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Dark Tidings (SI)

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Kerfitd said:
Whatever he was or was not meant to be, in the end he is what he is.
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Not merely meant to be, in canon, he basically is that.
In the context of this story — whatever Hiver decides to make him be.
IC, if Winter is thinking about Voldemort being the Prime Minister, he ought to think about Dumbledore being a manipulative bastard too. Think and prepare.
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I didn't dispute this, or mention anything to that effect. Just noting some canon facts so you don't get tainted by fanon info.
 
Bailey Matutine said:
In canon he apologizes to Harry for how very much he ISN'T that.
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Which, ironically, makes him even more of that kind of person. As I mentioned, he's not unapproachable - he makes mistakes, he is human - but he's a guy who will honestly and to the full extent of his power work to make people happy, work to create a good world.
 
But thepoint is that he understands the value of an egg to an omelette, and he will apologize while he breaks you, but if it honestly will make the world a better place, he will not hesitate to completely screw you over.
 
Bailey Matutine said:
But thepoint is that he understands the value of an egg to an omelette, and he will apologize while he breaks you, but if it honestly will make the world a better place, he will not hesitate to completely screw you over.
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... or if he seriously thinks it will, whether he's right or wrong, he'll completely screw you over.

Mind you, given the people he didn't break in canon, and the ones he did (or allowed others to break), I wouldn't trust his judgement. Full stop.
 
Bailey Matutine said:
But thepoint is that he understands the value of an egg to an omelette, and he will apologize while he breaks you, but if it honestly will make the world a better place, he will not hesitate to completely screw you over.
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Ah, the Greater Good crap.

Would this be the wrong time to point out that the whole Greater Good bullshit is fanon? Namely, he believed in that ideal when he was with Gellert, but after seeing what it led to, he grew disgusted with the idea. It makes me laugh at fanon all the more.

Incidentally, let's look at the things he did and what he told Harry about them. He told Harry that he originally wanted him to have the chance to be a boy - for him to handle things. So, he tried to give him that chance, not burdening him with Voldemort as much as he could. It went wrong, but he acknowledges that, just as he acknowledges his intent behind the action. Later, when it became clear that Harry would play a pivotal role in the war, he tried to impart the important knowledge for handling Voldemort to him, and also set himself to die at Snape's hands so that they'd have a mole in Voldemort's ranks. Then, upon realizing that Harry had a Horcrux in him and would hence die, be possessed, or be controlled if nothing was done, he concocted a scheme to ensure that Harry became free of the Horcrux - the only way he knew how, which would still keep him as safe as he could ensure he be.
 
What I'm saying is that, whatever her intentions, although she may have had wizard Superman in her head, what she wrote was wizard Ozymandias.

Edit: His assertion that he wanted to give Harry the chance to be a child is in direct contradiction with his dark and difficult years speech.
 
Bailey Matutine said:
What I'm saying is that, whatever her intentions, although she may have had wizard Superman in her head, what she wrote was wizard Ozymandias.
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... at best.
Bailey Matutine said:
Edit: His assertion that he wanted to give Harry the chance to be a child is in direct contradiction with his dark and difficult years speech.
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Not even the only contradiction that can be found in Dumbledore's words and/or actions, but certainly one of the more damning.
 
So perhaps it's more accurate to say that Dumbledore tries to BE wizard Superman, because he is afraid of becoming wizard Xanatos, because he's just so good at it, and so his conflicted nature makes him come off as a semi-incompetent wizard Ozymandias.
 
Bailey Matutine said:
So perhaps it's more accurate to say that Dumbledore tries to BE wizard Superman, because he is afraid of becoming wizard Xanatos, because he's just so good at it, and so his conflicted nature makes him come off as a semi-incompetent wizard Ozymandias.
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... Eh. I could buy that analysis.
 
Blackmane said:
The HP magic system is full of bullshity goodness!

Know how you can't conjure food?

Well, with a single first year spell... you CAN summon a buffalo. Seen here for fanfic goodness...
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Yeah, but if you aren't wearing the right kind of armour, it can get rather painful (also, I rather suspect that the name of the wizard who made that mistake in canon, Buffario, was a factor in getting a buffalo, specifically).
 
Blackmane said:
Just pawn the gold off in the muggle world, and exchange the cash for wizarding currency. You'll probably make a lot more. Or better yet, find mundungus fletcher, have him put a confundus on a bunch of cheap crap and charm it gold, then pawn it off all over london.

HP magic is fucking broken.

Polyjuice while selling it, and by the time the charms have worn off and people realise it's fake, the trail will have gone stone cold. As long as you don't repeat it, nobody will have a clue.

Or better yet, get some copper pipe and Gemino the fuck out of it before offloading it. It might start to go to rust after a while, but you will be LONG gone by the time that happens.

Their are Sooooo many ways to make money in this setting it's un-be-fucking-leavable.

Got a fifty pound note? Gemino. Buy a chocolate bar from a corner shop and get two twenties, a five and change in clean money and it should be months before it starts to dissolve but by then they would have used, and that person would have used it and so on. Spend the change going about your day... then gemino the original fifty again and just go to the corner shop down the road. (I would suggest using those self service machines in tesco and the like, but they weren't around then, I don't think)
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1. He is already in Diagon Alley. Exchanging jewellery in a muggle store would mean leaving and coming back - to do so he would need to sneak through the Leaky Couldron for the third time. Why bother when Gringotts is right there? It's not as his amount of jewellery is limited.

2. Your plans to make money are nice, but they do not consider that just going to the Zombieworld and grabbing stuff costs him far less effort and time. And, since he has some ethical standards, he probably doesn't want to rip people of - which jewels and gold just vanishing after a few months would do. The plans are also complicated, KISS is a thing for good reasons.

3. Contacting Fletcher is a bad idea: he doesn't know Winter, so he would be suspicious of him. Fletcher is also a known criminal (so he might be watched by Aurors) and a member of the Order, which he might tell about a mysterious guy who he doesn't know.
 
ina_meishou said:
Notably her examples of how it would be 'unreliable' were pretty hilarious stuff. Like wandlesly transfiguring it into something else after it left the bottle but before it touched the subjects mouth. Or magically spelling their throat shut in such a way that nobody could force it open.

You know, shit that would actually be really difficult to pull off and that it would be simple to prevent and/or test for before gathering testimony.
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It also sets a very dangerous precendet with the whole "transfiguring potions". It means a sufficiently powerful transfiguration master can transfigure things into potions.
 
ryuan said:
It also sets a very dangerous precendet with the whole "transfiguring potions". It means a sufficiently powerful transfiguration master can transfigure things into potions.
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Unless its like conjuring food, and just not possible.
 
Mortifer said:
Unless its like conjuring food, and just not possible.
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Probably it's one of the rules of magic, let me check it out.

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Nope, there's no 'grand list of magic rules' to check against, only vague references of one or other individual rules meant as patchwork to introduce artificial drama on the setting.
 
ryuan said:
Probably it's one of the rules of magic, let me check it out.

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Nope, there's no 'grand list of magic rules' to check against, only vague references of one or other individual rules meant as patchwork to introduce artificial drama on the setting.
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Which means its entirely possible, and more likely than the 'Wizards are Idiots' theory everyone comes up with.
 
Mortifer said:
Which means its entirely possible, and more likely than the 'Wizards are Idiots' theory everyone comes up with.
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OR wizards are idiots.

Seriously, why people keep bending themselves backwards to try to make them smarter than they should.

They are idiots, their society shouldn't work.

That's the whole fucking point of the books.
 
ryuan said:
OR wizards are idiots.

Seriously, why people keep bending themselves backwards to try to make them smarter than they should.

They are idiots, their society shouldn't work.

That's the whole fucking point of the books.
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I never said they weren't idiots. It just that, if people could make potions through trandfiguration, potion makin becomes redundant. Personally, my theory is that you can't conjure or transfigured anything that is or includes a magical ingredient. Otherwise, Hermione could've just transfigured the ingredients needed for the Ployjuice Potion.

And no, the whole point of the books was Harry defeating Voldemort.
 
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