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Even Further Beyond [Complete]
- Thread starter Rihaku
- Start date
- Original
[X] Strategic Complexion
[X] I'll Face Myself
We should really check in with grandpa now that he can no longer smite us.
[X] I'll Face Myself
We should really check in with grandpa now that he can no longer smite us.
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
Extra diligent thought. Extrusion is marginally sympathetic but was entirely serious about how it would take millennia for the scepter and didn't want us to burn out from not getting as much as we thought from practice.
Do you want me to try to produce a full and exhaustive list of corner cases where some option we could take would prove useful? Because I'm pretty sure I can find some for any option that actually has known results. Unless we expect that case to actually be an issue, those typically aren't worth worrying about.
- Location
- Australia
While a valid threat normally, we are doing this in elven lands that explicitly are such good living conditions that we can not have a Spoiled episode, and we are truly enjoying our discoveries in necromancy as well as it being more fun hopefully than it feels like it being work. I'm hoping they both mitigate burn out.
And it could totally take thousands of years for a Titan to master. However a year of solid effort probably goes a long way towards getting the hang of the basics, and we only have two before we probably want to drain a goddess so we may as well get started!
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- Location
- The savanna.
[X] Pursuit of the Truth
[X] Strategic Complexion
We need to face facts: Imperial instability is a threat to our life. Like, we can bitch about Nameless being lazy when it comes to training, but this is way more important. We ditched the Vault, we didn't take King to get rid of our loss condition, so Strategic Complexion is kinda necessary.
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
The dream of being a dickass orb thief... I had given up hope, but here we are. Odyssial always finds a way, but we get to open one. Palimpsest because the social bonuses will help if we're gonna negotiate with Yong Shen. Sucks to lose all that Cultivation progress from Elder Beast, but Balance is better quality of life in the long run.
[X] Strategic Complexion
We need to face facts: Imperial instability is a threat to our life. Like, we can bitch about Nameless being lazy when it comes to training, but this is way more important. We ditched the Vault, we didn't take King to get rid of our loss condition, so Strategic Complexion is kinda necessary.
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
The dream of being a dickass orb thief... I had given up hope, but here we are. Odyssial always finds a way, but we get to open one. Palimpsest because the social bonuses will help if we're gonna negotiate with Yong Shen. Sucks to lose all that Cultivation progress from Elder Beast, but Balance is better quality of life in the long run.
Kalkin
(╯ ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ╯︵ ┻─┻
- Location
- AK
Is it the standard of living though? I assumed that there just wasn't access to the type of things that'd allow Nameless to indulge spoiled. Think of an alcoholic moving into some puritan town.
Enohthree
Hypersane
Nope, the massive quality of life that comes with eating elven food, breathing elven air, etc. mitigated spoiled since we're technically being indulged all the time.
- Location
- Australia
I figured it referred to bathos, an antiquated inverse of pathos. It describes a sudden lack of strong emotion: most commonly a disappointment or anticlimax.
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Inserted tally
[X] Pursuit of the Truth
[X] Strategic Complexion
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
Truth is something we can reasonably get that synergizes very well with itself and the rest of our build, and we really want the empire to last so that we're not on the edge of failing. Plus, seeing the family again should be really fun.
[X] Strategic Complexion
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
Truth is something we can reasonably get that synergizes very well with itself and the rest of our build, and we really want the empire to last so that we're not on the edge of failing. Plus, seeing the family again should be really fun.
- Location
- US
[X] Pursuit of the Truth
[X] Extra Diligent
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
[X] Extra Diligent
[X] Open the Way
[X] Palimpsest - Form of Balance [1 Beyond Point]
Oh right. I'll also toss out the argument from perverse incentives against dealing with the Empire: assuming it does risk collapse if we don't deal with it, it will get closer to collapse over time. If we put dealing with that off until we're forced to deal with it actively, that's likely to be a significant disadvantage, of the form we need to get All Paths working on the Drawback. On the other hand, dealing with it now isn't anywhere near as clearly because of the Drawback, so I'm not sure if it would count for the purpose of All Paths.
(Obviously, I assume we would rather lose the Drawback if our choices were to lose it or keep the empire up, because we need to get rid of it eventually and before the Heroine spawns is a good time. Other people may have other opinions.)
(Obviously, I assume we would rather lose the Drawback if our choices were to lose it or keep the empire up, because we need to get rid of it eventually and before the Heroine spawns is a good time. Other people may have other opinions.)
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- Location
- Australia
We did not use Aurelia's nickname even once during the update! Travesty! A disgrace!*
All the blood, sweat and tears poor Nameless put into picking the perfect essence of pure elven waifu in letter form evaporated like dew drops in the harsh uncompromising Sun!**
* You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
**Entire picoseconds of work! And he could have ordered dozens of refreshing elven beverages in that time with cultivator speed!
All the blood, sweat and tears poor Nameless put into picking the perfect essence of pure elven waifu in letter form evaporated like dew drops in the harsh uncompromising Sun!**
* You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
**Entire picoseconds of work! And he could have ordered dozens of refreshing elven beverages in that time with cultivator speed!
Also, having just run a tally: why are there so many different votes for the same thing? I'm not really one to talk, I have a separate vote for I'll Face Myself (though to be fair that's because I like the color and want it to be there in the vote tally), but in general, we really don't need people pasting in the whole blurb!
Wow, that's a lot of support for Extra Diligent. I can kinda understand that! But I do have to ask if all its voters are aware that its gains as a scepter will be minimal, and that its payoff will be if the lich becomes substantially more interested in Necromancy. It's not a one-to-one training boost.
- Location
- Pindorama
Hmmm, I don't know if it's a good idea to remove Spoiled directly if Aurelia is against it; it would also be an anticlimax, in my opinion. The last update was littered with recriminations of this being caused by our "greed" and "always taking the easy option" (I disagree but no matter) when asking Aurelia to remove Spoiled would be a continuation of this perceived trend. It's also quite the whiplash from the previous fear of Aurelia unduly influencing us; If you prize Nameless's independence as some sort of principle, I'll Face Myself undermines that severely.
[X] Extra Diligent
[X] Strategic Complexion
[X] Amplification
[X] Open the Way
This is basically the "slurp on some monsters" plan. It aims to master Cultivation-leeching as fast as possible and basically takes the opportunity to stabilize the Empire, since we will act against the Overgrowth anyway. Amplification for additional Cultivation gains ans Open the Way to facilitate both exploiting the Overgrowth and Strategic complexion.
Well, time to see the Devil's Advocacy, if any. Have we gotten Aurelia as a Lieutenant, @Rihaku ?
[X] Extra Diligent
[X] Strategic Complexion
[X] Amplification
[X] Open the Way
This is basically the "slurp on some monsters" plan. It aims to master Cultivation-leeching as fast as possible and basically takes the opportunity to stabilize the Empire, since we will act against the Overgrowth anyway. Amplification for additional Cultivation gains ans Open the Way to facilitate both exploiting the Overgrowth and Strategic complexion.
Well, time to see the Devil's Advocacy, if any. Have we gotten Aurelia as a Lieutenant, @Rihaku ?
Rihaku
The Internet
Hey guys, remember that Truespelling Form of Balance most likely does not provide any mental-type bonuses, only bonuses that might plausibly be governed by a body (from which the user's mind has already been transferred to a phylactery). In contrast, Amplification provides an almost-guaranteed relevant boost to Cultivation speed, which is what you guys intended to prioritize. If the Overgrowth Plan works then you may not care, but why risk it so severely in your position?
The current winning combination focuses almost unilaterally on Nameless' personal power and capabilities. Given how astronomical his power already is, is this the wisest allocation of resources? Why not take Strategic Complexion and actually begin using some of that power to close off or mitigate areas of vulnerability?
The current winning combination focuses almost unilaterally on Nameless' personal power and capabilities. Given how astronomical his power already is, is this the wisest allocation of resources? Why not take Strategic Complexion and actually begin using some of that power to close off or mitigate areas of vulnerability?
We don't actually know this, it's worth noting. The variability could be based on how interested Nameless finds himself to be, for instance. Of course, this is possible, but we really can't definitively assert it, unless I'm missing something.
I feel like the easy option, at least in character, is to not change. It's presumably easier to keep doing what you're doing, and ignore the fact that you should be reworking how you think, even if it's not the right thing to do. On the other hand, people could easily disagree with me here.
I wanted independence back when it was an option. Now that it really isn't, and we're bound to Aurelia forever, I want to take advantage of that. We know she's loyal to us, we invested our Oath artifact (plus a BP which we would have gotten otherwise) and a significant bonus — one which would have been worth a BP wherever it was applied, at least roughly — in making our relationship as strong as it can be. We've invested quite a lot in it, let's at least reap some of the reward from that investment.
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
[x]Pursuit of the Truth
[x]Strategic Complexion
[X] Amplification
[X] Llewyn's Prodigious Might
[x]Strategic Complexion
[X] Amplification
[X] Llewyn's Prodigious Might
- Location
- The Surface Of A Hostile Planet
Inserted tally
RedV
Refuelling
- Location
- Right here
We didn't since her loyalty was 5, not 8 iirc.
I agree that Aurelia is like a therapist and its fine to use her for this purpose, but her option is competing with Strategic Complexion and True Incarnation and Extra Diligent, which I personally feel are overall more important to take before Heroine awakens.
I mean, we need to reinforce the Empire while either mastering the Necromancer for a protracted anti-Heroine offensive suite (we don't have enough time to FB relevant esoteric Diagrams) or get True Incarnation for the Fated Love Immunity before Heroine wakes up or she'll get shunted into 5000 year training or make us love her.
Diligence attempts to correct work ethic which was main problem of Spoiled anyway.