mdkcde
"Emotions are prohibited"
- Location
- Nani Sore?
That plotpoint is usually featured right in the summary, so you know what to lookout for.
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Mana Based System - FoZ/Gamer
- Thread starter minuseven
- Start date
Dopplerdee
Accident Prone(Yes the caps are necessary)
- Location
- Happy Place
latest chapter showed other people using skill books.
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- Location
- USA
Except for The Sleeper. No exp or loot.
LucidProp
Pocky Eating MafiaDoka
Which is extremely sad.
I find the Duke and Karin a lot more interesting than the main cast, probably because of the missing link in their story. Just imagining what happened to Karin that turned her from "Cross-Dressing Tsundere" to what she is now makes me giddy.
It's helluva disappointing that hardly anyone in ff.net utilize those two instead of making them OOC demons. They don't even make Karin that good in fight scenes!
Akasha
The Only Truth
- Location
- 「̛̛́́ ͏̨҉̕͏ ͏̶̴」
So...
I've seen people say that the other Void mages in the story - that king what's-his-name and the Pope being the two examples - are also Gamers.
Did the author actually say that, or is it simply a popular theory?
Because if that's truly the case, then that means there are at least two people that Louise won't be able to beat, regardless of the circumstances.
The difference in experience(literally in this case) and resources, as well as the willingness to go much further in their pursuit of power than Louise means that they are completely beyond her.
...Also, I despise that fucking Give Sauron The Death Star bullshit.
It's infuriating.
If it's a quest, you don't have any reason to grow stronger or improve yourself, because the enemy will grow proportionally to you, so the plot will go mostly the same, and all of your efforts would have been worthless. Hell, you might as well do your best to be as weak as possible, because that way, the conflict between you and the villain won't escalate to the point the fight between you results in millions of deaths.
If the villain is always going to be stronger than you, just stay weak and at least keep the battle contained.
If, in canon, the character got beat up by the villain, you will also get beat up by the villain, and the Plot will go the same.
Because Stupid Fucking Power Level Scaling.
And if it's a story, there is absolutely no reason to try and get truly immersed in the plot, because of the same reasons stated above.
If it's a fanfic story, if the canon character got beat up by the villain, you already know they'll get beat up regardless of any power-ups they might have gained, because Stupid Fucking Power Level Scaling.
It's like those horrible Harry Potter stories on fanfic.net where Harry somehow gets a power-up so huge he could easily curbstomp Voldemort in his prime, only to suddenly pick up the idiot ball that results in Voldemort still being resurrected regardless of all changes the main character has made, and somehow gaining all of Harry's powers as well, and then using them to force Harry into retreat the same way he did in Canon.
I fucking hate shit like this.
What's the point of giving the main character power if you're also going to do the same to the villain, just to preserve the status quo?
Just copy/paste the canon and get sued by the owner of the title, because that would be about the same amount of originality and innovation.
Sorry about the rant. I've been holding this inside for far too long.
I've seen people say that the other Void mages in the story - that king what's-his-name and the Pope being the two examples - are also Gamers.
Did the author actually say that, or is it simply a popular theory?
Because if that's truly the case, then that means there are at least two people that Louise won't be able to beat, regardless of the circumstances.
The difference in experience(literally in this case) and resources, as well as the willingness to go much further in their pursuit of power than Louise means that they are completely beyond her.
...Also, I despise that fucking Give Sauron The Death Star bullshit.
It's infuriating.
If it's a quest, you don't have any reason to grow stronger or improve yourself, because the enemy will grow proportionally to you, so the plot will go mostly the same, and all of your efforts would have been worthless. Hell, you might as well do your best to be as weak as possible, because that way, the conflict between you and the villain won't escalate to the point the fight between you results in millions of deaths.
If the villain is always going to be stronger than you, just stay weak and at least keep the battle contained.
If, in canon, the character got beat up by the villain, you will also get beat up by the villain, and the Plot will go the same.
Because Stupid Fucking Power Level Scaling.
And if it's a story, there is absolutely no reason to try and get truly immersed in the plot, because of the same reasons stated above.
If it's a fanfic story, if the canon character got beat up by the villain, you already know they'll get beat up regardless of any power-ups they might have gained, because Stupid Fucking Power Level Scaling.
It's like those horrible Harry Potter stories on fanfic.net where Harry somehow gets a power-up so huge he could easily curbstomp Voldemort in his prime, only to suddenly pick up the idiot ball that results in Voldemort still being resurrected regardless of all changes the main character has made, and somehow gaining all of Harry's powers as well, and then using them to force Harry into retreat the same way he did in Canon.
I fucking hate shit like this.
What's the point of giving the main character power if you're also going to do the same to the villain, just to preserve the status quo?
Just copy/paste the canon and get sued by the owner of the title, because that would be about the same amount of originality and innovation.
Sorry about the rant. I've been holding this inside for far too long.
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Could you put the information from the latest chapter of the Gamer in a spoiler? It just came out today and some people might not have read it yet, and might not be expecting spoilers in a fanfic thread.
Edit: Removed info from quotation
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As far as I'm aware it's just a theory at this point. While it may yet be shown to be true, it doesn't necessarily mean that they're unstoppable Goliaths however. Even ignoring the leveling plateu thing, there's just good old fashioned being clever to get around things.
However, there's no evidence one way or the other right now, so i'd put it out of mind.
- Location
- Canada
That's... not actually how give sauron the death star is supposed to work. it's how a lot of authors who don't know what they are doing use it, but not what it actually means.
What it means, is that if you give a character a massive power boost as part of the stories premise, then you should also increase the power level of his opposition, because otherwise they the character won't have any challenges and it turns into a curbstomp-fic.
and what idiot thought that scaling the antagonists power with the MC's after story start was a good idea?! I want to give them a review saying they're doing it wrong! yes, villains should be allowed the chance to grow and escalate, that does not mean that increasing the MC's power directly makes the villain stronger like some demented realtime port of TES 4.
as for the thing about harry potter fics? yeah, they're really screwing it up. you can't give the MC enough power to stomp the only villain in the setting from the get go, and then try to fix your shit with an idiot ball and a Diabolis-Ex-Mechina. that's shitty writing.
Liar
Aspires to Conquer the Known World
- Location
- Texas
I'm sorry, but what does Akane'd mean?
Akasha
The Only Truth
- Location
- 「̛̛́́ ͏̨҉̕͏ ͏̶̴」
And you know what the sad part is?
Almost every single Harry Potter fanfic I've seen still brute-forces the Resurrection, and vast majority of them also pull some bullshit like 'Well, the prophecy says they have to be equal, so I have to boost Voldemort!', conveniently ignoring the fact that Voldemort was superior in almost every single way to Harry in canon, and Potter didn't get any sudden Shounen-style power-ups from that fact.
Either that, or they go for the 'Well, Voldemort used Harry's blood to resurrect himself, so he got some(most?) of Potter's power, too!'.
Even when they previously mentioned that the pure-blood doctrine is bullshit, and magic is does not lie solely in blood.
They do things like that even when they had the main character imprison/kill every single person who could've aided Voldemort in his attempts to return, but conveniently spared a single random death eater who didn't even know Riddle wasn't completely dead, but who ended up bringing him back.
It's so... forced.
You see, it's not the part about villains not being strong enough to challenge the protagonist that I find problematic.
We've only seen Great Britain in the Harry Potter series, as well as some very scarce mentions of other places.
The world is a huge place, and there are bound to be other psychopaths trying to carve their way through the world. Even if none of them are powerful enough to be troublesome, you can always turn the story into a crossover at some point and throw an OCP villain into the mix.
Or just have the main character screw up with magic and fall into a world they know nothing about, but which has a lot of powerful foes to fight.
Voldemort is not the only bad guy to have ever existed. You can always make more of those.
If you can't find a way to make the story interesting without having the hero-is-weak-but-grows-stronger-and-overcomes-trials-with-blood-and-sweat stuff, then at least don't FORCE the same damn villain into a position of power through a Diabolus ex Machina.
If you made your character strong enough to curbstomp the villain, then let him do so, write some reactions to that and then throw some other bad guy at him, instead of having the supposedly-curbstomped bad guy come back to life STRONGER THEN EVAR.
That is what annoys me so much about it, and what turned me off from most Marvel comics.
There is only so many times I can see Joker come back to life before my SOD shatters like glass.
Not only do many authors completely misinterpret the 'rule', but they also don't bother to do it in imaginative ways, and just pull out the same guy over and over again, boosting his power constantly in the most convoluted of ways.
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Scify
It always starts with a lighthouse.
Presumably, it's a reference to Akane from Ranma 1/2. Apparently, parts of the fandom had a fairly negative opinion of her, which was reflected in their writing.
This has quickly left the rails of the thread?
Akasha
The Only Truth
- Location
- 「̛̛́́ ͏̨҉̕͏ ͏̶̴」
Actually, it is still on-rails.
Barely so, but it hasn't left quite yet.
This entire discussion is all about the theory that the other Void mages are Gamers as well, and why that would be a bad idea.
The Harry Potter thing was meant to provide a thoroughly detailed and convincing argument for the author not to do such a thing.
Whether I managed to convey it properly, however, I am unsure.
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I don't give a shit about power levels, but I think that the theory that the other void mages have the Gamer power is interesting for characterization purposes. They could easily serve as foils to Louise's own attitude towards her power and the lens she views the world because of it.
- Pronouns
- she/her
I don't think it would be an inherently bad twist for the other Void Mages to have the Gamer. Joseph and Vittorio aren't in positions where grinding combat skills to a high level very quickly is viable. They have a lot less free time than Louise due to being world leaders.
So if Louise ever met them face to face, she'd actually have no problem beating them with hard power as she'll be able to take full advantage of her learning curve.
Administrative and social skills OTOH would skyrocket in that environment. Conveniently explaining just how the fuck Joseph and Vittorio managed to pull off their roles in setting up the canon plot, despite acting insane and only being in power for 3 years respectively.
So if Louise ever met them face to face, she'd actually have no problem beating them with hard power as she'll be able to take full advantage of her learning curve.
Administrative and social skills OTOH would skyrocket in that environment. Conveniently explaining just how the fuck Joseph and Vittorio managed to pull off their roles in setting up the canon plot, despite acting insane and only being in power for 3 years respectively.
mdkcde
"Emotions are prohibited"
- Location
- Nani Sore?
It's funny that you complain about this and yet that was the same status quo as in canon. Louise and the others are almost always outmatched when it comes to facing either the Pope, Reconquista, King Joseph or the Elves.
But Louise and Saito had a group of allies and friends that can help her tip the scales just enough, even if they ended up winning by pure luck.
I loved the hint because we will see how four different characters coming from completely different backgrounds handle this situation.
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- Location
- Canada
Hint? the only hint I saw was an Omake that I myself wrote based on my own Random Mass Guessing... Or did I miss something?
Oh, right, nevermind. the whole Tabitha being worried about something happening "again" and I think having seen similar behavior from her uncle.
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Warning: Warning
- Location
- Singapore
warning
I quite disagree. Get back on topic or it's a break for you.
- Location
- USA
.....Hey what do you think will happen if Louise discovers the Party System? I'm thinking confusion or just acceptance and moving on.
The latter I imagine would happen after she's had a lot of experience with weird and ludicrously strange situations that she just doesn't care about it.
The latter I imagine would happen after she's had a lot of experience with weird and ludicrously strange situations that she just doesn't care about it.
- Location
- London
That might be because they are in a party or maybe because she actually entered the game on her smartphone.
Once upon a time, long long ago, there was an anime named Ranma 1/2. This is a reference to that. (Don't worry, I'm well aware that this is, basically, ancient history and you're now looking at me like you expect me to scream about my lawn and hit you with my cane. ...you damn kids. Back in MY day, we had eight generation VHS copies and we LIKED IT!)
"To Akane" someone means, in this context, to take a trait of someone (usually someone you don't like) and exaggerate it until it basically DEFINES the character. It's almost always a bad trait. (The currently accepted equivalent is Flanderization. Though, in context, "Akane'd" is almost always negative, and Flanderization can go either way.)
For an example that's actually thread relevant so the mods may smile kindly upon us, see Kirche and her teasing. Kirche likes to tease Louise. Louise seems to fire right back just as much. I don't even read much FoZ fanfic and I know that the range of responses to this go from "Kirche is just playful and thinks Louise is too" to "Kirche is a hatebeast and her only joy is causing Louise sadness."
Focusing SOLELY on Kirche's teasing to the exclusion of any of her other traits (no matter how well-developed they may be *eyebrow waggle*) would meet the requirement for being Akane'd, ESPECIALLY if it's played up as it being deliberately mean-spirited.
Now, we don't have ANY proof that Kirche is being deliberately mean-spirited in the story. We don't have any proof that Louise secretly cries herself to sleep at night because of the teasing. What we DO have is Louise looking forward to sparring with her in order to show off her skills and a LOT of speculation.
Given that @minuseven isn't a terrible, terrible writer, I'm pretty confident we're not going to see any Flanderization here.
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The other part not mentioned is that they did the same thing mentioned above to Akane Tendo from Ranks 1/2 and it became so prevalent that most new fans coming in without having seen or read canon assume that the heavily, HEAVILY flanderized version is the canon one. Thus the old inspire new who inspire new like a demented game of telephone till people are truly surprised how different the fanon Akane is from the canon version.
The same thing seems to be happening to Louise's folks. Neophyte writers who probably didn't see any canon version of her parents write them as abusive because they themselves read some other story or post, or don't get that the values from the time period presented are fairly different to the modern sensibilities and that colors their perspective and the cycle continues till the abusive parents thing gets embedded in the ZNT newbs collective unconscious.
Edit: I hate typing on phones.
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Exactly.
Edit: I'm being facetious, but I think Kirche was also quite malicious in the first few episodes of canon anime as well. It's not out of character for her to act even worse in this story given Louise's rapid growth here.
In fact, most characters in the main anime were on the lower end of the likeability scale for the first half of the season.
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- Location
- Canada
Interestingly, the anime version of FoZ flanderizes everyone. its why lots of people IRL think Saito's a rapist, Louise is a screaming brat that they would murder if they got summoned, that Kirche is a heartless bitch, and that Siesta is somehow a closet sadist.