So, Bioshock always confused me a little bit. Why exactly did Rapture fail as a city? I can imagine the Splicers going nuts and wrecking everything, but it's not like the entire city would be filled with splicers - or at least, not to the extreme where they went crazy. There would be some people who were fine with Incinerate as their only trick, mostly used for lighting candles and cigarettes, or the cold one to chill drinks, or whatever. There would be people who just didn't see the point, or who were more interested in other things than playing with a new toy/tool.

Really, for an entire city to fail, there had to have been some societal infrastructure problem or another. Maybe lack of law enforcement, particularly when the crazy ones came through. Insufficient disaster relief when parts of the city broke down? Or just a completely mercantile society without regulations collapsing on itself.

None of those actually make much sense though. No police when the Splicers start going wild? Everyone had access to guns and super powers, literally sold in vending machines, and you can generally count on a person's sense of self-preservation if nothing else. No disaster relief? bull crap, there had to have been engineers around just to build the place in the first place, of course there'll be someone around for maintenance and repairs. A completely mercantile society should be unstable, but just maxing out your greed is going to end badly, and everyone involved would have known that. A sense of self interest, if nothing else, would have kept most things in check.

So what went wrong?

/Did not finish the game, so if the answer is there that'll be why I don't know. Don't care about spoilers though, spoil away.
 
So, Bioshock always confused me a little bit. Why exactly did Rapture fail as a city? I can imagine the Splicers going nuts and wrecking everything, but it's not like the entire city would be filled with splicers - or at least, not to the extreme where they went crazy. There would be some people who were fine with Incinerate as their only trick, mostly used for lighting candles and cigarettes, or the cold one to chill drinks, or whatever. There would be people who just didn't see the point, or who were more interested in other things than playing with a new toy/tool.

Really, for an entire city to fail, there had to have been some societal infrastructure problem or another. Maybe lack of law enforcement, particularly when the crazy ones came through. Insufficient disaster relief when parts of the city broke down? Or just a completely mercantile society without regulations collapsing on itself.

None of those actually make much sense though. No police when the Splicers start going wild? Everyone had access to guns and super powers, literally sold in vending machines, and you can generally count on a person's sense of self-preservation if nothing else. No disaster relief? bull crap, there had to have been engineers around just to build the place in the first place, of course there'll be someone around for maintenance and repairs. A completely mercantile society should be unstable, but just maxing out your greed is going to end badly, and everyone involved would have known that. A sense of self interest, if nothing else, would have kept most things in check.

So what went wrong?

/Did not finish the game, so if the answer is there that'll be why I don't know. Don't care about spoilers though, spoil away.

Short version: Rapture failed because Andrew Ryan was beaten at his own game, and he didn't take that kindly.

Long Version: in a realm with no laws, the cunning shrewd businessman wins always. In Rapture, that man was Fontaine, who slowly but surely began to earn and cash in money and power far more than what Andrew Ryan ever achieved, and Andrew Ryan took that...poorly. When smuggling goods from outside -thus crashing the Rapture economy- became a problem, Ryan had the whole city embargoed, and with ADAM creating super-soldiers, super-addicted too, a war broke out between the two factions until Fontaine faked his death.

At the same time, though, the ADAM craze turned the population -the embargoed, nowhere to leave population- into a mass of neurotic crack-addicts that still were at war with the rebels, hence more adam was needed to splice oneself more, and the more one got spliced the more one got crack-addicted and mad.

Enter Big Daddies and Little Sisters to collect ADAM from corps -since sea slugs inside the stomach of young girls wasn't cutting it any longer. And you have a thriving ecosystem in which Rapture is split in half. Ryan's side, Fontaine's side and the smucks in the middle that get the short end of the straw and would really love to leave, only they can't since, yeah, Andrew Ryan's gotten paranoid enough he believes everyone in the city is out to get him.

How to solve that problem? Why, with mind-controlling abilities through Pheromones in the air!

Take away that shitty free will out of your Subjects, God-Emperor Andrew Ryan!

Thus, only the few who weren't Spliced survived the mind-whammy, including Fontaine/Atlas.

Cue the ball dropping as the only way to deal with Ryan was someone with his genetic code, a lover told to 'pop holes in the condoms' and bam, Jack Ryan is born, and then conditioned, to be the Would You Kindly Kill that son of a bitch of an Andrew Ryan guy.

So, to recap:

The economy went to shite. Everyone thought dosing on crack was a good idea since it gave superpowers. The big boss decided to mind-control the crack addicts to end the war, but by then the city was already pretty much falling apart.
 
And Dr. Tenenbaum.

Man, Fuuka's really holding on to that positive attitude. The only way you can get even more Noble-bright is if Shade had Madoka Kaname as his apprentice walker instead.
Ah, but Madoka would scold him and, by demonstration, remind him of that most terrifying of thoughts.

Responsibility.

...it's sad when a fourteen-year-old is a more responsible and overall better person than the several thousand year old Planeswalker. Kind of a pity that we probably won't ever see her universe, but between Madokami and Homucifer I suspect it's somewhat of a no-go zone. Hell, the Incubators on their own would be dangerous.
 
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Oh yeah, just realized: Did Fuuka just leave a bunch of de-powered, barely armed civilians (including a de-Little Sister'ed girl) without setting summons to guard them? In the middle of Rapture? With only Jack "Would you kindly kill all these people" Ryan* as their only muscle?


*who just started the game btw, probably armed with only a wrench, revolver, and shock plasmid at this point
 
Ah, but Madoka would scold him and, by demonstration, remind him of that most terrifying of thoughts.

Responsibility.

...it's sad when a fourteen-year-old is a more responsible and overall better person than the several thousand year old Planeswalker. Kind of a pity that we probably won't ever see her universe, but between Madokami and Homucifer I suspect it's somewhat of a no-go zone. Hell, the Incubators on their own would be dangerous.
Shade is a retired veteran of responsibility in this fic.

ie. he had a long tour of duty he's already finished and has moved onto being an old cynical ass teaching the next generation

In retirement he's already been shown influencing one planeswalker to serve their own tour immediately instead of after fucking about on their home plane for a few thousand years and beaten the fuck out of another planeswalker who was on the slippery slope to becoming a ruinous force of evil

Maybe he'll get back to fighting someday; maybe he wont. All that matters right now is that (as depicted in the fic) he has more than earned the right to sit his ass on whatever beach and drink as many fruity cocktails as he damn well pleases without criticism from 14 year old girls who enter contracts with cosmic horrors (without reading the damn fine print!) willy nilly and spout dollar store lines about friendship and love.

Also Madokami and Homucifer are small fry compared to most old-walkers. Their threat level is only "avoid confrontation" where Planeswalker threat levels go up to "Keep a safe distance of at least X universes (number varies) when speaking of this being in hypothetical neutral non-specific terms. Under no circumstances use nouns."
 
What, are there Oldwalkers who got the capstone of D&D Truenamers, then broke it so that using any noun to talk about them lets them be there?
As far as I know, the Oldwalkers have no equal in terms of personal power, versatility, survivability, and capability. And when Walker!Shade said that they were immortal he meant it. To kill an Oldwalker is something that only Urza did, it was so far out of the realms of possibility that even Bolas couldn't conceive how it would be done.
 
As far as I know, the Oldwalkers have no equal in terms of personal power, versatility, survivability, and capability. And when Walker!Shade said that they were immortal he meant it. To kill an Oldwalker is something that only Urza did, it was so far out of the realms of possibility that even Bolas couldn't conceive how it would be done.

Phage the Untouchable. That effect? That's the Oldwalker PC getting killed outright. It's a sort of soul rending/melting super Deathtouch. To kill an Oldwalker, you just need to use soul destroying effects, or let loose attacks more destructive than the Blind Eternities. Granted, you also need to hit with those effects, which is probably harder than making them happen when it comes to paranoid Oldwalkers.
 
As far as I know, the Oldwalkers have no equal in terms of personal power, versatility, survivability, and capability. And when Walker!Shade said that they were immortal he meant it. To kill an Oldwalker is something that only Urza did, it was so far out of the realms of possibility that even Bolas couldn't conceive how it would be done.

Didn't Urza build a weapon that did not do so much as kill but completely erase the target from existence?
 
Didn't Urza build a weapon that did not do so much as kill but completely erase the target from existence?
Urza built the Legacy Weapon that erased a plane and its inhabitants from existence, don't believe me? google it, I set up a link to the card in another post later.
Phage the Untouchable. That effect? That's the Oldwalker PC getting killed outright. It's a sort of soul rending/melting super Deathtouch. To kill an Oldwalker, you just need to use soul destroying effects, or let loose attacks more destructive than the Blind Eternities. Granted, you also need to hit with those effects, which is probably harder than making them happen when it comes to paranoid Oldwalkers.
Really? I thought that it was a "I shunt you through the Blind Eternities and an innumerable amount of universes away from me, thus ends our battle Planeswalker" type deal, also I am pretty sure that the only two old walkers two that died did so in a perfect trap created by Urza, piloting machines created by Urza that were hooked not into their souls, but directly into their Sparks, while in a very special place, "shortly" before the mending. Please correct me if I am wrong, or grab someone who really loves MTG lore.

Edit: Please let me know if I am wrong and send me links to any source on lore straight to me as a PM too! I love MTGs lore and don't want to give bad info and I love to learn new stuff! So please send me stuff whenever I am open for all your lore-filled tales!!!

P.S. I am now going to my long awaited sleep. so I may not reply for a few hours.
 
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Technically, a Doom blade is enough to kill a mono-white planeswalker who completely and utterly wanted to die.

Well Serra didn't instantly die from an instant die effect, but she didn't heal herself and died some time later.
 
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Stay with someone for centuries only to be abandoned for a harem protagonist?! Poor Shade....
Did you at least burned the planet to the ground?:rage:
 
Chapter Seventeen (Bioshock)
Chapter Seventeen (Bioshock)

It is not who we are that defines us. It is what we do that does. If we can do nothing, then are we nothing? If we refuse to act, then are we inaction itself? I crossed my arms as I watched the chastised Andrew Ryan deliver after a mixture of coaxing and gentle words the Genetic Key to Rapture to Fuuka, who took it with a smile. She didn't keep it, because how could she? She didn't even know how it worked. It was merely the act of giving it that broke Andrew Ryan further.

His were the eyes of a defeated opponent, whose slumped shoulders and shuddering breaths would have been a better fit for a death row inmate rather than the once leader of Rapture's Council.

"So you can put everyone to sleep with these pheromones, right?" Fuuka asked as Andrew began to rummage through the commands of the Central Control.

"I can render the Spliced population of Rapture more amenable to accepting commands," Andrew replied with a scoff, "But I cannot push a button and make them abruptly fall asleep. I will make them drowsier than normal, and apart from the bulking monsters known as Big Daddies and the Little Sisters, everyone else should fall into a deep sleep soon enough, no doubt facilitating your conquest of my city."

"I'm not here to conquer it," Fuuka said softly, shaking her head. "I'm here to free everyone."

"There is no freedom to be found in the restraints of society," Andrew Ryan growled, "Everything they will produce once out of here will be given to their state, to their holy men, or to others who did not work one day for it-" Fuuka didn't answer, simply crossing her arms behind her back. "You are merely exchanging one prison with another," Andrew continued.

"That's not true," Fuuka said, "But even if it were, at least they'd have a sky to gaze at." She exhaled and then neared the microphone that could communicate with the whole of Rapture. "Can you turn this on?" she asked next, "They'll fall asleep faster if I sing them a lullaby."

I scoffed, and my scoff was pretty much echoed by Andrew Ryan himself as he did so. Fuuka coughed lightly in the microphone, and then began to sing a few words with her voice rising and lowering, trying to get a grip of the audio system, perhaps. It was nothing worthy of a Dolby Surround, but I reckoned she couldn't demand it to be repaired.

"Hush little baby..." Fuuka began to sing, her voice gentle and soft, "Don't say a word," she continued, "Mama's gonna buy you a mockingbird." As her voice echoed through the whole of Rapture, the Splicers that had been already in the process of seeking out a shelter to sleep off their tiredness stopped abruptly to listen, their ears twitching in an effort to pinpoint the source of the voice. Those who weren't Spliced within the city listened on restlessly, trying to understand what was going on, trying to make sense of the sudden turn of events or just letting themselves go after a few minutes of bewilderment to the softly sung lullaby.

It was as Fuuka finished and closed the microphone that I appeared from the shadows, clapping my hands very slowly. Andrew Ryan turned to look at me, and then abruptly fainted at the snapping of my fingers.

"Congratulations," I said, "You plan on bringing them all topside now, do you?" I asked, only for Fuuka to turn towards me with a firm determined gaze.

"Yes," she said, nodding resolutely. "It might take a while, but once I get them all fixed and going, then-"

"Then this world shall know death unlike any others," I mused offhandedly, crossing my arms behind my back as I stopped by her side, looking through the windows at the mighty city of Rapture. "For you see, when the knowledge of the Plasmids and the Tonics shall reach the world above, America and Russia shall begin developing them. Already, the flying city of Columbia floats by in the sky, but it will be brought down, and afterwards? The world will know of war once more, and everyone will die."

I chuckled. "But indeed, for the time being, you saved everyone," I said, a tiny smile on my face, "Or perhaps not everyone." I gestured to one of the many screens, which at my unspoken command began to flicker and reveal the room where Fuuka had left everyone else. Or at least, where she had sealed them in. Jack's gun was fuming, the corpses of the people Fuuka had personally saved dead at his feet in pools of blood. The gun had been turned against Jack too in the end, killing him in order to not leave any loose ends.

So much like Fontaine to kill everyone in a fit of rage. He would then escape through the submarine, no longer stopped by Rapture's automated defenses now. That was his plan, his pathetically singular plan that repeated itself across thousands of repetitions. He never changed it. He never bothered mixing in with the people that would eventually return upwards with the repaired bathyspheres.

He was a petty man. He was a petty, cruel, and vindictive man.

"No!" Fuuka yelled, my eardrums already used to the loud voice of the budding Planeswalker, even as it cracked the high-resistance windows. She took a step towards the monitor, and then clenched her fists, "No! What-What happened!? Why-Why did that-"

I turned my back towards her, and began to move once more into the shadows. "If I were you, I would ask-" I didn't finish the sentence, because Fuuka's hand gripped onto my wrist and pulled, stopping my descent into the realm of shadows. I glared at her, but she glared just as fiercely back.

"Bring them back to life," Fuuka hissed at me, "You can do it, right?! To you it's like snapping your fingers!"

"If I did that, the lesson wouldn't stick," I replied with a half-bored tone, even as the strength in my arm suddenly increased, and I easily freed myself from her grip. Her fingers had left behind marks of burned flesh where they had held my wrist, but they quickly disappeared.

"There's no lesson that needs to stick like that!" Fuuka said hotly, her hands burning with flames. "Those people-there was a child in there too! She couldn't have been older than twelve! You have the ability to save them, so-"

"I call it the Superman dilemma," I retorted, taking a step back. "It goes like this," I hummed as I moved my index fingers in lazy circles, forming up an illusion of towering towers with two small children atop them, "Superman can save everyone," a flying Superman appeared in-between the two buildings, "but he can't be everywhere, then how does he pick who to save and who not to? If in the world two children are about to die, which of the two does he save? Does he differentiate? If so, how? If not, then does he flip a coin? Does he go for the one on the right, since it's his dominant hand?" I gestured at the illusion, quite calm even though Fuuka's flames were progressing from her hands to her arms, her veins glowing a bright white light. "Who should he save? If one's a girl and one's a boy, does it change? Does he run cost-benefit analysis? Does he decide based on their blood type? Their skin color? How does a Superhero decides who lives and who dies when he's got no other choice?"

Fuuka growled, closing her eyes shut firmly, "They're here. Right now, they are here, and you are here, and so you can save them. You can, you just don't want to. You're a monster."

"Exactly," I said with a grin. "Why should I? Because there's an innocent child? Oh, cry me a river. You ever emptied your wallet to feed starving African kids? Yes? No? Hypocrite. You're a hypocrite. You dare call me a monster, but by the same token, the effort it would have taken you to give your money to a poor bloke by the corner of the street is identical. Why didn't you? Well, Miss Rabbit!? Why did you not do charity? Uh? You can rant and grumble and remark on how I can make the difference right here and now, but where were you? Where did you make a difference there and then?"

I dismissed the illusion, humming happily as I placed my hands in my pockets. My gaze went to the ceiling, "I saved countless billions," I said offhandedly. "Resurrected unforeseen numbers. I have cured cancer in billion of worlds, annihilated sickness and destroyed diseases the likes of which you will never see," I laughed, "And for every world that I healed, a hundred more suffered! A man could go mad trying to save everyone, White Rabbit! I have paid my dues to this society of ours. If you want to empty the ocean by cupping your hands and draining it, then be my guest! Go!" I gestured all around us, as thin looking mirrors spread out, revealing countless worlds and dimensions. "Do you want to go to a world where there is only war!? Do you seek to heal those who suffer from a death sentence from the moment of their birth? Come on, White Rabbit! Answer me!" I laughed louder, clapping my hands together to let all the mirrors break and disappear in shards of glass.

The flames stopped spreading by Fuuka's elbows, and the woman's teeth gnawed against her lower lip. She looked down at the pavement, and then determinedly lifted her sight on me once more. "Maybe I don't know," Fuuka said, "Maybe I don't know anything, maybe I'm just a dumb whippersnapper in your eyes," she took a step forward, clutching her chest, "But I remember the pain of losing Yuu, I remember how much it hurt to watch the coffin get buried. I remember the pain of touching his face and not receiving a reply. I still hurt, I still think back and would gladly give my life to not have to face his death, and then...then everyone else died too," she hiccuped, "Maybe you've forgotten your pain, but...but I'd never let anyone suffer like that if I could help them!"

I sighed, and then shrugged. "Then be my guest," I said flatly, "Go on, bring them back to life."

"U-Uh?" Fuuka murmured, "What-I?"

"Yes, you," I drawled, "You want them back? Bring them back," I clenched my right hand, burning bright light igniting within it. "You have the Mana to do it now, so...go on, go do it. Then go back home and bring back your loved ones," I continued flatly as I spread my fingers open, letting the energies gathered dissipate. "But remember my words," I continued as this time, when I gave her my back, she did not try to stop me, "One day, you will realize that all that surrounds you is merely composed of shadows, smoke and ashes," I swung up my left hand, and disappeared, leaving the naive fool behind.

She would learn.

A thousand years, two thousand years, four thousand years...eventually, she would learn.

Pain can only be avoided if you don't care.

Superman can save one child only if he doesn't care about which of them he saves.

Otherwise, he either saves none, or he spends the rest of his life cursing the day he couldn't save both at the same time.
 
Obviously, Superman should go around the earth at light speed so time goes back until he's able to save both.

For all the worlds he's seen, he hasn't seen the movie? For shame.
 
Really not what I needed right now, but I guess I have to take what I can get. :(

Don't worry Bludflag, the Greeks used to be big on tragedies because by crying while watching them, they would purify their bodies of sadness.

Let it out my internet friend, or just send me a pm if you want to talk to someone.

I won't probably answer immediately because I'm out for the night, but hey, I promise I'll listen.
 
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