Finding the Spark (Pathfinder 1E Quest)

[X] Are pushed too far by your peers and in a moment of strife discover the power within that will mark you for all your days in the eyes of your kin and beyond (Sorcerer)
[X] Call out in the dark places of the world for someone, anyone to hear your voice and give you purpose. Something answers (Summoner)

[X] Show kindness unbidden to a beast which barely seemed large enough to be thrown in the pot and were rewarded with uncanny power (Witch)

[X] Acquire a gift for writing and a love of words second to none; watching and cataloguing powers seen and unseen even as you are ignored (Wizard)
 
[X] Are pushed too far by your peers and in a moment of strife discover the power within that will mark you for all your days in the eyes of your kin and beyond (Sorcerer)
[X] Call out in the dark places of the world for someone, anyone to hear your voice and give you purpose. Something answers (Summoner)

[X] Show kindness unbidden to a beast which barely seemed large enough to be thrown in the pot and were rewarded with uncanny power (Witch)

[X] Acquire a gift for writing and a love of words second to none; watching and cataloguing powers seen and unseen even as you are ignored (Wizard)
 
[ Acquire a gift for writing and a love of words second to none; watching and cataloguing powers seen and unseen even as you are ignored
[] When you first saw a spell being cast your first questions were how ? , What ? and Why ? , since then you have scrutinized and near obsessed over every bit of magic you could get your hands on trying to answer these questions ,examining their causes and effects along with all the supernatural forces and powers big and small involved to satisfy your curiosity of the arcane ( Arcanist – d20PFSRD)

@DragonParadox this a viable write in ?

E:updated and better version of written in by the OP
[X] When you first saw a spell being cast by a visiting duregar trader your first questions were how ? , What ? and Why ? , since then you have scrutinized and near obsessed over every bit of magic you could get your hands on trying to answer these questions ,examining their causes and effects along with all the supernatural forces and powers big and small involved to satisfy your curiosity of the arcane. This fascination with foreign sorcery has done little to endear you to the rest of your people ( Arcanist – d20PFSRD)
[X] Acquire a gift for writing and a love of words second to none; watching and cataloguing powers seen and unseen even as you are ignored (Wizard)
 
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[X] When you first saw a spell being cast your first questions were how ? , What ? and Why ? , since then you have scrutinized and near obsessed over every bit of magic you could get your hands on trying to answer these questions ,examining their causes and effects along with all the supernatural forces and powers big and small involved to satisfy your curiosity of the arcane ( Arcanist – d20PFSRD)
@DragonParadox this a viable write in ?

Hmm... I think it is worth noting how the people around you reacted. Something like

[] When you first saw a spell being cast by a visiting duregar trader your first questions were how ? , What ? and Why ? , since then you have scrutinized and near obsessed over every bit of magic you could get your hands on trying to answer these questions ,examining their causes and effects along with all the supernatural forces and powers big and small involved to satisfy your curiosity of the arcane. This fascination with foreign sorcery has done little to endear you to the rest of your people ( Arcanist – d20PFSRD)
 
The issue with the friendless curse is that it's going to be really difficult to ever find a party.
Not really. It's not like we're a pariah or anything, we just can't effectively use Diplomacy. That's hardly an issue for the vast majority of people. Most players don't even learn the skill, and for many classes Charisma is pretty much a dump stat, so they're always walking around with a penalty to their social skills, including Diplomacy.

Oracles normally excel at Diplomacy because it's a class skill and they have high Charisma, however, so the lack is just felt more than for most other classes. We can't be a party's typical 'face', but we can still do recon, provide buffs, act as a healer, etc.
 
Not really. It's not like we're a pariah or anything, we just can't effectively use Diplomacy. That's hardly an issue for the vast majority of people. Most players don't even learn the skill, and for many classes Charisma is pretty much a dump stat, so they're always walking around with a penalty to their social skills, including Diplomacy.

Oracles normally excel at Diplomacy because it's a class skill and they have high Charisma, however, so the lack is just felt more than for most other classes. We can't be a party's typical 'face', but we can still do recon, provide buffs, act as a healer, etc.
What concerns me is this part " if you use Diplomacy to make a request of someone, their attitude worsens one step (but no worse than unfriendly) after the request succeeds or fails.", that sounds like it would make making friends very difficult.
 
The issue with the friendless curse is that it's going to be really difficult to ever find a party.
I think that is a good thing, It means the GM can focus on our PC alone tailoring adventures and situations to suit , it also means its easier for the GM to plan and set up challenging encounters since he does not need account for an entire party of mid maxed overpowered munchkin monsters of PCs just our 1 optimized and mid maxed character this also nicely reduces the sheer amount of number crunching required as well , plus it means the GM has less need to nerf the players since its just the one PC so him being OP is just an excuse for the GM to introduce a higher level of stakes , on the player side it means we can't go murder hobo to solve our problems but instead need to be creative , cunning and ruthless to overcome challenges with stuff like social combat becoming much more relevant while making more utility focused stuff like the divination school much more important
 
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What concerns me is this part " if you use Diplomacy to make a request of someone, their attitude worsens one step (but no worse than unfriendly) after the request succeeds or fails.", that sounds like it would make making friends very difficult.
The trick here is to just never use Diplomacy. Basic character interactions don't use Diplomacy skill checks for everything, nor do regular party dynamics.
 
The issue with the friendless curse is that it's going to be really difficult to ever find a party.
We can pick up a different curse if we go oracle. It's very flexible as a class; personally I think it's got the most interesting setup of the available casters.

For example, we could take deaf:

You cannot hear and suffer all of the usual penalties for being deafened. You cast all of your spells as if they were modified by the Silent Spell feat. This does not increase their level or casting time.

At 5th level, you receive a +3 competence bonus on Perceptionchecks that do not rely upon hearing, and the initiative penalty for being deaf is reduced to –2.
At 10th level, you gain scent and you do not suffer any penalty on initiativechecks due to being deaf.
At 15th level, you gain tremorsenseout to a range of 30 feet.

It would still complicate going full social monster but allow us to connect with an immediate social group pretty easily. I don't think I've actually seen a quest with a deaf protagonist either, so that could be interesting to explore.

Tongues would be neat as well, though it'd have less interesting day to day impacts on the character:

In times of stress or unease, you speak in tongues.

EFFECT

Pick one of the following languages: Abyssal, Aklo, Aquan, Auran, Celestial, Ignan, Infernal, or Terran.

Whenever you are in combat, you can only speak and understand the selected language. This does not interfere with spellcasting, but it does apply to spells that are language dependent. You gain the selected language as a bonus language.

At 5th level, pick an additional language to speak in combat and add it to your list of known languages.
At 10th level, you can understand any spoken language, as if under the effects of tongues, even during combat.
At 15th level, you can speak and understand any language, but your speech is still restricted during combat


The unchained curse from earlier would add a lot of fun stuff to the narrative without as harsh a malus if that's a problem.

Cite
 
Can we actually take friendless? It's from a different publisher.

[X] Only grow stranger as you age and many whisper that you are ill luck upon the tribe. As you grow apart so do you gain a measure of understanding of what you have become and how you might wield it (Oracle)
[X] Wander far into the wilds, finding the company of the beasts that fill the nightmares of your kin to be better at times than their own
-[X] Druid


[X] Follow the path of the Whisper-Foot, most common among your kin
-[X] Slayer
 
Druid seems a good bit more independant than an Oracle.
Better suited for a few-friends-run.

The Animal Companion is useful, the trophy-feat I mentioned some time ago can help us get our hands on magic equipment (in exchange for providing materials to enchanters) and the prepared casting gives us greater flexibility.
 
Druid seems a good bit more independant than an Oracle.
Better suited for a few-friends-run.

The Animal Companion is useful, the trophy-feat I mentioned some time ago can help us get our hands on magic equipment (in exchange for providing materials to enchanters) and the prepared casting gives us greater flexibility.
Maybe, but it feels a lot less interesting to me. Oracles get their fair share of magic with a lot more flexibility in the themes we initially choose without getting overly complicated.
 
I say that forgettable is a nice curse too for a shadow oracle
I'd be happy with any of of them, though I've got to say deaf sounds most interesting to me.

It's not exactly overtly supernatural, and it has more mechanical implications, but it'd also be interesting to explore the impact it'd have on a day to day level of someone dealing with it in a DND death world. I don't recall the last time I saw a quest of any time deal with that sort of issue really.
 
@DragonParadox any hopes this will be a solo PC D&D game ?, there is a lot of freedom to be had from how different such a game would be from for example A Sword Without a Hilt , like for example you don't need to deal with keeping track of a large part and its easier to set up challenging encounters while encouraging creative solutions , making the players over powered is much less dangerous since its still one PC so no matter what the action economy is always against him so letting the player mess around with the more powerful stuff like artifacts and the like is a lot less likely to break the game and if the PC turns out overpowered you can just up the ante and put the solo PC against challenges that would normally require an entire party to over come and watch the fire works

there are also some pretty intersting ideas and mechanics you could introduce that in a game with more than one PC would get unwieldy and cause bloat , to give an example instead of having leveling up a case you gained X exp and your now level Y instead you show the process of the character advancing his class by studying , practicing and attaining great feats based on player choice and actions

to give a detailed example , your a level one arcanist and you want to become a level two arcanist then you need to do the following actions
1) study and practice (0/2) , this represents the skill points the players earn when they level up like knowledge arcana ,world , perception ..ect , along with the number of action points you need to put in to bring it to the next level , this Action point cost grows exponentially , going from level two to level three would require 4 AP and levels three to four would need 8 AP so on and so forth , this is both to prevent players from the rushing levels and to show why level 20 is considered a cap not hard cap mind you can totally go past it but it will be really Really hard as it should be , the PC could go to or hire trainers and teachers to reduce the AP costs but the higher the level the rarer the teacher and more expensive not in terms of gold and no such aids when you hit level 20 as that is the finish line for conventional skill and its more or less you pushing the boundaries of what can and can't be done at that point

2) research and experiment (0/2) ,this represents the class related specialized practices and traditions(like arcane exploits in this case) and how you raise your class's caster level as to allow for higher level spells to be cast , as an arcanist you accomplish this by studying magical theory , experimenting and reverse engineering the inner working and mechanics of magical phenomena (a spell and its effects for example) , this also increases exponentially but their are ways to mitigate that like for example arcane tomes and research journals you can acquire from libraries and magical book stores at increasingly high costs of gold based on your level to reduce the AP cost by as much as 75% since your not being forced to reinvent the wheel but that only applies for levels 1 through 10 , from levels 11 to 15 the books you need can only be found in the private collections of archmages requiring whole quest lines to get you hands on them and from levels 15 to 20 you reached the point were the knowledge you seek can only be found in ancient and deadly ruins , the lairs of elder dragons ,the hands elemental Sultans and domains of demon/empyreal lords , there are no aids to reduce AP for getting past level 20 at this point your at the end of conventional knowledge/understanding and are effectively trail blazing

3) accomplishing a feat , this is pretty self explanatory , this is how PCs gain feats , the players invest a bunch of AP to carry out actions relating to attaining a feat and this were some the fun of a Solo PC could come in for depending on how the many AP invested and the player write ins you could alter how a feat works narratively or mechanically (with GM permission goes without saying) allowing for some truly fascinating narratively driven creativity fueled munchkinry

4) lastly the last requirement the arcanist needs to level up is to train his mind and body through intense mediation to channel and control the new levels of magical energies he now understands how to wield followed by creating a partition in his mind to hold spells (getting a new spell slot)

lastly notice how I never mentioned at any point the PC being granted new spells just for leveling up , that is cause I prefer the Baulder's Gate method were if you want a new spell you go look for it , most first to fourth levels spells are easy enough to get from any magic store , fifth and sixth levels spells are harder only being found in the private collections of some mages or arcane academies with many of them requiring some good old fashioned dungeon delving to get your hands on them and for 7th ,8th and 9th levels spells due being supremely rare and down right mythical in some circles its either you go on massive involved quests for just finding a single one of those game breaking things or invent your own through AP hell

so what do you think ?
 
@DragonParadox any hopes this will be a solo PC D&D game ?, there is a lot of freedom to be had from how different such a game would be from for example A Sword Without a Hilt , like for example you don't need to deal with keeping track of a large part and its easier to set up challenging encounters while encouraging creative solutions , making the players over powered is much less dangerous since its still one PC so no matter what the action economy is always against him so letting the player mess around with the more powerful stuff like artifacts and the like is a lot less likely to break the game and if the PC turns out overpowered you can just up the ante and put the solo PC against challenges that would normally require an entire party to over come and watch the fire works

there are also some pretty intersting ideas and mechanics you could introduce that in a game with more than one PC would get unwieldy and cause bloat , to give an example instead of having leveling up a case you gained X exp and your now level Y instead you show the process of the character advancing his class by studying , practicing and attaining great feats based on player choice and actions

to give a detailed example , your a level one arcanist and you want to become a level two arcanist then you need to do the following actions
1) study and practice (0/2) , this represents the skill points the players earn when they level up like knowledge arcana ,world , perception ..ect , along with the number of action points you need to put in to bring it to the next level , this Action point cost grows exponentially , going from level two to level three would require 4 AP and levels three to four would need 8 AP so on and so forth , this is both to prevent players from the rushing levels and to show why level 20 is considered a cap not hard cap mind you can totally go past it but it will be really Really hard as it should be , the PC could go to or hire trainers and teachers to reduce the AP costs but the higher the level the rarer the teacher and more expensive not in terms of gold and no such aids when you hit level 20 as that is the finish line for conventional skill and its more or less you pushing the boundaries of what can and can't be done at that point

2) research and experiment (0/2) ,this represents the class related specialized practices and traditions(like arcane exploits in this case) and how you raise your class's caster level as to allow for higher level spells to be cast , as an arcanist you accomplish this by studying magical theory , experimenting and reverse engineering the inner working and mechanics of magical phenomena (a spell and its effects for example) , this also increases exponentially but their are ways to mitigate that like for example arcane tomes and research journals you can acquire from libraries and magical book stores at increasingly high costs of gold based on your level to reduce the AP cost by as much as 75% since your not being forced to reinvent the wheel but that only applies for levels 1 through 10 , from levels 11 to 15 the books you need can only be found in the private collections of archmages requiring whole quest lines to get you hands on them and from levels 15 to 20 you reached the point were the knowledge you seek can only be found in ancient and deadly ruins , the lairs of elder dragons ,the hands elemental Sultans and domains of demon/empyreal lords , there are no aids to reduce AP for getting past level 20 at this point your at the end of conventional knowledge/understanding and are effectively trail blazing

3) accomplishing a feat , this is pretty self explanatory , this is how PCs gain feats , the players invest a bunch of AP to carry out actions relating to attaining a feat and this were some the fun of a Solo PC could come in for depending on how the many AP invested and the player write ins you could alter how a feat works narratively or mechanically (with GM permission goes without saying) allowing for some truly fascinating narratively driven creativity fueled munchkinry

4) lastly the last requirement the arcanist needs to level up is to train his mind and body through intense mediation to channel and control the new levels of magical energies he now understands how to wield followed by creating a partition in his mind to hold spells (getting a new spell slot)

lastly notice how I never mentioned at any point the PC being granted new spells just for leveling up , that is cause I prefer the Baulder's Gate method were if you want a new spell you go look for it , most first to fourth levels spells are easy enough to get from any magic store , fifth and sixth levels spells are harder only being found in the private collections of some mages or arcane academies with many of them requiring some good old fashioned dungeon delving to get your hands on them and for 7th ,8th and 9th levels spells due being supremely rare and down right mythical in some circles its either you go on massive involved quests for just finding a single one of those game breaking things or invent your own through AP hell

so what do you think ?

That is a fun system, but not something I would want to introduce all at once, generally speaking as quests evolve they get naturally more complex to deal with the things occurring in the story so much so that one eventually has to prune complexity to carry on. That being the case I think it is best to start with as little complexity as we can, especially since the end of the prologue will leave Akorian in a rather precarious position.
 
[X] Discover a strange altar of ancient make in your wanderings from which a voice speaks without words, soothing the uncertainties of your soul
-[X] Paladin

[X] Call out in the dark places of the world for someone, anyone to hear your voice and give you purpose. Something answers (Summoner)

[X] Show kindness unbidden to a beast which barely seemed large enough to be thrown in the pot and were rewarded with uncanny power (Witch)
 
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Cleared up the votes as much as I could, this does not quite reflect all the sub-votes perfectly but it should give you guys a decent idea of where things stand. So far Oracle has a respectable lead but far from overwhelming lead on a variety of other classes neck to neck following it. I think I will leave this up a full 24 hours at least given all the debate going on.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Feb 18, 2023 at 1:09 PM, finished with 45 posts and 19 votes.

  • [X] Only grow stranger as you age and many whisper that you are ill luck upon the tribe. As you grow apart so do you gain a measure of understanding of what you have become and how you might wield it (Oracle)
    [x] Are pushed too far by your peers and in a moment of strife discover the power within that will mark you for all your days in the eyes of your kin and beyond (Sorcerer)
    [X] Acquire a gift for writing and a love of words second to none; watching and cataloguing powers seen and unseen even as you are ignored (Wizard)
    [X] Wander far into the wilds, finding the company of the beasts that fill the nightmares of your kin to be better at times than their own
    -[X] Druid
    [X] Show kindness unbidden to a beast which barely seemed large enough to be thrown in the pot and were rewarded with uncanny power (Witch)
    [X] Become first a cook, then a healer of sort, experimenting with strange mushrooms and the meat of beasts unfit even to burn (Alchemist)
    [X] Call out in the dark places of the world for someone, anyone to hear your voice and give you purpose. Something answers (Summoner)
    [X] Discover a strange altar of ancient make in your wanderings from which a voice speaks without words, soothing the uncertainties of your soul
    -[X] Paladin
    [X] Grow into a fierce warrior, turning the rage at your fellows' disdain against the enemies of the tribe
    -[X] Bloodrager
    [X] Rogue
    [X] Follow the path of the Dancer as best you understand it, those unbound by clan who wander the long tunnels to bind the people to one another beyond the trackless miles
    -[X] Skald
    [X] When you first saw a spell being cast by a visiting duregar trader your first questions were how ? , What ? and Why ? , since then you have scrutinized and near obsessed over every bit of magic you could get your hands on trying to answer these questions ,examining their causes and effects along with all the supernatural forces and powers big and small involved to satisfy your curiosity of the arcane. This fascination with foreign sorcery has done little to endear you to the rest of your people ( Arcanist – d20PFSRD)
    [X] Follow the path of the Whisper-Foot, most common among your kin
    -[X] Slayer
 
Personally would want to play at least a mixed martial class since want to play a fighter this time around, make full use of sneak attacks!
 
Personally would want to play at least a mixed martial class since want to play a fighter this time around, make full use of sneak attacks!
An intrigue or shadow oracle can get absurdly, unfairly, stealthy. It wouldn't take much on top of that to make a better sneak attack/ambush build than you can get with a rogue main baseline.

I don't really like martial classes, but we could come up with a reasonable mix.
 
I want to go for either wizard or arcanist , a pure learned caster who can if played correctly with right amount of thought be a solo campaign as to reduce strain on the GM while also having a wide array of options to adventure both at low and high level , since a learned arcane caster is both a skill monkey with spells and skill ranks and able to travel anywhere from the prime material to the outer plains to building his own multiverse traveling spell Jammer it gives us the most freedom to adventure and hit way above out weight class if called for would mean the GM has a lot of freedom when planning out encounters and adventures since whatever he put in front of us we can generally with the right amount of luck and clearness overcome , unlike if for example we play a pure fighter man and have a locked door we can not break down put in front of us at which point we'd be stuck
 
An intrigue or shadow oracle can get absurdly, unfairly, stealthy. It wouldn't take much on top of that to make a better sneak attack/ambush build than you can get with a rogue main baseline.

I don't really like martial classes, but we could come up with a reasonable mix.
Yep!

My proposed Shadow Oracle build starts off with a +9 Stealth bonus, and it will rapidly increase from there. It will be +14 by 3rd level, if we gain the Cloak of Darkness Revelation, and +19 at 5th level. At 10th level it will be +32, and that's without considering boosts from spells or magic items.

We'll also be able to cast the Invisibility spell at 4th level. We learn Deeper Darkness at 6th level, and that's a potentially devastating spell to use against anything that relies on sight and doesn't have our See in Darkness ability; IIRC, See in Darkness is very rare to find outside of Devils and certain other denizens of the Darklands.

Just because we won't have a Rogue's ability to Sneak Attack doesn't mean we won't be able to pull off good ambushes.
 
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