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Dumbest vs/fiction arguments you've ever heard?

Mak Taru

Mak Taru

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This thread isn't about claims ('X can do Y') but rather arguments used to back up said claims (X can do Y because Z')

For example, people have argued that Balrogs can't move at hypersonic speeds because they would catch on fire from friction with the air. Setting aside the issue of whether Balrogs actually are hypersonic or not, this is a terrible argument for many reasons.

Firstly, the majority of fictional hypersonic characters (especially in fantasy/non-science-based settings) don't demonstrate that side effect.

Secondly, and most hilariously, this argument could only be made by someone who hasn't the faintest clue of what a Balrog actually is, because being on fire is its natural state. Saying that a Balrog can't move that fast because it would catch on fire is like saying that a fish can't swim through water because it would get wet.
 
I've been in threads on very old forums where people have argued at length that the United Federation of Planets would beat the Culture, Daleks, and Time Lords.
 
Scots Dragon said:
I've been in threads on very old forums where people have argued at length that the United Federation of Planets would beat the Culture, Daleks, and Time Lords.
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But what reasoning did they use for that? This isn't about claims, it's about how they try to justify those claims. Even if a claim is so out there as to have no possible justification, the point of this is to look at the attempted justifications they give.

For example, did they say something like 'The Federation can beat the Culture because by using time travel', or 'The Federation can beat the Daleks because they can't climb stairs'?
 
"Women aren't as strong as men, therefore I can beat Supergirl."

Morgoth of the Silmarillion setting has invested the bulk of his essence into the world of Arda much as Sauron did into his Ring, and therefore can't be destroyed without destroying Arda. The Avada Kedavra spell of the Harry Potter setting can kill anything it hits. Therefore, Voldemort can kill Morgoth by firing an Avada Kedavra at the ground and killing the world.
 
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After Infinity War there were quite a few people claiming that WW2 era or developing nations could conquer Wakanda because "It's possible to tunnel under or force your way through the shield." I shouldn't have to explain why that's bs.

I've seen some people argue that scifi always beats irl modern day, which seems to make sense until you remember that writers have no sense of scale and care more for dramatic scenes than proper military tactics and strategy.
Case in point, the army deployed at the end of endgame is melee focused and largely not bullet proof. They don't have anything you can argue our militaries can't handle besides the spaceship itself.

Mild Endgame spoilers, I can't remember if that's cool yet.
 
I am reminded of a thread I read where someone argued that because the Skyline aliens are depicted as being largely invincible towards modern Earth, they'd be able to take on... some interstellar polity, I can't remember which one.

I also remember one of the old trolls on SB, I think it was Factually, claiming that Star Trek could beat the Imperium of Man because if the conquest takes more than three hundred years or so, the UFP would gain super tech that would let them technobabble the Imperium out of existence via time travel and what not.

There is also an infamous Trek story which, among other things, takes the statement that "lasers cannot penetrate our navigational deflectors" and extrapolates this to mean that a random UFP shuttlecraft is totally immune to the Death Star's superlaser (yes, the one it uses to detonate planets) because it has 'laser' in the name.
 
There's the classic "Harry Potter characters can block Gridfire because they have flame freezing spells" argument

In the (in)famous Maul vs Da Bloods thread, it was said that the Bloods would know what they're up against after looking at a scene of slaughter because apparently they're master detectives
 
White Wraith said:
There's the classic "Harry Potter characters can block Gridfire because they have flame freezing spells" argument
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I always thought that was just a hypothetical example used to illustrate the fallacy of taking the names of things too literally. I wasn't aware that anyone actually used that argument unironically.
 
The dumbest VS fights are usually between characters with incredibly vague but incredibly powerful abilities. A lot of times this is called "reality warping" or something similar. At that point you really have nothing to go on because its all incredibly arbitrary.
 
I can't find the thread, but there was this one versus where the OP pitted Warhammer 40k Space Marines agaisnt a modern tank covered in human skin because the skin would somehow provide extra resistance to bolter fire.
 
Godzilla vs. Cthulhu

Now, having read "The Call of Cthulhu" much more recently and critically at this point, I'm pretty solidly on the side of Godzilla taking this with ease. But the specific argument that was made by this one spacebattler, I swear...

1. Godzilla is "the king of monsters"
2. Cthulhu is a monster
3. Therefore, Godzilla is Cthulhu's king
4. A king is stronger than his subjects, so Godzilla can beat Cthulhu
 
Grey Rook said:
I also remember one of the old trolls on SB, I think it was Factually, claiming that Star Trek could beat the Imperium of Man because if the conquest takes more than three hundred years or so, the UFP would gain super tech that would let them technobabble the Imperium out of existence via time travel and what not.
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Honestly I think this argument is kinda convincing. Like, it'd be a longshot, but I could see it happening.
 
Leila Hann said:
Godzilla vs. Cthulhu

Now, having read "The Call of Cthulhu" much more recently and critically at this point, I'm pretty solidly on the side of Godzilla taking this with ease. But the specific argument that was made by this one spacebattler, I swear...

1. Godzilla is "the king of monsters"
2. Cthulhu is a monster
3. Therefore, Godzilla is Cthulhu's king
4. A king is stronger than his subjects, so Godzilla can beat Cthulhu
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This is a good argument.
 
Thanks to @Entropy Judge for finding the actual thread.

Leila Hann said:
In a universe where painting a vehicle red actually does make it go faster, at least in specific circumstances, covering one with human skin might very well proof it against explosives.
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That would have been better than the actual "logic":

Bolter shells have been known to reduce normal humans to scraps of flesh, therefore they will explode on contact with human skin, therefore they will explode before they penetrate any actual armor, protecting the tank.
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Ablative meat armor, mmmmm; no.
 
cB557 said:
If Godzilla and Aquaman give Cthulhu conflicting orders, who does it defer to?
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Cthulhu is actually not ocean-dwelling and in fact dislikes water in general, so I don't think Aquaman can command him.

Then again, this is "dumbest versus arguments," so the better answer is probably that he self destructs in confusion and then the Galactic Empire invades the planet and wins everything forever.
 
A few more:

Amaterasu will instantly appear on any target the user looks at, and it can consume any other type of fire. Therefore, Sasuke can beat Superman by looking at the sun and using Amaterasu on it, which will eat the sun and drain him of his power.

The intro sequence to the One Punch Man anime shows Saitama's fist glowing red and then white, which proves he can punch faster than the speed of light.

Turbolasers can't have 200 gigatons of firepower, because then 1 shot would destroy the earth, and they would have never needed to build the Death Star.

A Green Lantern ring is "the most powerful weapon in the universe", therefore it is more powerful than the Infinity Gauntlet.

A Saiyan is stronger than a man, therefore a Super Saiyan is stronger than Superman.

Saitama can beat Goku because Goku never defeated anyone in one punch. Reccoome doesn't count, because that was a 'gag scene'.

The Hulk can beat the Living Tribunal by ripping his head off (despite the fact that his head isn't even attached to his body in the first place).
 
White Wraith said:
There's the classic "Harry Potter characters can block Gridfire because they have flame freezing spells" argument

In the (in)famous Maul vs Da Bloods thread, it was said that the Bloods would know what they're up against after looking at a scene of slaughter because apparently they're master detectives
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Mak Taru said:
I always thought that was just a hypothetical example used to illustrate the fallacy of taking the names of things too literally. I wasn't aware that anyone actually used that argument unironically.
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It was in fact used, and in a thread with a ton of bad arguments.

Including but not limited to, culture cannot get/learn magic (not even if they clone a wizard), and no wizard would ever turn traitor to the culture no matter what happened. Because loyalty is so 100% in the Wizarding World and Faerun (the two discussed magic sides in the thread).



Avernus said:
I can't find the thread, but there was this one versus where the OP pitted Warhammer 40k Space Marines agaisnt a modern tank covered in human skin because the skin would somehow provide extra resistance to bolter fire.
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Bolter shells detonate when they hit people, people are covered in skin, if a tank was covered in armor it'd therefore detonate the shells before penetrating, QED.
 
Mak Taru said:
I'm guessing game mechanics were banned in that thread, else the go-to strategy would be to use some ridiculous Pun-Pun build to annihilate the Culture (and the Sublimed for good measure).
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If the conversation descends to that level, just point out that the Culture is aware of Earth and can get hold of the sourcebooks if they want. Therefore, they can actually find out what the game mechanics are and do it better. Why use an old fashioned hand-crafted Pun Pun when you can mass produce a legion of Mind-optimized Pun Puns?

Not entirely serious...
 
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