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We may not have much gold according to the Thread name, but this line is certainly among it.
Dearth of Gold (Elden Ring X Fairy Tail)
- Thread starter Naron
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And hiding a dork behind the fine steel behind the dainty appearance.
Back to the original body?
Or closer to it, at least.
That's what you get when you take centuries long nap, your knowledge all out of synch with reality.
I mean, we have wings, we don't need no car, thanks.
Meanwhile, as far as Natsu's concerned, they're both speaking bynharic.
Well, good thing this basically is one of the best world when it comes to that then.
Rykard says hi.
Our friend on the moon?
I trust her with my life!
Just like Godwyn did!
Huh, I mean, she has a guy that tries to backstab her in her service, and she wait for him to try to get rid of him.
She isn't that backstabby.
Did she though?
Like, there are some things that would point to that… but there are also a lot of signs that points to the black knives doing it on Marika's orders, with Ranni just using the opportunity to do her thing.
Huh, what? What in hell are you talking about? The shattering was done by Marika, without Ranni's involvement from what we know, and the immense majority of the lands between's problems come from the shattering.
[x] Propose alternate terms
-[x] guarantee that Ranni will not kill or hurt Miquella once she has found him, in addition to the previous terms.
Edit:
Actually, now that I think of it, @Romancic, do you know about the very big case of mistranslation about Ranni's goal?
Because it changes a lot of her character when you know how badly her goal was told in the english version.
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Thing is, Marika already held the leash of Maliketh. She could openly threaten whoever she wanted with Destined Death because he did her bidding. There was no need for a plot like this.
Adding to this, when meeting Ranni on her Rise, she introduces herself as the one who stole a fragment of Death. Quoting the Black Knife item description:
You also find the Evergaol of Alecto, the Black Knife Assassin ringleader, basically next door to the Cathedral of Manus Celes (where Ranni's Two Fingers hide). So the connection is definitely there and not just conjecture.
Then there is the part where Ranni must have at least known of the plot beforehand; else she could not have slain herself at the same time as Godwyn. Quoting the Cursemark of Death:
So yes. All signs point to Ranni being the mastermind behind the Night of Black Knives. Even if she is not, she was at least a key collaborator.
That's the thing, Marika has all the cards, including the Black knives, so I do think that putting the whole thing on Ranni is incorrect, Marika was just as important at the very least.
As for why would Marika steal the rune of death? Easy, she wants to use it without Radagon interfering. He did try to stop the shattering when Marika was destroying the elden ring, why couldn't he also counteract her ability to use the rune of death?
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There is no connection between Marika and the Black Knives. Nor is there anything that points to Radagon being against her using Destined Death, or being able to counter her use of it, beside conjecture. We find Marika's remains crucified, which I imagine is how Radagon, or perhaps the Greater Will, stopped her from finishing whatever she was aiming for. If she was even stopped and not just punished.
The black knives are all lumen, which is Marika's origin.
I know there are other things.
The black knives are actually strongly implied to work for Marika.
Here's a part I remember finding about that:
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I remember reading that the assassins are all Numen, yes. However, the only direct connection there is to Marika is that Numen are of 'the same stock' as her. The Numen's Rune has that as part of its item description.
I can see why one would link the two together, but I personally do not see it. Unless there is actual confirmation somewhere that I have missed.
I do not think both of them were working together on this, either. Else there should have been at least a tiny hint of it somewhere. So between the two, Ranni having the exact timing to split the Cursemark of Death in two when offing herself just seems like a much stronger link to me.
Marika shattering the Elden Ring appears more like the reaction to the event happening at all. Not like some sort of master plan that starts with having one of her own sons assassinated.
Found it, black knife armor description:
The assassins that carried out the deeds of the Night of the Black Knives were all women, and rumored to be Numen who had close ties with Marika herself
The black knives are explicitly close to Marika.
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Alright. Point still stands on Ranni having impeccable timing, though. So she must have been aware of the plot. She would also need to have conveniently stolen the Rune of Death at the same time Marika did to pull off her little stunt, so yeah.
We do not have anything on Marika's motivations, unfortunately. Everything else we hear of her does not paint the picture of someone unhappy with the overall situation. The Numen having close ties may just as well mean that the plot was sold as a coup against Marika to them.
Overall, I am still with Ranni as the mastermind. There is some uncertainty, but her motivations are pretty clear and the pieces we have line up with that read more than they do with Marika having done it for reasons unknown.
Sure they are, but the chain of events in the lore is this: Ranni somehow got a piece of Death rune and shares it with Black Knives - BK kill Godwyn the golden - Marika has an aneurysm and breaks the Elden ring, Ergo Ranni is literally the reason for shattering
No, just, no.
There are traces of Marika being unhappy with the golden order before the shattering and she is the easiest way for Ranni to get the piece of the rune of death (and Mariketh has some dialogue about having been betrayed by Marika to correlate that if I remember correctly).
That tells of the shattering not being Ranni's fault, but Marika's, with Ranni only being a coconspirator at most that benefited from something Marika wanted to do already.
How come?
Why would Marika try to kill off her first kid for literally no reason whatsoever, with a really strange way of using the death rune through another party, when she literally owns it???
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This part is definitely incorrect. I checked back with the wiki, there are only two lines of dialog from Maliketh that reference her. Both only appear if the Beast Clergyman is given all Deathroots.
(On killing the player in second stage) "Cower. Before Maliketh, Marika's Black Blade."
(On Death) "Forgive me, Marika... The Golden Order... cannot be restored."
Neither of these has any implication of betrayal between the two. Maliketh, by all accounts, was loyal to Marika till the end.
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Maybe she got tired of being the two fingers puppet as well?
And she would hardly be the first monarch (let alone a parent) to off their kid.
As for why use another party, deniable assets are a thing, and she, being who she is, would have been under constant attention by almost everyone, so where Marika would be immediately found out, Ranni could act.
Elden Ring gives us plenty of minor details, but almost never the full truth, especially of things pre shattering, or the war that followed.
That's by design, there may not even be a complete account, the point is to create a fascinating setting, and part of that fascination is the imperfect beings and their often not fully understood actions and goals.
Maybe or not maybe, it doesn't really matter when the real perpetrator is right there, and it's Ranni.
It's backed by lore and by in game items, there's literally no need to make it harder than it is
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You know, this is a good point. Getting bogged down by the particulars is not all that conductive.
I think the one thing we all will (have to) agree on is that Ranni was involved rather deeply in the plot. Be it as the sole mastermind or a co-conspirator of Marika, she is definitely and absolutely among those responsible for The Shattering.
And I believe this is really the only thing that matters to the issue at hand.
She shattered the ring After the night of black knives, which means she did that in grief/anger etc. at how her first ever kid got murdered
Nicolay
The Sequel Trilogy is Canon!
Not just the first but one of her three favorites as well
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What do we know?
At the knight of black knives, Godwyn the golden was murdered, and Ranni was almost certainly involved.
That i am sure we can all agree on.
Now, for your consideration, i would like to offer a theory.
Godwyn the golden was a horrible person, and deserved to be shanked.
Golden Order was not an enlightened religion, nor was Marika and/or Radagon just rulers, and as political and military leaders, their children were not innocent either.
We don't know much about the world at its heydey, but there seems enough hints for me to consider Golden Order to almost certainly be fairly draconian order, and very prejudicial one, considering how omens were treated, the wandering merchants having to live in hiding, the beastmen being used as "menials", and so on.
Godwyn, as one of the foremost champions (and beneficiaries) of this order, shares the blame for its sins.
At the knight of black knives, Godwyn the golden was murdered, and Ranni was almost certainly involved.
That i am sure we can all agree on.
Now, for your consideration, i would like to offer a theory.
Godwyn the golden was a horrible person, and deserved to be shanked.
Golden Order was not an enlightened religion, nor was Marika and/or Radagon just rulers, and as political and military leaders, their children were not innocent either.
We don't know much about the world at its heydey, but there seems enough hints for me to consider Golden Order to almost certainly be fairly draconian order, and very prejudicial one, considering how omens were treated, the wandering merchants having to live in hiding, the beastmen being used as "menials", and so on.
Godwyn, as one of the foremost champions (and beneficiaries) of this order, shares the blame for its sins.
- Pronouns
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[X] Refuse the alliance
[X] Continue your studies and find him through the spread of your reputation
Good to know the Frenzied Flame won. Burn it all down and rebuild everything without the Greater Will meddling in everything. Just like my Tarnished did first playthrough.
[X] Continue your studies and find him through the spread of your reputation
Good to know the Frenzied Flame won. Burn it all down and rebuild everything without the Greater Will meddling in everything. Just like my Tarnished did first playthrough.
Correlation is not causation.
She did a thing after another thing, but we don't know why she did the second thing.
I am far from the only person to think that Marika is responsible for her son's death, making your entire point moot about the shattering being done in grief.
Edit:
Hmm, you know there is no rebuilding after the burning when it comes to the frenzied flame, don't you?
Because, well, there is never any implication of rebuilding anywhere, only going back to chaos.
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Out of curiosity, what kind of guarantee's would you want/accept?
Because Ranni is capable of lying, and she knows that harming Miquela would make Malenia her instant enemy.
Any alliance would, be necessity, require not harming Miquela, unless Ranni is planning some sort of double cross from the start, at which point i would not trust her word to not harm Miquela anyway.
I have another one for that (it's on Gurranq's page, maybe it's why you don't have it?)
Marika...why...wouldst thou...gull me? Why...shatter...
With Gull being a reference to a person that is easily cheated and deceived.
There is definitely a strong implication that Marika did trick Maliketh, and the simplest explanation is by taking a part of destined death from him.