Let's Play Every Final Fantasy Game In Order Of Release [Now Playing: Final Fantasy IX]
- Thread starter Omicron
- Start date
- Let's Play
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Which would certainly explain why he didn't survive to the present day; it is the haircut of a guy who gets killed to kick off the story.
somewhatLazy
Serial Procrastinator
- Location
- lurking
*squints at Doomtrain from FF6*
Alright, which developer's mom got tragically hit by a train?
Kuja
I'M A SQUIIIID
- Location
- AZ
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Oh, you thought Aeris dying was a punch to the gut? Welcome to the ice fields, motherfucker.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvZYge6afuI&ab_channel=CreatureFeature-Topic
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvZYge6afuI&ab_channel=CreatureFeature-Topic
Guile
Having a really great time right now
Rufus: "Since we couldn't get the Tiny Bronco, we had to use this old thing instead"Omicron said:
Rufus: "Heidegger! Please explain why we even brought him with us."
Heidegger: "Gya ha ha huhhhh... I think he's technically been on payroll this entire time?"
Reeve, /very faintly, all the way from Midgar: "Please fire him so I can get a budget"
Rufus: "Whatever, maybe he'll be useful against Sephiroth."
Scarlett: "Did we ever remember to take him off payroll?"
Rufus: "What do I look like, an HR manager? ... Do we have an HR manager?"
Reeve: "Not since Tseng was put in a coma"
Scarlett, Heidegger and Rufus: "... Oops."
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I think Hojo's probably their HR guy, in the sense that I think they give anybody who complains about their policies to Hojo to use as a lab rat
This naturally poses problems when they have issues with Hojo himself - he's not exactly going to give himself the fatal "I wonder what this syringe of random chemicals does" injections like usual
This naturally poses problems when they have issues with Hojo himself - he's not exactly going to give himself the fatal "I wonder what this syringe of random chemicals does" injections like usual
Last edited:
MiskWisk
Hoot
- Location
- Somewhere devoid of wit
- Pronouns
- He
Welcome to the gut punch section Omi!
The Seal Materia. Aka, the materia that let's you cast Silence. Admittedly, it would have been nice to have actually had Sephiroth visibly use it, but it wouldn't be surprising for him to be able to throw status effects around after marinating in pure materia for so long.
Alternatively, this is Sephiroth directly affecting Cloud through the Jenova cells, but that then causes the issue of asking why Tifa doesn't inform people what's wrong.
What's the enemy you ask?
Oh, just a small, insignificant one.
Tonberry.
This is the only area it naturally would spawn. But because it is effectively dummied out, the Tonberry cannot be encountered. It can only be fought in the Battle Square.
Because his development from overly serious to eager to help makes it far more believable. He's desperate to help and afraid, everyone just vanishes suddenly and then Tifa comes running back saying they need his help, only for Cloud, someone he trusts to ask for the materia back. It's much more believable that he would hand the materia over than Barret.
Still, this is the biggest in game message that Jenova is not the one in charge anymore. It does rely on you believing Hojo, but there are a couple minor things as well to support it.
I still do like the idea that this isn't entirely Sephiroth though. That Jenova and Sephiroth have melded, combining Jenova's instincts and desires with Sephiroth's personality to create a new entity. Sephiroth might be in charge, but I'd only give it a 55:45 split.
However, I can through in something I wanted to for a while now:
@Omicron, now knowing these details, do you have any new thoughts regarding various bits in this trailer, and Sephiroth's comments about Tifa?
EDIT: Dammit, not this trailer. Where's the one where Sephiroth calls Cloud a puppy and makes comments about Tifa?!
EDIT 2: Well, I can't find what I was looking for, so I'll just have to amend the question to if you have any new thoughts on the Rebirth stuff we've seen, and how it applies to what's been revealed just now.
So, for certain reasons, I'd say Nanaki is the more narratively satisfying character to give the Black Materia to. I'll explain later though.
Excuse you that is Raditz-tier hair. Also yes, every appearance of him tones it down.
There's actually something you've not considered here Omi.
The Seal Materia. Aka, the materia that let's you cast Silence. Admittedly, it would have been nice to have actually had Sephiroth visibly use it, but it wouldn't be surprising for him to be able to throw status effects around after marinating in pure materia for so long.
Alternatively, this is Sephiroth directly affecting Cloud through the Jenova cells, but that then causes the issue of asking why Tifa doesn't inform people what's wrong.
Fun fact by the way, there is an enemy encounter in this area. However, because encounters are disabled it doesn't appear.
What's the enemy you ask?
Oh, just a small, insignificant one.
Tonberry.
This is the only area it naturally would spawn. But because it is effectively dummied out, the Tonberry cannot be encountered. It can only be fought in the Battle Square.
And this is why I say Nanaki is the narratively better choice here.
Because his development from overly serious to eager to help makes it far more believable. He's desperate to help and afraid, everyone just vanishes suddenly and then Tifa comes running back saying they need his help, only for Cloud, someone he trusts to ask for the materia back. It's much more believable that he would hand the materia over than Barret.
So I probably shouldn't have made my earlier comment but I had genuinely forgotten this line. Oops. At the very least I should have waited till this update. So, you were right @foamy.
Still, this is the biggest in game message that Jenova is not the one in charge anymore. It does rely on you believing Hojo, but there are a couple minor things as well to support it.
I still do like the idea that this isn't entirely Sephiroth though. That Jenova and Sephiroth have melded, combining Jenova's instincts and desires with Sephiroth's personality to create a new entity. Sephiroth might be in charge, but I'd only give it a 55:45 split.
Spoilers for later.
This was such a great read. Seeing you dig into a bunch of older stuff to support your ideas is so much fun to read. It's also mildly maddening because I can't talk about the stuff I want to.
However, I can through in something I wanted to for a while now:
@Omicron, now knowing these details, do you have any new thoughts regarding various bits in this trailer, and Sephiroth's comments about Tifa?
EDIT: Dammit, not this trailer. Where's the one where Sephiroth calls Cloud a puppy and makes comments about Tifa?!
EDIT 2: Well, I can't find what I was looking for, so I'll just have to amend the question to if you have any new thoughts on the Rebirth stuff we've seen, and how it applies to what's been revealed just now.
Last edited:
Emy
Artificial Defender
One of the things I find interesting about these is that the flashback interactions with Sephiroth in the manor specifically show him being mislead by documents he found down in the basement. I think that implies a bit of untrustworthiness in the documentary evidence you find.
But, also, these documents about escapees were compiled years ago, and they aren't a recent secondhand telling or recollection (which have recently been demonstrated to be extremely suspect). Even if they're fallible, due to being compiled by Hojo or someone who does similarly lazy work, they don't have the immediate agenda that the present Hojo and Sephiroth do.
Man, that is a chonky update. I mean, that's to be expected considering the content, but still, one thing to know it's coming another to actually see it.
So let's dive in!
He'll do that, right?
Honestly, looking at it now decades later, I highly suspect the reason we start getting things like Neo Bahamut is because the devs made more than one Bahamut animation and just really, really wanted to show them both off. So unlike basically every other Final Fantasy where summons have some level of hiearchy going on where Bahamut is one the Big Last Boss ones, we get this situation.
Yet more Barret points
One of these days I'll find that internet guy who told me "Barret has no use or character development past Midgar" and force him to read this LP, that I will.
Sephiroth: "NOW YOU SEE CLOUD, NOW YOU KNOW ALL THE SECRETS OF YOUR SORDID PAST AND HOW YOU ARE NOUGHT BUT A CLONE PUPPET JENOVA THINGY"
Cloud: "What sorry man, did you see that sick-ass spider over there? Bro it's got like blue patterns and shit... sorry anyways what were you saying?
Probably should have... talked to the rest of the party at some point though. Might have helped avoid things.
Or possibly Final Fantasy as a whole.
Barret: "Of course I'll give this to nobody at all (except you)
Whoops, proper communication failed.
Then again, it's Barret, losing twelve gallons of blood probably isn't much for someone that size.
WEPON TIEM
On the other hand, Bashfics exist, sooooo yeah probably some people out there blamming Tifa.
I mean, I know it's theories partially crafted with known outside spoilers, but still, the fact is the evidence that something deeper is going on is right there in the game, well before these big plot whammies all hit at once.
So let's dive in!
Well obviously we can have Vincent stay behind on sniper duty, taking care of any rogue Sephiroths or Shinra baddies showing up, right?
He'll do that, right?
Ah yes, Bahamut II: Electric Boogaloo.
Honestly, looking at it now decades later, I highly suspect the reason we start getting things like Neo Bahamut is because the devs made more than one Bahamut animation and just really, really wanted to show them both off. So unlike basically every other Final Fantasy where summons have some level of hiearchy going on where Bahamut is one the Big Last Boss ones, we get this situation.
Sorry I just love how there's all the Shinra Goons standing around up here, being Shinra Goons... then Hojo apparently just hitched a ride in the back corner and is going "mweehehe ah yes my secret evil plans, all coming together, hm yes I will monologue about these right in front of the President yes". At some point I'd really expect Rufus to just blow his leg off to shut him up or something, not like he needs them to Science.
As a kid, I always assumed they just... walked here, honestly. And that's part of why they're collapsing and falling down, because the flesh is weak even if the mind is willing to make it all the way to the Northern Crater. Though that does leave the question of how some of them jumped over the ocean to reach this continent.
Is Haste All even needed? Pretty sure FFVII Big Guard casts full party haste in the first place.
Oh hey look at that
Yet more Barret points
One of these days I'll find that internet guy who told me "Barret has no use or character development past Midgar" and force him to read this LP, that I will.
Yeah, I feel like MP Turbo is going to fall into the usual lategame Final Fantasy issue of "magic inferior to physical" because physical attacks just get more damage later on in the form of multi-hit attacks. Why cast Flare for 200 MP and 9999 damage, when Meteorain does six hits of 5000 damage?
...Oh wow, that is way spikier than I remember, you're right to get distracted by this guy.
Yuffie you weren't even there for the story first time around, what are you smoking talking about how bad it was or wasn't.
Man, if only Cloud managed to maintain this through the entire scene, peak comedy.
Sephiroth: "NOW YOU SEE CLOUD, NOW YOU KNOW ALL THE SECRETS OF YOUR SORDID PAST AND HOW YOU ARE NOUGHT BUT A CLONE PUPPET JENOVA THINGY"
Cloud: "What sorry man, did you see that sick-ass spider over there? Bro it's got like blue patterns and shit... sorry anyways what were you saying?
To be fair, "oh no this photo is missing a person but I'm sure we know who it is" seems like a classic twist.
It's certainly something for Tifa's characterization, to find out for certain she knew something was wrong all along, as far back as the original Nibelheim flashbacks, and was trying her best to work around it.
Probably should have... talked to the rest of the party at some point though. Might have helped avoid things.
And at last, we get Sephiroth's final evolution to the guy we've seen in every single other FFVII related media: the one who spends 99% of his screentime getting off on how much he can fuck with Cloud, the kind of guy who would absolutely stab himself in the chest if he knew it would make Cloud sad. What a guy.
I mean... just by default, don't you like every character in comparison to Hojo? At least, I don't think there's anyone you've liked less than him in FFVII.
Or possibly Final Fantasy as a whole.
Throwing out some arbitrary "let's salvage the plot" headcanon here, it could be some sort of "Jenova/Sephiroth can only pull this off here in the Northern Crater because it's where they incubated for millennia and because there's so much mako energy to work with in the air".
One of these days, I'll get around to rereading and finishing that quest. It was good, from what I remember, I just... didn't keep up, and it's a daunting thing to leap back into.
Cloud: "Don't give this to literally anyone (including me implied)
Barret: "Of course I'll give this to nobody at all (except you)
Whoops, proper communication failed.
Lmao fucking Hojo. I swear, any other 2-bit shitty scientist man from whatever other media would just take the win and go "mwahaha even my failure is a success", but he's just so goddamn salty that Cloud doesn't have a number.
Yeah, something like that probably would have been an overall improvement. Though, it might make it difficult for Barret to cover Tifa in that FMV later if he's just been cut open.
Then again, it's Barret, losing twelve gallons of blood probably isn't much for someone that size.
It's incredible really, how Hojo somehow gets actively worse in every way with every scene he's in. And I'm not even sure if this is rock bottom.
WEPON
WEPON TIEM
Golly, why would you ever think that Omi? It's not like the previous game had an Ultima Weapon, or "Gaia has awakened the weapons to 'protect' the world, they proceed to try and genocide humanity" is an incredibly common cliche.
I'm sorry Tifa got me cracking up hard in that first one. Just peak "oh no look at my sexy falling pose" with the wide open polygon mouth being the cherry on top.
Some… interesting work being done with the posing in these shots. Fantastic use of light and shadow in the second one, though.
On one hand, I wouldn't think anyone would go that far.
On the other hand, Bashfics exist, sooooo yeah probably some people out there blamming Tifa.
Awww yeah here we go Omi Theory Times
Oh, just some dude. Probably not important to the plot or anything, could be any SOLDIER I bet they all look like that.
Ah SHIT he's bringing out the DEEP LORE for his theories!
I mean, I know it's theories partially crafted with known outside spoilers, but still, the fact is the evidence that something deeper is going on is right there in the game, well before these big plot whammies all hit at once.
Mister Bad Guy
Mr Mercury to friends
- Location
- Bay Area
So, here's a fun fact: in the Japanese version, Cloud is introduced as a "ronin." Now, the definition you're probably familiar with for a ronin is that they're a samurai who no longer works for their master (usually because their master is dead or they've been disgraced by some means), and so archetypally tends to wander around the countryside doing work for whoever needs a good swordsman. And that fits Cloud pretty well.
However, there's another, more modern definition of a ronin, which has arisen from slang: a ronin in modern Japan is a person who failed their university entrance exams, couldn't get into college, and now wanders around doing work for whoever needs a person with a high school education.
Unbeknownst to us when we first heard this, that definition also fits Cloud pretty well.
However, there's another, more modern definition of a ronin, which has arisen from slang: a ronin in modern Japan is a person who failed their university entrance exams, couldn't get into college, and now wanders around doing work for whoever needs a person with a high school education.
Unbeknownst to us when we first heard this, that definition also fits Cloud pretty well.
Last edited:
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
To be fair even the non-LEGO imagery here tones it down - that photograph makes it look less Raditz and more "guy with a mullet".
Which is equally a "hairstyle of the doomed", but in a very different way that wouldn't have been nearly as applicable in 1997. Although still pretty applicable given mullets were dead even then IIRC, if by a much narrower margin of years.
Last edited:
Dybbukpossesed
Falling Somewhere
- Location
- California
Up to episode 26 of the parody now! And I have to say I love how Tifa's first instinct on finding her old friend, clearly suffering from brain-damage or something similar, is to enlist him in her group of terrorists freedom fighters.
Last edited:
- Location
- East Coast
Hojo is coming across less and less as 'Greedy Megacorp mad scientist doing evil science for profit' and more as 'Completely insane Cthulhu cultist mad scientist doing evil science because he thinks the tentacle supermonster is our superior',
Guile
Having a really great time right now
Hojo falling ass-backwards into success through almost no intention of his own again.Omicron said:
He has this big (crazy) plan, but all those clones he built to do the thing failed, and it's some reject contents of a test tube he tossed out with the garbage before the process was even complete that got up, scraped up the tatters of itself, dragged itself to the Seventh Heaven, and thereafter went on a world-spanning whirlwind tour to arrive here at the exact time and place for Reunion.
Hojo is going "Yes! Success!" when he basically didn't do anything. His failures succeeded more than his successes, and he's taking all the credit in the world for it.
Omicron said:
Yuffie: "No no, I remember this, we got to Nibelheim and Cait was like 'Wow Cloud did you just lie to get us to like you' and then he had to explain everything off-screen while you, Tifa and Aerith ran around doing stuff."McFluffles said:
Zap Rowsdower
Ex-cultist vagrant
- Location
- Bright lights, big city
- Pronouns
- He/Him
He doesn't experiment, he does shit to see what'll happen, claiming later he totally predicted the results.
Unfortunately, one of the things he wants to do to see what happens is wake Cthulhu up. No different in his mind I suspect than the "breed Aerith and Nanaki and see what happens" scheme - its all "do the forbidden and watch eagerly" to him.
MiskWisk
Hoot
- Location
- Somewhere devoid of wit
- Pronouns
- He
Well, to paraphrase a Final Fantasy XIV character:
"Having struck upon a hypothesis, there is but one thing the wise man desires...
Last edited:
Hah, fair, she probably got some explanation by around that point in time.
Though now that I think about it, Cait Sith also wasn't there for the original briefing so who told him lmao
Oh also, Omi congratulations, FFVII is now as long in update parts as FFVI (not even getting into probably longer in wordcount). Just Four More Parts and you'll catch up with the longest, FFV with 29 parts!
...Yeah you're absolutely going to blow that record out of the water, I get the feeling FFVII has at least a dozen more updates in it. You haven't even gotten the airship yet for "let's waste three weeks hitting up every map location for sidequests".
- Pronouns
- He/Him
It's been a while since @Omicron checked on the Big Bird! And now everybody's, uh, in a not-great place.
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Aside from the great update Omi put out, I think my fave thing in the last couple of pages is this line, "ricotta skull" is such a great phrase for this entire situation.
- Location
- Italy
I mean, both could absolutely be true in Hojo's eyes. Cloud could actually be the original Cloud AND what Hojo considers nothing but a test tube failure because the greasy fuck doesn't consider 99% of the population worth engaging with. The after action report was there for a reason after all.
- Location
- United States
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Oh no, there's no doubt Hojo saw the original Cloud as raw material that has a tendency to wiggle around.
- Location
- Lost in Hell
In the tradition of past Final Fantasy games with Extreme Rotating Casts, and the spirit of a certain young woman staring at a certain edge lord and wondering when he'd drop dead, I'm going to say they made Barret do it. Then each new party member had to explain it to another in a game of telephone.
Last edited:
Ah yes, each new party member just gets it explained by someone else down the line until it becomes Yuffie going "yeah Nibelheim was razed to the ground seven times, Sephiroth was straight up murdering Cloud's mom over and over and casting Life 2, was some CRAZY shit apparently" when it reaches Cait Sith. No wonder he seemed so annoyed that Cloud was just totally lying to them for Clout.