What? This is the timeline where Hawkmoth is a Light Yagami level strategist where even the heroes defeating his minions is simply another step of his master master plan. (His master plan to master people, or simple the true master plan behind his fake master plan?)
I... don't think that's quite true. I think he just designed a plan where it doesn't matter if they beat his minions, not a plan where them defeating his minions is a necessary step.
Animan: I get it, I would be a dinosaur if I could, too. It's the next best thing to a dragon. But, for hunting people through underground tunnels, have you considered, I don't know, a bloodhound?
I'd like to note that the main villain of the segment these random civilians are charging against is DarkBlade. Dark Blade, the guy who's main superpower is turning random civilians into his brainwashed armor clad minions.The Pharaoh is also there. Him and his ability to turn random civilians into his brainwashed mummified minions.Princess Fragrance is also stinking up the joint. And turning random civilians into her brainwashed freestyling loveslaves.Basically this fight is going to last all of thirty seconds and then the enemy horde is going to be even stronger. Which is what happens when you're facing three overlapping zombie apocalypses at the same time. (Miss Bustier, the actual zombie apocalypse, is safe with her non-Marinette's class students back at the school.)
And they could have gotten around this issue by having those three be out searching for Chat and Lady instead of being between the people and Hawkmoth. Although... Maybe these mass market Akuma really are a bit weaker than they were when he was only empowering one at a time? He's making dozens of them, so it would still be more total Akuma power.
I'd say Hawkmoth and Peacock's powers are broken, but maybe this is just what happens when you actually know what you're doing instead of being handed a Miraculous at random by a moron who doesn't know what he has or how it works?
Oh, God Damn it show. I was this close to being willing to let you get away with redeeming Chloe.
Marinette stares at dat booty as he walks away. Like, it goes all pastel and bubbly and we're supposed to thing she's looking at all of Adrien/just experiencing an upsurge in love for him, but the butt is by far the most mobile thing in the shot. Thus inevitably drawing the eyes to it.Marinette screws up the courage and goes in for a kiss. On the cheek. As thanks.
Oh wow I didn't even think of that.
Y'all got dirty minds.
Also, Chat Noir is the same age as Ladybug. And as established in the episode The Pharaoh, Ladybug is approximately 5,000 years old. So it's all fine.
Putting that aside, I'm not the one who framed that shot, and checking out Adrien's body is entirely in character for Marinette. I pretty sure we saw her actually, literally drooling at him at one point.
Re: Chloe I KNow Right?? Like, she was doing actually pretty great throughout the episode and the last one. Still arrogant and stuff, but not being insulting to her teammates, working with them instead of in spite of them, putting herself in the way of danger in order to act as defense while Carapace was trying to help Rena Rouge fight off Heartbreaker's effects, staying on task when the evil(er) version of her family showed up.
And then they ruin it in the very last scene by having her be terrible to Delphma.
Like, even have her insult Delphma's cooking or whatever, but then when Delphma starts crying or is notably hurt or something, have Chloe notice and recant. "Fine, if you're going to make a big deal of it I'll eat the damn cookies. The sacrifices a hero must has to make for the little people." Or something like that.
Still bad, but noticeably better than she was before.
Re: ChloeI KNow Right?? Like, she was doing actually pretty great throughout the episode and the last one. Still arrogant and stuff, but not being insulting to her teammates, working with them instead of in spite of them, putting herself in the way of danger in order to act as defense while Carapace was trying to help Rena Rouge fight off Heartbreaker's effects, staying on task when the evil(er) version of her family showed up.And then they ruin it in the very last scene by having her be terrible to Delphma.
Like, even have her insult Delphma's cooking or whatever, but then when Delphma starts crying or is notably hurt or something, have Chloe notice and recant. "Fine, if you're going to make a big deal of it I'll eat the damn cookies. The sacrifices a hero must has to make for the little people." Or something like that.
Still bad, but noticeably better than she was before.
Yes, exactly. You could even have her watch Delphma start crying then suddenly have Ladybug pop into her head and inspire her to do better, if you wanted to be really blatant about how she's still relying on outside influences to model better behavior.
The class just starts yelling in chorus whenever Chloe opens her mouth "Would Ladybug Approve of What You're About to Say?" and like 60% of the time Chloe just shuts her mouth again.
The class just starts yelling in chorus whenever Chloe opens her mouth "Would Ladybug Approve of What You're About to Say?" and like 60% of the time Chloe just shuts her mouth again.
Chloe: Well, I'm just going to drag Adrikins to a broom closet and kiss him silly.
Class: Would Ladybug approve of that?
Marinette: Only if I'm invited.
Lila is...
She's actually really fucking Dark for this show. Chloe has a shitty home environment, which while not making me want to forgive her, makes me think that at some point, you might be able to hammer home just how terrible she is and see a change in her personality--and she likes Adrian, if nothing else.
Lila...She's cold blooded, she enjoys what she's doing, and she knows exactly what she's doing. If it wasn't a children's show, I'd actually be worried for Marinette's physical safety around her.
Lila is...
She's actually really fucking Dark for this show. Chloe has a shitty home environment, which while not making me want to forgive her, makes me think that at some point, you might be able to hammer home just how terrible she is and see a change in her personality--and she likes Adrian, if nothing else.
Lila...She's cold blooded, she enjoys what she's doing, and she knows exactly what she's doing. If it wasn't a children's show, I'd actually be worried for Marinette's physical safety around her.
What's weird is that it started the other way around. I found a few lies to make oneself look better far more forgivable than going out of the way to ruin people's days like Chloe does. In fact, it's kind of to the show's detriment that they picked the person they did to 'redeem'.
To this point, there's been no redemption. Chloe hasn't faced any consequences, and yeah, people are still enabling her. Maybe, if at some point her Kwami refused to work with her, something might happen, but their Kwami seem to be pretty indifferent to the personality of their owners.
But yeah, with Chloe, there hasn't even been the beginning of a full on redemption arc, which really makes things difficult.
To this point, there's been no redemption. Chloe hasn't faced any consequences, and yeah, people are still enabling her. Maybe, if at some point her Kwami refused to work with her, something might happen, but their Kwami seem to be pretty indifferent to the personality of their owners.
But yeah, with Chloe, there hasn't even been the beginning of a full on redemption arc, which really makes things difficult.
EEEEEEH! I love this show so much! And this thread is so fricking hilarious!
Where do I start?! The powerful pull of potential polyshipping for pleasing the public? The shenanigans of the society of symbiotic-suited superheroes and the sensational surprises that result? The appeal of alliteration and Akuma-activated adversaries adding all the more awesomeness?
Let's see:
Tom is holding a baguette in his left hand. Seriously, look at the size of him! His arm is bigger than his mother.
Gina is holding a...holy crap is that a gun?!
Mark is there with Luca. I'm guessing Nathan got Akumatized again.
Alya's mom and oldest sister.
Anarka.
And 5 civilians I don't recognize.
Wow, actually...
Remember how Chloe actually managed to lie to Style Queen (who was her mother) enough to not get immediately zapped and ran and hid from Malediktator (who was her father) but for all the other supervillains she kept insulting them to their faces? She might actually have more self-preservation instincts than we've been giving her credit for and is counting on a reset if anything did happen to her. But when it's actually personal to her she doesn't.
Lila is like if they combined the worst features of Chloe with Alya's competence.
She's the Thrawn to Chloe's Tarkin. In terms of effectiveness anyway.
Both in that is my emotional response to the events of my personal/professional life since returning from my awesome (but physically draining) vacation, and that I am still entirely obsessed with this show. I wish I had thought to do an IWIW of this series before I actually started watching it, because I could talk about it effortlessly for hours on end. Unlike Miraculous Ladybug sometimes.
Oh right, I suppose I should get on that.
And then I did. And it was long and slow and rambly and what I did end up producing was just a bunch of uncoordinated bitching while throwing in asides about the stuff that did actually work for me. Then I got bored and realized the end was nowhere in sight after like four weeks of dead air and decided to just move on to Season 3 already.
So TLDR:
The Pharaoh is displeased.
Lots of flash with the second stage transformations and new heroes, not enough time spent on either of those factors, let alone both of them.
But three more of Marinette's classmates are, and I think that's pretty neat. And also Nathalie sorta.
And all of the regular Akuma, which I really appreciate, as the combat scenes where the animators really lean into the enhanced abilities of Kwami-enhanced individuals are by far the most enjoyable part of this show.
Kagami- new Queen, possibly of Ice. Big gay energy sword lesbian. We Stan.
Marc- new King. Oh hi Marc. Soft shy boy will kill everything, write porn. We Stan.
Saint Bustier- Technically not new. Has personality, will protec dese kids. We Stan.
All these other one-off characters- No. Go away. We want screen time on people we already Stan.
P.S. Ondine(shyren)- Oh honey, he's just not that into you. Or any other girls. Still cute though. We lowkey stan.
P.P.S. Worst Mom- Fuck OFF. All the way back to New York. We bill.
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On to season 3. Season 2 fixed most of my biggest issues with season 1. Hope S3 does same with S2.
So. Season Two.
I'd give it a C. … plus? I guess? Like it has some really good stuff, my two Favorite episodes in the entire series were in this season (Sapotis, Zombizou) and when it was good it was very very good. But when is was bad it got so frustrating that I gave serious thought to just giving up on this entire project. But it managed to pull through in the end and leave me excited for season 3. Because season 2 managed to address some of my biggest issues with season 1 (non-chronological order, lack of lore), so if season 3 manages to improve on season 2 in the same way then we'll be sitting on a very solid show.
The good: The episodes appeared to chronological in order, there was lots of lore stuff, there were changes to the dynamic between Hawkmoth/the heroes, Rena Rouge.
Rena Rouge.
But look, okay. As much as I love Rena Rouge and Carapace, and yes, even Queen Wasp… they should not have been in this season.
Like, they didn't actually add anything to the final fight. And their own episodes were largely self-contained. Three episodes in Chloe's case, because the Bourgeois definitely deserves more screen time than everybody else. So they could have been shifted to the next season and tied into the seasonal myth arc a lot more. And then Season two could have done a lot more with it's actual myth arc: The BOOK and the second stage transformations.
Because that's very much were the focus should have been given what we saw.
Last chronological episode of season 1: Volpina. All about the book.
First episode of Season 2: Le Collectioneur. All about the book and also has a Miraculous holder undergoing a different transformation.
Shyren: Huge chunks of times dealing with the Book, talking about translating the individual spells, hyping up how powerful they were, Adrien taking a big step to establish respect and independence for himself, Master Fu being known to both heroes.
Entire rest of season: Not a fucking mention. Does not even side-eye the concept.
Frozer: Oh yeah these are a thing.
Finale: Remember Shyren? Ye. Oh, and Hawkmoth's big finale is also a second stage transformation, though using a different method.
So the big deal book and transformations winds up completely overshadowed by the other Kwami (who don't actually do much in the big picture sense) and the transformations actually only come up twice. Like, did they get through the Shyren episode and then realize that they hadn't actually come up with any other transformations? Was the new merchandising line delayed?
Because let's be honest, all these alt transformations are merchandising gold. Admittedly, I haven't actually seen that much Miraculous LadySwag, but I assume it's more popular in France.
Admittedly, the other heroes were a much more interesting plotline, so taken in a vacuum I would have rather had them than the Second Stage stuff, but thematically that's not viable given the Volpina-Le Collectioneur set up.
Moving on.
The other heroes were great. The character design pops. Enough to have lots of detail without not being needlessly busy. And their origin stories are all great fun. Love it. Want some more of it. Like, really really want some more of it.
Give me that aftermath. Drop lines about how the Ladyblog changes after Alya starts moonlighting. Let us know how Nino changes after that. We got confirmation that Alya went out at least twice, did Nino? I mean, he had that secret handshake thing with Wayzz all worked out so probably?
There's just so much more I want of what I was given and that's really great.
--
Btw, Superheroism is contagious. Like, pick any superhero narrative and if it starts with just one person being a superhero or magical girl or whatever, then by the end of the first universe year, at least one person in their social circle will have also become a superhero. Probably two. And one that's gone supervillain.
Actually, know that I think about it the reverse is true in this show. Gabriel Agreste became a supervillain, then his son became a superhero, then his son's classmate also became a superhero, then the classmate's best friend became a superhero, then the best friend's boyfriend became a superhero, then the boyfriend's best friend's ex-best friend became a straight up supervillain but everybody just forgot to have a problem with that so she joined the superhero team.
Basically I'm saying that if Gabriel had completely abandoned his son instead of just mostly abandoned him, then the Agreste family could have been reunited months ago!
… wait.
--
Ehhh, fergit it.
BAH HUMBUG!
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Giving the Kwami back at the end of the episodes is a cowards move by the writers and bullshit in-universe (except for Chloe.)
Master Fu is not to be trusted and I hope Marinette grows steadily more aware of what an unprepared dumbass this guy is across season 3.
Dropped Plotlines and repeating character development/plotlines plague the show and massively pull down it's enjoyability.
Chloe a shit. Rena.
Goddamn.
Rouge.
That is all.
Just finished and caught up with all this and I wanted to say thank you for doing it. The other IWIW I've ever followed was Shadowjack's Sailor Moon (and I saw that reference way back!) and while this doesn't ride the crazy-train as much it's still so good, and about a show that for all its warts should get more attention.
Also, something occured to me, that I'm not sure was brought up yet...and I wonder...
Adrian's mom is a human popsicle and/or corpsesicle, which is the reason all this is actually happening.
We learned in that S2 finale that the Peacock Miraculous is damaged to a degree that makes it dangerous to use.
...the Peacock Miraculous that was in Gabriel's safe propped against a picture of his probably-dead wife who he wants to pull a Lazarus on.
I'm not a gambling man, but if I was I'd be putting buckets of quatloos on "Adiran's Mom was the previous Peacock Miraculous holder and its breaking is why she's currently auditioning for the role of Nora Fries".
Just finished and caught up with all this and I wanted to say thank you for doing it. The other IWIW I've ever followed was Shadowjack's Sailor Moon (and I saw that reference way back!) and while this doesn't ride the crazy-train as much it's still so good, and about a show that for all its warts should get more attention.
I don't think there's any rule against it, though the W.I.T.C.H. thread is more similar in both content and tone, which is why it's the one I recommended to a fan of this-- though that's no knock against your own style.
