I mean there's hints of a larger plot and some very minor political stuff but the focus remains pretty squarely on the MC either powering up or getting to show off his increasing power to more and more important people. That's basically how the entirety of its genre works.
Japanese manga and novels - General Discussion
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Ugh. Well that's a shame.
What's the gold standard of manhwa around here?
Shanejayell
Yuri Fan without a Pause
- Pronouns
- He
Finished Arifuretta ZERO #1. Not bad, actually. It also explains why the heroes in the main books are clearing the labyrinths so easily:
Turns out they accidently did the hardest FIRST. Orcus' one was the most difficult.
Arcman
Heh
The first chapters are good, everything afterwards is a power fantasy and the ending turned me off hard for the series.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Oof, that's a shame.
Ah well, at least Fight Class 3 is good, considering what a disappointment School of the Wilds is.
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
Isn't that kinda stated in the main Arifureta story as well? There's a sorta 'order' to the labyrinths that those who seek to clear all the labyrinths/rebel against God should follow - as some of the labyrinths are either very hard or nigh impossible to actually clear without Magic from the other labyrinths. I think it was pointed somewhere around when they do the beastkin's Great Tree labyrinth.
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
I'm currently working my way through The Alchemist Who Survived Now Dreams Of A Quiet City Life, and I'm trying to figure out the morality of a certain common plot point.
Namely, the protagonist buys a slave because they feel that only a magically-contracted slave is trustworthy enough to be their companion, and then the slave is devoted to their new master because the protagonist treats them well and humanely (but still has the magical contract).
In this case, the protagonist is a woman, and the slave is a man. Because the protagonist is worried that being a lone woman in a world where she has no support structures is dangerous for her, so she wanted a bodyguard who would not betray her. Hence buying a slave.
Given that we generally agree that it's kind of skeevy if the slave-buyer is male and the slave is female, I don't actually know if it still remains skeevy when the genders are reversed, or if the circumstances are different enough to excuse it.
Namely, the protagonist buys a slave because they feel that only a magically-contracted slave is trustworthy enough to be their companion, and then the slave is devoted to their new master because the protagonist treats them well and humanely (but still has the magical contract).
In this case, the protagonist is a woman, and the slave is a man. Because the protagonist is worried that being a lone woman in a world where she has no support structures is dangerous for her, so she wanted a bodyguard who would not betray her. Hence buying a slave.
Given that we generally agree that it's kind of skeevy if the slave-buyer is male and the slave is female, I don't actually know if it still remains skeevy when the genders are reversed, or if the circumstances are different enough to excuse it.
It being explicitly acknowledged that the protagonist feels they can't trust anyone they aren't magically dominating is kind of fresh, but without having read it, I'd say that having the slave love the master despite the whole magical contract thing kind of ruins it.
In any case, still skeevy.
In any case, still skeevy.
Vindictus
XENO
- Location
- Texas
The notion that a woman owning a male slave is somehow 'less skeevy' than if the genders were reversed seems like the sort of thing that's based entirely in a sort of gender absolutism- where males are expected to act in perverse ways when they have the opportunity, the assumption is that a woman would not indulge herself in the same way.
That aside, this presumption of how people should and will act based on gender is not terribly relevant to the main issue here- which is that the protagonist is a slaver. While I'll grant that some slavers are worse than others, it isn't really possible for someone to be a slaver and also a good person. The two categories are mutually exclusive.
That aside, this presumption of how people should and will act based on gender is not terribly relevant to the main issue here- which is that the protagonist is a slaver. While I'll grant that some slavers are worse than others, it isn't really possible for someone to be a slaver and also a good person. The two categories are mutually exclusive.
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
If it matters (I don't think it does), the context (such as it is) is that the titular protagonist Alchemist has no combat capabilities and is worried that her potion-creating skills will be taken advantage of. So she wanted a bodyguard right now, and one that she could trust not to backstab her.
That this proceeded in her head to mean "a slave with a magical contract" made me think that it's skeevy, but I wanted to make sure, because my initial reactions have been wrong before.
I've heard the argument that it's a question of power dynamics in context, but I only got as far as that before the conversation turned into jargon more esoteric than I understood. So it felt like the sort of thing I should ask about, just so I didn't assume something incorrectly.
In this story, the protagonist bought the slave because she wanted a bodyguard, because the slave was crippled and was thus potentially facing disposal, and because she was apparently especially taken with his "beautiful blue eye" (the other eye having been injured), which all felt to me like it was entirely excuses for the author to let the protagonist have a slave-companion. But I can't actually define why I felt it was skeevy, other than "well, all that still makes her a slaver", and I was unsure if something so simple was correct.
(The slave was a "debt slave" turned "criminal slave" because he hurt his former master's son, with no other context given so far, which makes me highly suspicious that it's going to turn out to be a "oh poor misunderstood slave" situation that the protagonist could soothe with the power of her Basic Empathy, except apparently not enough empathy required to not engage in slavery.)
Literally the exact same rationale used in Shield Hero. Which kinda weighs against it when deciding skeeviness, IMO.
Jemnite
CVN-69 Fella
- Location
- 清源书院
Read what's been TL'd of Asuperu Kanojo. Struggling mangaka meets one of his three fans, who turns out to be an autistic woman who moves in with him.
I'm not an expert but the autism is being handled well - it's not just the "fun" parts of autism, but the harder, more difficult parts as well. Though there's a certain expectation that it'll turn romantic eventually, the focus is more on both of them coping with their issues. Contains some adult content.
I'm not an expert but the autism is being handled well - it's not just the "fun" parts of autism, but the harder, more difficult parts as well. Though there's a certain expectation that it'll turn romantic eventually, the focus is more on both of them coping with their issues. Contains some adult content.
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
Finished reading the latest volume of Realist Hero. Just a fun side story-ish Volume, centered around the preparation for the marriage, and the other characters' relationships as well. It's not particularly organic or believable, as with everything the story does, but it's still nice and satisfying to see. Hal's chapter is probably the best what with his own fear of Fuuga and how that ties into his impending marriage (also, more Castor is always welcome).
I quite like the depiction of the male and female roles in relationship in the story. It's more or less in line something you'd see from a pre-modern society, but with some modern and harem elements that makes it fairly balanced. If anything, they're the ones driving the relationship and thinking of the good of the House. Of course, there's the fact that most of the males are good people themselves who's more concerned about doing right by the women in the relationship even as most of them just attract multiple women. It's not a particularly nuanced depiction of medieval relationship but it's both in line with historical roles while still having a good amount of modern sensibilities in it.
That aside, the real star of the volume is the extra chapter IMHO. It has the story of Queen Elisha, Liscia's mother. It shows how her power works and how it takes tolls on her, so much so that when she met Albert it was like "What the hell, I've already died more than a dozen time in one go, if I'm going to die anyway, might as well do it while spending time with someone I actually enjoy being with." One of my friend has said that he doesn't see how the kingdom doesn't collapse under Albert and how easily they gave the crown to Souma. I think that the whole 'rewind' thing is more of a patchwork solution to those two issues, but they did make a good story out of it.
For the most part, I'm looking forward to the next arc. Since the author loves doing RotK references, it's obvious that we're entering the Three Kingdoms proper after this volume. As lighthearted as the story is, I'm somewhat afraid of Fuuga as well because I feel like he would actually deal a major blow to Souma even if no one important might actually die. The Empirse is also a whole host of problem in of itself, as we're always reminded how it has problems equal to Friedonia while being even more bloated and short-staffed.
It's a nice lighthearted volume as we're starting to get into the real period of crisis. Mostly, I'm just satisfied in how far we've come in depiction and progression of actual romance in a harem LN. Granted, this was originally a WN and those are less concerned with the whole No Relationship thing harem usually have until late in the story, but it is nice to see the relationships actually progressing and showing both sides' perspective. Mushoku Tensei's anime adaptation is already announced, so I hope this one will get its anime adaptation within 2-3 years (and hopefully with the manga's character design because those arts were gorgeous).
I quite like the depiction of the male and female roles in relationship in the story. It's more or less in line something you'd see from a pre-modern society, but with some modern and harem elements that makes it fairly balanced. If anything, they're the ones driving the relationship and thinking of the good of the House. Of course, there's the fact that most of the males are good people themselves who's more concerned about doing right by the women in the relationship even as most of them just attract multiple women. It's not a particularly nuanced depiction of medieval relationship but it's both in line with historical roles while still having a good amount of modern sensibilities in it.
That aside, the real star of the volume is the extra chapter IMHO. It has the story of Queen Elisha, Liscia's mother. It shows how her power works and how it takes tolls on her, so much so that when she met Albert it was like "What the hell, I've already died more than a dozen time in one go, if I'm going to die anyway, might as well do it while spending time with someone I actually enjoy being with." One of my friend has said that he doesn't see how the kingdom doesn't collapse under Albert and how easily they gave the crown to Souma. I think that the whole 'rewind' thing is more of a patchwork solution to those two issues, but they did make a good story out of it.
For the most part, I'm looking forward to the next arc. Since the author loves doing RotK references, it's obvious that we're entering the Three Kingdoms proper after this volume. As lighthearted as the story is, I'm somewhat afraid of Fuuga as well because I feel like he would actually deal a major blow to Souma even if no one important might actually die. The Empirse is also a whole host of problem in of itself, as we're always reminded how it has problems equal to Friedonia while being even more bloated and short-staffed.
It's a nice lighthearted volume as we're starting to get into the real period of crisis. Mostly, I'm just satisfied in how far we've come in depiction and progression of actual romance in a harem LN. Granted, this was originally a WN and those are less concerned with the whole No Relationship thing harem usually have until late in the story, but it is nice to see the relationships actually progressing and showing both sides' perspective. Mushoku Tensei's anime adaptation is already announced, so I hope this one will get its anime adaptation within 2-3 years (and hopefully with the manga's character design because those arts were gorgeous).
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
Finished The Alchemist Who Survived, and as it turned out, the protagonist buying a slave was indeed another example of the writer wanting the protagonist to have another character who was utterly devoted to them, without doing the hard work of showing how this devotion might have come about "naturally". Outside of the slave's flashbacks, the concept of slavery is left as some abstract thing that exists in the world, but does not actually affect much about it that wouldn't have been solved by regular hirelings.
It's a lazy copout. Which makes it even more of a shame, because the overall story is mainly about how the protagonist is trying to adapt to the world, since she had spent two hundred years in suspended animation, and so there's the occasional melancholy of remembering the world as it was and seeing what it has become, sprinkled with the clear PTSD of being a survivor of a monster horde stampede that flattened a city (and caused the protagonist to go into suspended animation in the first place). So there is plenty of narrative space for the protagonist to be able to gain the devotion of the clear primary love interest through her actions and personality, without having to go through this slavery business at all.
And while the beginning of the story has the justification for the slave contract to be a way for the protagonist to have someone she can trust, as it turns out, every significant character the protagonist meets is someone she can trust. So it's not a cynical world of "everyone will backstab you", but rather a optimistic world of "everyone is good at heart". Which makes the slave contract even more pointless.
I suspect a large part of why I think lazy writing is to blame is because there are a lot of descriptions of "alchemy", using fictional ingredients and fictional processes, like the author was more proud of their alchemy system which they came up with in a vacuum, and decided to write a story around it. And for some reason, the alchemy uses SI (or SI-derived) units for measurements, like Celsius.
Overall, The Alchemist Who Survived is a story that is one half an intriguing premise of a character displaced in time, and one half complete BS that could have been trimmed down or excised completely.
- Location
- Singapore
- Pronouns
- Singular They
I notice that a lot of LNs (or webnovels, often) have a "slavery" system that goes far out of its way to explain that actually these "slaves" have guaranteed rights and limited contracts and clearly delineated boundaries, and I keep thinking "dear LN authors, the concept you are looking for is 'D&D hireling'".
Derek58
Rocket Punch is Best Punch
- Location
- Getter Valhalla
Or perhaps an indentured servant.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
True, but at least in the Japanese context, a lot of 年季奉公 was supposed to be temporary or would lead to adoptation. Thus, it wouldn't quite fit the whole "despite everything, they're still owned" narrative.
I'm kind of wondering if theres some missing cultural translation issue. Slave style thematics had kind of been a thing since well before the modern isekai fad, though usually with a bit more grace to it than literally going shopping for one.
I mean if you look at it that way, Fate/Stay Night Servants basically are slaves, complete with magically compelled obedience. Zero no Tsukaima calls it Familiar, but does the same.
Something about finding a soulmate of some form through magically compelled loyalty appeals.
Vindictus
XENO
- Location
- Texas
I had a thought, a while back, of a LN style Isekai where the protagonist is summoned as the Legendary Hero, and then things go off the rails in the first chapter because it turns out the kingdom he* was summoned from was a slaver empire, and for once the 'hero' is not okay with slavery being condoned.
And honestly, I think this is an example of how the Isekai... 'genre', as it were, is underutilized as a way to explore different worlds. Most of the time, the other world is derivative, and if the protagonist has any issues with the way the world works, they're usually entirely derivative too. Isekai offers the opportunity to give an explicitly modern viewpoint towards an exploration of multiple alternative societies and sets of social norms, and to offer, through the protagonist's viewpoint, a sort of author's commentary on those alternative systems- to make arguments for and against them, and to explore new worlds of what could be.
But most Isekai is incredibly, unspeakably boring about how it handles itself. It never questions if monarchy should exist, because the author and the protagonist are too interested in fucking the goddamned queen to think about that.
*Could also be a female hero, but I sort of want to bait and switch how most male isekai protagonists are totally okay with slavery because it means they get a cute slave girlfriend or twenty.
And honestly, I think this is an example of how the Isekai... 'genre', as it were, is underutilized as a way to explore different worlds. Most of the time, the other world is derivative, and if the protagonist has any issues with the way the world works, they're usually entirely derivative too. Isekai offers the opportunity to give an explicitly modern viewpoint towards an exploration of multiple alternative societies and sets of social norms, and to offer, through the protagonist's viewpoint, a sort of author's commentary on those alternative systems- to make arguments for and against them, and to explore new worlds of what could be.
But most Isekai is incredibly, unspeakably boring about how it handles itself. It never questions if monarchy should exist, because the author and the protagonist are too interested in fucking the goddamned queen to think about that.
*Could also be a female hero, but I sort of want to bait and switch how most male isekai protagonists are totally okay with slavery because it means they get a cute slave girlfriend or twenty.
- Location
- Dethklok
I'm waiting for the next chapter of Dungeon Meshi, the update schedule is quite slow, like once a month and the last chapter (for once) ended up on a cliffhanger.
It's a weird combination, a dungeon-delving story with a focus on food-making (!), cooking done using mostly traditional D&D monsters parts, like usually once per chapter, and with the writer trying to explain how and why a D&D-like dungeon would exist (magic!/a wizard did it!) and why would people go there (treasure! Also monster parts).
The main story hook is the main character trying to save his sister, but they have to mostly live off the land (and bodies of various monsters) because of a lack of money and ressources, which explain why they have to cook monster parts. There's also a few more subplots around the dungeon itself, other adventuring parties and an evolving geopolitical situation (elves! Badass elves!). I personally find the characters (mostly the main party) endearing (not sure if it's the right term, but bear with me). There's also some originality, with the dwarf character being a poor fighter, but an excellent cook and the main character a good example of Lawful stupid (most of the time). I enjoy also the relationship between the characters. Also I like the drawing, with sometime very expressive characters:
It's a weird combination, a dungeon-delving story with a focus on food-making (!), cooking done using mostly traditional D&D monsters parts, like usually once per chapter, and with the writer trying to explain how and why a D&D-like dungeon would exist (magic!/a wizard did it!) and why would people go there (treasure! Also monster parts).
The main story hook is the main character trying to save his sister, but they have to mostly live off the land (and bodies of various monsters) because of a lack of money and ressources, which explain why they have to cook monster parts. There's also a few more subplots around the dungeon itself, other adventuring parties and an evolving geopolitical situation (elves! Badass elves!). I personally find the characters (mostly the main party) endearing (not sure if it's the right term, but bear with me). There's also some originality, with the dwarf character being a poor fighter, but an excellent cook and the main character a good example of Lawful stupid (most of the time). I enjoy also the relationship between the characters. Also I like the drawing, with sometime very expressive characters:
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