Eve of Destruction Part 2: All Along the Watchtower (Update: Now back to regular turns)

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Red Bovine said:
Do people really really see us doing more than one project for either Garrahan or Mama Dolce for the entire year when taking into acount every other thing we need to do? Especially considering that we are still working on a single project for just Daisytech?

And of course giving away funding just makes this even more harder on us.
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We can go into dept, just need to make sure is not too deep, while we can rob Pluto Compound, RobCo, Pinkertons and the FBI to replenish losses.

Like I get your objections but all these dices can be recovered one way or another and most of our schemes and plans that were chosen last turn should be used as frameworks while also meant to be worked in long term not to be rush at once, also most of the projects can be made in our lair using the huge amount of Mischief Dices we have our disposal.

Also just because we chose a partnership it doesn't mean we have to work on they projects immediately, like chosen Graham and Dolce, the latter gaining 1 Agricultural Dice, would simple open some projects related to them but we don't need to start them from the get go.

Also we have the rewards from Australia that could be dices or funding or something else.

Also @The Bird rewards trow ourselves in these things instead of turtle up.
 
Soberan 123 said:
We can go into dept, just need to make sure is not too deep, while we can rob Pluto Compound, RobCo, Pinkertons and the FBI to replenish losses.

Like I get your objections but all these dices can be recovered one way or another and most of our schemes and plans that were chosen last turn should be used as frameworks while also meant to be worked in long term not to be rush at once, also most of the projects can be made in our lair using the huge amount of Mischief Dices we have our disposal.

Also just because we chose a partnership it doesn't mean we have to work on they projects immediately, like chosen Graham and Dolce, the latter gaining 1 Agricultural Dice, would simple open some projects related to them but we don't need to start them from the get go.

Also we have the rewards from Australia that could be dices or funding or something else.

Also @The Bird rewards trow ourselves in these things instead of turtle up.
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First off it's not just about the dice, I know we are encouraged to trade out dice. The issue is that it's hard to guess what is the appropriate number, as in what is too little or too much. Another issue is that there is no guarantee that the rewards for Australia is more dice or funds. It could easily just be more projects that would be unlocked that would help but may just be adding even more things we need to do.

Second, even if we are discounting the mandates from RADICAL and it's expansion that is still not counting the other numerous things we need to do. Like the Flood walls, brain quests from our other advisors, mandates and needing to constantly rob people all the time. Then there are other issues we need to deal with like House's agent and the Pinkerton's. We may also need to with the mayor who thinks he is the devil. That's actually a lot before even taking Radical into account. Or the fact that we need to spend a ton of our dice robbing places all the time.

Third, people are using the argument that we 'need to hurry' while missing the fact that focusing too much on things outside our region means that it's less prepared for the end of the world. Like I mentioned we haven't even built a single flood wall or signficantly raised the stat of even a single community.

Fourth, on the hurry thing. I hear things like we need to go attack this or that and we need a intrigue network. Well we don't have an army to attack any other significant force, we haven't done the project that gives us that. We don't have a network like htat because we haven't built it yet. We don't have the funds for those things because we haven't set something up that gives us funds reliably with it seeming like Tortuga does just that.

It feels like people are focusing way too hard on trying to do things outside the region we are supposed be helping when we haven't even done much for said region and still need to do just the basics for numerous communities.

Basically it feels like people are putting the cart before the horse. Not just that, it feels like people are trying to put the cart before horse before we even built the cart in the first place. Which really doesn't feel like an exaggeration since it seems like RADICAL was literally meant for what people are insisting we do in regards to attacking our targets. If anything it could be argued that people are trying to rush things in regards to military and intrigue operations in other places before we even built up our foundations.
 
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[X] Plan: DaisyTech Liasons
-[X] Sell
--[X] 1 AGENT +20
--[X] 1 SECURITY +20
-[X] Buy
--[X] DaisyTech Liasons x2 20 each = 40
--[X] DoP Finance Grants [Days Technologies]: (0/15 --> 5/15)

I think the leading plan spends to many dice on buying graham mining that we are going to need to save the rest of the state
 
Red Bovine said:
[X] Plan: Throw the Good Ones a Bone

Going with this because while I'm not totally on board with it really feels like we just flat out wouldn't be able to add anymore on our plate without making things harder then need be.

To give a list of everything we are working on and need to do:
To do List-

1) Build floodwalls for every single community.

2) Build more weather stations to reduce damage from the super storms every year

3) Finish the Menagerie

4) Finish TAPP- which is a 500 progress project

5) Finish laser ballon project

6) Work on more laser project for Wilbur's brain quest

7) Do ACME Loans for our religious fanatic brain quest

8) Finish two more weird projects for Skulder's brain quest

9) finish the Co-op garden

10) Do the nuke a hurricane mandate

11) Work on Sophia's brain quest

12) Start and finish the Hubologist sponsorship

13) Complete the Bootlegger brigade

14) Complete a phase one garage and safe house

15) Build a Phase Two Reznivok Private Lab

16) Do a sponsorship action to be able to get Alvicorp cloning

17) complete the Alvicorp cloning project

18) Do Hover brain insurance

19) Put a cloning lab in our lair

20) Build a factory in our lair

21) Build docks for our lair

22) Build a power peanut plantation in our lair

23) Do Feelsgood mandate

24) Deal with the Pinkertons

25) Deal with House's agent

26) Deal with whoever the gov sends after RADICAL after our last stunt

27) Spend several turns and by extension our dice robbing numerous places just to be able to do several of these projects

I ask again, what is the plan in regards to grabbing even more things to put on our plate when we haven't even started a bunch of crucial projects we need to do? Garrahen is one thing, Mama Dolce is another and even one of these would be adding more to our overloaded plate but I'm honestly not seeing how we will even be doing any of their projects or more than one over a single year at the moment with every other thing we already need to get started on. And that's before we get any new mandates or something more comes up.

Do people really really see us doing more than one project for either Garrahan or Mama Dolce for the entire year when taking into acount every other thing we need to do? Especially considering that we are still working on a single project for just Daisytech?

And of course giving away funding just makes this even more harder on us.
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I feel as though this list is misrepresentative. We're not completing projects in a sequential order, in fact that majority of this list can be worked on side by side, we also need to consider that projects fall into separate categories that use completely separate dice to one another, this means that gaining more agriculture projects will in no way effect Mischief projects. On that note the vast majority of projects on this list are in the Mischief category which we have 8 dice exclusively for that category and we're constantly accumulating more wrath meaning that the rate we're able to complete these projects will be even faster.

You're also discarding the possibility of Australia which will see us no doubt accumulate new resources and technologies that might have the chance to make our lives a little easier.

The only reason why we're still working on Daisy Tech is because it's been rather low priority, if we compare our progress of Daisy Tech projects with our progress on AlviCorp infrastructure you can see that we do in fact have the power to complete projects efficiently. Mama Dolce's would most assuredly be high priority because, without intervention Louisiana, is going to end up starving soon. Bird has already confirmed that the FUSA is going to collapse prior to the bombs dropping and so we need to make Louisiana as self-sufficient as possible, our only agri projects as it stands are a few co-op gardens which aren't realistically going to feed a whole state.

If we want to make it to 2077 we need food and so far our only option seems to be Mama Dolce's.
 
Ah hell, we built Ceres without really building other agri projects in the same region, let's get some Agri projects and a die.

[X] Plan: Helping Friends
 
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Geedubs said:
That Black Isle are orientalists?
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Whatever the Doylist reasons for it, though, in a Watsonian analysis it's still some of the best information we have available, I think.

The Bird said:
than the meme version indistinguishable from sinophobic cold war propaganda we usually get in fallout
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...I don't think I'd describe it as sinophobic, though? IIRC, the Shi are fine, indeed one of the nicer groups in the California Wasteland both to outsiders and their own people. They've also done quite well in terms of infrastructure and technology given how little they started with, but didn't use it to go out and start expanding an empire across California and beyond.

Compare that to, say, Vault City, which probably would be growing a slaver empire if it could, the NCR, which has a lot of upsides but also over time develops increasing inequality in wealth and political power and an idea of its own Manifest Destiny, and, of course, the Ancient Rome cosplayers who are building a slaver empire. Or the Enclave!
 
Reese said:
...I don't think I'd describe it as sinophobic, though? IIRC, the Shi are fine, indeed one of the nicer groups in the California Wasteland both to outsiders and their own people. They've also done quite well in terms of infrastructure and technology given how little they started with, but didn't use it to go out and start expanding an empire across California and beyond.
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It's not so much an issue in their attitude so much as it is in how the Shi represent their culture. People can be helpful in media while still being racial stereotypes.
 
Vote closed
  • Voting
    • Scheduled vote count started by The Bird on Jul 9, 2024 at 12:18 PM, finished with 45 posts and 24 votes.
    Click to expand...
     
  • Voting
    • It was because you had it set up to go by block. We've got a tie at the moment it looks like.
    Adhoc vote count started by TempestK on Jul 13, 2024 at 9:05 AM, finished with 137 posts and 24 votes.
    • [X] Plan: Throw the Good Ones a Bone
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Disaster
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Exchange Agents (Harlem)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Daisy Technological Enterprises)
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Garrahan Mining)
      --[X] Laser Tower Defense Arrays (0/150 --> 2/150)
      [X] Plan: Helping Friends
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Prototype
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      --[X] 2 Funding
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Daisy Technologies]: (0/15 --> 15/15)
      --[X] Exchange Agents [Harlem]: (0/10 --> 10/10)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining (12/75 --> 75/75)
      --[X] Mama Dolce's (0/25 --> 25/25)
      [X] Plan: The Bare Necessities
      [X] Plan: Shoot To Thrill
      [X] Plan: Sustainable Wasteland 2: Revengence
      [X] Plan: Covering All Our Bases
      [X] Plan: Covering All Our Bases (RIP Garrahan)
      [X] Plan: Helping Friends
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Prototype
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      --[X] 2 Funding
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Daisy Technologies]: (0/15 --> 15/15)
      --[X] Exchange Agents [Harlem]: (0/10 --> 10/10)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining (12/75 --> 75/75)
      --[X] Mama Dolce's (0/25 --> 25/25)
      [X] Plan: Weirdly Daisy
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      --[X] 1 Chems 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Cryptid Caretakers [Weird] x3 45/45
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons [Daisy] x2 40/40
      [X] Plan: Weirdly Daisy
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      --[X] 1 Chems 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Cryptid Caretakers [Weird] x3 45/45
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons [Daisy] x2 40/40
      [X] Plan: Don's Regards
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Putting Out Hits: Pinkerton X2 50/50
      --[X] Strategic Personnel Depot Expansion [Population] 20/100
      [X] Plan: Throw the Good Ones a Bone
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Disaster
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Exchange Agents (Harlem)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Daisy Technological Enterprises)
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Garrahan Mining)
      --[X] Laser Tower Defense Arrays (0/150 --> 2/150)
      [X] Plan: DaisyTech Liasons
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT +20
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons x2 20 each = 40
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Days Technologies]: (0/15 --> 5/15)
    Click to expand...
     
    TempestK said:
    It was because you had it set up to go by block. We've got a tie at the moment it looks like.
    Adhoc vote count started by TempestK on Jul 13, 2024 at 9:05 AM, finished with 137 posts and 24 votes.
    • [X] Plan: Throw the Good Ones a Bone
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Disaster
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Exchange Agents (Harlem)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Daisy Technological Enterprises)
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Garrahan Mining)
      --[X] Laser Tower Defense Arrays (0/150 --> 2/150)
      [X] Plan: Helping Friends
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Prototype
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      --[X] 2 Funding
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Daisy Technologies]: (0/15 --> 15/15)
      --[X] Exchange Agents [Harlem]: (0/10 --> 10/10)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining (12/75 --> 75/75)
      --[X] Mama Dolce's (0/25 --> 25/25)
      [X] Plan: The Bare Necessities
      [X] Plan: Shoot To Thrill
      [X] Plan: Sustainable Wasteland 2: Revengence
      [X] Plan: Covering All Our Bases
      [X] Plan: Covering All Our Bases (RIP Garrahan)
      [X] Plan: Helping Friends
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Prototype
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      --[X] 2 Funding
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Daisy Technologies]: (0/15 --> 15/15)
      --[X] Exchange Agents [Harlem]: (0/10 --> 10/10)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining (12/75 --> 75/75)
      --[X] Mama Dolce's (0/25 --> 25/25)
      [X] Plan: Weirdly Daisy
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      --[X] 1 Chems 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Cryptid Caretakers [Weird] x3 45/45
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons [Daisy] x2 40/40
      [X] Plan: Weirdly Daisy
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      --[X] 1 Chems 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Cryptid Caretakers [Weird] x3 45/45
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons [Daisy] x2 40/40
      [X] Plan: Don's Regards
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      --[X] 1 Genetics 15
      --[X] 1 Government 15
      --[X] 1 Cambridge Louisiana 15
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Putting Out Hits: Pinkerton X2 50/50
      --[X] Strategic Personnel Depot Expansion [Population] 20/100
      [X] Plan: Throw the Good Ones a Bone
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT
      --[X] 1 SECURITY
      --[X] 1 Chems
      --[X] 1 Disaster
      --[X] 1 Genetics
      --[X] 1 Government
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] Exchange Agents (Harlem)
      --[X] Garrahan Mining
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Daisy Technological Enterprises)
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants (Garrahan Mining)
      --[X] Laser Tower Defense Arrays (0/150 --> 2/150)
      [X] Plan: DaisyTech Liasons
      -[X] Sell
      --[X] 1 AGENT +20
      --[X] 1 Security 20
      -[X] Buy
      --[X] DaisyTech Liasons x2 20 each = 40
      --[X] DoP Finance Grants [Days Technologies]: (0/15 --> 5/15)
    Click to expand...
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    Click to shrink...
    Nah Helping Friends is ahead by two.
     
    Before anyone suggests investing a ton of resources into Mama Dolce next it needs to be pointed out despite people talking about some food issues we haven't actually seen such things happening in our region. We also got word of bird that we more than likely pushed back the bombs falling thanks to previous actions.

    From what the QM said it seems like it would be absolutely possible to just have one community be the breadbasket for the region using 4 agri projects along with a Ceres. New Alexandria already has a Ceres and a Plantation, so we just need to put in something like 3 more agri projects to fix the food issue for the region.

    So I think that the one Dolce dice per turn is enough while we work on our other projects. Especially since besides us not having an actual food crisis we don't have the dice to spare. Before people bring up us having 8 mischief dice it needs to be pointed out that we are spending around around 3-4 of said dice just to rob people to get funds. That's literally half our mischief dice just for funds every single turn, and there is a very real chance that we fail leaving us with now funds and needing to do even more the next turn, and we still need to deal with House's agents and the Pinkerton's, with either of them taking the other half. So that's pretty much all our mischief dice taken up in a single turn that means we can
    't even work on our lair.

    On that note I really think we should stop trying so hard to try to affect things outside our region when we haven't even done much for our own region in over 2 years because we constantly need to deal with issues all the time, like restoring communities after every single storm every year or dealing with NEXT. Like I get that we are supposed to be fighting the 'Man' but we know from canon that the Enclave is called the Enclave because the people in charge got absolutely wrecked to the point that only a few remnants remain. Worse for them in that NEXT is constantly fighting them.

    We also haven't even gotten our lair set up beyond the most basics and that would include things like logistics and actually supplying and building up an army to fight other people.

    Not saying we shouldn't be fighting the Fascists. Just that we really don't have the resources or manpower to have that much of an effect at the moment, so we can't really afford to spread ourselves thin and avoid fighting beyond what we can handle. Even just supporting Garrahan seems like a huge investment at the moment with our long list of things to do that literally number at around 30.

    I see people saying that we are fine with dice but we are actually having serious issues as a result of our mandates and everything we need to do all the time with dealing with problems. It's so bad that we are constantly stopping projects mid turn and leaving them for multiple turns just because we don't have the time or resources to finish them.

    It's pretty bad when after people decided to pick a fight with RobCo only for them not to do anything against House's agent because we had so much to do. If we are too busy to deal with one single agent over several turns then that should seem like a really good indicator that we don't have the resources to go around starting anymore fights until we deal with our current issues.
     
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    Alright, updates finished and on the patreon- if anyone want's to see it before anyone else, as always, one dollary doo gets you access to everything a day ahead of time (and helps support me.) That said, like I said, day ahead of time (assuming nothing comes up or I decide the thing needs major revisions), so it's not a particularly long wait.

    That aside, I'm going to be camping this week so writing outside of revisions is likely to be minimal: the perfect time for a QnA! As always, spoilery questions will be ignored, "how do we win" questions will be ignored, etc, etc.
     
    With the Mccoys having a knack for organizing and administration, what would Roger have been like? Not that he was even a choice, but im curious how he would participate in a plan quest.
     
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