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Wild Card: A Fallout New Vegas Post-Game Quest

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Why are the leading plans leaving the omertas alive? Does everyone voting to keep them around remember who the omertas are? Not only were they planning on chlorine bombing the strip and gunning down any survivors in order to take it over for Caesar's Legion, they were also actively killing their prostitutes to help set that up, whether by letting their bomb maker create snuff films or manufacturing a drug induced killing by their gun smuggler. The prostitutes who are deliberately manipulated into having severe drug addictions, to keep them dependent and controlled by the Omertas, and killed if they try to leave!

Why, of all the families on the strip to spare, are we letting the fucking Omertas get off scott free? Do you really think a plan that involved was only known by the top brass?
 
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Doctor Elsewhere said:
Why are the leading plans leaving the omertas alive? Does everyone voting to keep them around remember who the omertas are? Not only were they planning on chlorine bombing the strip and gunning down any survivors in order to take it over for Caesar's Legion, they were also actively killing their prostitutes to help set that up, whether by letting their bomb maker create snuff films or manufacturing a drug induced killing by their gun smuggler. The prostitutes who are deliberately manipulated into having severe drug addictions, to keep them dependent and controlled by the Omertas, and killed if they try to leave!

Why, of all the families on the strip to spare, are we letting the fucking Omertas get off scott free? Do you really think a plan that involved was only known by the top brass?
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To be fair, the biggest issue people seem to have with the plan is how difficult it would be to rehabilitate the poisoned casino and hire new staff. Not any bleeding-heart feelings regarding the Omertas.
 
Randino Treviani said:
I think your missing the fact where the Chlorine gas poison saturated Casino will need to be cleared before we can reopen it, taking with it a third of our primary yearly income, possibly for multiple turns.

also consider the fact that just because we can hire replacement staff for the other two, doesn't mean those staff will be as competent or even remotely familiar with the work as the Chairmen or White Gloves. New Vegas has neither people experienced with playing old world gentry nore an abundance of old world movie enthusiasts.

New Vegas has 2 intact, healthy population centers outside the strip not populated by junkies, gangs, and maniacs, since we need sloan for quarry work. Good spring & Primm. I highly doubt we have the facilities to staff all three casinos between them, and it rather limits the number of individuals we can put towards sustainable farming. Let's hold onto the Omerta's and charge them for their crimes so we can put them to work in the farms the NCR just vacated.
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Doctor Elsewhere said:
Why are the leading plans leaving the omertas alive? Does everyone voting to keep them around remember who the omertas are? Not only were they planning on chlorine bombing the strip and gunning down any survivors in order to take it over for Caesar's Legion, they were also actively killing their prostitutes to help set that up, whether by letting their bomb maker create snuff films or manufacturing a drug induced killing by their gun smuggler. The prostitutes who are deliberately manipulated into having severe drug addictions, to keep them dependent and controlled by the Omertas, and killed if they try to leave!

Why, of all the families on the strip to spare, are we letting the fucking Omertas get off scott free?
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Leaving the Omertas alive is different than letting them get off scot free. We can punish them properly as part of the actual quest, using legitimate methods that serve our ends, rather than with a goddamn chlorine gas bomb that renders the casino unusable.

There have been several pages of discussion I advise people read, as well as going over the update more carefully, to fully understand the consequences of accepting the more haphazard fallout new vegas canon solutions. It explains a lot of the logic behind choosing to not have done something as horrific as copy the Omertas to deal with them rather than handle things in a none psychotic manner.
 
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Personally, the chlorine bomb is my only sticking point. I'd be perfectly fine with mulching them with our securitrons, if that were an option here. Bullet holes, blood, and laser burns would be much easier to clean up than fucking chlorine gas.
 
Randino Treviani said:
Leaving the Omertas alive is different than letting them get off scot free. We can punish them properly as part of the actual quest, using legitimate methods that serve our ends, rather than with a goddamn chlorine gas bomb that renders the casino unusable.

There have been several pages of discussion I advise people read, as well as going over the update more carefully, to fully understand the consequences of accepting the more haphazard fallout new vegas canon solutions. It explains a lot of the logic behind choosing to not have done something as horrific as copy the Omertas to deal with them rather than handle things in a none psychotic manner.
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Could you provide a link to direct me to that discussion? Which page is the start of it?
 
I would also like to bring up the fact that, while it me turns getting civilians out first, that doesn't necessarily mean the sex. workers. Id rather try and gaurentee 0 innocent deaths here.
 
[X] Plan: A Modicum of Restraint
[X] Plan: Don't Rock the Boat... for Now

If in some smothering dreams, you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,—
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.
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I don't know what the Omertas have done, beyond a quick skim showing them to be pimps who hooked sex workers on drugs (and thus, I am all for shooting every person who helped that along, if possible). However, the use of asphyxiating gases crosses a moral line of what's appropriate justice regardless of what they did and I'd rather not start the quest off with something so abhorrent.
 
[X] Plan: A Modicum of Restraint

[X] Plan: Don't Rock the Boat... for Now
 
[X] Plan: Strip-ped Clean

I'm gonna be honest, my defense of the other plan was way too concerned with being able to use the fucking building afterwards. I look fucking psychotic in this thread.
 
 
Captain_Deegan said:
I'm gonna be honest, my defense of the other plan was way too concerned with being able to use the fucking building afterwards. I look fucking psychotic in this thread.
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Umm, isn't it more psychotic to be pro gassing an entire buildings worth of individuals, even murderous criminal scum, putting all of the civilian population out of a home and job in the process(they do need to eat) than it is to resolve to deal with them later in a more humane controlled fashion and simply eliminate the most inhumane individuals now so nothing quite so terrible as chemical war crimes happens in the prologue? The actual vote option description seems to imply as much.
 
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Randino Treviani said:
I think your missing the fact where the Chlorine gas poison saturated Casino will need to be cleared before we can reopen it, taking with it a third of our primary yearly income, possibly for multiple turns.

also consider the fact that just because we can hire replacement staff for the other two, doesn't mean those staff will be as competent or even remotely familiar with the work as the Chairmen or White Gloves. New Vegas has neither people experienced with playing old world gentry nore an abundance of old world movie enthusiasts.

New Vegas has 2 intact, healthy population centers outside the strip not populated by junkies, gangs, and maniacs, since we need sloan for quarry work. Good spring & Primm. I highly doubt we have the facilities to staff all three casinos between them, and it rather limits the number of individuals we can put towards sustainable farming. Let's hold onto the Omerta's and charge them for their crimes so we can put them to work in the farms the NCR just vacated.
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Why do we need all three casinos?
The war just ended and I doubt we have tourist at the same level as height of NCR garrison (whom we also seen off).
 
Randino Treviani said:
Umm, isn't it more psychotic to be pro gassing an entire buildings worth of individuals, even murderous criminal scum, putting all of the civilian population out of a home and job in the process(they do need to eat) than it is to resolve to deal with them later in a more humane controlled fashion and simply eliminate the most inhumane individuals now so nothing quite so terrible as chemical war crimes happens in the prologue? The actual vote option description seems to imply as much.
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Your proposed solution to deal with the omertas in a "humane controlled fashion" was prison slavery.

As for "putting all of the civilian popluation out of a home and a job in the process", 1) We have two other casinos we can house them in, as getting rid of the white gloves doesn't destroy their casino in the process of kicking them out, and 2) the only other "job" being done at the casino was the chemically enforced prostitution, which punished trying to leave on pain of death.

We're going to have a lot of new jobs open up through the process of establishing a new city-state, and even if the sex workers decide to stick to what they were doing before, they'll be leagues better off not being under the thumbs of the omertas.
 
[X] Plan: Strip-ped Clean
-[X][OMERTAS] Took out the whole murderous bunch.
-[X][GLOVES] Exposed them to the world.
-[X][CHAIRS] Incorporated them into your efforts.

We can always make more caps, but I'd like to root out the rot ASAP so nothing comes back to bite us in the ass.
 
The Laurent said:
Honestly, I'd rather fuck up the Omertas than the Gloves, but the plan that does that is, like.

Losing badly?
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I guess the question is whether you care more about getting rid of the omertas or keeping the white gloves then. Unless there's a major vote shift. (Which could happen! We have over a day left after all)
 
Doctor Elsewhere said:
Your proposed solution to deal with the omertas in a "humane controlled fashion" was prison slavery.
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There are a few hundred nations on the planet with basic community service as a punishment for minor crimes. New Vegas as food production to population deficiency. It only makes sense that if there going to be kept alive with the expensive prospect of feeding, watering and housing them when all of those basic necessities are at a premium in the new vegas area, that they need to contribute to the production of at least one of those. It's certainly more humane than just killing them outright in one gruesome fashion or another.

If anyone feels like suggesting exile by all means. Not sure how well it will take. It's basically a death sentence for some of them to send them unarmed into the wasteland anyway.
Doctor Elsewhere said:
We're going to have a lot of new jobs open up through the process of establishing a new city-state, and even if the sex workers decide to stick to what they were doing before, they'll be leagues better off not being under the thumbs of the omertas.
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Fair. Those will take time to set up but hopefully we'll have options for that.
 
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