I want to suck your blood - Vampires and the vampire concept

Oooh, good point.

He could also have a brother who carries on the family name, you know.
Also, plausible, except when it's explicitly stated they're his descendants.

By the way, speaking of descendants and vampires; some years ago, in a thread somewhere discussing the The Batman VS Dracula animated TV movie, I blew up at a guy for declaring that the scene where the Count uses the alias "Doctor Alucard" was "probably a reference to Hellsing", going on a rant about how he should educate himself, that alias goes back to at least 1934's Son of Dracula, blah blah blah.

Is it weird that nowadays I feel a little guilty about that?
 
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Oooh, good point.


Also, plausible, except when it's explicitly stated they're his descendants.

By the way, speaking of descendants and vampires; some years ago, in a thread somewhere discussing the The Batman VS Dracula animated TV movie, I blew up at a guy for declaring that the scene where the Count uses the alias "Doctor Alucard" was "probably a reference to Hellsing", going on a rant about how he should educate himself, that alias goes back to at least 1934's Son of Dracula, blah blah blah.

Is it weird that nowadays I feel a little guilty about that?
Yes, you shouldn't get mad at people for not knowing things

But like I dont know how severe this "blow up" was so like I cant judge if it was bad or not
 
Yes, you shouldn't get mad at people for not knowing things

But like I dont know how severe this "blow up" was so like I cant judge if it was bad or not
I think I mostly just called the guy an ignoramus or words to that effect.

It's been awhile, and I don't remember what forum it was on, so I can't check.
 
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So I kinda came up with a vampire hierarchy. From the top to the bottom.

Varcolac: the oldest vampires, tend to be in charge of clans/tribes/covens.

Strigoi: old, but considerably younger than a Varcolac. Will control the clan/tribe/coven if the Varcolac is unavailable for whatever reason, and loyalty to their Varcolac varies by individual.

Vampires: the normal guys.

Thralls: human servants of vampires(think Renfield, but usually less insane)

Feral vampires: vampires that have gone without feeding so long that they are barely a step above animals, can be recovered from by drinking blood in short time.

Chupacabras: Feral Vampires that have degraded into basically animals, this condition is permanent.

Ghouls: humans that were meant to be turned into vampires, but they died before the vampirism could set in. Are literally just zombies that drink blood.
 
Out of curiosity, how many of y'all have watched "What we do in Shadows"?

It's a pretty neat vampire serial... drama? comedy? dramedy? Something like that, anyway.
 
So, this is weird: remember how I mentioned that Vampirella has father-and-son descendants of Van Helsing in her cast? Well, Dracula just showed up.

WUT.

Though at least this has been noted, with Van Helsing fils confusedly pointing out that their ancestor killed the Count.

Out of curiosity, how many of y'all have watched "What we do in Shadows"?

It's a pretty neat vampire serial... drama? comedy? dramedy? Something like that, anyway.
Saw the movie, decided to give the show a shot, watched the first three episodes, decided that while it's good, I wasn't interested in investing the time/effort in watching it. Which, granted, has been my attitude towards television shows in general for the last six months.
 
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I liked the vampires in Near Dark. They were parasites in every possible way. They ruined things just by being around. They killed, stole shit, and destroyed things constantly. They were also dirty and looked like they smelled bad. The protagonist got taken in by the one who seemed to occasionally clean up a bit, but that all went downhill fast.
It had a bit too much of a happy ending, but Bill Paxton and Lance Henriksen really sold the whole "redneck scumbag vampire murderhobo" thing.
 
So I kinda came up with a vampire hierarchy. From the top to the bottom.

Varcolac: the oldest vampires, tend to be in charge of clans/tribes/covens.

Strigoi: old, but considerably younger than a Varcolac. Will control the clan/tribe/coven if the Varcolac is unavailable for whatever reason, and loyalty to their Varcolac varies by individual.

Vampires: the normal guys.

Thralls: human servants of vampires(think Renfield, but usually less insane)

Feral vampires: vampires that have gone without feeding so long that they are barely a step above animals, can be recovered from by drinking blood in short time.

Chupacabras: Feral Vampires that have degraded into basically animals, this condition is permanent.

Ghouls: humans that were meant to be turned into vampires, but they died before the vampirism could set in. Are literally just zombies that drink blood.
Not a bad schema.
 
I was thinking about child vampires and intelligence and it struck me for the first time that Claudia from Interview is biologically dead, which means her brain never developed passed the age of five, but she of course matures like any other person would. She ends up being a fully grown woman in terms of her mental faculties but has the body of a child.

Generally, child vampires are portrayed as physically less capable than other vampires who weer changed while adults and yet mentally they seem to develop just like others. In short , strength comes from "muscles" but intelligence doesn't come from the brain... It doesn't really work as far as I can see.

Also it's interesting there is no law in Kindred society in VTM that prohibits Embracing a human child. You would think the Camarilla would be steadfast against this for all the risks it poses to the Masquerade. But nope.

More relevantly to my current topic though, I did have to wonder how The Beast would impact a child vampire's maturity. Probably badly.
 
I was thinking about child vampires and intelligence and it struck me for the first time that Claudia from Interview is biologically dead, which means her brain never developed passed the age of five, but she of course matures like any other person would. She ends up being a fully grown woman in terms of her mental faculties but has the body of a child.

Generally, child vampires are portrayed as physically less capable than other vampires who weer changed while adults and yet mentally they seem to develop just like others. In short , strength comes from "muscles" but intelligence doesn't come from the brain... It doesn't really work as far as I can see.

Also it's interesting there is no law in Kindred society in VTM that prohibits Embracing a human child. You would think the Camarilla would be steadfast against this for all the risks it poses to the Masquerade. But nope.

More relevantly to my current topic though, I did have to wonder how The Beast would impact a child vampire's maturity. Probably badly.
that actually varies quite a bit. You'll see some child vampires who are just as physically powerful as "adult" ones. Going into anime we've got Evangeline McDowell, turned at 10, really bitter about being stuck in that body, terrifying enough to be the boogeyman of a hyperadvanced magical society that terraformed Mars. Likewise, D&D vampires gain power as they age by virtue of a deepening connection to the Negative energy plane. The only child vampire that seems exempt from this in that setting is Merilee Markuza, but her powers seem to have developed along another lines, with enhanced stealth and mental abilities beyond the standard for her age as a vampire.
 
There are some series where turning a vampire is kinda illegal



and some where Vampire children are separate species entirely, while still being contagious...
 
Was figuring of making a setting where Jiangshi (Chinese 'hopping vampires/zombies') were one of the major species, whom I don't think have been mentioned yet in this thread. Think Hsien-Ko in Darkstalkers, or VtM's Kuei-jin.

These Jiangshi would use cloning technology to reproduce for two main reasons. First, making victims into thralls has now been outlawed (though still happens anyway in secret) in their society, as slavery being banned is one of the main features of this setting (given how common it usually is in fantasy). This leads other races to treat them like a hivemind, which is not the case at all, as new generations of clones can end up differing significantly from their originals (think the Rimmer clone in that early episode of Red Dwarf). The second is that Jiangshi lack either reproductive organs or a libido, which in turn leads people to seeing them as emotionless, which again is not the case at all as Jiangshi are still very much able to form romantic feelings, in fact most of their poetry centres on love.

I was worried about that 'fantasy race as a stand-in for minorities' with this Jiangshi concept, however that's usually only a problem for settings where humans exist yet any minority is 'represented' by aliens or other races. Not the case here since, other than far in the backstory, there are no humans in this setting (closest thing are the Jiangshis' main rivals the Elves, but even they're more based on Dark Elves than regular Elves and have things like homosexuality being the norm, communal child-raising rather than nuclear families, and a main religion with sex workers for clerics. These things were all practiced by human societies, like the Ancient Greeks, Iroquois and Babylonians, but are still rare for a 'default' race in fantasy).
 
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Generally, child vampires are portrayed as physically less capable than other vampires who weer changed while adults and yet mentally they seem to develop just like others.

Off the top of my head, both the Twilight series and the Anita Blake series have it so that those turned as children definitively don't develop properly, and so turning children is consequently banned because of the major issues it causes. (Anita Blake series actually has them appear rather than just be mentioned and they are deeply fucked up)

Pretty sure other (better written) series have the same thing, those are just the two I recall without thinking about it.
 
Off the top of my head, both the Twilight series and the Anita Blake series have it so that those turned as children definitively don't develop properly, and so turning children is consequently banned because of the major issues it causes. (Anita Blake series actually has them appear rather than just be mentioned and they are deeply fucked up)

Pretty sure other (better written) series have the same thing, those are just the two I recall without thinking about it.
children forced to kill get fucked up in real life (read anything about child soldiers), so it's not too surprising they get fucked up in fiction too. I don't think it has to do with physical changes to the brain, given what a massive "biological" change undeath is to begin with.

Although that brings up another interesting thought. Do people used to killing (like Vlad Tepes, for example) adjust better to a life of required murder as a vampire than people who lived normal peaceful lives?
 
children forced to kill get fucked up in real life (read anything about child soldiers), so it's not too surprising they get fucked up in fiction too. I don't think it has to do with physical changes to the brain, given what a massive "biological" change undeath is to begin with.

Although that brings up another interesting thought. Do people used to killing (like Vlad Tepes, for example) adjust better to a life of required murder as a vampire than people who lived normal peaceful lives?

Probably depends on what kind of mental changes come with undeath. I suspect the fewer built in changes, the more it's important to select someone already inclined towards violence.
 
It's only a traumatic thing if their brain chemistry is unchanged when they are turned. If they view things from a more predatory viewpoint then killing left and right isn't a thing to worry twice about
 
The Familiars from Gather, Darkness by Fritz Leiber are an interesting take on vampirism.
Gather Darkness by Fritz Leiber said:
Dickon was not worried. Such emotions were much too elaborate for his clearcut, highly simplified mind. Even his frequent self-pity was matter-of-fact. But he knew that his fresh blood was running low, and waste blood piling up, even under the slight demands of his ribbonlike muscles. He had gorged himself at the Breeding Place, but it wouldn't last forever. Eventually he would have to stop moving.

But before that happened he would be able to explore a few more branches of the huge inside- out tree which was Dickon's mental diagram of the ventilation system of the crypts.

It was very windy in the tunnels. He had to buck a constant gale. If he ever let go all four suctorial paws at once, he would be whisked like a bit of waste for an indeterminate distance before he managed to bring himself to a stop with his claws—if he could. For Dickon, as he often told himself, was a mere diagram of a man. His bones were lighter than a monkey's, his body had not a genuine fat cell in it, and his internal organs were reduced to a single compartmentalized cavity which served both as blood pump and blood-storage chamber. All physiological substances for the production or conditioning of which other organs were necessary, he sucked in along with the blood he drew from his symbiotic partner through his wizened little mouth. He neither digested nor eliminated. He did not breathe, although he could make feeble sounds and even talk sketchily by drawing air into his mouth cavity and expelling it between taut lips. His bones were hollow, since he needed no marrow for producing blood corpuscles. He was without ductless glands and had no sex. His fine, short fur insulated him against loss of body heat.

Just a skeleton, muscles, tendons, skin, fur, heart, simplified circulatory system, nervous system, twitching ears, peering eyes—and a personality as queerly simple as his physiology.

One of the aims of the original makers of his artificial species had been to devise an extremely swift and nimble organism by eliminating as much weight and as many functions as possible. This aim they had achieved, but at the inescapable cost of making the creature absolutely dependent on its symbiotic partner or some other blood supply, and strictly limiting the extent of its activity before return to such blood supply became imperative.
 
I basically got harangued by someone elsewhere over how to pronounce Jiangshi. I did get that Chinese words can be hard to say as they're often very specific inflection-wise, and that you're not meant to pronounce the i in shi (or in Jiang I think, but it still changes how you pronounce the J), but really all they needed to do was just link to a video or audio file with the correct pronunciation.

Edit: I've now updated my new Worldbuilding thread to cover the Jiangshi, much more in-depth compared to what I've said here. This'd include more on their society, origins and history, crafts and technology. Link here
 
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So, I recently came across the following article, any of you have thoughts on it?

www.northjersey.com

This early 'Dracula' movie has a message for today

The first "Dracula" movie, the 1922 classic "Nosferatu," wasn't about vampires. It was about plague. Which is why it's so timely now
COVID-19 has made us look at a lot of familiar things with fresh eyes: from a handshake to a doorknob to a grocery list. Certain movies, too, will never look quite the same. One is this early silent movie version of "Dracula," which might have been made with the present moment in mind. And no wonder — because it was made during a similar moment.

...

"Nosferatu" is old. It will be celebrating its 100th birthday in two years. But history is said to repeat. And in a time of plague, paranoia and fear-mongering — alas! — everything old is new again.
 
Two more interesting takes...
Blood by Fredric Brown said:
In their time machine, Vron and Dreena, last two survivors of the race of vampires, fled into the future to escape annihilation. They held hands and consoled one another in their terror and their hunger.

In the twenty-second century mankind had found them out, had discovered that the legend of vampires living secretly among humans was not a legend at all, but fact.
There had been a pogrom that had found and killed every vampire but these two, who had already been working on a time machine and who had finished in time to escape in it.

Into the future, far enough into the future that the very word 'vampire' would be forgotten so they could again live unsuspected — and from their loins regenerate their race.

"I'm hungry, Vron. Awfully hungry."

"I too, Dreena dear. We'll stop again soon."

They had stopped four times already and had narrowly escaped dying each time. They had not been forgotten. The last stop, half a million years back, had shown them a world gone to the dogs — quite literally: human beings were extinct and dogs had become civilized and man-like. Still they had been recognized for what they were. They'd managed to feed once, on the blood of a tender young bitch, but then they'd been hounded back to their time machine and into flight again.

"Thanks for stopping," Dreena said. She sighed.

"Don't thank me," said Vron grimly. "This is the end of the line. We're out of fuel and we'll find none here — by now all radioactives will have turned to lead. We live here ... or else."

They went out to scout. "Look," said Dreena excitedly, pointing to
something walking toward them. "A new creature I The dogs are gone and something else has taken over. And surely we're forgotten."

The approaching creature was telepathic. "I have heard your thoughts," said a voice inside their brains. "You wonder whether we
know 'vampires,' whatever they are. We do not."

Dreena clutched Vron's arm in ecstasy. "Freedom!" she murmured hungrily. "And food."

"You also wonder," said the voice, "about my origin and evolution.
All life today is vegetable. I — " He bowed low to them. "I, a member of the dominant race, was once what you called a turnip."
 
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