assumed to be bad faith rather than confused, and nobody stopped to clarify that point.
 
mesonoxian said:
Terrabrand tried to tell me to play like I was town and to quit trying to be tactical, but I didn't wise up and really start doing that in earnest until day 3.

I thought I would get more towncred for trying to help Absum than I did. I also legit thought Nictis was third party not town.
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You were going pretty hard on pushing that Absum was Town, and if you had left it at that it would have been less strange than revealing as a Transporter. You had signaled it to Absum, which would have been enough for a future claim and an explanation for why you were sure that he was Vig.

The Fatmo situation absolutely reeked of bussing, but there was a risk in the scenario where it wasn't and we lynch wrong.

As for you and ondine... You both went to bat for each other way too much. You two repeatedly defended the other or started shading people who were scumreading the other.
 
Also, @Fatmo deserves some appreciation. He subbed in to a doomed roles, played it to the hilt, and probably bought us another day off that solid performance.

He wasn't actually absent at EoD, but stayed out of the thread because the vote was close and he'd have no excuse not to vote for me.

Nictis said:
You were going pretty hard on pushing that Absum was Town, and if you had left it at that it would have been less strange than revealing as a Transporter. You had signaled it to Absum, which would have been enough for a future claim and an explanation for why you were sure that he was Vig.

The Fatmo situation absolutely reeked of bussing, but there was a risk in the scenario where it wasn't and we lynch wrong.

As for you and ondine... You both went to bat for each other way too much. You two repeatedly defended the other or started shading people who were scumreading the other.
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I thought I was avoiding that but apparently not.
 
I figured Absum would out me as a transporter when I survived, so I might as well get out in front of it.

Next time I roll scum I will do things differently.
 
Alright, so there are a lot of things I want to cover, so I want to just jump right into it. Points alternate between indented and not indented for slightly easier viewing.
  • First and foremost, this community is not large enough to be able to host 20+ player games consistently yet. It was an outlier with Arch Fiend that we were able to get as many players as we did, and it was certainly an anomaly here that I was able to get four people to replace into a game that already had 21 players. Future GMs, for your own sanity, please do not do this.
    • In general, I think the general toxicity exhibited in this game was far more apparent than in past games, and I think everyone can agree with me there, as it has taken up a lot of space on SVMC. While I fear potential weaponizing of reports under harsher control of the thread, I do believe something should be done to ensure both fairness and consistency on this issue where it needs to be addressed.
  • So the "Role Cop" was a mistake on my part; I knew what I had in mind given the setup, and that was, in fact, a Power Cop, but I couldn't put a name to it at the start so ended up just calling it Role Cop instead. I wanted a situation where these roles could figure out information about players without giving a hard "this is their alignment" indicator. I'm very much an advocate of more advanced Day play, having seen just about everything when it comes to Night play, so I didn't want multiple roles that could potentially out scum without doing much else (Watcher was the role that I intended for that purpose, and is fairly weak as a scum hunter in the grand scheme of things, despite it producing results this game).
    • There were. . . honestly a lot of logical clusaterfucks that happened throughout this game, most of which I think could be simplified into points where they conveys the same message, but with a lot fewer words. Looking at mainly the stuff meso had to defend in this game, I think it became unnecessarily difficult for him once the logic started getting really out there (and this was noted throughout the game in the Observer channel, if you care at all to go and look).
  • Here's where I get to factional thoughts; I'll start with Town here. Frankly, you guys got a lot of big breaks, which all started with the Hobo vote on Day 1. I think popping both Twins on D2/3 was a bit of a misplay, as it actually led to a potentially very bad situation for you guys before the GM-kill, where you probably would have ended up losing. Though at the same time, leaving TMR alive Day 3 comes with its own risks, and as many have pointed out, I don't think trying to control a killer on the third Night is a very good move, as there are just too many uncertainties to deal with in a game that still has over half its players. I would have agreed with the reasoning around, say, Day 6 or so, where the board would be much easier to manipulate due to fewer pieces being present.
    • Dear Twins. . . wow that was really rough. Overall I think the Pawn vote on Day 2 was a bit questionable at best, even if the TMR vote was significantly more justified. Overall it's unfortunate that they were eliminated so soon, and that I can't really talk about them that much.
  • Despite the Mafia's position early in the game, losing their Role Blocker after the Day 1 vote, I think you guys had a lot of good stuff happening, that all just got kinda washed away by the GM-kill. Before that, I honestly feel like you guys would have ended up winning based on the progression you had. Nanimani was in a decent spot to win the game outright if ondine and meso were to go down, meso had become a big question mark as to whether it's even worth trying to kill him or not, and ondine was in a position to be able to suggest better targets for a Day vote to avoid her own death. The GM-kill basically ensured that all of those things could not happen, and largely attributes to the game ending early.
    • I feel like this needs clarification since it was a pretty prevalent subject in this game, but my Third-Party color does not necessarily mean that Third-Party roles are of the same faction. Perhaps I could do to make some distinction between different roles, but generally I do not make Third-Party an overarching faction of its own, rather a collection of roles with win conditions that do not fully match Town or Mafia.
  • This point is for @tootitorbootit specifically, as I want to stress not to let that whole situation get to you too much. Everything is a learning experience, and I really hope it's something you can take away and learn from for the future, rather than seeing it as a reason not to try forum Mafia again. I think if you learn the ropes here, you'll have a lot of fun with it!
Might possibly have more, but this is what comes to mind so far. I also have a couple questions for everyone who participated, if you don't mind responding:
  • How did you feel about the overall game balance? Do you think it was skewed toward one alignment, or do you think everyone had feasibly equal odds from the start?
  • How did you feel about the flavor of the game? I try to be a lot more immersive about the things I write in relation to the game, so I'd love to see your feedback on it!
 
mesonoxian said:
Terrabrand tried to tell me to play like I was town and to quit trying to be tactical, but I didn't wise up and really start doing that in earnest until day 3.

I thought I would get more towncred for trying to help Absum than I did. I also legit thought Nictis was third party not town.
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If I had to identify the two big things that made me go from mostly neutral to Sus of you, it would be your interactions with Nictis and with Fatmo. For the former, not so much the argument as the insistance that there was a third twin; from where I was standing, that didn't seem even remotely plausible, and gave me the impression that legit thoughts or not you were clearly coming at this from an entirely seperate angle than I was.

The rest of your plays with Nictis also mattered, but mostly only in how they played into your actions with Fatmo. It was clear that the only way Fatmo could possibly be town was if you were also scum, and you not acting like you were convinced they were scum pretty much sealed it for me; sure, you said you were, but the rest of your posting did not bear it out.
 
TL;DR for last post - If you're gonna read anything, read the last two bullet points!
 
tootitorbootit said:
Oh thanks for not totally hating me! I felt like such a fool and am so sorry I didn't properly learn the rules!!!!
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Thanks for coming out to play with us. Sorry it went awry. This game is complicated and it is easy to misunderstand things or just forget.

In the last game I nearly posted my notes to the thread, with a list of who suspected each of my team mates at the top.

@-Rosen I loved the fiction. The only downside is that I didn't get to mention I was a mass transit, or "I'm a train" memes. Like I legit cared about the characters separate from the game, and I wanted to win because I was rooting for the President and the Seperatist characters.

As far the mechanics went, they seemed good to me from what I could see.
 
Honestly, I don't think the GM kill mattered so much. Like, if Tootiforbit had made that claim without the GM confirm, Nanimani would have been in a lot of trouble. There was already some stuff suspicious about them that had mostly only been able to avoid by being the only cop claim; the moment that vanished, their situation was a lot worse.
 
-Rosen said:
  • How did you feel about the overall game balance? Do you think it was skewed toward one alignment, or do you think everyone had feasibly equal odds from the start?
  • How did you feel about the flavor of the game? I try to be a lot more immersive about the things I write in relation to the game, so I'd love to see your feedback on it!
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The flavor was absolutely amazing, but whenever I first saw it I largely just sorta... blanked out and moved on. It couldn't play in the game, and aside from joking about Cyricubed's role I couldn't really use it for fun, so it just wasn't very relevant. It's good writing, and I imagine for the people who get immersed it was really neat, but personally I just didn't care quite as much, being more mechanically inclined.

Was fun to go over in the downtime, but otherwise I largely ignored it.

As for balance... There was a lot of protection, and I'm not really sure what the point of an Arbitrator really is? Arb wouldn't have info separate from the thread to act on, unless if they got informed by the Jailer, so all they could really do is disagree with one of Town's few kills and stop it, which would work as a pseudo proofing for them but otherwise didn't seem like it'd be all that useful. For protection, we had a Jailer that acted before the Transporter, a Doctor, and a Watcher, which covers basically every angle. Plus the two bulletproof vests the Twins had.

There was not a lot of kills in play, with the Twins only getting to kill if one of them dies and the Vig being limited shot, but there were a lot of protection sources.

Power Cops. I honestly really like the role, it serves better for Day play than a normal cop, and makes it a bit more fun to puzzle things out instead of the binary check you get from a normal Cop result. On the Mafia side, it's more powerful than a Tracker for picking out targets. The issue here is that having both only really served to make the Mafia Power Cop be counter claimed by the Town Power Cop. And... Two Mafia were immune to the Power Cop? The Mafioso would be shown as Vanilla, and the Godfather would be shown as Vanilla as well, despite actually having an ability.

Mayor + Jailer with a Quick Topic remains a really powerful combo, with both being confirmed Town and the Mayor keeping votes off of the Jailer. Add in the Arbitrator that can confirm itself by canceling a lynch on itself... That's a lot of confirmed and nearly confirmed Town.
 
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