Even Further Beyond [Complete]

This is fair, but, like, what problems is Nameless the Layabout going to be able solve that Suizhen wouldn't? He would be weaker than her, less skilled at rulership than her, less invested in social wellbeing than her, etc. So at best, he would let Suizhen be in two places at once rather than one, which IMO may still not be enough?
If there's a problem that Nameless can't handle with Artifice or the Diagram then I can only assume that the Accursed is on his way to deal with the elder horror bent on devouring all that could ever possibly exist. Seriously the amount of issues which aren't solvable by throwing Nameless at it are pretty small in the long run. Even if it's "only" him making an artifact which spreads Yong style fertility on steroids across the world.
 
If there's a problem which exists that Nameless can't handle with Artifice or the Diagram then I can only assume that the Accursed is on his way to deal with the elder horror bent on devouring all that could ever possibly exist. Seriously the amount of issues which aren't solvable by throwing Nameless at it are pretty small in the long run. Even if it's "only" him making an artifact which spreads Yong style fertility on steroids across the world.
I mean, I guess that's fair, but I just don't get the feeling 'get these two backwater hicks to stop refusing to do business with one another in a way which interferes with the ability of the empire to peacefully improve their lives' is something that Nameless if going to have the patience to sit down and make a custom artifact for, considering it could easily happen trillions of a times a generation?
 
Trouble does show up in one place at a time, and even with stage 18 rulership I suspect that there will be problems that Suizhen needs at least amount of time it takes speak a few words to solve

Suizhen, at Stage 18, has infinite speed and can write on things. She effectively can be in as many places at once as she likes, at least on the scales relevant to the Labyrinth Empire. Also, Elves for uncorruptible, superhumanly charismatic and skilled functionaries. Also, also resurrection to handle any fuckups.

I mean, I guess that's fair, but I just don't get the feeling 'get these two backwater hicks to stop refusing to do business with one another in a way which interferes with the ability of the empire to peacefully improve their lives' is something that Nameless if going to have the patience to sit down and make a custom artifact for, considering it could easily happen trillions of a times a generation?

Just use a bunch of Yong Dao Cultivators or Elven Naturalists to turn the Empire into a post-scarcity society. No arguments to resolve, so long as resource distribution is handled, which it would be through Elves and the implicit threat of their Empress.
 
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I mean, I guess that's fair, but I just don't get the feeling 'get these two backwater hicks to stop refusing to do business with one another in a way which interferes with the ability of the empire to peacefully improve their lives' is something that Nameless if going to have the patience to sit down and make a custom artifact for, considering it could easily happen trillions of a times a generation?
I'm reasonably sure that's what underlings are for? Seriously that's not even an issue which Suizhen would have to deal with, just sic one of her many aides as Empress to go and work things out. I'm fairly certain that having Sword-level talent at running a government lets you know how to delegate.
 
I mean, I guess that's fair, but I just don't get the feeling 'get these two backwater hicks to stop refusing to do business with one another in a way which interferes with the ability of the empire to peacefully improve their lives' is something that Nameless if going to have the patience to sit down and make a custom artifact for, considering it could easily happen trillions of a times a generation?

NAMELESS: Kill 'em.

SUIZHEN: What!? Sir, are you sure...

NAMELESS: Yeah, just kill 'em. I'll resurrect them and we'll figure it out later. Someday. That'll learn 'em not to escalate this crap to the point where it bothers fucking me. Hey, you want a sandwich?

SUIZHEN: I can't say I'm not tempted, Sir! Is it one of Aurelia's?

NAMELESS: You know it. Freshly stolen from the kitchen!

That is to say, for the Thrice-Great, the problem of good governance is more a matter of motivation than ability... in some sense Rain is the most restrictive in terms of Nameless' scope of action since he can neither filter Daos through the Nebula Battlesuit or Absorb Reality Effects via Might's Ring.
 
Suizhen, at Stage 18, has infinite speed and can write on things. She effectively can be in as many places at once as she likes, at least on the scales relevant to the Labyrinth Empire. Also, Elves for uncorruptible, superhumanly charismatic and skilled functionaries. Also, also resurrection to handle any fuckups.

Just use a bunch of Yong Dao Cultivators or Elven Naturalists to turn the Empire into a post-scarcity society. No arguments to resolve, so long as resource distribution is handled, which it would be through Elves and the implicit threat of their Empress.
Moving through air infinite speed does not do good things to other people who are also touching the air. Also, I guess that's fair, but at the same time I don't really see how 'just use magic to make the world bountiful everywhere for everyone' is something particularly unique to having Suizhen as stage 18 god-empress, rather than stage 16 part-time god-empress.

I'm reasonably sure that's what underlings are for? Seriously that's not even an issue which Suizhen would have to deal with, just sic one of her many aides as Empress to go and work things out. I'm fairly certain that having Sword-level talent at running a government lets you know how to delegate.
She can delegate, yes, but there just aren't that many people who are as power as her, or Nameless, or Nameless-1 around to delegate to? IIRC high-level cultivators are super rare, and the number of titanic cultivators who aren't Nameless or Suizhen can be counted on one hand.
 
Moving through air infinite speed does not do good things to other people who are also touching the air.

The Nameless already moves at speeds that would sunder the world if Cultivators gave a fuck about things like drag. Considering the world seems just fine, I don't think it's an issue. Since Cultivation also scales up control, they don't even have to worry about any fuckups.

Also, I guess that's fair, but at the same time I don't really see how 'just use magic to make the world bountiful everywhere for everyone' is something particularly unique to having Suizhen as stage 18 god-empress, rather than stage 16 part-time god-empress.

Stage 18 is good governance and the guarantee against Kong and the Fates.

She can delegate, yes, but there just aren't that many people who are as power as her, or Nameless, or Nameless-1 around to delegate to? IIRC high-level cultivators are super rare, and the number of titanic cultivators who aren't Nameless or Suizhen can be counted on one hand.

They don't need to be Cultivators when they're backed by the implicit threat of transcendental gods like Suizhen and the Nameless. Anybody who fucks with an Elven functionary could have various unspeakably awful fates inflicted on them, where even death is not an escape.

People will get the message.

Also, we can mass manufacture Grand Solipsist Cultivators so it's still really not an issue.
 
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Omake time. Imagining a far, far future. Initially I wanted to make the POV character a Rihaku quest cameo (maybe the Shining Heroine?) but I didn't want to go back and reread them all to get the tone right so have an OC. Also consider this advocacy for vampire minions!

1033 words

"Alright." He sunk down on the chair, thoughts interrupted for a solid five seconds by how awesome it felt to sit in it, how the fine cushions molded to his form, more comfortable than his gaming chair back home at ever been despite the apparent tech level of this world. He'd avoided all but the blandest of food and drink to avoid distractions, yet even the fucking chairs messed with his mind here. Whatever was making everything feel better was apparently too strong or insidious to be prevented by his admittedly lackluster mental defences.

"Alright what, boss?" His train of thought was interrupted, or perhaps brought back on track, by the glowing sprite before him. Just five days since he accepted the deal, and the little faerie companion was starting to seem totally normal. Totally worth the remittance slot, if you asked him. A near-absolute information advantage, omniscience filtered through a mind actually capable of distilling only the information he actually needed, capable of giving advice, serving as a training aid and a million other, 'minor' functions. "Alright, what can you tell me, Na'ry?"

"I've compiled all information on this world and your target ever known to at least one being within fifteen million levels of your own, piercing all information-concealing effects of less than absolute magnitude and sorted them according to what you'd find most useful. The mental effect you've been feeling is caused by the Veil of Maya. I recommend you simply practise your willpower to lessen the effect, you can use the stat training. I will remind you on regular intervals to get back to work."


Well, he might have joked that she was an annoying faerie like from a certain video game before, but having her actively interrupt him whenever he had fun would definitely heighten the similarities, even if it was for his own good.

"As you know, you are tasked with acquiring at least one 'Ring of the Ages'. Each one is an artifact of immense power, an entire aeon ended by fate made manifest, granting its wearer tremendous power. Two are held by the Overlord himself, one by his wife and one by his immortal lich mentor slash adviser so...let's just say the 500 years time limit for this task might be cutting it a bit close, even for a progression type."

"So grind for a bunch of levels and power up before I go for them, as usual. I've got time. Tell me about this Overlord, who do I have to watch out for?"

"This reality is ruled by The Nameless Overlord. I am unable to access full information on him, as he falls outside the permitted level range. He has claimed an entire Dyson sphere as his palace of infinite indulgence, attended by...well boss, let's just say he grow up spoiled to a ridiculous degree and aeons of ruling only made it worse. Luckily, he is lazy as fuck and won't lift a single finger unless we directly threaten him or the few people he cares about. The real danger as we ramp up in power are his enforcers. Let me show you."

A moment later, and a lifelike hologram sprang up in front of him, only the slight hue giving it away as fake, conjured up by Na'ry. It was a man, though not a human, his limbs too slender, his ears slightly pointy, moving with a strange, alien grace, flowing from one step into the next. When he smiled, a pair of thin fangs poked between his lips, somehow managing to look totally natural and not threatening. <Fledgling Highborn, 9000th generation, level 13,600,106>.

"The Overlord is what to you is probably best described as a vampire of truly ridiculous power. And he's capable of passing that power down to his lieutenants, who pass it on in turn and so on. This Fledgling here is 9000 steps removed from the Overlord, and still outlevels you by far. I was unable to acquire full information on any higher generation vampires, as they fell outside the level range. Their greatest weakness is their extreme sense of justice and morality, which you should be able to exploit, though don't think they're idiots. The good news is they should present a nice power gradient for you to power-level with, if you can find a sufficiently thinblooded enforcer to start with. Once vamps of one generation stop providing meaningful xp, the next higher generation should be within reach, and sufficiently alerted to come after you, to boot!"

She knew exactly when to stop in her info dumps, to give him time to process the information, to prevent his mind from wandering or getting bored. He stared out the window of his hotel room, given to him free of charge when he swore he had no money. Below, the streets churned with people, celebrating a festival of some kind, music and laughter rising all the way up. There was always a celebration going, they'd told him. Nobody in the endless domain of the nameless ever wanted for anything, needed anything, that was the task he had given his numberless minions, and they'd carried out his will with fanatical loyalty. Was it really his place, then, to upset everything, slaughter his way through the local powers and steal some kind of overpowered ring?

And just as she knew when to stop talking, she also knew when to start again, his little assistant faerie distracting him from his grim thoughts: "But it's not just danger, this world also offers a great number of opportunities to grow your power. Even were you not a progression-type cursebearer, you could still pick up quite a lot of it here. With your gifts, we can quickly boost you to at least relevance against thinblooded enforcers, where combat levelling can take over, thanks to what the locals call 'Cultivation'. I have compiled a list of forgotten or abandoned stashes of cultivation resources and priceless treasures for you to exploit, most left over from the fall of the great sects and clans. Within 3 months we should be able to get all the low hanging fruits that provide no moral quandaries, at which point we can re-evaluate..."
 
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The Nameless already moves at speeds that would sunder the world if Cultivators gave a fuck about things like drag. Considering the world seems just fine, I don't think it's an issue. Since Cultivation also scales up control, they don't even have to worry about any fuckups.

Stage 18 is good governance and the guarantee against Kong and the Fates.

They don't need to be Cultivators when they're backed by the implicit threat of transcendental gods like Suizhen and the Nameless. Anybody who fucks with an Elven functionary could be tortured to death, resurrected and then tortured again. People will get the message very quickly.

Also, we can mass manufacture Grand Solipsist Cultivators so it's still really not an issue.
Nameless has never used infinite speed (on account of never actually having stage 15 movement, IIRC), so for him at least he might just be up far enough that the shockwaves get damped before they hit the ground. He also can just fucking teleport, which also solves the issue.

Having Suizhen be stage 18 with Swordmaiden does guaranteed good governance, and I suppose the only literal guarantee against Kong, but I don't think that it's the only way for us to have distinctly strong odds of beating both of them.

I have concede the last point though. I straight up for forgot out essence transfer without blood being a thing. So yeah, overall Swordmaiden Suizhen will definitely lead to an overall stronger government post-win. I don't think that necessarily means that the government post-win with Distillation will necessarily be bad though, since we will still be employing Suizhen in all her idealism and a bunch of undiminished elven functionaries.
 
Realistically speaking.

The last thing we want is for Nameless to be in charge of anything. Arguably not even his own life. Spoiled is so fucking awful
 
Nameless has never used infinite speed (on account of never actually having stage 15 movement, IIRC), so for him at least he might just be up far enough that the shockwaves get damped before they hit the ground. He also can just fucking teleport, which also solves the issue.

Nameless stepped forward, atomizing the tide of beasts and verdigris before him. Behind him, the defenders of Yongshan stood frozen, as if suspended in lucite, prisoner to their simple lack of speed. In the space between their heartbeats he could clear out their whole nation, sunder both heaven and the Mountain that ruled all below it. But he did not. That was not his purpose this day.

Destruction rippled like a molasses wave through the ranks of the rampaging beasts, row after row bursting into contrail of shredded flesh as they contacted the impact of his forward step. Suizhen looked upon the scene with ambiguous eyes. He glanced briefly at her before walking into the Overgrowth.

This is Stage 14 Nameless, who's already got supercluster level strength and likely proportional speed. Despite this, both Suizhen, the randos and the planet are untouched by this impossible power.

Considering it doesn't mention any world shattering conflagrations of plasma, I think things will be just fine.

Having Suizhen be stage 18 with Swordmaiden does guaranteed good governance, and I suppose the only literal guarantee against Kong, but I don't think that it's the only way for us to have distinctly strong odds of beating both of them.

Of course it's not. To do so with Tyranshal's path requires us to face Heavenly Tribulation, which is an uncertain affair at best. To do so with the Ring condemns us do a fate worse than death or loss*. Because of these, I'm voting for Rain.

*i've read too much xianxia trash man. i can't go back. don't make me go back.
 
As Nameless adventure approach its conclusion I think it's worth it to look back on how it all began, with the benefit of hindsight.
- Even Further Beyond -
In the end isn't that what's it all about? For it is through the terrifying power of omakes and other fanworks and the beyond points they generated that the Fates will come to know their doom.
An Age of the World draws to a close. Cataclysm and anarchy ravage its peoples. Bandits and monstrosities prowl the wilderness. The great empires of yore are decaying husks of their former glory, offering little protection at the price of ceaseless exploitation. Oppressed, benighted, savaged by tempest and claw, the masses of the world cry out for a savior.
In retrospect, that was not actually true from the beginning. It is only through Liefang (directed by the guiding hand of the Fates) that this is finally coming true, though the creation of the Overgrowth (also ultimately a fruit of the machinations of the Fates, for all that it was accomplished by Zang Kong's hand) was apparently enough of a pretext to excuse the intervention of the Fates.
Their cry is answered. The self-styled Divinities, secret masters of the world, send forth one of their own to be born amongst the people, to live as incarnate flesh and lead them into a new Age. Every genius shall be afforded her. Destiny shall be her perennial ally, circumstance laid prostrate at her feet. She shall tear down the moldering edifices of the past and lay them as kindling for the phoenix-flame to come. From that conflagration shall the Spirit of the World be born anew, the close of an Age and the dawn of its successor.
And none of this will ever get to happen because we're just going to murder the Fates themselves.
At all costs, she must be stopped.
Oh, she will be, don't you worry.
Balance is the watchword of the Divinities, and the appearance of balance their ultimate law. For one of their number to transgress openly upon the world, a countervailing force must be raised.

Hence your presence, child of Earth.
And what a countervailing force it turned out to be!
Make no mistake: you are doomed. Though they will grant you raw power the equal of her own, they have tilted the world so thoroughly in her favor that your defeat is all but inevitable. Such is written in the air and the stars, in the seas and the fields, written on the very bones of the earth.
You're vastly underestimating Nameless.
Your life is tied now to a dying Age, and should it breathe its last your very existence is forfeit.
Not if we pick up the Ring of Might! Then we truly will be unbeatable...
Consignment to oblivion is likely the kindest fate in that scenario. It is in your best interests to delay that hour for as long you can.
Delay? So little ambition... We will not merely delay our inevitable loss, we will triumph!
Willing or not, you are conscripted for this role. Soon you will be confronted with a plethora of choices; balance to your unwitting recruitment, a myriad of ways in which the power of your station can manifest itself. They hope that in your inexperience, you will destroy yourself by choosing foolishly. See now how they operate, always and forever: superficial fairness to mask the stacked deck.

Choose carefully. Choose well. For all of us that have come before.
Given the result of our choice, I think we can indeed say that we chose well. Though a large part of that has to be put on the shoulder of our frankly absurd Beyond Points generation and it was Rihaku who ended coming up with the details of the plan that got us here in the end...
Alright, enough of that!

Sorry about him, kid, the servants can get a bit uppity at times. It's my own fault, I like 'em with a bit of fight. Makes it easier to justify punishments, heh.
What an asshole. Soon to be a dead asshole.
1) You're in a contest with my sister to determine the fate of the world. You're trying to prop up the old order, she's trying to destroy it. Win, and we'll grant any wish within our power - no grumbling or rules-lawyering, guaranteed. Lose and you're fucked.
Good thing we have no intention to lose, then!
2) To make it fair, you'll be granted three Celestial Orbs. Spend 'em below to give yourself a fighting chance. You can take more orbs, but then we have to grant some of her requests as well. Gotta keep things balanced.
In retrospect they really shouldn't have given us the chance to get more orbs this way, should they? I mean, it made sense for them to do that given the nature of the Zang Kong threat but it really ended up screwing them over in the end...
3) Once you've spent your orbs, we'll kick you down to the mortal realm. Anything goes over there. The contest won't be finished until the Age ends or her life does.

4) The Age ends once all great empires that defined it have fallen. Should an ambiguous situation pop up, you'll intuitively know which side to support.
Pretty simple rules... But we have no reason to play by them now that we have accumulated enough power to take out the Fates directly! And given that the Fates were hoping for us to help with the Zang Kong problem and the Fates are weaker than him, I feel like they should have seen that one coming...
Got it? Good!

Oh, a word of advice: try to make a good show of it. No one likes it when the Dark Lord lays down and dies 'for the good of the world.' My sister might appreciate the gesture, but don't expect the rest of us to go easy on you afterwards!
The very idea of Nameless lying down and dying 'for the good of the world' is kind of hilarious... And I'm pretty sure that, looking back on it, the Fates are now wishing he had done just that. Of course, in retrospect, the reason they didn't want us to just lay down and die 'for the good of the world' had nothing to do with entertainment, but everything to do with the fact that they needed an ally against Zang Kong.
Special
Some personal offers from yours truly! You should pick these.
That make those options sound like obvious traps but, given our current situation, Young Master turned out to be an excellent option (at least when paired with Thrice-Great).
[ ] Reincarnation (1 orb) - Now, you unfortunately are not actually the reincarnation of a mythological warrior or legendary wizard, but that can be rectified. We'll induce a temporal schism to split off a fragment of your soul, hurl it back in time, and twist Destiny to ensure you do something notable with your life. An existence full of hardship and tribulation awaits you, all for your benefit in the future! Advantages unspecified, but likely vast.

*Grants roughly 3 orbs worth of benefits over time, the exact nature depending on the activities of your past soul fragment, but no immediate power.
*
Your soul fragment will likely be aggrieved over your treatment of you. May result in conflicts during reintegration.
Could have been very interesting even if the purpose of it was only to turn us against Zang Kong in the end. Ultimately though, we did not need the extra power provided by this option.
[ ] Young Master (2 orbs) - No one likes being born a loser. Don't worry, we can fix that.

*Rather than being placed directly into the world, you'll reincarnate in the same manner as your opponent, but with all your memories intact. You'll live a charmed life, guaranteed a position of prosperity and power until you reach your maturity. Your new body will be exceptionally strong, quick of limb and of mind, well-formed and attractive. You will have a natural charisma that makes alliances easy and inspires even your enemies to begrudging respect. You will be able to leverage the contacts and connections of the family you're born into for additional benefits.
*A myriad of advantages at a steep cost, and not just in orbs - you'll lose your temporal head start over your opponent, a serious issue.
The costs of the option are obvious and I was highly skeptical of it when it was first offered, but it turned out to be completely worth it.
Magic
I'm sure this section will be popular. You mortals love that weeb shit... I personally find it disgusting. Servant, take over!
I really want to see this guy face when this 'disgusting weeb shit' end up destroying him and his fellow Fates...
[ ] Cultivation (1 orb) - In theory, anyone who has not practiced another form of magic can Cultivate! However, those with the talent to become relevant in battle are far less common. Spending an orb here will ensure a prodigious talent arises within you, the equal or superior of any who live in this age. 



*An art that focuses on 'improving' and 'modifying' the self to attain ever-increasing heights of longevity and personal power. There are seven known stages of Cultivation, each vastly greater than the last: Ego Barrier, Organ Refining, Soul Chrysalis, Dao Cleaving, Reality Forming, Grand Solipsism, Titanic Ascension.

*Past the first few stages, Cultivators are far stronger than practitioners of the other arts, and only moderately less versatile. 

*Reaching even modest heights requires a massive investment of time, effort, and resources. Only the improbably fortunate or shockingly talented ever advance past the second stage. Competition for cultivation resources is unremitting.
A copy of Zang Kong talent as it turns out. Kind of hilarious that the Fates reaction to the Zang Kong problem was to offer their opponent in this game... a copy of Zang Kong talent! And all for one measly Orb! Desperate times call for desperate measures I suppose. Not that this is anywhere near their greatest mistake in the design of this competition.
] Diagram Magic (1 orb) - In Ages past, the magi of the Diagram School worked ceaselessly to stamp out all other forms of magic, for each conflicting paradigm saps a magical School's effectiveness. For a time, they were successful. At their hands fell the Dwarves and their Stonecunning, the Orcs and their War-Magic, and all tribes of men that dared arise to oppose them. Their paradigm was ascendent; their power unchallengeable. Among their archmagi were men and women capable of traveling a thousand miles with a gesture, of eradicating whole cities with a word. 


Then came the Cultivators. 

Now the nations of the Diagram are broken, their peoples assimilated, their power shattered. Archamge holdouts remain, hidden underground or in subspace dimensions, reliant on lichdom and superior logistics to harry those who humiliated them so many years ago. They are a bitter and fractious people, arcanists who committed atrocities of terrible scope for ends that turned out to be ultimately frivolous. The paradigm of Diagram magic remains unchallenged to this day, for Cultivation's inward focus shelters it from such interactions. Cold comfort, that. 



This option grants you an affinity for Diagram magic and a natural understanding of how to develop it. 



*A relatively resource-light school that can be learned with only the proper materials and sufficient intelligence, and mastered in only decades.

*Superb versatility: Teleportation, transmutation, divination, and other such wizardly magics. A great force multiplier if you have a non-magical power source. 

*The School is truly adroit at countering other schools of external magic, an advantage that is lamentably useless in the present Age.
Ah, the Diagram... Nameless first love when it comes to magic. I was rather skeptical of the initial monofocus on this discipline at the expanse of cultivation during Nameless early years, but given how it turned out in the end, I can't say I regret it.
[ ] Binary Magic (1 orb) - The Twin Magics of the elves do not follow the strict logic of their human counterparts. Do not expect consistent or replicable results. 


Elven Artifice consumes the essence of its practitioners, leading to eventual madness and ruin, but can forge masterworks of world-shaping significance. Elven Naturalism allows one to redefine the nature of one's lands in the mortal realm. It presents numerous applications, defense foremost among them. Nonetheless, the last elven nation is a pale shadow of its former glory, corralled into an increasingly cramped homeland by all manner of foe. Their own fault, really.



*Practitioners of Artifice are poor Naturalists, and vice-versa. 

*Neither school yields reliable results, but their grandest effects can be spectacular nonetheless - rivaling the potency of the mightiest Cultivators while surpassing the Diagram Schools in versatility.

*This option grants enough raw ability to begin forging Artifacts immediately, if so desired. Beware the cost of Artifice, and the avarice of your lessers.
You'd have to pretty silly to pick this option by itself, but with the ability to cultivate and thus replenish one essence (and a hefty supply of Beyond Points) it turns out to be completely busted!
[ ] Thrice-Great (4 orbs) - If the three schools of magic could ever be mastered by a single entity, their powers would not combine linearly. Interactions would be discovered that compound one upon the other: 

Artifice devours the self, which Cultivation replenishes and fortifies. Diagram divination to locate rare Cultivation resources, transmutation to render out any imperfections. A time-dilating Artifact or Diagram to buy subjective eons for a Cultivator to reach breakthrough. Or consider the simple destruction incipient in a kinetic-amplification Diagram married to a Cultivator's brute strength. 

This option combines the benefits of the three options preceding, allowing them to be used in unison.



*Long-term potential is immense.

*Spending four orbs towards an option that provides no immediate or even short-term security is immensely risky.
And this is, without doubt, the Fates greatest mistake. What were they thinking? Zang Kong was such an existential threat to them by the dint of his Cultivation talent alone and then they go and give their enemy the option of getting a path to power which combine that talent with incredibly potent synergistic multipliers... I mean, sure, they intended for us to fall in love with the heroine and they couldn't really have predicted the absurd amount of beyond points we managed to generate, but still...
[ ] The Bow (1 orb) - The Sign of the Bow grants you a Conquerer's Heart. When you struggle to overcome a genuine enemy and finally prevail, there is a good chance they will become your loyal ally. Boon companions forged from such circumstances may instigate friendly rivalries with you, but would never betray you.

*The effect has one chance to trigger per victory over a major foe. Compatible personalities or a more difficult struggle improve your chances.
*Ineffective against your true nemesis.
Who needs that kind of crutch when one can be Liefang son and learn to acquire people loyalty the hard way?
[ ] The Sword (2 orbs) - The Sign of the Sword grants you the Blood Impulse. You will gain an intuition for physical conflict that well exceeds the humanly possible. This holistic combat instinct explosively accelerates your progress in any martial discipline and renders you immune to violent ambush. Magic is not a martial discipline per se, but differences in fighting skill can compensate for a power gap.

*Applies to violent conflict in greater contexts as well, so with experience you could become an expert general and tactician as well as combatant.
*True battle is necessary to awaken your potential. You will not improve in a fight without stakes, the higher the better.
It has been speculated that Suizhen has this. I'm not sure it's really worth 2 Orbs though?
[ ] The Scales (2 orbs) - The Sign of the Scales grants the power of the Robber Baron. You will gain skills of appraisal, perceptiveness, administration, and manipulation verging on the preternatural. You will semi-regularly encounter situations which you can exploit for considerable profits at the cost of bringing ruin to others. You are under no obligation to leverage these situations. Remember: your powers are structured for their entertainment, but nothing prevents you from growing past your role.

*Able to talk your way out of most fights, but the truly determined are unlikely to be swayed by mere words.
*The pettiness, transparency, and selfishness of normal humans will wear on you. You see their true intentions, even the ones they hide from themselves.
Or be Liefang son and get basically this for free! Well ok, we're probably not that good. But still...
[ ] The Scythe (3 orbs) - The Sign of the Scythe grants the power of the Harvest. Upon slaying a genuine enemy, you may designate one of their attributes. If it is higher than your own, you will gain ranks in that attribute equal to the difference. Those slain by you cannot be resurrected by any known means.

*If you have the strength of one man, and kill a monster who has the strength of twenty men, you'll have the strength of twenty men.
*Skills cannot be acquired in this manner, but talents can. However, the Scythe alone does not allow you to practice multiple schools of magic - you could gain the relevant attributes, but would be unable to use them.
*The process is quite obvious, you will gain a reputation quickly. Few could trust the bearer of such a power.
A potent ability, but one which could never have come close to threatening Zang Kong, given that nothing in this world come close to Zang Kong power short of the Fates themselves.
[ ] Limit Break (1 orb) - At the cost of grievous harm to your physical and spiritual corpus, you can temporarily exceed your limits in a situation of great exigency, becoming many times more powerful than you would normally be. Each use dramatically shortens your lifespan. For a normal human, a single minute of use will reduce lifespan by 5-10 years.

*Immortality can reverse the physical consequences, but not the spiritual deterioration.
*The technique is less effective the more powerful you are. A normal human might become dozens of times stronger and faster, while a Grand Solipsist might only triple in total strength.
Imagine being so desperate for safety has to spend an Orb on this.
[ ] Guardian Beast (2 orbs) - You will be given a sequence of three runes. Within them is a guardian spirit of immense power, capable of matching even the mightiest denizens of the mortal world. Three times the Guardian Beast will protect you from certain death, slaughtering any enemies present. After the third, its power is expended, and it will watch over you no further. Should you wish the creature to escape oblivion, call upon it no more than twice.

If you should have a child, you may pass the Guardian Beast to them, replenishing its usable charges.

*The Guardian Beast can repel, but not slay, your nemesis. The very strongest Cultivators can also survive its attentions.
'capable of matching even the mightiest denizens of the mortal world'? Color me skeptical given that those include Zang Kong!

It does precise that the strongest Cultivators can survive its attention, but I would expect Zang Kong to do far more than merely survive if faced against such a creature...
[ ] Immortality (3 orbs) - There are other means to secure longevity, but few as potent and reliable as this one. Eternal youth and enormously powerful regeneration are yours; you recover from the most grievous wounds in a matter of seconds. This will also preserve your life in the absence of sustenance. Should the Age be ended, however, the conditions of your defeat will still apply.

*Offers no protection against capture or torture.
The ultimate in safety! At the completely extravagant cost of 3 full Orbs...
[ ] Cursebearer (4 orbs) - Surely I've seen this option before, but I don't recall anything...

If you seek power enough, not merely to survive, but to triumph, then I have an offer for you.
The conditions are imperfect, your suitability mediocre. But they will suffice, if your resolve is true.
They so badly desire a Dark Lord. Give them one worthy of the name.
*Pay four orbs and take on three Curses to be appointed a Combat-class Cursebearer.
*Curses are disadvantages far more serious than those listed in the Drawbacks.
*The sheer force of a Combat-class Cursebearer represents power enough to sunder armies and boil seas, to shatter continents and raze nations to ash. Even in a world such as this, the number of experts capable of overcoming you could be countered on the fingers of one hand. But your Cursebearer powers will not grow on their own and may be difficult to improve with the resources you have available.
*Compared to the other choices, you'll be playing a completely different style of campaign.
'Power enough, not merely to survive, but to triumph'... is that what they sub-titanic power these days?

In the end, we attained enough power to truly triumph, power far in excess of any this option could have ever provided us with, without even needing to take on any Curses at all!
Drawbacks
For each one you choose, you'll be granted an additional orb, up to seven total orbs.
Choose carefully, some combinations will all but spell your doom.
In retrospect, they probably should have capped the total number of Orb we could get at a lower number.
[ ] Unnamed - It has been requested that you be stripped of your name. You shall not recall it, not those who knew you in other worlds. You may refer to yourself by a pseudonym or abbreviation, but never a proper name. Names are important to the Divinities, and your lack of one may de-humanize you in their eyes, but tactically speaking this request is harmless. The Divinities loathe to think of themselves as bad people.

*There were a number of omakes in the last thread that I enjoyed but didn't credit, so have this free orb.
I'm sure they appreciate having offered us an extra Orb as such a low price and now being able to de-humanize us as we proceed to murder them...
[ ] Incarnate - Normally you would have a period of decades to familiarize yourself with the world and gather power before your nemesis reaches maturity, fully regains her memories, and begins adventuring. Should you choose this, some contrivance will ensure that your opponent is fully operational within the year. Temporal acceleration, spiritual possession, stranger methods - you won't have much time before she begins to accumulate power and fortune with terrifying speed.

*There is no reliable way to locate your opponent until she begins accumulating power, so even without this you won't be likely to kill her before she starts adventuring - destiny will see to that.
Imagine having to deal with an active heroine from the start instead of being able to kill the Fates before she even become active in the first place...
[ ] An Age of Glory - The world will not have a single savior, but many. A number of great heroes will emerge alongside your opponent, each bearing some unique and unpredictable advantage. While they may have their petty differences, none will be satisfied with a world in decline. You might subvert one or two, but the majority are likely to unite against you.

*4-5 other heroes will appear around the world, nearly as powerful as your opponent. Unless you have taken In Full Bloom, it may be difficult to figure out which one is actually your opponent.
4-5 heroes, eh? One of them is Suizhen and presumably the Rubric hero is another, I wonder who the other 2-3 are? Not that it really matters at this point...
[ ] Trebly Bound - The elves know well that theirs is a nation in decline. In their desperation, they turned to a power they did not fully understand. Should you accept the offer inherent in their summoning ritual, you will be granted one orb's worth of power, but be bound in service to the Elvish state. The pathologically noble elves would never compel you against your free will, but should they fall then so too shall you.

*Rather than being defeated after every major empire falls, you will lose if the Elvish nation does. The Elves' position is considerably more precarious than that of humanity. Their once-vast power has been expended on one too many a selfless crusade. They would rather a thousand of the highborn die willingly, than for one human child to perish undeservingly.
*Fulfill your degenerate fantasies and become, at least from one perspective, a summoned hero! Your opponent will know of your new loss condition.
The elves really deserved a hero... And we kind of ended up as their hero despite us never picking up this drawback! We even got very nice perks out of it...
[ ] Heroic Passions - The maximum valence of your emotions will be greatly expanded, allowing your soul to safely contain more power. However, your notable traits will be exacerbated to tragic proportions. Imagine Achilles sulking in his tent while his countrymen die, or Agamemnon sacrificing his own daughter for favorable winds.

*Does not affect day-to-day life overmuch, but intimate relationships and important decisions may be much trickier to resolve.
This is the Fates other major mistake. I'm sure they're looking at our Heroic Passion: Vengeful and regretting their life choices, right about now...
[ ] Talentless - You are unable to perform magic of any kind. You cannot Cultivate, cannot perform Diagram Magic and cannot perform Binary Magic.

*You may still benefit from the Scythe in acquiring attributes unrelated to the casting of magic (magic resistance from a monster, for example).
*Some Cursebearer powers are non-magical in nature.
Why would you ever pick this?
[ ] In Full Bloom (+2 orbs) - Your opponent will be permitted to employ her full powers to personally customizing her life before being instantiated. As soon as her reincarnated form reaches adolescence, the following benefits will accrue:

While previously good fortune followed her like a favorable wind, now it will shelter her with hurricane force. Fate will accept virtually any turn of events, no matter how contrived, to ensure her survival. No misfortune will befall her save that which is sown to reap even grander rewards in the future, a heroic panoply surely powerful enough to overcome you in time.

*Your opponent was already a reincarnated goddess and omni-disciplinary genius with incredible good fortune. This will raise her plot armor to nigh-impenetrable levels while also granting at least two additional advantages of equivalent scale. Your only realistic hope will be to array the entire world against her before she reaches maturity, and strike before she accrues too much power.
Really dangerous, but probably not unwinnable with the right build and enough Beyond Points, given what we now know is possible... But why would we have ever risked such a thing? Definitely not worth it.

Given the whole Zang Kong problem, the Fates must have really really wanted us to pick this option, but realistically they must have known we would never go for it...
[\spoiler]
 
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Omake time. Imagining a far, far future. Initially I wanted to make the POV character a Rihaku quest cameo (maybe the Shining Heroine?) but I didn't want to go back and reread them all to get the tone right so have an OC. Also consider this advocacy for vampire minions!

"Alright." He sunk down on the chair, thoughts interrupted for a solid five seconds by how awesome it felt to sit in it, how the fine cushions molded to his form, more comfortable than his gaming chair back home at ever been despite the apparent tech level of this world. He'd avoided all but the blandest of food and drink to avoid distractions, yet even the fucking chairs messed with his mind here. Whatever was making everything feel better was apparently too strong or insidious to be prevented by his admittedly lackluster mental defences.

"Alright what, boss?" His train of thought was interrupted, or perhaps brought back on track, by the glowing sprite before him. Just five days since he accepted the deal, and the little faerie companion was starting to seem totally normal. Totally worth the remittance slot, if you asked him. A near-absolute information advantage, omniscience filtered through a mind actually capable of distilling only the information he actually needed, capable of giving advice, serving as a training aid and a million other, 'minor' functions. "Alright, what can you tell me, Na'ry?"

"I've compiled all information on this world and your target ever known to at least one being within fifteen million levels of your own, piercing all information-concealing effects of less than absolute magnitude and sorted them according to what you'd find most useful. The mental effect you've been feeling is caused by the Veil of Maya. I recommend you simply practise your willpower to lessen the effect, you can use the stat training. I will remind you on regular intervals to get back to work."


Well, he might have joked that she was an annoying faerie like from a certain video game before, but having her actively interrupt him whenever he had fun would definitely heighten the similarities, even if it was for his own good.

"As you know, you are tasked with acquiring at least one 'Ring of the Ages'. Each one is an artifact of immense power, an entire aeon ended by fate made manifest, granting its wearer tremendous power. Two are held by the Overlord himself, one by his wife and one by his immortal lich mentor slash adviser so...let's just say the 500 years time limit for this task might be cutting it a bit close, even for a progression type."

"So grind for a bunch of levels and power up before I go for them, as usual. I've got time. Tell me about this Overlord, who do I have to watch out for?"

"This reality is ruled by The Nameless Overlord. I am unable to access full information on him, as he falls outside the permitted level range. He has claimed an entire Dyson sphere as his palace of infinite indulgence, attended by...well boss, let's just say he grow up spoiled to a ridiculous degree and aeons of ruling only made it worse. Luckily, he is lazy as fuck and won't lift a single finger unless we directly threaten him or the few people he cares about. The real danger as we ramp up in power are his enforcers. Let me show you."

A moment later, and a lifelike hologram sprang up in front of him, only the slight hue giving it away as fake, conjured up by Na'ry. It was a man, though not a human, his limbs too slender, his ears slightly pointy, moving with a strange, alien grace, flowing from one step into the next. When he smiled, a pair of thin fangs poked between his lips, somehow managing to look totally natural and not threatening. <Fledgling Highborn, 9000th generation, level 13,600,106>.

"The Overlord is what to you is probably best described as a vampire of truly ridiculous power. And he's capable of passing that power down to his lieutenants, who pass it on in turn and so on. This Fledgling here is 9000 steps removed from the Overlord, and still outlevels you by far. I was unable to acquire full information on any higher generation vampires, as they fell outside the level range. Their greatest weakness is their extreme sense of justice and morality, which you should be able to exploit, though don't think they're idiots. The good news is they should present a nice power gradient for you to power-level with, if you can find a sufficiently thinblooded enforcer to start with. Once vamps of one generation stop providing meaningful xp, the next higher generation should be within reach, and sufficiently alerted to come after you, to boot!"

She knew exactly when to stop in her info dumps, to give him time to process the information, to prevent his mind from wandering or getting bored. He stared out the window of his hotel room, given to him free of charge when he swore he had no money. Below, the streets churned with people, celebrating a festival of some kind, music and laughter rising all the way up. There was always a celebration going, they'd told him. Nobody in the endless domain of the nameless ever wanted for anything, needed anything, that was the task he had given his numberless minions, and they'd carried out his will with fanatical loyalty. Was it really his place, then, to upset everything, slaughter his way through the local powers and steal some kind of overpowered ring?

And just as she knew when to stop talking, she also knew when to start again, his little assistant faerie distracting him from his grim thoughts: "But it's not just danger, this world also offers a great number of opportunities to grow your power. Even were you not a progression-type cursebearer, you could still pick up quite a lot of it here. With your gifts, we can quickly boost you to at least relevance against thinblooded enforcers, where combat levelling can take over, thanks to what the locals call 'Cultivation'. I have compiled a list of forgotten or abandoned stashes of cultivation resources and priceless treasures for you to exploit, most left over from the fall of the great sects and clans. Within 3 months we should be able to get all the low hanging fruits that provide no moral quandaries, at which point we can re-evaluate..."
Don't forget to list your word-count, and to ping Rihaku.
Realistically speaking.

The last thing we want is for Nameless to be in charge of anything. Arguably not even his own life. Spoiled is so fucking awful
Agreed. I'd still like to for him to leave his habits behind, go down to a somewhat less inconvenient amount of leisure time. Not sure if we're going to have time get him to before he becomes an NPC for the epilogue, though.
This is Stage 14 Nameless, who's already got supercluster level strength and likely proportional speed. Despite this, both Suizhen, the randos and the planet are untouched by this impossible power.

Considering it doesn't mention any world shattering conflagrations of plasma, I think things will be just fine.

Of course it's not. To do so with Tyranshal's path requires us to face Heavenly Tribulation, which is an uncertain affair at best. To do so with the Ring condemns us do a fate worse than death or loss*. Because of these, I'm voting for Rain.

*i've read too much xianxia trash man. i can't go back. don't make me go back.
Just because that Nameless is stage 14 while doing that doesn't mean he's exerting 100% of his strength. It'd be entirely within character for him to put the absolute minimum amount of effort into it.

IMO it may not be necessary to face Tribulation to beat Kong, assuming there's at least +1 combat stage worth of loot in Heaven. Plus it's also possible the loot might be suited to helping us defend against Tribulation (or at least, give us some idea of what it will involve), which helps our odds.
 
[X] High Hand of the Norn [Fate, Battle]
[X] Negotiation


The other forging options seem a bit meh to my taste, I like the story of this one the best in regards to taking over the age via being a better forger than the fates, so since I think success is pretty likely with any of them I decided based on that specifically mostly.
 
Just because that Nameless is stage 14 while doing that doesn't mean he's exerting 100% of his strength. It'd be entirely within character for him to put the absolute minimum amount of effort into it.

The amount of power necessary to instachump Titanic entities is more than enough to sunder worlds by itself. But let's say that going at max speed does cause damage. That doesn't really matter since we'll still have Artifice and the Diagram. It's not exactly an unsolvable issue, if it's even an issue at all.

IMO it may not be necessary to face Tribulation to beat Kong, assuming there's at least +1 combat stage worth of loot in Heaven. Plus it's also possible the loot might be suited to helping us defend against Tribulation (or at least, give us some idea of what it will involve), which helps our odds.

The fact is that the second we storm Heaven the Fates are going to active their contingencies and rouse Kong or bring about the end of the Age. Even if there is +1 Stages worth of loot, that doesn't make it possible for us to use, whether it be due to unsuitability or the time taken to learn how to use it.
 
As Nameless adventure approach its conclusion I think it's worth it to look back on how it all began, with the benefit of hindsight.
In the end isn't that what's it all about? For it is through the terrifying power of omakes and other fanworks and the beyond points they generated that the Fates will come to know their doom.

In retrospect, that was not actually true from the beginning. It is only through Liefang (directed by the guiding hand of the Fates) that this is finally coming true, though the creation of the Overgrowth (also ultimately a fruit of the machinations of the Fates, for all that it was accomplished by Zang Kong's hand) was apparently enough of a pretext to excuse the intervention of the Fates.

And none of this will ever get to happen because we're just going to murder the Fates themselves.

Oh, she will be, don't you worry.

And what a countervailing force it turned out to be!

You're vastly underestimating Nameless.

Not if we pick up the Ring of Might! Then we truly will be unbeatable...

Delay? So little ambition... We will not merely delay our inevitable loss, we will triumph!

Given the result of our choice, I think we can indeed say that we chose well. Though a large part of that has to be put on the shoulder of our frankly absurd Beyond Points generation and it was Rihaku who ended coming up with the details of the plan that got us here in the end...

What an asshole. Soon to be a dead asshole.

Good thing we have no intention to lose, then!

In retrospect they really shouldn't have given us the chance to get more orbs this way, should they? I mean, it made sense for them to do that given the nature of the Zang Kong threat but it really ended up screwing them over in the end...

Pretty simple rules... But we have no reason to play by them now that we have accumulated enough power to take out the Fates directly! And given that the Fates were hoping for us to help with the Zang Kong problem and the Fates are weaker than him, I feel like they should have seen that one coming...

The very idea of Nameless lying down and dying 'for the good of the world' is kind of hilarious... And I'm pretty sure that, looking back on it, the Fates are now wishing he had done just that. Of course, in retrospect, the reason they didn't want us to just lay down and die 'for the good of the world' had nothing to do with entertainment, but everything to do with the fact that they needed an ally against Zang Kong.

That make those options sound like obvious traps but, given our current situation, Young Master turned out to be an excellent option (at least when paired with Thrice-Great).

Could have been very interesting even if the purpose of it was only to turn us against Zang Kong in the end. Ultimately though, we did not need the extra power provided by this option.

The costs of the option are obvious and I was highly skeptical of it when it was first offered, but it turned out to be completely worth it.

I really want to see this guy face when this 'disgusting weeb shit' end up destroying him and his fellow Fates...

A copy of Zang Kong talent as it turns out. Kind of hilarious that the Fates reaction to the Zang Kong problem was to offer their opponent in this game... a copy of Zang Kong talent! And all for one measly Orb! Desperate times call for desperate measures I suppose. Not that this is anywhere near their greatest mistake in the design of this competition.

Ah, the Diagram... Nameless first love when it comes to magic. I was rather skeptical of the initial monofocus on this discipline at the expanse of cultivation during Nameless early years, but given how it turned out in the end, I can't say I regret it.

You'd have to pretty silly to pick this option by itself, but with the ability to cultivate and thus replenish one essence (and a hefty supply of Beyond Points) it turns out to be completely busted!

And this is, without doubt, the Fates greatest mistake. What were they thinking? Zang Kong was such an existential threat to them by the dint of his Cultivation talent alone and then they go and give their enemy the option of getting a path to power which combine that talent with incredibly potent synergistic multipliers... I mean, sure, they intended for us to fall in love with the heroine and they couldn't really have predicted the absurd amount of beyond points we managed to generate, but still...

Who needs that kind of crutch when one can be Liefang son and learn to acquire people loyalty the hard way?

It has been speculated that Suizhen has this. I'm not sure it's really worth 2 Orbs though?

Or be Liefang son and get basically this for free! Well ok, we're probably not that good. But still...

A potent ability, but one which could never have come close to threatening Zang Kong, given that nothing in this world come close to Zang Kong power short of the Fates themselves.

Imagine being so desperate for safety has to spend an Orb on this.

'capable of matching even the mightiest denizens of the mortal world'? Color me skeptical given that those include Zang Kong!

It does precise that the strongest Cultivators can survive its attention, but I would expect Zang Kong to do far more than merely survive if faced against such a creature...

The ultimate in safety! At the completely extravagant cost of 3 full Orbs...

'Power enough, not merely to survive, but to triumph'... is that what they sub-titanic power these days?

In the end, we attained enough power to truly triumph, power far in excess of any this option could have ever provided us with, without even needing to take on any Curses at all!

In retrospect, they probably should have capped the total number of Orb we could get at a lower number.

I'm sure they appreciate having offered us an extra Orb as such a low price and now being able to de-humanize us as we proceed to murder them...

Imagine having to deal with an active heroine from the start instead of being able to kill the Fates before she even become active in the first place...

4-5 heroes, eh? One of them is Suizhen and presumably the Rubric hero is another, I wonder who the other 2-3 are? Not that it really matters at this point...

The elves really deserved a hero... And we kind of ended up as their hero despite us never picking up this drawback! We even got very nice perks out of it...

This is the Fates other major mistake. I'm sure they're looking at our Heroic Passion: Vengeful and regretting their life choices, right about now...

Why would you ever pick this?

Really dangerous, but probably not unwinnable with the right build and enough Beyond Points, given what we now know is possible... But why would we have ever risked such a thing? Definitely not worth it.

Given the whole Zang Kong problem, the Fates must have really really wanted us to pick this option, but realistically they must have known we would never go for it...
[\spoiler]
Remember to list your wordcount and ping Rihaku.
The amount of power necessary to instachump Titanic entities is more than enough to sunder worlds by itself. But let's say that going at max speed does cause damage. That doesn't really matter since we'll still have Artifice and the Diagram. It's not exactly an unsolvable issue, if it's even an issue at all.

The fact is that the second we storm Heaven the Fates are going to active their contingencies and rouse Kong or bring about the end of the Age. Even if there is +1 Stages worth of loot, that doesn't make it possible for us to use, whether it be due to unsuitability or the time taken to learn how to use it.
I will concede the first point. In retrospect, it honestly probably would be easier in the long-run for Nameless to just make an artifact that lets Suizhen use something equivalent to True OTW than to help her get around every time.

Would KZ actually attack us immediately upon being roused early, considering we'd be in the process of killing the Fates, his sworn enemies? Even once we're finished, would he have a reliable way of entering Heaven? I suppose he may, so I will partially concede this point as well. IMO the Heavens are ancient, and the Fates probably aren't shy about having some really cool shit up there, so as long we don't have to break too much of it when they pull it out as they try to defend themselves, I do think it'd be reasonable for there to be things that don't require meaningful amounts of time for Nameless (or Suizhen, since she may have a better grasp of Weapon Treasures on account of, like, actually having a fighting style) to bend against KZ.
 
It's close, folks! Certainly within argument / omake range!
It would be most interesting, to me. It echoes Winter's statement and wishes that her Age reign forever and unabated. It echoes Banelixnaier's Vengeance, No matter the cost. It echoes Tyranshal's fear that Banelixnaier had given us too much power.. and indeed we use Banelixnaier's spells and gifted power to topple the fates. And Nameless is a spoiled brat. TBH it's just perfect.

It is in some ways the greatest glory of the Diagram: Invoking an entire other Age with a single spell. Power is the incidental cast-off of knowledge indeed.
Unsuited for Immortal Cultivation.
Unfortunately it seems Immortal Cultivation is more similar to Truth and Grace than Might, more based on understanding, insights, etc. I suspect Immortal Tribulation might be a test of character, which woulllddddd be kinda dangerous. Unless we can just annihlated with overwhelming post-Heavenly power.
 
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Unfortunately it seems Immortal Cultivation is more similar to Truth and Grace than Might, more based on understanding, insights, etc. I suspect Immortal Tribulation might be a test of character, which woulllddddd be kinda dangerous. Unless we can just annihlated with overwhelming post-Heavenly power.
This is an interesting idea, and honestly it kind of gives me hope that if Nameless does survive Tribulation, he will be a better person for it. I suspect that greater part of the reason that the Ring of Might denies the Immortal path is that it is a refutation of Might's creed, though. The Immortal path was impossible with Might alone, and yet it stands to be almost as incredible, if not even more so. Might cannot countenance the idea that it might be another ideal's equal.
 
This is an interesting idea, and honestly it kind of gives me hope that if Nameless does survive Tribulation, he will be a better person for it. I suspect that greater part of the reason that the Ring of Might denies the Immortal path is that it is a refutation of Might's creed, though. The Immortal path was impossible with Might alone, and yet it stands to be almost as incredible, if not even more so. Might cannot countenance the idea that it might be another ideal's equal.
Or as a matter of fact lesser.

Man, just imagine what a Mastered Ring of Might would do... assuming it could be mastered. It certainly seems like the sort of Ring that could be stolen and re-Mastered, like Majesty (although one can't steal Majesty, it has to be given).

e: That being said creating vampire elves and unleashing them upon the world is pretty cool. The elves have been pushed back for very long now. Suddenly, an outside-context problem of super-elves?
 
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It is in some ways the greatest glory of the Diagram: Invoking an entire other Age with a single spell. Power is the incidental cast-off of knowledge indeed.

It does have a nice thematic finality to it, putting an end to the Fates not by playing the rules of their twisted game but simply by sheer overwhelming might, birthed by a variation on the work of the lich they Doomed for presuming to see too much. Baenlixnaire sacrificed everything to give you one Ring. Now you have the chance to pay him back with another.

But, on the other hand, it means you will likely give up on Immortal Awakening. For one path to bloom to its full potential, another must be curtailed...
 
Or as a matter of fact lesser.

Man, just imagine what a Mastered Ring of Might would do... assuming it could be mastered. It certainly seems like the sort of Ring that could be stolen and re-Mastered, like Majesty (although one can't steal Majesty, it has to be given).
Hm.

The Diagram sought Truth, ability to describe the world as it exists in the language of symbols.

Cultivation seeks Might, the power to deny the world, to create your own.

Truth, when mastered, offered the powers to purify our actions, spells, and self of fallacy. So, perhaps Might, when mastered, would offer utter transmutation of reality into fantasy? Transcend merely 'crushing' esoteric effects, and simply overwrite anything we turn our attention to, as easily as turning over our hand, discarding the present world and revealing a new one?
 
Actually in principle Rihaku, wouldn't an army Stage 15 Vampire Elves with Spiritual Perfection make some really rad artifacts for Nameless? Some of which might even be relevant? At any rate I think it is unlikely a nation of Stage 15 Elves + (Stage 15/Elf) Naturalism/Artifice buffs + Lore/Severity/Majesty would really have problems with the aftermath of a ZK-Suizhen fight.

Unleashing Vampire Elves would be pretty awesome too.
 
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