- Location
- Russia
- Pronouns
- He/Him
But Bluff also seems useful... maybe swapping favoured class bonus?
Finding the Spark (Pathfinder 1E Quest)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Fantasy
-
- Tags
- pathfinder
A. By the time she was adventuring, IIRC, Daenerys was effectively a moderately famous princess in a magic friendly kingdom who was reasonably evident magical herself, and had a retinue of trusted friends and effectively bodyguards. None if that applies to us (including the friends bit).
B. I'm more just thinking every day life, and not mechanics only adventuring.
We want to walk, climb, swim or run anywhere? Being a child will make life suck.
We want to interact with normal society without having to explain that we're a magical cursed oracle every step (and definitely not a sorcerer child who's lost his marbles)? That kind of sucks.
We don't want to get trampled in a completely mundane mob of people without breaking out magic? Kind of sucks.
We don't want to look like easy prey for marauders, slavers and hungry animals? We don't want to look really suspicious when we're just travelling, alone, down the road? We want to move a heavy object that may just be outright bigger than us? We don't want to have to advertise the fact we're a mage just to be treated like an adult? We ever get into a fistfight, or even just get drugged with an adult's dosage?
All kind of sucks.
I'm not sure how much that word for word turns up in pathfinder, but it sounds less fun than frustrating to just repeatedly be treated as the child we look like every time we meet someone new.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
We aren't ever going to have enough skill points we need for everything we want, so you have to focus on the necessities. Pick one, Bluff or Diplomacy, and stick with it.
I definitely wouldn't be lowering our HP for another skill point, especially not if you want to go with the Child Curse.
- Location
- Russia
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Okay, thank you for advice. I'll hope that our Diplomacy will help to find friends with Bluff.
For me it looks like interesting difficulties to overcome, especially in DP quest.
- Location
- washington
I mean I still want friends and party members which friendless makes hard.
somewhat looks like making a bit of an edgelord if I'm being honest with our race and build.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
As I explained yesterday, no, it really doesn't. The Friendless Curse doesn't literally make us a pariah unable to find friends and companions, it just magically prevents us from using the Diplomacy skill without consequences. Most adventurers don't have the Diplomacy skill and many of them have negative Charisma modifiers, but that doesn't prevent them from finding teammates.
It stops us from capitalizing on our high Charisma score and means we can't be a team's "face", but we aren't actually cursed to be alone forever.
- Location
- washington
isn't that likely to come up a lot like a lot a lot? we wont be able to boss around party members to tell party members what to do and makes any leadership position for enacting plans seem difficult?
Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Probably early on, when we're low level and not personally powerful. But that's fine, we don't have to be a leader right from the beginning, or ever for that matter. You can't always start off in charge, especially when you have no experience or reputation.
Eventually we might put together our own crew, or find one to run with. Or we might run solo more often than not and work as an independent contractor.
There are plenty of opportunities on Golarion for all sorts of adventures and endeavors.
- Location
- washington
while thats fair I foresee us making plans in every combat scenario with other party members not working well with us. Well unless we can ooc control their actions during combat. I don't need to be in a leadership position personally just find that we're gonna be in a lot of scenarios where we really wish we were.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle - Deafened Edition
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Improved Initiative
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Secret-Keeper (Faith): You gain a +3 trait bonus on Bluff checks when they are opposed by another's Sense Motive check.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonuson Perception checks, and Perception is always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Deaf Curse]
--[X] Revelation: Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sight shadowdancerclass feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Protection from Evil, Shadow Trap
Hope you don't mind me stealing most of your plan @Goldfish I like the build, but friendless is sort of annoying.
I vastly prefer it to eternal child though. Friendless makes it impossible to use diplo long term, looking like a kid till you die is functionally social exile.
Being dead would make for some interesting trials to explore for Kori, especially in a society that seems prone to being unkind about that sort of thing, but doesn't stop us from forming normal social bonds with people given time.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle - Deafened Edition
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Improved Initiative
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Secret-Keeper (Faith): You gain a +3 trait bonus on Bluff checks when they are opposed by another's Sense Motive check.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonuson Perception checks, and Perception is always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Deaf Curse]
--[X] Revelation: Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sight shadowdancerclass feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Protection from Evil, Shadow Trap
Hope you don't mind me stealing most of your plan @Goldfish I like the build, but friendless is sort of annoying.
I vastly prefer it to eternal child though. Friendless makes it impossible to use diplo long term, looking like a kid till you die is functionally social exile.
Being dead would make for some interesting trials to explore for Kori, especially in a society that seems prone to being unkind about that sort of thing, but doesn't stop us from forming normal social bonds with people given time.
Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Here's a basic starting gear package for Kori. It's pretty barebones, but it doesn't make much sense to start off loaded down with a lot of stuff. There is also weight to consider. At STR 8 our 'heavy load' rating is only 54 pounds, so we definitely have to stay under that to avoid penalties.
This totals up to 49 pounds, a medium load. We can drop our pack to go down to a light load for full movement speed in combat. Total cost of 74 gp leaves us with 46 gp to play with.
[] Starting Gear
-[] Modified Oracle's Kit (Darklands Caligni Edition): Backpack, Bedroll, Belt Pouch, Chalk, Candles (10), Flint & Steel, Iron Pot, Mess Kit, Rope (50ft), Trail Rations (5 days), Waterskin (Empty), Hammer, Pitons (5). Weight: 19 pounds, Cost: 10 gp
-[] Armor & Shield:
--[] Hide Shirt (+3 AC): Weight: 18 pounds, Cost: 20 gp
--[] Buckler (+1 AC): Weight: 5 pounds, Cost: 5 gp
-[] Weapons:
--[] Dagger (1d4 damage): Weight: 1 pound, Cost: 2 gp
--[] Light Crossbow(1d6 damage): Weight: 4 pounds, Cost: 35 gp
--[] Crossbow Bolts (20): Weight: 2 pounds, Cost: 2 gp
This totals up to 49 pounds, a medium load. We can drop our pack to go down to a light load for full movement speed in combat. Total cost of 74 gp leaves us with 46 gp to play with.
[] Starting Gear
-[] Modified Oracle's Kit (Darklands Caligni Edition): Backpack, Bedroll, Belt Pouch, Chalk, Candles (10), Flint & Steel, Iron Pot, Mess Kit, Rope (50ft), Trail Rations (5 days), Waterskin (Empty), Hammer, Pitons (5). Weight: 19 pounds, Cost: 10 gp
-[] Armor & Shield:
--[] Hide Shirt (+3 AC): Weight: 18 pounds, Cost: 20 gp
--[] Buckler (+1 AC): Weight: 5 pounds, Cost: 5 gp
-[] Weapons:
--[] Dagger (1d4 damage): Weight: 1 pound, Cost: 2 gp
--[] Light Crossbow(1d6 damage): Weight: 4 pounds, Cost: 35 gp
--[] Crossbow Bolts (20): Weight: 2 pounds, Cost: 2 gp
- Location
- washington
its almost as bad honestly for social bonds? and kinda messes with a lot of intrigue if we can't hear people.
I like to imagine my own friends don't hang out with me and respect my opinions because of my Diplomacy score myself, to be honest. If it's something we're good at and they're really our friends, then they'll listen to us; if it's something we're not good at and we're really their friends (like, in this character's case, small unit tactics), then presumably we should listen to them.
Edit: Sorry, wrong quote initially.
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- Location
- washington
I mean yes we are kinda in a shit place right now though so good people willing to take us in seems somewhat unlikely? Well I guess we could befriend some slaves. Also you know I'm mentioning leadership position like tactics in a battle. Also we need to get them to like us unless you think we're lucky enough to be the ones approached to try to get us to like them.
Well.., yes, I did.
Roland was a knight, and so probably the best qualified in his party to understand tactics.
Akorian is not a knight, or any kind of warrior, or any kind of tactician in general, and so I don't see why his in character contributions to such would be particularly valuable.
Just… be personable and stick out for them? I don't actually remember Roland making diplomacy checks for most of his crew either, as much as they were thrown together by fate and gravitated around him as the valiant and fair hearted warrior noble. Certainly, I don't remember applying some spark of charisma to make my friends (thank goodness).
It'll be harder, but not unfathomably difficult.
Plus, maybe we'll slot into someone else's party, instead of having to make our own whole cloth. You never know.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Being deaf is a really rough condition on Golarion. There is no real sign language, leaving aside Drow hand sign, which is a secret language exclusive to them IIRC, so communicating with people is going to be very difficult.
Not being able to make sound-related Perception checks in the Darklands of all places is scary, too.
If you want an alternative to Friendless, what about Haunted? That one could fit a Darklands Shadow Oracle, and would mean we'll with the Umbral Unmasking drawback.
As bad as what? Being a child forever would make it incredibly difficult to be taken seriously by people who don't know us, and hard to not be treated as even more of an outcast by those who don't know us well.
It's basically a wall between us and everyone else that will take forever to work around, and won't even truly come down even then.
Compared to friendless it's more of an issue, but it doesn't cut off a base social skill. The tactical consequences of it are worth noting, but a lot of things down here are silent stealth predators anyway. The curse also gives a sequence of pretty good mitigations for that sort of thing as we level, so it isn't as serious a concern in that area forever.
Beyond that, if this is supposed to be something we take to avoid losing diplo while
maintaining our low social build, then we should use the skills we retain to address our curse. Get someone willing to work with us, work our way up to summoning something to hear for us, whatever is the most convenient once we've started.
- Location
- washington
as opposed to friendless for making friends really. also the summon things to hear for us hmm thats not that bad an idea I've even seen it done before. Though might take a while and we kinda do need to talk for early levels I imagine also there would be ways to mess with that. Not that contingencies can't be made or anything is perfect. Also from a more practical point I'd say I'm not sure you can convince many to actually vote for deaf?
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Made a couple of adjustments to my plan since initially posting it, thanks to @Shine and @Arhin's suggestions.
Swapped out a skill point from Spellcraft to start off with Sense Motive, changed the Secret Keeper trait for Fate's Favored (to use in conjunction with the Divine Favor spell which I switched to from Shadow Trap), and picked Extra Revelation to learn Cloak of Darkness instead of Improved Initiative. When using Cloak of Darkness, our starting Stealth bonus will be +11.
Also added a section for languages. In addition to the starting languages (Dark Folk and Undercommon), I've selected Common as our bonus language. Not super helpful in the Darklands, but it will make it much easier to communicate with any explorers from the surface and we'll be able to get by on the surface ourselves when we eventually travel there.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Extra Revelation (Cloak of Darkness)
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Languages: Dark Folk, Duergar
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Fate's Favored (Faith): Whenever you are under the effect of a luck bonus of any kind, that bonus increases by 1.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonus on Perception checks, and Perception is always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Friendless Curse]
-[X] Revelation:
--[X] Cloak of Darkness (Su): You conjure a cloak of shadowy darkness that grants you a +4 armor bonus and a +2 circumstance bonus on Stealth checks. At 7th level, and every four levels thereafter, these bonuses increase by +2. You can use this cloak for 1 hour per day per oracle level. The duration does not need to be consecutive, but it must be spent in 1-hour increments.
--[X] Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sight shadowdancer class feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Divine Favor, Protection from Evil
Swapped out a skill point from Spellcraft to start off with Sense Motive, changed the Secret Keeper trait for Fate's Favored (to use in conjunction with the Divine Favor spell which I switched to from Shadow Trap), and picked Extra Revelation to learn Cloak of Darkness instead of Improved Initiative. When using Cloak of Darkness, our starting Stealth bonus will be +11.
Also added a section for languages.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Extra Revelation (Cloak of Darkness)
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Languages: Dark Folk, Duergar
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Fate's Favored (Faith): Whenever you are under the effect of a luck bonus of any kind, that bonus increases by 1.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonus on Perception checks, and Perception is always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Friendless Curse]
-[X] Revelation:
--[X] Cloak of Darkness (Su): You conjure a cloak of shadowy darkness that grants you a +4 armor bonus and a +2 circumstance bonus on Stealth checks. At 7th level, and every four levels thereafter, these bonuses increase by +2. You can use this cloak for 1 hour per day per oracle level. The duration does not need to be consecutive, but it must be spent in 1-hour increments.
--[X] Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sight shadowdancer class feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Divine Favor, Protection from Evil
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How about Forsaken instead?
It doesn't directly mess with diplomacy, but it does provide a strong character reason for us to vote around playing that sort of game. An oracle so traumatized by their early life that it ends up branded on their soul as a curse should be slow to trust at the very least, but it doesn't stop us from forming strong bonds with a small group once we've established some basic level of understanding.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle - Forsaken Edition
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Improved Initiative
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Secret-Keeper (Faith): You gain a +3 trait bonus on Bluff checks when they are opposed by another's Sense Motive check.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonuson Perception checks, and Perceptionis always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Forsaken Curse]
--[X] Revelation: Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sightshadowdancerclass feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Protection from Evil, Shadow Trap
It fits perfectly with how Kori's been treated, gives a meaningful but manageable debuff, and provides an immediately useful series of buffs based on the conditions he's currently living in.
It doesn't directly mess with diplomacy, but it does provide a strong character reason for us to vote around playing that sort of game. An oracle so traumatized by their early life that it ends up branded on their soul as a curse should be slow to trust at the very least, but it doesn't stop us from forming strong bonds with a small group once we've established some basic level of understanding.
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle
[X] Akorian the Caligni Oracle - Forsaken Edition
-[X] Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
-[X] Favored Class Bonus: +1 Hit Point
-[X] Attributes (20-point Buy; +2 DEX, +2 CON, -2 INT): STR 8, DEX 14, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 17
-[X] Feat: Improved Initiative
-[X] Skills (5 points): +1 Bluff, +1 Knowledge (Dungeoneering), +1 Perception, +1 Sense Motive, +1 Stealth
-[X] Drawback:
--[X] Umbral Unmasking: The shadow you cast is monstrous. Under normal lighted conditions, this is not hard to observe—but uncommon to notice. Creatures that succeed at a DC 15 Wisdom check notice it plainly (an additional Perception check may be required based on environmental conditions). This telltale sign of wickedness cannot be concealed by misdirection, nondetection, or illusions, except those that also affect shadows (such as invisibility).
-[X] Traits:
--[X] Reactionary (Combat): You gain a +2 trait bonus on initiative checks.
--[X] Secret-Keeper (Faith): You gain a +3 trait bonus on Bluff checks when they are opposed by another's Sense Motive check.
--[X] Seeker (Social): You gain a +1 trait bonuson Perception checks, and Perceptionis always a class skill for you.
-[X] Class: Oracle (Shadow Mystery) [Forsaken Curse]
--[X] Revelation: Stealth Mastery (Ex): You gain Skill Focus (Stealth). At 8th level, you gain Signature Skill (Stealth), even if you don't meet the feat's prerequisites. At 16th level, you gain the hide in plain sightshadowdancerclass feature.
-[X] Spells:
--[X] Orisons: Create Water, Detect Magic, Guidance, Mending
--[X] 1st Level: Cure Light Wounds (B), Protection from Evil, Shadow Trap
@Goldfish there is no reasonable way for Kori to know Common (which is propperly Taldan since they invaded most of the Inner sea Region at one point or another), he has never met a surface dweller in his life. Also less importantly 'Undercommon' is a silly concept that I will be changing from canon, the drow did not invade Nar Vroth to impose a common language, traders in this region of the Darklands speak a Duegar-derived language, so I'll take undercommon to mean that.
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Goldfish
Friendly Spider-Fish Abomination
- Location
- Formerly of the Far Realm
Okay, sounds good to me.
Duergar normally start with the Undercommon and Dwarven languages, so having Duergar as the effective equivalent to Common (Darklands) makes sense.
- Location
- washington
we never met a slave? Like I understand not having learned the language. we've never even met a slave or someone who knows it though?
TheOmnimercurial
Dragon Bard
- Location
- UK
Animal Companion as Mount and Beast of Burden for loot!
Kori's tribe do not keep slaves, not necessarily out of moral compunction, but because they are quite poor and isolated. If you want to find burnlands slaves hook up with a duegar trade caravan