Oh, I didn't even realize our character sheet was up.
Guess I was right in predicting that the old soldier would have a super ability!
Carefully.
Or by evolving it into a whale.
Is that a typo, or are we Ragyo KIryuin?
Crystalwatcher's Base Commander Quest (CMGQ Spinoff)
- Thread starter Crystalwatcher
- Start date
- Original
Guess I was right in predicting that the old soldier would have a super ability!
Or by evolving it into a whale.
LostDeviljho
Flame Dragon Princess
- Location
- The glorious Pacific Northwest
- Pronouns
- Any
Clearly we need to buy a zeppelin.
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
Fixed.
ABalloonyChaos
Drifts wherever the wind may take me.
- Location
- USA, up in the air.
voting for this. Dosen't blow our cash resuvesrs or over populate right away. hopefuly more info next turn of what we are fighting.
[X] plan hcv
[] A Squad of Infantry ($2,500) X 10
[] Legit Barracks ($75,000)
[] Motorpool ($250,000)
[] Dock ($350,000)
[] Research Barracks (A.K.A. The Wizard House) ($125,000)
[] A Proper Communications Array ($55,000)
[] Scout the area
[] Try and get in touch with the local Valkyr commander.
[X] plan hcv
What I would prefer but know isn't gaining traction.
[] A Squad of Infantry ($2,500) X 10
[] Legit Barracks ($75,000)
[] Motorpool ($250,000)
[] Dock ($350,000)
[] Research Barracks (A.K.A. The Wizard House) ($125,000)
[] A Proper Communications Array ($55,000)
[] Try and get in touch with the local Valkyr commander.
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- Location
- A trench being shelled.
[X] plan hcv
Scout next turn, ensure base safety now.
Scout next turn, ensure base safety now.
ConfusedPotato
Unverified Verifier
- Location
- Australia
[X]Plan Setting up V2
[X] [JENOVA] Stand Guard
[X] [Personal] Try and get in touch with the local Valkyr commander.
[X] [JENOVA] Stand Guard
[X] [Personal] Try and get in touch with the local Valkyr commander.
- Location
- St. Petersburg
What are Full Auto, Inspiration and Sync bonuses?
How do we get an Assault Scanner and start packing magical reinforcements?
No, I have not read the previous quest. Am I to understand that it is a requirement to comprehend what is going on?
[X] Plan Rookie Tripwire
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Combat mechanics in this system are REALLY complicated.
Enough so that even most of us who have followed the original quest from the start don't remember everything.
The following post explains all the myriad Abilities that can appear on Weapons and Spells.
https://forums.sufficientvelocity.c...agical-girl-quest.25232/page-372#post-6784636
To answer your question though, Full Auto is a a ranged weapon ability that makes you do 5 extra hits of 20% normal damage each, Inspiration is a status buff (usually from either a really good leader's influence or a spell cast by a mage), and Sync is a bunch of mooks teaming up to act as a single attack.
I don't think it's necessary to read all of CMGQ, but you should probably at least look at some of the information there. In particular, the character sheets on the first page (to get an idea of what the numbers mean), the Magical Girl templates, and the demon classification post (both linked in the first post, along with other useful information).
The basic part of the combat system is pretty simple: Total Damage is calculated for each attack as (Base Damage + Modifier roll + additive bonuses) x multiplicative bonuses (the modifier roll is 1d(character's Magic Modifier)) (actually, going by Goddess White in ALIGNED GEAR and MECA Force in PROPHET DRIVE, a multiplier from a Weapon Ability such as Crush does not apply to damage bonuses given by personal Abilities, Modifier rolls, buff spells, or situational modifiers like Surprise, but multipliers given by personal Abilities do (Sixth Heaven in PROPHET DRIVE and UNIFIER DRIVE, Judgement Core in UNIFIER DRIVE). This does not match Summit's performance in LEGEND GEAR, but that was a canonized omake, not written by crystalwatcher). Then synchronized attacks are combined and have their synchronization bonus applied (x2 for 3–9 synchronized attacks, x5 for ≥10). Then all damage to the same [group of] enemies is added up to get the Total End Damage (I'm actually just guessing that this happens after synch bonuses are applied, because we've never had people with a synch bonus attacking at the same time as someone not synchronized with them. Also, it's not completely consistent whether "Total End Damage" refers to damage before the additive defenses or after; it appears both ways in PROPHET DRIVE). Then additive defensive effects are calculated for each target: (Base Resilience + Modifier roll + additive bonuses) x multiplicative bonuses (just guessing; we haven't seen any multiplicative defensive bonuses yet) is subtracted from Total End Damage (note: if the defender has a strong defensive malus, this can add extra damage). Then multiplicative damage reduction is applied to get the Final End Damage. The Final End Damage is subtracted from the target's HP. Bonuses stack additively (so an x3 damage buff and an x5 damage buff would combine to give x7 damage, not x15). A character's Attacks Per Turn governs how many actions they can use in a single 10-second combat turn (see crystalwatcher's post on APT for more). Attacks targeting multiple enemies will usually deal their full damage to each enemy (though there are exceptions, such as spells with the Target: Army Ability).
For example, @kelllogo's calculation has three errors in it: the +150% bonus from Survivor of Elysium is written as an additive effect, so stacks additively with Base Damage and Full Auto (I think), and the Synchronization Bonus for ten soldiers is the x5 Staccato of Slaughter, not the x2 Hail of Lead (ref: PROPHET DRIVE for SoS, CARNAGE GEAR and others for HoL). And Survivor of Elysium gives double damage vs. Unified Darkness forces, which our enemies are likely to be. The calculation would then be written as
except that the bonuses from Survivor of Elysium would get better names (it's also possible that it would only be x9, since that's what two x5s combine to give, but I think it would be x10).
Where it gets complicated is Abilities and soft mechanics. Soft mechanics govern various things, such as surprise bonuses, turn order, emotional effects, collateral damage, accuracy, etc. And Abilities can do many, many, things. LDj's list covers nearly all (it's missing a couple—Protean and Lethal Surprise at least) of the known Abilities that can appear on weapons and spells, and character Abilities can be all over the map. For some examples of how this interferes with the combat calculations above, Solid Core's Echo of Peace reduces Total End Damage (as I used the term) aimed at her allies by 65% (contrasting how other multiplicative defenses apply after the additive ones); Judgement Core's Burst Stream of Obliteration will under certain conditions double the bonuses given by Full Auto (another of her Abilities lets her retain the bonuses from previous attacks, so this means a lot), and triples Total Damage; and Dark Steel's Never Outnumbered means that attacks against her are resolved individually instead of being combined.
There are a few common character Abilities which might come up: aura effects (straightforward, they activate at start of turn and healing auras apply before damaging ones); attack interception (intercept an incoming attack with your attack; the person with higher damage deals the difference); Skill-based Attack Negation (see the APT post linked above); Flight (flight); and those appearing on the stat sheets for our forces (see the first page of CMGQ). We have very little hard information on Affinity interactions, but our infantry rifles' Holy Affinity may do some extra damage to certain enemies.
Anyway, you should be able to get by pretty well with a look at the things I mentioned at the beginning and reading what crystalwatcher and people who've read CMGQ say in this thread.
My first question is what kinds of static defenses do we have, and what can we buy to improve them? In particular, what do we have in terms of anti-air? Being defeated by Hell Beasts dropping boulders would be highly embarrassing. Next, what do we know about the local geography and disposition of forces? I'm sure we'll find out more if we choose "Scout the area", but surely we can at least see a little, know which direction is allied territory, and have some idea how hard the UD is pressing here and maybe how far away the front lines are? And since we're apparently next to water, is it an ocean, a lake, a bay, a river, or what, and how does its location and direction relate to the battle lines (do we need a fleet to prevent the UD from sneaking by)? And in the general sense, what do we know IC about what Valhalla is like? Heaven and Hell are both kind of weird, does Valhalla have anything like that going on? What's the day/night cycle like—is Valhalla a planet orbiting a star, is it a plane with a magical light-source traversing the sky (the update said "dawn", so it isn't perpetually mid-afternoon)? How about the weather—what's it like right now, and do we know how it varies? Do we need to watch out for tornadoes, or be prepared for snow? Is there any weather at all? (If we don't know, we need to ask the Valkyries.) And what do we know about Valkyries? In particular, can they fly (I'm guessing yes)? Might help with our air defenses.
Will you be keeping track of our stocks of ammunition, ordnance, fuel, food, medical supplies, etc., and if so how much do we have? Are upgrades assumed to come with support personnel? How long is a turn? How long does it take to build things/obtain forces? When does Survivor of Elysium's +150% bonus to human soldiers apply—single-man weapons only, humans manning machine gun nests or vehicle-mounted guns, probably not all the way up to artillery and airstrikes? And how directly do we have to be commanding them?
On a different note, what's the in-universe justification for the Bounty System? It doesn't seem like an efficient way to run a military, never mind that I would expect manpower and resources to be more of an issue than money (speaking of which, if the Counter Force will send us stuff when they can spare it, will they also sometimes take forces which are needed elsewhere?). Though it does answer a question I should have been wondering about, namely how independent Magical Girls can afford to spend their time fighting instead of going to school or working. Hm, was the Bounty System originally intended for independents, but got extended to the normal military because of complaints or people trying to cheat the system? Or maybe it's not run by humans at all? Though that still doesn't explain how having cash will convince Command to send us tanks when "the front will collapse if I don't get more tanks" won't. Or are we buying from someone else, and if so, who?
How do MG Quarters differ from regular barracks?
This obviously takes place close to the present time of CMGQ (Heaven is pulling out of Valhalla, so it's after (or at least not long before) FUTURE GEAR, and there's only 28 days between that and Operation Answerer), but can we get a specific date?
[x] Plan Rookie Tripwire
We need manpower. We need to be able to be in multiple places at once (and to guard the base effectively, even at night), and infantry are cheap and fairly effective (a squad will do 10k damage firing together, or 20k against UD forces), if slow and squishy. I want at least ten squads this turn. Humanity's vehicle-enabled mobility is one of our biggest advantages in this war, so motor pool now—I'd take it just for jeeps and APCs, but tanks and artillery are really nice too. Magic plays a big role in this war, and being able to understand and counter it is necessary, never mind using it ourselves, so Research Barracks (I actually would be interested in trying to do this quest without mages, but I like the combat system too much to not play with it, and I don't think other people would go for it anyway). We don't know precisely what Legit Barracks does, but I think we want it before we get too many troops. I would like the Communications Array, but I can understand saving the money. The Tech Research Division is just too expensive on top of everything else, and likely not necessary too early. We'll need airpower eventually, but I think we can get away with relying on the Valkyries and whatever static defenses we have for the moment. And it's hard to determine how useful a navy will be.
[x] [JENOVA] Stand guard
I want to scout the area, but leaving the base empty (modulo janitors) is just asking for something to go wrong, especially since "stand guard" is an explicit option. Even though the base was apparently empty before we got there.
[x] [Personal] Try and get in touch with the local Valkyr commander.
We need to talk to our local allies. They have intel, they probably have the airpower that's too expensive for us to get just yet, and we need to know how much help we can expect.
One more thing: note that the thread is tagged "boss fight". This may inform people's planning—CMGQ boss fights are fun.
I think this should be "have been", since the light is still in the process of getting rid of the darkness. Not sure.
The last bit isn't really necessary, and unless "and cheerful demeanor" is meant to be parenthetical there's no comma. And we've encountered what is by far your most common mistake (there's about fifty in the first two chapters of CMGQ): slipping into past tense in a story written in present tense. One suggestion: every time you use the word "had", or especially "had been", double-check the tenses.
Unless "the Valkyr" is the name of an individual (or government/place/etc.), or "Valkyr" is a mass noun.
This looks like you accidentally mashed two versions of the same sentence together while editing.
LostDeviljho
Flame Dragon Princess
- Location
- The glorious Pacific Northwest
- Pronouns
- Any
...I am now more confused about the combat system than I was an hour ago.
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
Just do what I do, and nod along as all the smart people use arcane words like 'ratios' and 'multipliers', than rubber-stamp the plan that will include the most explosions....I am now more confused about the combat system than I was an hour ago.
Usually works out!
3074
LostDeviljho
Flame Dragon Princess
- Location
- The glorious Pacific Northwest
- Pronouns
- Any
I'm supposed to be one of the smart people tho...
To the workshop!...........?
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
Sometimes, being the smartest person in the room means that you delegate to the specialists. That way, we can sit back, relax, and calculate the optimal strategic method of not getting boned. Or wander off and do something else. Either or, really.
3075
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
... The battle system is meant to be mostly intuitive. Did I do something wrong?
Once you have a better idea of what you'll be facing, Mason'll start planning out defenses in the vote.
On the mainland side of the bridge, you have hills and open plains. There's a forest in the distance, but nowhere near close enough to be worried about yet. The Valkyr battle lines are to your east where they're duking it out with demons pouring through a few dozen Hell Portals.
For example, lethal wounds aren't as dangerous as they'd otherwise be, and a soldier can fight for longer than they otherwise would be able to. It makes one hell of a battleground.
You can pop a proper barracks in place in two days/a turn.
Idiot B: DO IT!!!
SoE: You're both idiots, but lets watch what happens
(Answer your question?)
The Counter Force can fund their forces perfectly alright on their own, no trouble there, but the increase of enthusiasm amongst the soldiery for killing demons was deemed to be worth the extra money.
It also gave them a reason to officially cut back on military spending without actually loosing money.
A MG Quarter has more room allocated to Magical Girl teams than they'd otherwise get in order to accommodate the otherwise civilian weapons of mass slaughter and their support team. This means they hold proportionately fewer personnel (Magical Girls) than a proper barracks, but means your murder machines are happier. It also comes with the room that allows the identification of a MG's affinities.
Zilch at the moment.
Once you have a better idea of what you'll be facing, Mason'll start planning out defenses in the vote.
Pinnacle Station is on a small island just close enough to the mainland to be connected by a short bridge. Otherwise you're sitting on open ocean.
On the mainland side of the bridge, you have hills and open plains. There's a forest in the distance, but nowhere near close enough to be worried about yet. The Valkyr battle lines are to your east where they're duking it out with demons pouring through a few dozen Hell Portals.
An Ocean. You're to the direct west of the main Valkyrie combat lines where they're fighting with the Unified Darkness' forces. So if you won't want water demons sneaking past, you'll need boats.
Think Terra with the trappings of Heaven. Beautiful place to live, but not 100% perfect like Heaven is.
Valhalla's special is that inhabitants heal from injuries better and faster, as well as recover Stamina a lot easier.
For example, lethal wounds aren't as dangerous as they'd otherwise be, and a soldier can fight for longer than they otherwise would be able to. It makes one hell of a battleground.
They can all fly and are highly adept at magic of all kinds. They're particularly skilled warriors, even when compared to other War Angels.
To lower my own required book keeping I'm going to leave most of this in the background. If you need justification, then Zack's a wizard at keeping you properly supplied.
Yes.
Two days.
Depends on what you're building/trying to obtain.
You can pop a proper barracks in place in two days/a turn.
Idiot A: I'M FIRING THE NUKE!
Idiot B: DO IT!!!
SoE: You're both idiots, but lets watch what happens
(Answer your question?)
It started out as a way to fund independent Magical Girls like you said, but after a while it spread to also become a way to also improve moral among the ground pounders by giving them a way to get some extra money to spend. (Team GEAR are fucking rich by now.)
The Counter Force can fund their forces perfectly alright on their own, no trouble there, but the increase of enthusiasm amongst the soldiery for killing demons was deemed to be worth the extra money.
It also gave them a reason to officially cut back on military spending without actually loosing money.
Remember that the average Magical Girl has/had/will have no military training. So they're not used to living out of a footlocker.
A MG Quarter has more room allocated to Magical Girl teams than they'd otherwise get in order to accommodate the otherwise civilian weapons of mass slaughter and their support team. This means they hold proportionately fewer personnel (Magical Girls) than a proper barracks, but means your murder machines are happier. It also comes with the room that allows the identification of a MG's affinities.
You're three weeks before the start of the main quest.
Decim
On again, off again lurker.
- Location
- St. Louis, MO
I know it was meant to be intuitive, but the melding of hard mechanics, soft mechanics, and general complexity creep of combat mechanics (mostly abilities here) has lead to the situation where it can be rather clunky to work through if you're not familiar with it. At this point, I see the combat system as being primarily narratively driven, with a side of deterministic mechanics to nail down exactly how a fight will go for fluff purposes. It's a lot easier for me to comprehend it that way.
- Location
- madison
the typical mid level attack will have 3 or 4 modifiers, whose order of operation may or may not be very important, and high level combat revolves around exploiting the exact interaction of complex offensive and defensive abilities. The system is cool, and great for puzzle battles, but it is way too complex to be intuitive.
Decim
On again, off again lurker.
- Location
- St. Louis, MO
Quick question here, did you have the bounty system as a thing before I wrote up my canon omake on Sega's day out? Or was it something that you retconned in because it was convenient and it wasn't touched on, or relevant, beforehand?
- Location
- Anchorage, Alaska
I doubt it. That you did anything wrong, that is. The main issue is that "intuitive" is somewhat subjective, and not at all exclusive to "complex" or "lots of interacting mechanics".
For example, let's take a car: From a driver's perspective, it's all fairly straight forward. The wheel controls the direction of the vehicle, there's a brake to go slower and a gas to accelerate. Some vehicles are stick shifts, but that also becomes fairly intuitive with only a bit more practice. But then you pop open the hood and OH DEAR LORD LOOK AT ALL THE FIDDLY BITS. What your witnessing is everyone looking under the hood that is the background mechanics, and "NOPE"-ing right off, when really our involvement is largely input driven with generally self-evident outcomes, like "Soldiers fight high level demon. They all died."
Not a perfect analogy, since understanding the underlying mechanics translates directly into being able to better micro-manage what our guys are doing and how we should deploy them. But a lot of it is still going to be fairly self-evident on a surface level, provided that you have an accurate idea of what they do.
For example, Zachary Mustang can fairly accurately be described as "The Reaper of Mooks!" Seriously, his very existence enforces the Inverse Ninja Law to the detriment of his enemies. Properly employed, he's the badass in the background wrecking the shit of mobs of enemies as our MG's face down the big boss monsters. Never put him anywhere close to an elite enemy though, he's liable to get his face punched in from his buffs disappearing in a puff of narrativium. Luckily, elites are more likely to be demoted to mooks, rather than the other way round, so depending on narrative forces he'll be able to apply his bonus to steadily more and more powerful enemies. Never make him the centerpiece of any fight though, only deploy to mook meatgrinders to increase our K/D efficiency.
3076
Soft mechanics and math, son!
In concept it's simple, and remains so when attacks and defense are each simplistic, but when both sides have multiple different modifiers that apply to their offensive and defensive calculations, and when half those modifiers have their own soft mechanics, things get messy.
Order of operations mattering at times just adds to that.
It's a fun system that works well, but it's only simple when dealing with simple combatants.
Crystalwatcher
(Verified GM)
- Location
- Limbo
It was a vague idea that was floating around before hand. You just gave me a reason to flesh it out.
So a little of A and a little of B.
LostDeviljho
Flame Dragon Princess
- Location
- The glorious Pacific Northwest
- Pronouns
- Any
It's fairly intuitive to me when it's being employed, it's just that beth's explanation had me look at it and kinda go "wut?".