The Lonely Lioness - Cersei Lannister Quest

Seems we have a contested vote for once.
Also, @Taut_Templar, it would be good if you edited your old plan as posting a new one with the same name messes up the tally.

Vote still open.

Adhoc vote count started by Azel on Jan 7, 2024 at 6:14 AM, finished with 40 posts and 10 votes.

  • [X] Plan: A Mother's Indulgence
    - [X] [Joffrey] Indulge him. As long as there are enough guards, it will be fine.
    - [X] A large guard of 100 men with full regalia and the entire Kingsguard to make a show of Joffrey as a heroic warrior king - though minimal servants and baggage train for speed. Let the Hound take Joffrey through some destroyed villages so he can see the consequences of war and learn that it's not a game. Make it clear to both Joffrey and his bodyguard that the king is there to be seen by the men. Not participate in the battle.
    - [X] Speak with local traders to organise better food supplies for the city.
    - [X] Speak with the Pyromancers. Learn more about the wildfyre found in the sept and see if they can aid you in the battles to come.
    - [X] Raise the banners of the Crownlander houses. (Free Action)
    [X] Plan: King Joffrey I 'the Valorous!'
    -[X] [Joffrey] Indulge him. As long as there are enough guards, it will be fine. (Write-In guards)
    --[X] Deploy the Kingsguard (barring the absent Jaime) in a grand procession along with whatever court notables wish to accompany their king on his glorious mission.
    -[X] Expand the Gold Cloaks. You will need far more than a mere thousand soldiers.
    --[X] Have Varys arrange for Janos Slynt to be disposed of in a suitably deniable fashion, and find someone capable of leading the Gold Cloaks in battle to head the paramilitary, ideally from within its ranks.
    -[X] Organize a shipbuilding effort. You will need a fleet to defend yourself against Stannis.
    --[X] Lord Rykker is naturally appointed to oversee the effort, ensuring that the Crown's limited funds are distributed wisely.
    - [X] Raise the banners of the Crownlander houses. (Free Action)
    -[X] Adjust the Small Council (Free Action)
    --[X] Appoint the High Septon as Advisor to the Small Council, in order to further harmonize the affairs of Faith and Throne.
    -[X] Letter: Write to Riverrun, commanding that Edmure Tully's first job as Hand of the King - should he choose to accept the honor - is to coordinate the defeat of renegade Ser Gregor Clegane with the arriving King Joffrey I and Lord Paramount Tywin Lannister. With the blessing of the Seven, he will first enter King's Landing with the kinslayer's corpse dragged behind his steed.
    -[X] Letter(?): Speak to the High Septon regarding the current succession crisis. Threatened by the Mad King's ilk and untrue uncles, the Seven Kingdoms need reminding about the necessity of uniting behind their true monarch - especially the Reach, whose loyalties lie uncertain and where the Faith's influence is strong. A resounding homily in the Starry Sept ought to make its position on the matter clear to all and sundry, and cause the lords of the Reach to think twice about which king they choose to back.
 
Is it alright if I add @Taut_Templar's letters to my plan? Those are good additions and I wouldn't want them to be lost if my plan won.
 
Assuming Tjf adds in both letters, that leaves our plans divided principally on these things:

We're both having Joffrey join the Mountain-Hunt with the full Kingsguard, with some minor semantical differences - his plan goes into more detail about what and how it should happen, while mine is more hands off.
--My argument is that this is an opportunity for Joffrey to earn his spurs, and we shouldn't choke it by hovering over his shoulder and micromanaging everything like Cersei always has.

His first action to to Speak with the Traders.
--That's fair, food was a big issue in canon. My stance is that we've done a much better job of handling PR and that the issue will only resolve itself by opening up the import routes - that is, the Riverlands, Reach, and Blackwater. So long as at least one remains open, we should avoid starvation and canonical bread riots.

My first action is to Expand the Gold Cloaks, with an addendum of having Varys 'remove' Slynt.
--The Goldcloaks are a weird combo of city guard and paramilitary, and we need them in fighting shape for whenever Stannis, Renly, or even 'Caern' decides to attack. With Baelish out of the city, now's the perfect time to handle it.

His second action is speaking with the Pyromancers.
--This leads to playing games with Wildfyre, for better or worse. I believe we have greater priorities - it's too specific in scope and application.

My second Action is Organizing a Shipbuilding Effort, with Lord Rykker in charge to avoid canonical Cersei screw-ups.
--I really think we need to get started on this ASAP. There are so many threats across the Narrow Sea that not having a fleet cripples us from dealing with, and it cannot be fully completed with haste. The sooner we get started, the better.

Finally, my plan has the additional action of appointing the High Septon to the Small Council.
 
[X] Plan: King Joffrey I 'the Valorous!'
I like this plan better, but I hope that whatever plan is chosen, we would send more troops than the Mountain has. He apparently defeated both Berric Dondarrion and Tully household guard, he probably has at least troops for planned ambush on Eddard Stark under his direct command.
 
We're both having Joffrey join the Mountain-Hunt with the full Kingsguard, with some minor semantical differences - his plan goes into more detail about what and how it should happen, while mine is more hands off.
--My argument is that this is an opportunity for Joffrey to earn his spurs, and we shouldn't choke it by hovering over his shoulder and micromanaging everything like Cersei always has.
Personally, my main issue with your plan is that "a grand procession along with whatever court notables wish to accompany their king on his glorious mission" sounds more like sending noble failsons to form a moving court (which is smtg I can def see Cersei doing, so am worried that's how it would be carried out) than forming, well, a war party, which the other one is more explicitly. Cersei isn't micromanaging anymore than giving him a set amount of resources (men and the Kingsguard) either way. Honestly, would recommend either plan just give Sandor leave to take whomever he wants to take (also, to keep at least some Kingsguard, preferably reliable ones, at court. They are supposed to protect the Royal Family as well).
 
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I checkee, Dondarrion himself had 120 soldiers. The plan which have us send only a hundred definitely does not work.
Folks, there will be plenty of soldiers in the Riverlands to handle Clegane, Joffrey's not literally doing this on his own. Don't worry about it.
Personally, my main issue with your plan is that "a grand procession along with whatever court notables wish to accompany their king on his glorious mission" sounds more like sending noble failsons to form a moving court (which is smtg I can def see Cersei doing, so am worried that's how it would be carried out) than forming, well, a war party, which the other one is more explicitly. Cersei isn't micromanaging anymore than giving him a set amount of resources (men and the Kingsguard) either way. Honestly, would recommend either plan just give Sandor leave to take whomever he wants to take (also, to keep at least some Kingsguard, preferably reliable ones, at court. They are supposed to protect the Royal Family as well).
He's just moving to join up with the troops already tasked to handle the Mountain-Hunt. We're specifying his personal guard, hence the Kingsguard coming along, and I added in the 'court notables' since Joffrey getting to know the young and ambitious figures in court through a most classic westerosi endeavor will only help his future reign.
 
He's just moving to join up with the troops already tasked to handle the Mountain-Hunt. We're specifying his personal guard, hence the Kingsguard coming along, and I added in the 'court notables' since Joffrey getting to know the young and ambitious figures in court through a most classic westerosi endeavor will only help his future reign.
In his rampage, the dealt a major defeat to the hastily raised forces of the Riverlands under Brynden Tully and was said to have killed Lord Beric Dondarion who had been sent months ago to apprehend him. His forces are still harassed by smaller warbands, but for now nothing seems to be able to stop him.
What forces? The ones under Dondarrion are clearly done for, and everyone else's loyalties are suspect and have not been able to deal with this anyway. Like, we are sending the King, if he gets captured or killed we would get a crisis in our hands. This could be a disaster in the making if we don't handle this with care. Again, I really think the plans should leave the planning to Sandor, he knows his brother and he knows war.
 
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What forces? The ones under Dondarrion are clearly done for, and everyone else's loyalties are suspect and have not been able to deal with this anyway. Like, we are sending the King, if he gets captured or killed we would get a crisis in our hands. This could be a disaster in the making if we don't handle this with care.
Let's get this clarified, then.

@Azel - In the vote about Joffrey's guard, are we also supposed to specify whether or not he's supposed to march out with an army, or is this supposed to be about his personal protection? It seems there's a lot of confusion over the whole thing.
 
Let's get this clarified, then.

@Azel - In the vote about Joffrey's guard, are we also supposed to specify whether or not he's supposed to march out with an army, or is this supposed to be about his personal protection? It seems there's a lot of confusion over the whole thing.
I am not suggesting an Army, we don't have one of those lol, just that we send what Sandor thinks is needed. The vote is supposed to specify what forces we should send to guard the King, nominally this whole affair is to send the King out to enforce the King's justice by detaining Clegane and stop his brigading. Sandor think its a stupid ideia since he knows his brother has no compunctions about just killing Joffrey if he goes there and try to do this. He will resist. Which is why we need to send people at least capable of matching his warband, ideally enough to reliably win against them, since they won't just surrender nicely. Joffrey is leading a "hunt for the Mountain" after all.
"The king believes them and that's what counts. Add kinslaying to the list at least, then I will seal the new order. A father, a sister and two wives." With that Joffrey handed her back the parchments. "I will lead a party to the Riverlands to see this enforced."

Cersei was about to protest, but the Hound beat her to it. "My brother will rip your fucking head off with his bare hands and wipe his ass with your face. He gives no shits about your crown."

That shook him visible and Cersei pressed on. "It would be safer for you to stay here in Kings Landing while someone else takes care of this."

Joffrey tensed again, his hand clenching around the sword hilt and drawing it a fraction from it's sheath. "A king needs to lead. If he doesn't fight himself, he at least needs to be present to bolster the troops morale." He seemed to truly care about this.

Joffrey wants to lead the hunt for the Mountain. Do you allow it?

[] [Joffrey] Indulge him. As long as there are enough guards, it will be fine. (Write-In guards)

[] [Joffrey] Deny him and send someone else. (Write-In whom)
 
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@Azel - In the vote about Joffrey's guard, are we also supposed to specify whether or not he's supposed to march out with an army, or is this supposed to be about his personal protection? It seems there's a lot of confusion over the whole thing.
Unless you want him to deploy with Gold Cloaks, you don't really have an army. There's only a hundred Red Cloaks in the capital.

What you do want to deploy with him is entirely up to you, but the expectation is that he will join up with some forces already present in the Riverlands. Either Tywins host or the reforming Tully host. Or the Starks if you want to be really ballsy.
 
Maybe we could try to bring some Dornishmen into this little hunt for Clegane and start working with the Martells in Dorne. Sure, they hate us, but their vassals don't. Maybe the Yronwoods or the Daynes – kind of a long shot, but sending a few letters can't hurt.

Also, if Hoster in the Riverlands doesn't want to play with us, there are other houses that we can feel out. It has been stated that the Tullys' rule is not as strong as the Starks or the Arryns. The Freys are not the only house that could jump for the crown if they see an opportunity to rise in prestige, especially the houses that are looking at our dear father from their windows like the Wayns, Rygers, and Pipers.

Regarding the situation of the gold cloaks, there are seven gates, each with a captain; we could do a small round of interviews and find a better person to take the job, or at least a person just as bad but loyal to us.

Lastly, I don't really remember in canon, but I think that the majority of Stannis' fleet came from the Velaryons, a great house that is now a lesser one serving a zealot with no friends; giving them the opportunity to regain a little of their former glory could bring them to us, and if not, a certain Velaryon bastard might want to jump ships if Joffrey were to legitimize him and declare him lord of Driftmark in exchange for something?
 
Unless you want him to deploy with Gold Cloaks, you don't really have an army. There's only a hundred Red Cloaks in the capital.

What you do want to deploy with him is entirely up to you, but the expectation is that he will join up with some forces already present in the Riverlands. Either Tywins host or the reforming Tully host. Or the Starks if you want to be really ballsy.
I figured the plan was that he'd join with Edmure's host, but I'll make sure to specify that in the plan. Otherwise, the Kingsguard and other noble volunteers should do the trick of ensuring Joffrey doesn't die in the process.
 
Maybe we could try to bring some Dornishmen into this little hunt for Clegane and start working with the Martells in Dorne. Sure, they hate us, but their vassals don't. Maybe the Yronwoods or the Daynes – kind of a long shot, but sending a few letters can't hurt.
Unless they are all equipped with Baelish's show teleporters / jetpacks, the fight will probably be done by the time their forces march all the way from Dorne to the Riverlands.
 
Look, I'm gonna be real. Y'all are putting way too much focus and detail on what is essentially letting Joffrey participate in something Edmure and Tywin would already be able to handle.

As a plan maker, can we please focus on Cersei's actual actions? I really think building up the Goldcloaks and royal fleet are important, more so than lowering food prices and talking with pyromancers.

If nothing else, I really hope this discussion has helped illustrate that we don't actually have a lot of useful troops on hand and should really, really set about fixing that.
 
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If nothing else, I really hope this discussion has helped illustrate that we don't actually have a lot of useful troops on hand and should really, really set about fixing that.
there are a lot of sellswords and free knights in KL, maybe creating a small retinue of people chosen by joffrey? (mostly clegane) giving them a little name and maybe some distinctive clothes so people recognize them? there is precedent in canon with the ravens teeth and the winter wolves. It would give us numbers and start training the little monster in management and people skills.

''The kings company of the brave sons, for true knights and warriors of the realm, created in the honor of the bravery of robert baratheon, betrayed by brothers and friend.''
 
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If nothing else, I really hope this discussion has helped illustrate that we don't actually have a lot of useful troops on hand and should really, really set about fixing that.
It has at that. Although I was already swayed by the focus on building a loyalist fleet to contest the Narrow Sea. Command of the sea is too dangerous a thing to just cede to one's enemies.

[X] Plan: King Joffrey I 'the Valorous!'
 
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