General Legend of the 5 Rings Thread

I know some people are hyper disappointed at the fact the new adventure book is AiR, but while I am no fan of Adventures I have to admit, if the new adventure is a pure dungeon crawl I cannot think of a single system *less* suited for that style than FFG's L5R RnK.
 
Honestly I don't know if they even want to continue the metaplot. It works for card games, but for what they're doing right now? I'm not sure.
 
So I was reading through The Sword and the Fan Splat book for 4e a few days ago (not a deep study) but I was going through the war bit and I gotta ask.

Do they really just announce to their superiors that high-ranking samurai such and such, is going to lead this many troops down this road to wage war on this clan? Come and fight if you're hard enough.

Is THAT how the clans fight each other all the time without it being constant wars to the knife? Or did I misread things?
 
So the thing to understand is that in setting you're not *allowed* to go to war without it being approved. The Imperial Throne banned both wars on minor clans, and wars without their approval. The Throne is fairly adept at giving permission liberally and then withdrawing it after both sides have had a go and cooler heads can prevail. But because official war is sanctioned. There's no real benefit to hiding who is doing what. All Clans have developed enough information networks that they can usually figure it out. From that War is primarily a 'glory' thing. While wars for resources do happen they are comparatively rare. Land almost never changes hands. Most wars end up happening because someone somewhere did something to piss off someone else and no one ever just gets over things. If the primary goal is to win glory, then telling people to come have a go is a reasonable action to take.

But most fighting is skirmishes that happen mostly because of the following reason: 'We're both here at the same time, this is our turf, let's fight about it' and are walked back. (Or not depending on if the Throne feels like your clan needs to be cut down to size.)
 
So here's something else I've come across.

I think I remember reading somewhere that only about 2% of the entire Samurai population are Shugenja. Does that mean that the Kuni family within Crab Clan are absolutely tiny in total numbers? Or that only the elites of the Kuni family are actually Shugenje and the rest probably went to the Hida school or the local bushi equivalent to be the guards for the important members of the family.

Also saw I think in The Sword and the Fan that the average number of Bushi to Courtiers in a Clan is about 20 to 1, so taking the Crab for example again does that mean that the Yasuki are much smaller in number compared to the Hida, Hiruma or Kaiu or does that mean that the high ranking Yasuki are all courtiers/merchants while the lower ranking bloodlines that swore service to the Yasuki just follow what the Hida do?

Everyone sharing the surname of the founders of a family makes this crap so confusing.
 
So by the lore shugenja are rare, and indeed most shugenja families do have most of their numbers filled out by courtiers, bushi, and whatever else. But since stories are usually about exceptional people, the actual fiction and mechanics tends to have shugenja as common if not as common as other types of samurai. So yes Kuni who don't have the gift end up learning how to be bushi or courtiers. While the Yasuki have a reasonable number of bushi to defend themselves with.

It's honestly just best to toss out any population estimates because they're all nonsense. But typically when a book says 'average' they mean in relation to the Lion Clan.

Vassal families have long been used to fill out the lack of names yeah but they're not popular in official work on account of them requiring more customization.
 
So by the lore shugenja are rare, and indeed most shugenja families do have most of their numbers filled out by courtiers, bushi, and whatever else. But since stories are usually about exceptional people, the actual fiction and mechanics tends to have shugenja as common if not as common as other types of samurai. So yes Kuni who don't have the gift end up learning how to be bushi or courtiers. While the Yasuki have a reasonable number of bushi to defend themselves with.

That was what I figured but the confirmation is appreciated.

It's honestly just best to toss out any population estimates because they're all nonsense. But typically when a book says 'average' they mean in relation to the Lion Clan.

Fair enough but I'm unfortunately one of those weirdos who like to try and figure out how such a world actually functions. You really don't know how many stories I've had die because I was trying to figure out harvest yields and wages during a set time period.

I knew that like in the Lion Clan, a LOT of the Akodo aren't actually descended from the One-eyed lion. Either they're descended from someone who swore service during the early days of the Empire or were more recently added to the clan for service rendered. I just wish there was a way to tell just how many there actually are.

Vassal families have long been used to fill out the lack of names yeah but they're not popular in official work on account of them requiring more customization.


I get the feeling that if you wanted to be more realistic, there are a lot more Akodo that can add a vassal family name to their full name than those who are really just Akodo Hayato or the like. But apparently, those vassal names are only used within the clan, to outsiders they present a united front.

Also thanks for answering these questions.

I hope I'm not bothering you with dumb questions but this setting is making me curious.
 
There's a reason basically every shugenja family has a second non-shugenja school. So while yeah SOME Kuni for example just end up learning from the Hida Bushi how to be Hida Bushi, more likely they learn how to be Kuni Witch Hunters if they don't have the ability to be actual shugenja.
 
I mean I get it, I've been there. Its just...an exercise in futility because the answer is always rooted in 'what *narratively* sounds good. Rather than any sort of 'what makes physical sense'

In theory basically all of the buke are vassal families and only the Champion family are just Founding Name Founding Name. In practice FFG/AEG is never going to satisfy our thirst for more names by releasing a list of all of them because that would take way too much effort for too little payoff. Having actually gone through and come up with about four vassal families per province per family in an all Crane game, I can tell you it is a *crapton* of effort. And most of it isn't even being used.

And no I don't mind answering questions. I love this setting and I love helping other people get into it.
 
I mean I get it, I've been there. Its just...an exercise in futility because the answer is always rooted in 'what *narratively* sounds good. Rather than any sort of 'what makes physical sense'

In theory basically all of the buke are vassal families and only the Champion family are just Founding Name Founding Name. In practice FFG/AEG is never going to satisfy our thirst for more names by releasing a list of all of them because that would take way too much effort for too little payoff. Having actually gone through and come up with about four vassal families per province per family in an all Crane game, I can tell you it is a *crapton* of effort. And most of it isn't even being used.

Honestly, it sounds like for your personal campaign or fic it'd be pragmatic just to find a name generator program to insert a vassal family name as needed unless dealing directly with the Daimyo or Clan Champions and their immediate relatives.

And no I don't mind answering questions. I love this setting and I love helping other people get into it.

Thanks. Nice to hear.
 
So I was thinking of putting together a build for a low ranking samurai among the Hida who has people looking at him funny for a few physical traits.

So here was what I was thinking.

His father was of the Hida but his mother was from the Yasuki, meanwhile, her mother was from the tortoise clan specifically descended from one of the gaijin that was adopted into the clan. Neither his mother nor maternal grandmother showed any trace of Merenae or Thrane heritage but for whatever reason the kid presented a few atavistic traits from his ancestors who were on the wrong side of the Battle of White Stag centuries ago.

His face is Rokugani and he's got the height and bulk of a proper Hida, but his hair is red and he had to start shaving when he was twelve and the less said about his body hair the better. Would such a kid be allowed to be claimed by his father or would honor demand that he deny that the kid was his son and run both him and his mother out of town for her infidelity (which apparently a father CAN do for any reason).

The thing is if you dye his hair black and give him a VERY good shave and he's his father's mirror image.

There's a disadvantage for a Gaijin name in the 4e system but what about not looking completely Rokugani?
 
The disadvantage applies to the gaijin name thing as well. But well, best hope for a twenty goblin winter. He's probably more likely to be seen as *cursed* than as a gaijin. Although I admit to not quite understanding the appeal of making him a Crab. Crab will if you can fight well enough and follow orders allow someone into their clan. So long as the father and mother both swear to fidelity, well, he's cursed, which probably means shit assignments but he'll be fine.

In the Lion, Crane, or Scorpion though? He's probably going ronin at best.
 
The disadvantage applies to the gaijin name thing as well. But well, best hope for a twenty goblin winter. He's probably more likely to be seen as *cursed* than as a gaijin. Although I admit to not quite understanding the appeal of making him a Crab. Crab will if you can fight well enough and follow orders allow someone into their clan. So long as the father and mother both swear to fidelity, well, he's cursed, which probably means shit assignments but he'll be fine.

In the Lion, Crane, or Scorpion though? He's probably going ronin at best.

I was just trying to extrapolate how much worse of a disadvantage (point-wise) would having Gaijin physical traits be compared to just having a Gaijin name like I imagine some Moto Clan members might have.

I chose Crab because that's the one I actually read the most about their history and culture. And the ones LEAST likely to drown him at birth instead of tolerating him if he proves to be an able fighter. That and a big guy smashing the shit out of stuff with a heavy weapon appeals to my monkey brain.

Pretty sure his own mother would probably throw him off a cliff if she were of the Lion Clan. Though that would raise an interesting story for such a guy if he were born of Lion Clan parents.

Huh, shaggy mass of red hair... he practically comes with a Lion's mane already.

Though this kid being born among the Crane known for their graceful and elegance would be a sight to behold.
 
The people least likely to drown him at birth are the Mantis.

Why do you want to make them so foreign looking? Like there are plenty of ways to stick out like sore thumbs without being foreign in appearance. Indeed most of the setting is built on contradiction between an inhuman code of honour and the very real humanity of the people involved. That is the kernel of what I think is compelling about the setting.
 
The people least likely to drown him at birth are the Mantis.

Weren't they the golden child for the developers back in the day?

Why do you want to make them so foreign looking? Like there are plenty of ways to stick out like sore thumbs without being foreign in appearance. Indeed most of the setting is built on contradiction between an inhuman code of honour and the very real humanity of the people involved. That is the kernel of what I think is compelling about the setting.

Mostly so he's got a reason to constantly prove himself harder than someone more run-of-the-mill would.

But if I HAD to have someone that doesn't stick out like that... I figure I'd go with a Ronin.

Maybe he was the children of disgraced Samurai, maybe he was a peasant that swiped a few swords and managed to make sure no one was able to prove his claims wrong. But his mission is to be somebody important.

The spark that set him on his ambition was watching a procession of Jito and their entourage riding to pay homage to their local lord. He knows he could never be a Clan Champion or a Daimyo, or a Lord, he doesn't have the pedigree or the connections. But by the kami, he can kill and kill and kill in battle until they make him a rich man. That's his goal, fight hard, gain glory, and die a wealthy man so he and his descendants NEVER go hungry again.

He wasn't taught all the niceties of a court, but put on a battlefield and he'll prove his worth.

I like the story of a man rising from the bottom through his will and strength of arm.
 
They were the fan favourite and Marketing loved fan favourites so they got a lot done with them back in the AEG days.

The endless ambition to stand atop the world does not need to begin from a place of lack, it can simply *be*, one of the highest positions in the land, The Emerald Champion is, a position you can *win* if you're good enough at court and fighting to get it. But unless your family was truly *destitute* to the point of barely being samurai. You'd have grown up with enough to eat, enough to survive.
A mark of a lord's skill is their ability to retain and provide for their followers after all.

But that drive to be recognized really is very prototypical Mantis. Forever looked down upon as a minor clan ever since their founder was passed over for leadership of the Crab. They yearn to be looked as equals when the Great Clans have no intention of allowing another into their exclusive ranks.
 
Probably sick of me by this point, but here's another concept.

A Matsu's Matsu that might be a bit too Matsu for even the Matsu.

Basic Concept.

Mother was of the Matsu family (rank and file but drank the family's Kool-Aid so to speak), she was so hell-bound and determined to fight against the Crane; she somehow managed to hide a fairly advanced pregnancy. She ended up getting an arm loped off during a battle against the Crane on a field that had been fought over between the two clans repeatedly and she went into labor early.

Born on a constantly fought-over battlefield, to a mother nearly out of her mind with rage, pain, and frustration at her situation... something made contact.

The boy has the Large advantage and the Quick Healer advantages, but he's got the Bad Misfortune - (disfigurement) disadvantage and I'm considering the Cursed by the Realm - Toshigoku disadvantage for that extra rage monster persona.

He's got a strength of 5 and Stamina 3.

The only none combat skills he's got at the moment that didn't come with the school are lore heraldry and perform drums, and I was thinking of those massive Taiko drums that I imagine you FEEL as much as hear. I don't think he'd be all that SKILLED at it, but he just loves the feeling of the drums thrumming through his body and his eardrums.

Good concept? Bad Concept?

Suggestions?
 
Well, it works? Being born on the battlefield that particular way is a bit much for me personally, but that's just a flavouring thing. And isn't actually completely out of keeping with the AEG canon. Matsu Ketsui daimyo of the Matsu gave birth to a son while her husband was ganked by some Kakita, and despite the pregnancy taking a lot out of her, a week later she killed that Kakita.

I think you'd want Brash over Cursed by the Realm. Mechanically the Toshigoku curse is about getting more blood and targeting wounded people. Going from 0 to 60 because you got pissed is more how brash works. And it's worth extra points for Lion characters.

In terms of your stats, there's no good way to say this. Strength isn't that important. Because of how roll and keep works what matters most is the keep number. Strength only contributes to unkept dice. So take your basic katana at 3k2, add 5 strength gives 7k2 which isn't nothing. It does mean on average your going to have powerful hits when you hit. However, that strength 5 costs 20 xp, xp that you desperately need for other attributes. You want earth to be at least 3 so you don't die like wet tissue paper. (Probably want strength of the Earth too which reduces wound penalties) you want your agility up so you can hit people and make use of that strength. And you want uh, honestly just all the air. But reflexes in particular, the 4e game heavily favours initiative.

And you'll want void to help you not die.
 
Well, it works? Being born on the battlefield that particular way is a bit much for me personally, but that's just a flavouring thing. And isn't actually completely out of keeping with the AEG canon. Matsu Ketsui daimyo of the Matsu gave birth to a son while her husband was ganked by some Kakita, and despite the pregnancy taking a lot out of her, a week later she killed that Kakita.

I think you'd want Brash over Cursed by the Realm. Mechanically the Toshigoku curse is about getting more blood and targeting wounded people. Going from 0 to 60 because you got pissed is more how brash works. And it's worth extra points for Lion characters.

In terms of your stats, there's no good way to say this. Strength isn't that important. Because of how roll and keep works what matters most is the keep number. Strength only contributes to unkept dice. So take your basic katana at 3k2, add 5 strength gives 7k2 which isn't nothing. It does mean on average your going to have powerful hits when you hit. However, that strength 5 costs 20 xp, xp that you desperately need for other attributes. You want earth to be at least 3 so you don't die like wet tissue paper. (Probably want strength of the Earth too which reduces wound penalties) you want your agility up so you can hit people and make use of that strength. And you want uh, honestly just all the air. But reflexes in particular, the 4e game heavily favours initiative.

And you'll want void to help you not die.

Well that's why I ask.

Thanks for the information.

I'll rejigger a few things.
 
So I've got this so far. Using an online character sheet and made a few screen shots to show what I have so far.

tried to follow your advice and strength 4 is already pretty high for a starter character which I get naturally for being a Matsu of the Matsu School so I let that be.




Tried to be a bit more balanced but not sure if I did it right.
 
Well it says your 2 xp over. If I'm reading it right.

And you seem to have put all your agility skills at k2 despite having a 3 in it. While jiujutsu isn't a bad back up, pick one weapon skill to focus in on. 4e does not reward you for knowing multiple ways to hurt someone but knowing how to hurt someone really well. (Heavy Weapons might be the best because that includes the Ono weapon which is a 0k4 weapon meaning you have a 4k4 damage roll) If you want to get him with all weapons, pick up crab hands as an advantage. Your wounds are also just all off. the modifier is *2 at base (meaning your line would go 10, 14, 18, 22, 26, 30, 34, 38)

Which is why getting a 3 in your earth ring (willpower and stamina) is so impactful. Because it goes from that to
15, 21, 27, 33, 39, 45, 51, 57. Which is a huge jump in survivability. (The jump to 4 is also impactful but it costs so much xp that it's hard to justify for a lot of players. Attribute rating *4 means that Earth 4 is costing 32 xp out of box)
 
Well it says your 2 xp over. If I'm reading it right.

Yeah, I realize that, trying to figure out what I can shave off or add to disadvantages that isn't going to screw me over.

And you seem to have put all your agility skills at k2 despite having a 3 in it.

Far as I can tell that's because the Fire Ring is at two because my Int. is still at 2 and pumping that up would make it -14 instead of -2.

While jiujutsu isn't a bad back up, pick one weapon skill to focus in on.

It came with the School as far as I can tell and 2 other Bugei skills so I took Athletics and Heavy Weapons.

4e does not reward you for knowing multiple ways to hurt someone but knowing how to hurt someone really well. (Heavy Weapons might be the best because that includes the Ono weapon which is a 0k4 weapon meaning you have a 4k4 damage roll) If you want to get him with all weapons, pick up crab hands as an advantage. Your wounds are also just all off. the modifier is *2 at base (meaning your line would go 10, 14, 18, 22, 26, 30, 34, 38)

From what I can tell that's because my Earth Ring is at 2 because my Willpower is currently 2, again bumping that up is another 12 exp.

Which is why getting a 3 in your earth ring (willpower and stamina) is so impactful. Because it goes from that to
15, 21, 27, 33, 39, 45, 51, 57. Which is a huge jump in survivability. (The jump to 4 is also impactful but it costs so much xp that it's hard to justify for a lot of players. Attribute rating *4 means that Earth 4 is costing 32 xp out of box)

... At this point, I might just math this out by hand so that no glitching happens.
 
So... looking between the Heavy weapons I gotta ask, Ono or Tetsubo?

Either way, this guy I think isn't going to be the greatest duelist, but point him at a line of spears and tell him kill; and he can probably batter his way through the line of battle with little issue. Especially if he took the Heavy armor option.
 
So... looking between the Heavy weapons I gotta ask, Ono or Tetsubo?

Either way, this guy I think isn't going to be the greatest duelist, but point him at a line of spears and tell him kill; and he can probably batter his way through the line of battle with little issue. Especially if he took the Heavy armor option.
Tetsubo, having more rolled dice means you have more options for kept. Although using an axe would be distinct. You're more at the mercy of rolls if you get a bad one.

And you want heavy armor, because the Matsu Berseker school has exactly one opinion on what stance to use. Which is the Full Attack Stance (fire) all the time forever. This does give you +2k1 to attack, but tanks your armor by 10, so heavy armor can help with that.

As can getting into the notional male equivalent of the Lion's Pride advanced school. (The books all say there is a male version but it's never named)

And no your character will be a terrible duelist. The unfortunate thing about 4e is that the dueling minigame doesn't really integrate into the rest of it all that well. Duelists want decent awareness and sky high void. While investing in iaijutsu which is only usuable in the minigame.
 
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