Inner Sphere Outcast

[X]Plan: We will not go Silently
-[X] Create a balanced arsenal of all types of WMDs to keep options open
-[X] Support a full reinstatement of the Ares Conventions, banning WMD use on planets and Orbital bombardment near civilians
-[X] The manned MK. 39-005 will be produced to put a manned command ASF into service immediately, but the drone version will be canceled and research begun on a proper Assault ASF, to be deployed after landing arrestors are fixed
 
Can we put quad-copters on the VTOL or is there a few more layers we should go though.

The practical limit of this is the small laser, which is half a ton.

Smaller than that and you move from heavy weapons to smaller support and infantry weapons.

Any support vehicle under 5 tons counts by the kilogram and uses support and infantry weapons, so I suppose an actual 100kg drone with an AK isn't out of the question.
 
That's not really how Mutually Assured Destruction works.

Yes, but it works if opponent can't match your capabilities. It's not like you can jump into a system, pick first asteroid you like, attach engines to it and launch it at planet. Tensor of inertia and composition of the launched object, as well as the direction of its movement, are important. Not to mention the time it takes to install all equipment. With Superhauler you bypass all these issues.
The enemy can still intercept projectile. But only if he diverted part of his forces and set up "pickets".
Thus, Houses simply should not use WMD against us due to the fact that KKV-enabled warfare would divert too many forces. And we already have an advantage in WarShips...

Basically, Small Craft make for better Torpedo Bombers than ASF because they are thin tin boxes with heavy engines. The 200 ton proposal, for example, only has the internal structure durability of a 50 ton ASF.

In that case, maybe we should make an unmanned version too...

The issue is that ASF engines guzzle fuel. A good ASF fuel load is somewhere around an hour and a half. On the same fuel, a Small Craft can run for days.

But this only means that we can be more flexible in our choices of mission profiles. For example, ASFs can accelerate for some time at the most optimal mode, turn off their engines and move by inertia, waiting for a Small Craft to overtake them. And then repeat. This in itself should increase range somewhat. And what if the tanker carries another 100 tons of fuel?
Besides, we don't always want to fly halfway across solar system. For example, when defending a planet, tankers will increase "standoff distance". Or will allow for a few additional bombings of approaching enemy fleet.
 
Yes, but it works if opponent can't match your capabilities. It's not like you can jump into a system, pick first asteroid you like, attach engines to it and launch it at planet. Tensor of inertia and composition of the launched object, as well as the direction of its movement, are important. Not to mention the time it takes to install all equipment. With Superhauler you bypass all these issues.
The enemy can still intercept projectile. But only if he diverted part of his forces and set up "pickets".
Thus, Houses simply should not use WMD against us due to the fact that KKV-enabled warfare would divert too many forces. And we already have an advantage in WarShips...

The Great Houses are short on warships, but not disposable dropships. Pretty much any dropship can be dumped into a system to become a KKV.

In that case, maybe we should make an unmanned version too...

I was going with that already. Basic SDS drone computers weigh 10 tons on a 200 ton small craft and divide allocated 'crew' tonnage requirements by half.

So a going from 3 crew and one gunner with 5 tons of accommodations each to 10 tons of automation plus 10 tons of AI computers means it pays for itself and saves manpower.

But this only means that we can be more flexible in our choices of mission profiles. For example, ASFs can accelerate for some time at the most optimal mode, turn off their engines and move by inertia, waiting for a Small Craft to overtake them. And then repeat. This in itself should increase range somewhat. And what if the tanker carries another 100 tons of fuel?
Besides, we don't always want to fly halfway across solar system. For example, when defending a planet, tankers will increase "standoff distance". Or will allow for a few additional bombings of approaching enemy fleet.

Yes, sending small craft out to refuel ASF is optimal for planetary defense because planets aren't tonnage limited. So in most cases you run into life support supplies and crew limitations before fuel since you could just conscript civilian small craft for the job. And even then TEC bypasses the life support issue with drones.

But for Warships and Dropships it's a different story because fuel is limited. If your Supercarrier warship has 1000 ASF out, or your Carrier dropship has 100 ASF, that's 1000 and 100 tons of fuel they burn about every ten minutes. If you try doing that for days across a system, you quickly run into the Warships and Dropships running dry, and require a bunch of Aqueducts to assist and become targets themselves.
 
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[X] Support a partial reinstatement of the Ares Conventions attempting to ban Chemical and Biological weapons
[X] Focus on Nukes, only making them readily available to Aerospace forces for space combat
 
[] Focus on Nukes, only making them readily available to Aerospace forces for space combat
[] Support a partial reinstatement of the Ares Conventions, attempting to ban Chemical and Biological weapons
[X] A new Small Craft will be designed to extend the range of all ASF and function as a Torpedo Bomber itself, while the One-for-All project will just replace cockpits on other variants as needed and the MK. 39-005 will be canceled for later replacement

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[X] Support a pragmaticly compromised Ares Convention after publicly championing the original Ares Conventions for PR purposes. Integrate the WMD renegotiation with reiterations of the appendices of the treaty protecting the rights of surrendering soldiers (and nobles) to make maintaining the treaty more appealing to the ruling class. Offer to serve as a neutral arbitrator, observer or facilitator to the terms of the conventions to include the exchanges of and care of POWS, occupied civilians or captured noncombatant nobles, especially the nobles. Ban the longer-lasting variants of WMDs such as dirty nukes, wide-spreading plagues and permanent poisons or notoriously cruel forms. Attempt to restrict the use of WMDs with a disproportionate scope than the intended military target, i.e. planetary biosphere destruction, planet-spanning plagues or using ten times the megatons required for factories below a significant scale etc, if you can't ban planetary use entirely. Seek lower limits on the ranks of personnel allowed access to WMDs to prevent easy escalation. Make an attempt to agree no use on civilian targets, even knowing almost everything will be considered a dual-use target, defining destruction of infrastructure necessary for continued habitation of the planet such as water purification facilities as equivalent to WMD use. If adjacent or part of a valid military target destroying such facilities is acceptable but destruction of civilian facilities would be little different from nuking a colony. Make some effort to establish mutually intelligible codes of conduct for the occupying forces and occupied civilian population in conquered worlds to protect civilians as much as you can and maybe prevent culture clashes leading to massacres.
[X] Create a balanced arsenal of all types of WMDs to keep options open also purchasing from the Periphery nations willing to sell weapons. Establish a public no-offensive first use (on planets) policy while leaving space based and defensive planetary use in extremes possible.
 
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[X] Support a full reinstatement of the Ares Conventions, banning WMD use on planets and Orbital bombardment near civilians

[X] A new Small Craft will be designed to extend the range of all ASF and function as a Torpedo Bomber itself, while the One-for-All project will just replace cockpits on other variants as needed and the MK. 39-005 will be canceled for later replacement

[X] Focus on Nukes, only making them readily available to Aerospace forces for space combat
 
This Small Craft design seems like a smart idea but at this point I feel like we need to take a higher level view of these decisions. They all seem smart in isolation but is our procurement and industrial strategy consistent after so many different votes?

You can absolutely advocate for a revised Ares Conventions. In fact, that is far, far more likely to be successful if you put effort into it.

A hardline stance in support of the Ares Conventions will get you laughed at by other powers. But if you start making compromises, you might actually get somewhere.

The Taurian Concordat, for example, didn't even agree to the original Conventions. But if you made a carve out for nukes, they might actually be able to support them without feeling like they're disarming themselves of their best defense.

Biological and Chemical weapons are in some ways crueler and harder to control than Nuclear WMDs but the floor for them is also lower, especially for Chemical weapons. I'm not entirely sure limiting them is innately good if it means people use Nukes instead. Is it possible to define limits on the forms and impacts of Chemical and Biological weapons instead? They can't last longer than X years, they can't spread become X iterations, they can't be targeted at non-military targets etc?

Limiting attacks on civilian areas also runs into the inevitable question of dual use facilities and possibly using civilians as human shields via rules lawyering. When some Mech factory is in the middle of a suburb or a military or heavy industrial R&D lab is in the downtown of a planetary capital they will become targets. Is it better to pick a more restrictive wording like 'purely civilian areas cannot be attacked' and extend extra protection to civilians? If we go too far it feels inevitable that someone will violate the rule and the taboo will be lost. At least something like that would leave the peasantry somewhere to huddle until the fighting stops. Kind of like how the Turians operate in Mass Effect. If you're in the 'neutral noncombatant zone' you're safe...ish until the new despot is determined. An Atlas will still stomp on your irradiated home and trample your super-measles infected workplace getting to the mega-chlorine drenched steel plant but at least the Firestarters won't be coming for the refugee camp your family is starving in.

More optimistically we could convince people to separate military and civilian areas but who has the time to move their mech factories or dual-use heavy industry around right now?

[X] Prepare and promote a revised Ares Convention that bans the use of biological weapons entirely, limits use of chemical weapons away from civilians, limits the use of non-laser based orbital or propelled impactor bombardment away from civilians, and has a cutout exception for nuclear use by and against the Taurians on the understanding that the other provisions will still apply.

I'm sure some Taurians will take great pride in being specifically excluded from the war crimes act but I'd be concerned that provision would be extremely toxic to the principle... and to relations with the other Taurians.
 
This Small Craft design seems like a smart idea but at this point I feel like we need to take a higher level view of these decisions. They all seem smart in isolation but is our procurement and industrial strategy consistent after so many different votes?

Your policies are consistent with what you vote for. But if you vote to support every cutting-edge and ridiculous research proposal put forward, who am I to stop you?

It's disappointing you guys didn't go with LAMs earlier, they'd be hilarious.

Biological and Chemical weapons are in some ways crueler and harder to control than Nuclear WMDs but the floor for them is also lower, especially for Chemical weapons. I'm not entirely sure limiting them is innately good if it means people use Nukes instead. Is it possible to define limits on the forms and impacts of Chemical and Biological weapons instead? They can't last longer than X years, they can't spread become X iterations, they can't be targeted at non-military targets etc?

Limiting attacks on civilian areas also runs into the inevitable question of dual use facilities and possibly using civilians as human shields via rules lawyering. When some Mech factory is in the middle of a suburb or a military or heavy industrial R&D lab is in the downtown of a planetary capital they will become targets. Is it better to pick a more restrictive wording like 'purely civilian areas cannot be attacked' and extend extra protection to civilians? If we go too far it feels inevitable that someone will violate the rule and the taboo will be lost. At least something like that would leave the peasantry somewhere to huddle until the fighting stops. Kind of like how the Turians operate in Mass Effect. If you're in the 'neutral noncombatant zone' you're safe...ish until the new despot is determined. An Atlas will still stomp on your irradiated home and trample your super-measles infected workplace getting to the mega-chlorine drenched steel plant but at least the Firestarters won't be coming for the refugee camp your family is starving in.

You can propose any type of compromise, yes. Whether any other power will care is a seperate issue.

Laws of War are fundamentally a diplomatic agreement. Nothing will stop a power that really hates you from doing all kinds of horrible things. The best you can do is abide by agreed on standards and hope the enemy reciprocated, otherwise things quickly go from tit-for-tat to complete barbarism

More optimistically we could convince people to separate military and civilian areas but who has the time to move their mech factories or dual-use heavy industry around right now?

There's about zero percent chance of that. Te entire concept of civilian and military areas isn't one that militaries have ever really cared about, it's only a concept as a PR move to use when convenient.

For example, the US strategic bombimg in WW2 focused on 'military targets', not out of kindness, but because they were trying to win a war. Against Germany this meant that factories were targeted, but against Japan where manufacturing was more distributed and buildings were flammable, everything burned. Morality had nothing to do with the targeting, only perceived military effectiveness.

Similarly, post WW2 the emphasis on avoiding civilian casualties is pretty much a 1:1 linked with the US developing precision weapons. Suddenly when a side has a military advantage, the moral standard says they are good because of it, and weaker opposing forces are automatically bad, funny how that works.
 
I'm sure some Taurians will take great pride in being specifically excluded from the war crimes act but I'd be concerned that provision would be extremely toxic to the principle... and to relations with the other Taurians.
The Taurians wouldn't sign an agreement that prohibits them from using nukes. The point is to give them the ability to sign an agreement to prevent them from being bio-plagued or gassed like happened previously when they didn't sign the Ares Convention. Allowing them to use nukes on the understanding that their opponents can use nukes on them is the fairest answer that both sides might agree to. The only reason for others to oppose it is because it treats Taurians like special snowflake, but they are special snowflakes by nature of being Taurian so you take what you can get.
 
The Taurians wouldn't sign an agreement that prohibits them from using nukes. The point is to give them the ability to sign an agreement to prevent them from being bio-plagued or gassed like happened previously when they didn't sign the Ares Convention. Allowing them to use nukes on the understanding that their opponents can use nukes on them is the fairest answer that both sides might agree to. The only reason for others to oppose it is because it treats Taurians like special snowflake, but they are special snowflakes by nature of being Taurian so you take what you can get.

Spite is the strongest and most universal state policy in BT. A specific carveout would never be accepted, just on principle. It would have to apply to everyone or not at all.
 
Spite is the strongest and most universal state policy in BT. A specific carveout would never be accepted, just on principle. It would have to apply to everyone or not at all.
Okay, then package each individual clause as a separate Convention. So each individual power will only be protected by whichever Conventions they sign. Then write the whole deal up in a nice summary package which has the same fucking effect for ease of use reference. I presumed the whole thing will be the result of starting from the full Conventions and compromising backwards anyway.
 
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Okay, then package each individual clause as a separate Convention. So each individual power will only be protected by whichever Conventions they sign. Then write the whole deal up in a nice summary package which has the same fucking effect for ease of use reference. I presumed the whole thing will be the result of starting from the full Conventions and compromising backwards anyway.

Ah, but that's the trap. Nobody will sign multiparty agreements unless they're confident the results will be universal, or at least close enough to not disadvantage themselves.

You could try smaller agreements between just yourself and a single other power at a time. They may even be followed during skirmishes. But if you enter full scale war it's because you are seen as weak, so the agreement will be toilet paper.

Getting the Inner Sphere to do anything is like herding rabid cats.

Currently the best chance for a real treaty is when the Siege of Terra ends and all heads of state arrive to discuss the succession to the First Lord of the Star League.
 
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Ah, but that's the trap. Nobody will sign multiparty agreements unless their confident the results will be universal, or at least close enough to not disadvantage themselves.
I don't see how that makes the individual clause idea unworkable. First of all the Taurians alone shouldn't be enough to get the nuke agreement derailed since they weren't part of the original Ares Conventions anyway. Start by getting everyone except the Taurians to agree to the nuke Conventions, noone will be surprised that the Taurians say no, get that Convention signed. Move on to bioweapons, everyone agrees, including the Taurians, get that Convention signed. Next limit chemical weapons away from civilians, everyone agrees, get that one signed. Limit kinetic impactors away from civilians, everyone agrees, get that one signed. So on and so forth.
 
I don't see how that makes the individual clause idea unworkable. First of all the Taurians alone shouldn't be enough to get the nuke agreement derailed since they weren't part of the original Ares Conventions anyway. Start by getting everyone except the Taurians to agree to the nuke Conventions, noone will be surprised that the Taurians say no, get that Convention signed. Move on to bioweapons, everyone agrees, including the Taurians, get that Convention signed. Next limit chemical weapons away from civilians, everyone agrees, get that one signed. Limit kinetic impactors away from civilians, everyone agrees, get that one signed. So on and so forth.

Most of the other ones would be an easier sell, yes. Taurians staying out of the nuke accord would cause the Fed Suns to do the same and collapse that one like dominoes tgough.

Maybe Canopus would object to bioweapon bans similarly to Taurians with nukes, but there's a lot less bad blood between the Canopus and everyone else, so maybe they could actually get an exception if the FWL was bribed enough and nobody else objects.

Alternatively you could go for another angle like, 'Can only use WMDs in certain areas' and try to establish a wall between the Inner Sphere and Periphery everyone agrees not to sling WMDs over.
 
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Most of the other ones would be an easier sell, yes. Taurians staying out of the nuke accord would cause the Fed Suns to do the same and collapse that one like dominoes tgough.
Im a little confused as to why, they wouldn't be at a disadvantage compared to the Taurians just because they signed the treaty and the Taurians didn't.

Anyway, a lot of this gets into the kind of horse trading that should either be beneath our direct attention or should really get a further vote beyond just a unilateral write in.
 
Im a little confused as to why, they wouldn't be at a disadvantage compared to the Taurians just because they signed the treaty and the Taurians didn't.

Anyway, a lot of this gets into the kind of horse trading that should either be beneath our direct attention or should really get a further vote beyond just a unilateral write in.

Right, this turns vote is more of a mission statement than specific deal. It was just something that meshed with the nuke question so I put it in.

When I get home I'll see about writing the next turn which should be about sending ships to the Periphery and Great Houses to properly clear out Star League assets, and hopefully pop in to say hi to Elysium finally.

Or not, since leaving them hanging would be even funnier.
 
pop in to say hi to Elysium finally.
Hey guys, I just wanted to leave a message that I took our tiny military and reconquered the Hegemony in its entirety. It is kinda a bombed out mess, and the Great Houses are circling like vultures, so you guys keep puttering along and keep your heads down since we might need a bolthole in the future.

P.S. Here are some socialist economic reforms and corporate regulations if you guys could please put them into practice.

-Your President
Kearny
 
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Hey guys, I just wanted to leave a message that I took our tiny military and reconquered the Hegemony in it entirety. It kinda a bombed out mess, and the Great Houses are circling like vultures, so you guys keep puttering along and keep your heads down since we might need a bolthole in the future.

P.S. Here are some socialist economic reforms and corporate regulations if you guys could please put them into practice.

-Your President
Kearny

He didn't even take the whole tiny military.

The warship was left behind, just to give Amaris a fair chance.
 
[X] Produce the minimum number of Nukes, to avoid heavy investment and hopefully avoid retaliation
[X] Support a full reinstatement of the Ares Conventions, banning WMD use on planets and Orbital bombardment near civilians
[X] A new Small Craft will be designed to extend the range of all ASF and function as a Torpedo Bomber itself, while the One-for-All project will just replace cockpits on other variants as needed and the MK. 39-005 will be canceled for later replacement
 
Most of the other ones would be an easier sell, yes. Taurians staying out of the nuke accord would cause the Fed Suns to do the same and collapse that one like dominoes tgough.
but why though the Taurians never signed the original conventions and that didn't stop anyone else from doing so, in fact the Cappllens established the precedent that the conventions and their protections don't apply to none signatories as shortly after the conventions were put into law the Cappelens invaded the Taurians and made sure to commit every single war crime in the books as if they were going down a check list throwing everything at the Taurians nukes ,unrestricted warship deployments , chemical weapons .. the works

there justification was that the conventions only applied between signatories and the rest of the inner sphere reacted with an "Eh, fair enough"
 
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