Hestia&theCourt
Turns out we're plural too.
- Location
- In transition
- Pronouns
- She/Her
You recall that Diana can literally see lies, right?
With This Ring (Young Justice SI) (Thread Thirteen)
- Thread starter Mr Zoat
- Start date
- Status
You recall that Diana can literally see lies, right?
That could be it or the land might not be able to choose someone born inside or some other such rule.
But temporal shenanigans is more likely given that the ruler claims to be the temporal ruler of the land
- Location
- Madness realms
That woman was really unpleasant, I'm glad she sad.
- Location
- australia
..poorly worded- (maybe drop the obscenity- there ARE men who are like this as well), but i...get what i THINK you mean- it'd be a net positive for society if my aunt went under a bus-
the kinda person who in public is all smiles and social, happily plays the role of the beloved socialite whilst in private social manipulating the entire family into framing her sister for a serious offence to get her out of the wil- y..you know, that kinda thing...
she doesn't really seem like that- just...inflexible and INCREDIBLY judgemental of what she doesn't understand/isn't familiar with
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- Location
- U.S.
I don't really hope for her death, but as I see it that is pretty much the only way she'd stop believing what she believes (ignoring the fact that afterlives exist). The understanding of tolerance that I've developed from my aggregate life experience is that it doesn't actually exist. "Tolerant" people aren't actually tolerant, they just don't care that people hold differing worldviews as much as "intolerant" people do. It's not so much that they accept the other world view as valid, they still think the other person is 'wrong' in their head, they just don't care strongly enough to make a issue of it.
Additionally, as I see it, once they develop a world view it is more-or-less inviolable. Rationality, argument, etc are all basically useless for attempting to change even minor beliefs, and there's some good evidence that it actually makes these held beliefs stronger. However, it's not impossible for someone's mind to change, the human brain isn't adamantite; value drift can occur and can even be encouraged/forced via some methods.
Unfortunately, these methods are either extremely slow or considered morally despicable: on the slow side, things like immersing someone in a environment encouraging or requiring different beliefs, necessitating value drift to maintain comfort or even survive. On the morally despicable side, things like OL's branding or assimilation (misc 'mind rape'), or using physical/mental trauma (e.g. stockholm syndrome). And none of these methods are actually things that should cause changes in belief; this isn't changing someone's mind through rational debate, this is exploiting glitches, design flaws, or limitations in the human brain to edit someone's utility function.
This, unfortunately, means you really don't have a lot of options in this scenario. Generally the best option would just be exactly what OL and company did; use a monopoly on force to make the person in question accept a desirable solution that is, to them, a "least bad" solution. It doesn't actually change her mind, it just leaves her no choice but to do what you want, and also leaves her vulnerable to the 'slow' methods of forced value drift that most people find morally acceptable. Unfortunately, given how strong her beliefs are, that might not actually work.
If that's the case, you could just keep using your monopoly on force to force her to continue to accept a solution you find acceptable, but if that isn't a maintainable strategy (though it probably is), then you're left with a choice of either killing her, condemning thousands of people to death and starvation, or using a morally despicable method of forced value drift on her like what OL did to Mammon.
- Location
- washington
This is the age of plotlines be assured that something disastrous can and most definitely will happen.
- Location
- Oblivion
And if anyone could potentially have a way around that, it would be the 5000 year old Wizard King.
Cherico
Machine
I think people are less angry about the religious intolerance then the shear freaking ungratatude on display here.
The magic kingdom saved her life, saved her sons life, they gave her food and shelter and kept her from dying, they then promoted her son to prince, and she is willing to gleefully have them all die.
That's a massive dick move.
The magic kingdom saved her life, saved her sons life, they gave her food and shelter and kept her from dying, they then promoted her son to prince, and she is willing to gleefully have them all die.
That's a massive dick move.
Empiricist2
Let's play doctor!
- Location
- Baton Rouge
I always love when parents forget that their children are not their property to do with as they please.
This lady isn't an unrealistic characterization, but she's still really annoying all the same. And I get that it's intentional. But I just want her to go away
ThrawnCA
Carbon-based biped
- Location
- Australia
why did you?!
some though self-indulgence
some through self-indulgence
there us nothing
there is nothing
to chose
to choose
Why about my people!
What about my people?!
have to electricity
have no electricity
as many matters as possible.
as many matters as possible?
- Location
- sweden
Sure, but when a 5000 year old wizard king with a happy populace, who's a friend of a friend, goes apeshit and says their entire realm is going to die in front of the woman who senses lies and the man who sees souls in ways Rama literally can't have encountered before...well it's a bit paranoid to assume he's an evil mastermind who just wants one specific baby to stay in his kingdom. Even forgetting the fact that Paul read his comic, either Rama is telling the truth or he's using some serious magic and exposing himself to the outside world for the first time in thousands of years for seemingly no value. If it's the latter, he's a crazy and ludicrously powerful magician, I would think that Diana and Paul would be able to spot them by now.
Of course, it helps your credibility when the opposing view is represented by a fundamentalist straw-man come to life.
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- Location
- Hampden Park
You don't, no, but it has.
John Stewart is black and Diana's kind of olive.
Thank you, corrected.
Breadnaugt
Even in Death, I'm still Tasty
- Location
- Britland
And any trace of sympathy I had for this bitch is just gone.
Hardly. Clearly the exact opposite is true. There is no polity on Earth that can match the record of this place. Even if their civilisation collapsed today, they'd still be the record holder for successful nations, outlasting all others.
If the kid learns his lessons well and becomes a good ruler, he could ensure continuation for thousands of years more.
Him ageing isn't the issue. The land has picked a new heir and will soon stop sustaining and empowering him.
Some Power Ring treatment might keep him alive even after the land withdraws its power, but they still need the new heir.
- Location
- Germany
To show him as an expert on the subject whose judgement she should trust?
I don't think Paul is clever enough to pull that off. And I doubt that Paul thinks that he's clever enough to pull that off.
He's going after them to prevent his heir potentially being stuck half a world away having learned all the wrong lessons from all the wrong people.
And as an Australian you should realize that the obscenity can be used equally for either gender.
I hang out with God all the time on the weekends, so clearly you should trust my judgement because I'm an expert on being chill with the Omnissiah. And you can believe me because I'm just that trustworthy.
- Location
- Germany
He has a lot of witnesses. And he can literally take her to hell to kill a few demons with her
- Location
- Greece
On top of that, telling a religious fanatic that believes magic is evil that
- you know better because you use magic
- you consort with demons
- you stole from God
- an Angel dropped in to basically smite you
(I know Zaruel didn't come to smite him, but if he had found that the guy who stole the fruit was alligned with Hell, he would totally smite him)
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And as an American on a board with plenty of Americans I know that that particular word is very, very, very offensive to American women, and a bad one to use where they might see it whether you are Australian or not. Especially since moderators on any number of boards will come down on you for it, so posting that word is a bad habit to develop.
- Location
- australia
oh, I realise-its others im worrying about
case in point- remember, the Victory handsign means "fuck you"/ "up yours" in certain parts of the world- Fanny means ass in some, and...well..you know, in others..
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The Bushranger
In the Danger Zone
- Location
- TSAB Asura
If I remember correctly, that depends on whether or not the palm of the hand is facing in or out...
- Location
- Australia
What did you think tolerance was? Tolerance means you are willing to put up with something not that you treat something as equally valid. If I ignore someone on a street corner ranting about the end of the world I am tolerating their prescence but that doesn't mean I agree with them or are willing to accept their views as equally valid to my own.
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- Location
- Denmark
agreed, it can hardly be called tolerance if you only tolerate the people you agree with.
- Location
- Ashtabula
I'm guessing you meant no electricity.
Also, rapidly getting tired of this woman.
This does seem to be balancing on the problem that the entire land has a rather nasty and uneradicable Single Point of Failure - if it chooses a person and that person leaves (or is presumably forced away from the land), everything falls completely apart. There are no backups, no secondary systems, no emergency options. Sooner or later, this is going to happen. The only way to fix it is either to install those secondary systems, or to remove the people and their culture from the potential failure area and let it collapse (and perhaps magically scour it or at least decouple the physical land from the magical effect).
An interesting point, too, is that while Ailani comes across as extremely intolerant and bigoted, that's not exactly surprising considering her background, upbringing, and experiences. She's undergone enormous and repeated trauma, had nearly everything taken from her with no chance of getting even that tiny amount back, and the only two things which she could consider reliable constants in her life are her child and the religion taught to her. Expanding the role of the religion to cover everything possible may be her only psychological security blanket - everything else has been torn away.
In short, she may not be deliberately choosing to come across as an intolerant bigot; it may purely be a result of her holding a mental death-grip on the only thing left to her in life.
I really rather hope that she doesn't decide that the only way to free her child from the combined forces of outside oppression is to kill him.
In short, she may not be deliberately choosing to come across as an intolerant bigot; it may purely be a result of her holding a mental death-grip on the only thing left to her in life.
I really rather hope that she doesn't decide that the only way to free her child from the combined forces of outside oppression is to kill him.
- Status