Given how linked Rinoa is to her dog, maybe her dog is able to Junction GFs and Rinoa benefits from that. (monsters come from the moon wolves howl at the moon dogs are related to wolves is this dog a monster from the moon)
Let's Play Every Final Fantasy Game In Order Of Release [Now Finished: Final Fantasy Tactics]
- Thread starter Omicron
- Start date
- Let's Play
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
That's kind of interesting. On a quick skim, I don't see Selphie explicitly saying "I'm from Trabia Garden", but the dialogue does proceed on the assumption that everyone (both in-universe and players) already knows.
For example, when the party members are talking about how Galbadia Garden is quiet, Selphie says "It's a different atmosphere to Trabia and Balamb Garden". So it's again only an implication, albeit a strong one, that Selphie is from Trabia Garden and thus knows what it's usually like.
I like the (unattributed) NPC who notes that sorceresses have, until now, only existed in history books, and is wondering whether all of this will be on the exam.
The Japanese script has a curious distinction between "rumours" and "statements", ie stuff that is explicitly labelled as "rumours", and stuff that the NPCs state as though they are facts. I'm not sure how significant this is, since a lot of the "statements" could be implied to be rumours as well.
Rumours:
- The sorceress is living in Galbadia's capital city.
- The sorceress wants to claim Galbadia Garden.
- The events at the Timber TV Station may have involved a student of Garden.
- The power of sorceresses may be inheritable through some secret unknown means.
- The visiting SeeDs look like they get poor grades.
Statements:
- The sorceress is using President Deling to try to conquer the world. The speaker does speculate that there may be some question of who is manipulating whom.
- The sorceress has the ability to brainwash others. This is something the speaker has been taught in class, but they do ask us if this is actually true.
So there seems to be some difference between "this is what we have heard", ie rumours spreading organically, and "this is what we have been told", ie information given from those in authority.
Given the taught knowledge of the sorceress mind control, though, it confirms the biggest surprise blindsiding the Gardens (and the world in general) was the existence of the sorceress at all, rather than the sorceress's capabilities. I wouldn't be surprised if the strategists in Garden were desperately digging up all the old histories and records for any clues on countermeasures. It's one thing to know "sorceresses can brainwash people", and another to need a way to prevent that right now.
Which is a bit of an odd translation choice, likely due once again to the lack of subject in Japanese grammar. It's probably more like "I'm too old to be playing cards", since according to the Japanese script site, the other two people in the room are busy discussing card power levels: "character cards" are strongest, "GF cards" are second-strongest. Well, "discuss" might be too generous, since they're just stating it for the sake of the player.
Maybe "We're too old to play cards" is that NPC scolding the others, rather than a statement of consensus.
Okay, this might be a case of outright mistranslation, but I'd need confirmation of context to be sure.
The line itself is such, copy-and-pasted from the script site:
The part that caused confusion is モンスター軍団 ("monster gundan"). The first part, モンスター, is straightforwardly "monster" in katakana. The second part, 軍団, means "military unit" ("army corps" for a generic translation).
So "monster gundan" would, if taken in isolation and literally, mean "a military unit of monsters".
But I've seen it used in other contexts to mean "a military(-esque) unit created to handle monsters". As in hunting and subjugating monsters, like a specialized anti-monster unit. I've completely forgotten if such units are a known thing in the FFVIII setting, so I can't be sure which meaning is intended.
That line would be "Did you know about the hockey team formed by the Monster Corps? Our team will be facing them soon, but I don't know if we'll be fine. They seem like a team that would produce corpses if fought."
So the interpretation could go either way. The one that has Deep Implications for worldbuilding is this is a combat unit made of literal monsters, who have formed (or been asked to form) a hockey team, and everyone is worried about their ferocity even in sports.
The other interpretation is more boring, which is this is a combat unit assigned to deal with monsters, and they formed a hockey team, and everyone is still worried about their ferocity even in sports.
Interestingly, the Japanese script names Deling City, rather than Galbadia in general, as the primary "great power of the west". ("Power nation" is indeed the literal translation, but these days I think "great power" is a better term.)
Timber and Winhill are "under the administration of" Deling City/Galbadia, which is a bit more explicit than "affiliated with". It's still not using words like "conquer" and "subjugate", so I agree that it's a pointed polite fiction.
The "kinda hard to explain" is probably the translator's best attempt at 微妙 ("bimyou"), which itself is, well, kind of hard to explain. It means the kind of fuzzy, uncertain feeling that can be verbalized as "subtle", "iffy", "doubtful", "complex", "complicated", and "hard to explain". It's like the proverbial "It's Complicated" relationship status, which does describe the relationship between Galbadia and Galbadia Garden quite well.
"I hear it's one of those under-the-table, sketchy deals, though."
This is a bit of a mistranslation.
The term used for "Master" (of the Garden) is the katakana マスター. The term used for "Headmaster" is the kanji 学園長. This has been fairly consistent in the Japanese text.
The Japanese script says the Master of Galbadia Garden and Master of Balamb Garden have been corresponding, which is probably what the "business relationship" part is about. The latter part is accurate, about how there seems to be some sort of "shady correspondence" as well.
The bit which might have caused the confusion is we don't know how this applies to Galbadia Garden. When Quistis went to report on the events in Timber, she says she's meeting the Headmaster. But later, when the party is asked to assemble at Galbadia Garden's gate, she says the Master is meeting them there, who turns out to be Martine.
So I don't know if Martine is the Headmaster (not stated in the dialogue, but might be in UI text), the Master, or both positions in the same person. The translator might have assumed "Master" and "Headmaster" were the same thing, but earlier in content like the Balamb Garden classroom computer we saw that they were distinct, so it might be an oversight here.
It's one of the bits of FFVIII I still remember clearly to this day. Rinoa acts a beat behind the trained SeeDs, and then has to sneakily peek at the others to check that she did it correctly.
I assume Martine absolutely spotted this, but either felt it was not important enough to comment upon, or thought Rinoa was just a very poor SeeD.
Irvine calls them "bumpkins"/"rural", so he's not only insulting the party, he's insulting Balamb too. I can totally understand Zell's reaction, given he's from Balamb.
Not only does Irvine boast of not failing, he says "Don't worry" in English for extra "attempted cool" points.
Also out of interest, did the English translation give the same details as the Japanese text for the plan? As in Squall explaining their immediate orders, which are to head to Deling City and make contact with a certain person (named in the text) for further specific orders. I want to make sure the name is also in the English dialogue, so I know I'm not inadvertently spoiling, since I only have the Japanese script to go by.
We're, what, three or four updates into Galbadia, and no mention of the Wendigo? Not content with being an ugly looking enemy with way too much HP that has a valuable crafting material locked behind a minuscule drop rate...they also decided to give it one of the funniest special attacks in FF history.
EDIT: that should be the proper link now.
EDIT: that should be the proper link now.
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- Location
- Spain
So Wendigos can't blow up the moon? Dissapointing.
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
That's interesting; there's little indication in the EN dialogue that people thought Sorceresses didn't exist, rather it just emphasizes that little is known about them beyond the fact that they exist; there's reference to a Sorceress's War and students being afraid of it repeating now that a new sorceress has appeared.
Unfortunately, that student's line is the only reference to these monster gundan, so until and unless we meet them (they could serve as a combat encounter later on), it's our best guess which is the more accurate.
This is actually answered way back at the beginning of the game in the desktop informationals: "Galbadia Garden's master, Martine, who is also the headmaster, has setup a program to recruit Balamb graduates into the Galbadian army."
...okay so I totally misread that at the beginning of the game. I thought this said 'recruit Garden graduates into the Galbadian army, as in, graduates from Galbadia Garden go on to the Galbadian army. That's not the case at all; rather, Martine has set up a system to recruit SeeDs into the Galbadian army?
This changes the dynamics I'd assumed were at play in a weird way. Not sure what to make of it yet.
Yes; Squall says "We're going to head to the capital of Galbadia, Deling City. There, we'll meet up with General Caraway to go over the details for the plan."
I didn't mention it at the time because it gives us so little information about who Caraway is (is he a Galbadian general working on a palace coup or a foreigner doing a covert op?) but later dialogue we'll get to in the next update clarifies that Caraway is indeed a Galbadian General.
This is the funniest attack of all time, my God.
...
I was going to insert a picture of Gotenks's Ultra Buu Buu Volleyball attack from DBZ as a gag here, but attempting to Google a picture of it has just resulting in me getting increasingly angry at the enshittification of GIS, and now I'm just mad. So you'll have to imagine a clever reference here for yourselves.
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- Location
- Canada, probably
Ah, Google image search. Back in my day, it would either give you what you wanted, or basically nothing. Now it always gives you a bunch of random shit, and if you're very lucky, what you actually want will be buried in that shit.
Also, that animation is indeed peak comedy. But… maybe this is just my paranoia talking… 35 minutes is a pretty long compilation of the same animation. So it's 35 minutes of a young woman (almost always Selphie, the youngest) being transformed, and then used against other two young women. Feels maybe just a little bit fetishy. But again, maybe that's just paranoid.
Also, that animation is indeed peak comedy. But… maybe this is just my paranoia talking… 35 minutes is a pretty long compilation of the same animation. So it's 35 minutes of a young woman (almost always Selphie, the youngest) being transformed, and then used against other two young women. Feels maybe just a little bit fetishy. But again, maybe that's just paranoid.
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I resisted posting this at first, but you had to bring the evil out, leaving me no choice.
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'm going to quote the wiki on General Caraway.
Also worth noting: never mentioned in game but in the files and mentioned in the Ultimania, Caraway's given name is Fury. Colonel Fury [Caraway].
Methinks there was a Marvel fan at 90s Squaresoft, which is actually impressively westaboo for 1998.
Also worth noting: never mentioned in game but in the files and mentioned in the Ultimania, Caraway's given name is Fury. Colonel Fury [Caraway].
Methinks there was a Marvel fan at 90s Squaresoft, which is actually impressively westaboo for 1998.
- Location
- Lake Wobegon
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Well, you might notice a pattern.
As for Caraway's name, he is from the country which produced Ragna LaWar. There seems to be a pattern at play there as well.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I think it has to do with how, like, genuine their friendship seems to be? When I think of a "Disciplinary Team," my first thought is a bunch of power-tripping narcs, but these guys are nothing like that. They all seem legitimately fond of each other, which is kind of impressive given how Seifer is.
Like, I want to know the story behind these nerds. We know Seifer was assigned there as a way to learn a lesson, but what about Fujin and Raijin? Were they also assigned there, and they bonded over being singled out? Or did those two join willingly, and Seifer impressed them somewhere down the line? What is their dynamic when it's just the three of them, and Seifer isn't putting up a front for the people he disdains?
I'm a little upset VII is the one that got all the spinoff material, because I'd pay good money to see more of the Disciplinary Team doing whatever the hell it is they do. Give me their friendship origin story at least. And yeah, I saw Fujin's eyepatch in this update, she's got the character design chops to be a costar.
C'mon Squeenix I need to you to go make a spinoff of a PSX Final Fantasy game for me, specifically, get to it.
Egleris
Vagrant Dragon
- Location
- Italy
That does seems an interesting coincidence, doesn't it.
- In other notes from the Italian translation, I can confirm that Caraway is a colonel in the game.
- Also, the PC in the Italian version says about Galbadia Garden "it has a program to enlist Garden graduates into the Galbadian Army"; there's nothing specifically indicating that it would be Balamb graduates, so, given the context, I would expect that it's Galbadia Garden graduates who are funneled into the army, since that makes more sense to me.
- As mentioned by others, the man who is both Headmaster and "Garden Master" for Galbadia Garden is called Dodonn in Italian, not Martin.
- The Italian translation goes with the "you heard that the monsters have a team?" interpretation for that particular line, with no reference to any monster-hunting squad, so I'm inclined to agree that the idea here is that they have actual monsters playing hockey.
- Before the discussion about Seifer, Rinoa has a perplexing line saying "so Quistis studied here?", which seems to conflict with established information; I'm not sure if this is an incorrect translation, or just Rinoa misunderstanding Quistis previous explanation of why she had some knowledge of the local administration.
- As far as changes go, there's not that many, but Quistis does says "I guess I'm no good at comforting people" rather than her more neutral comment of "that wasn't much comfort, I suppose", which is a point of characterization consistent with her berating herself from before.
- Another interesting note is when Rinoa comments about Seifer; instead of the vague "I wonder how he felt" from English, her line is a much more pointed "I wonder what he thought about me", specifically. Then, when Selphie asks "do you still love him?", which is a substantially stronger declaration in Italian than the English "like" (you don't really throw "love" around in Italian, not even with family, you'd generally use "I adore this thing" or "I care deeply for this person" if you weren't talking about a romantic partner), instead of the English "I wouldn't talk about this if I wasn't", she's way less determined, saying "I'm not sure", before seguing into the "I was sixteen, last summer; so many memories" line.
Put together, this seems to suggest that Rinoa, not unlike Squall, saw Seifer as more of an inspiration than a person she really knew well, and whether they had some form or relationship or were just friends is left even more ambiguous and open to interpretation than in English.
- Squall's freakout is the same, word for word.
- The girl in the corridor is specific about the "Garden Masters", not "Headmasters", of the Galbadia and Balamb garden, being those with a working relationship - this is very clear because the "Garden Master" title is translated in Italian as "Supreme", and "Headmaster" is a very different word ("Preside"), so there can't be any confusion on the matter. Not sure how much that influences the speculations, but it's a thing.
- The conversation with Fuijin and Raijin is the same, with Squall saying Seifer is "probably" dead, and that "he heard" Galbadia executed him, and the two laughing off the idea that Seifer would just accept his death so easily, and deciding to go looking for him.
- A line in the incidental dialogue about the sorceress says "rumor goes the power of the Sorceress is secretly passed down to the chosen ones", which is very interesting when put in contrast with the general wariness everybody seems to have about the Sorceress - the line about her being rumored to have mind-control power is still in the game, although it's presented as less of a "control" and more of a "make people pliant" thing, which is a small nuance - more like she's using Hypnotism, Fascinate or Charm Person rather than a Dominate spell, in D&D terms. It suggest a less-than-absolute control, which might be meaningful when the speculation about Seifer's potential fate is involved.
- Not a change, but I want to point out that, once again, we have the dialogue box saying "let me introduce a sharpshooter from Galbadia Garden." Then there is a pause. Then there is the character name, "Irvine Kinneas", and the FMV; exact same process as I mentioned was present with Quistis, Zell and Selphie, which is another point in favor of my theory that it was intended for them all to be renamed.
Also, I mentioned surnames before; we know that Quistis is Trepe, Zell is Dintch, and now Irvine is Kinneas. We've not been given the surnames of Selphie, Rinoa or Squall, at least not in dialogue, that I can remember. I'm not sure if Seifer's surname was provided, but Cid was named as "Kramer". Just wanted to keep that as a note here, for future reference.
- Irvine is exactly the same, very nearly word for word - the only change is that he says "a pleasure" when saying "I'll need to work with you country bumpkins from Balamb", which is ambiguous in that, depending on tone, it can be said arrogantly or in a friendly manner. This doesn't really changes the impression he leaves in both versions.
Right? I tried my hand at writing a fanfiction about that when I was sixteen, but I lost interest eventually. Also, it's in Italian, and not very good at all. Still, I do think they're an interesting pair of characters.
Now, this is not stated anywhere, but... are Fujin and Raijin SeeD? Because, while it would make sense that they aren't, since Seifer isn't, unlike the other students we saw during the exam, they weren't disappointed when the Faculty didn't call their name. Additionally, the way things are presented when the group comes back from Dollet after the SeeD Exam, they were waiting for Seifer, asking him how it went; suggesting they didn't take part in the exam. And now, here they are in Galbadia Garden, after Quistis told us that she was sent here on missions in the past, whereas I would expect that, if they were students, they wouldn't be allowed to bring orders around, much less be commanded to do so.
And I can easily see an exam where Seifer was put in charge of a team of Fuijin and Raijin, they executed whatever orders he gave them flawlessly and with the mindless obedience of a good soldier despite the order themselves being Seifer's independent decision, and thus them (like Zell and Squall here) being promoted while Seifer was held back. We don't have their age, either. So... is it just me who thinks they might actually be SeeD themselves, or is it a theory that somebody else thinks might hold water?
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Guile
Having a really great time right now
To tangent for a minute, since Omi played Intergrade:
I was watching a Let's Play sort of guy on youtube (TBSkyen), and he came down pretty hard on Intergrade's interpretation of Yuffie. Now, because I enjoyed Yuffie so much there, I wanted to 'Um Actually' him immediately, but he raised some valid points:
Yuffie's comical pratfalls in Intergrade are weird compared to her otherwise being a talented ninja, but I can excuse that as, y'know, teenager. Still growing and body changing and all that.
And everybody dragging Yuffie for being a kid is just keeping up the fine, hallowed tradition of FF7 dragging Yuffie at every opportunity.
But he also noted that she seemed remarkably guileless for a teen who repeatedly made fools ofus Omi when she showed up, and was capable of stealing all our materia and running off into the night when we arrive at Wutai.
And I couldn't really argue that one. Omi, any thoughts on Yuffie getting the flanderization that Aerith and Tifa avoided in Remake?
I was watching a Let's Play sort of guy on youtube (TBSkyen), and he came down pretty hard on Intergrade's interpretation of Yuffie. Now, because I enjoyed Yuffie so much there, I wanted to 'Um Actually' him immediately, but he raised some valid points:
Yuffie's comical pratfalls in Intergrade are weird compared to her otherwise being a talented ninja, but I can excuse that as, y'know, teenager. Still growing and body changing and all that.
And everybody dragging Yuffie for being a kid is just keeping up the fine, hallowed tradition of FF7 dragging Yuffie at every opportunity.
But he also noted that she seemed remarkably guileless for a teen who repeatedly made fools of
And I couldn't really argue that one. Omi, any thoughts on Yuffie getting the flanderization that Aerith and Tifa avoided in Remake?
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Hmm.
I did think, while playing Intergrade, that it was missing some level of Yuffie actually getting to fool people. She doesn't really trick anyone or steal anything.
But I think Yuffie's identity may have transformed somewhat in the process of more integrating her in the story rather than playing her as a joke who constantly fails to get people invested in her story. Wutai is in a cold war situation with Midgar, Yuffie is actively taking part in an espionnage effort targeting Shinra rather than just stealing random people's Materia to bring back home, Sonon's death gives her a personal stake of grief/revenge,, and Wutai won't feature in Rebirth (word is it'll wait until Part 3) so she needs a different arc for her role in Rebirth. All of which combines to suggest she'll have a different narrative role, and her characterization has shifted to accommodate that - I'm curious where they'll be taking it; it'll probably have to do with the alienation angle that's present in Rebirth, where she finds Midgar a strange and hostile place and no one shares her cultural references (see the recurring gag with Da Chao beans), leaving her isolated even when cooperating with people (other than Sonon).
Intergrade!Yuffie is in a weird position where she is both a doofus who's not very good at the whole 'thief' part of her job, and also an incredible physical force who is, like, animated as more agile and fast than even Cloud is, running across walls, doing pirouettes, easily parrying bullets and so on. People talk about Ninjas in the same way they would talk about SOLDIERs, and you can see why. And at a gameplay level, she comes across as more flexible and powerful (and more difficult to master) than any of the characters in the base game, because by nature of what Intergrade is (you only have one playable character, and an NPC teammate in Sonon), she needs to be able to cover the full spectrum of combat and be entirely self-sufficient, so she can fight at range, close up, physically, with magic, with perfect parries, all without even a single Materia.
Which produces the strange result that Yuffie is a pratfalling goof who also could probably take on most of Avalanche on her own. And that latter aspect will probably be toned down in Rebirth, where she'll be 'just' a normal party member, so I'm curious how her introduction will go. Will she even still try robbing the party?
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I've said it before, I'll say it again: I'm fully expecting Yuffie to not only try robbing the party, but for such to be the explanation for why the party doesn't have the endgame hax gear and materia they had when they left Midgar.
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Speaking of which, I just finished the Rebirth demo and I am vibrating.
- Location
- USA
I always thought that Caraway was named after Carraway from The Great Gatsby. Just look at Deling City--art deco everywhere, music bars, throwback-styled cars...Jazz Age aesthetics all the way, straight outta Gatsby.
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- Location
- Lake Wobegon
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Absolutely not. Great Neck never looked like that.
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Of course! They're all countries which were aligned with fascism during World War 2. It makes perfect sense 🤔
- Location
- Brittany, France
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Their name haven't been mentioned. I'm aware that Squall's last name is Leonheart and that Rinoa's is Heartilit, because they're frequently mentioned in external material. I can't recall Selfie and Seifer's last names either off the top of my head, although I've seen them before. I assume Squall and Rinoa both having "Heart" in their name is a meta allusion to their romantic arc, and Squall's name has obvious significance relating to his lion theme - he literally has a 'lion's heart,' allegedly.
- Location
- Lake Wobegon
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Tilmitt and Almasy, respectively. This information never matters.
I vaguely remember Rinoa also mentioning that Quistis originally studied in Galbadia Garden in the French version. Don't take my word for it though, it's literally been more than 20 years since I've played that game.
Also, I have to agree with Omi, typing Rinoa instead of Linoa just feel weird.
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
It's one of the offhand chatter while the party is waiting for Quistis to finish reporting in, like Selphie wondering if Galbadia Garden has its own school festival.
The way Rinoa says it is phrased as speculation, so the translation would be "I wonder if Quistis has studied here (before)." Or more pedantically "had lessons here", but same idea.
It's a question that doesn't seem like Rinoa is expecting an answer, as opposed to making conversation, like Selphie asking about Galbadia Garden Festivals.
EDIT: Wait, I just thought of another interpretation.
Rinoa says "I wonder if Quistis has had lessons here (before)." My immediate thought was the same as the other translations, ie "studied here", but I had a flash of insight about the word used, 授業 ("
Another interpretation of "jugyou" is "instruction", as in giving instruction. In other words, Rinoa is asking if Quistis has taught at Galbadia Garden before. "Had lessons here" would thus mean "had given lessons here".
That might explain why Rinoa wondered about it: being teaching staff, however temporary, would also explain how Quistis knows the local administration.
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- Location
- USA
Isn't that pronounced "jugyou", with dakuten? Why am I quibbling over this kind of stuff?!