The fact that it doesn't work when the gate is buried is a point against that theory.
Cleaning Up After The Ancients (Stargate SI)
- Thread starter Vaermina
- Start date
Silveraith
Argent Phantasm
- Location
- Terra Atlantus
If the gate is buried no connection is established to open a wormhole. The Kawoosh only functions when a connection can be made and to ensure it's reasonably clear for the incoming traveler.
Shadow Archon
Protoss Preserver
- Location
- Louisiana
Remember the stargate in Antarctica that worked despite being buried beneath the ice? Both in Solitudes and Continuum? The Kawoosh there explicitly punched straight through some ice right in front of the gate.
I'm assuming as long as the space in the middle of the ring isn't obstructed, a wormhole can form, and the Kawoosh will clear out anything immediately in front of the gate.
However, if it's compactly buried, the address ring and chevrons could be stuck, which might also completely prevent a wormhole from engaging at all. That's clearly an issue for Milky Way Stargates that physically move their address rings when dialed, but it might not be for Pegasus ones that have the digital ring.
Not quite. The Kawoosh Vortex needs some space for getting started, otherwise it will fail to clear the space before the gate.
Per 100 Days, the Gate got covered closely enough when it was buried that the kawoosh couldn't clear the naturally formed (after the impacts) iris equivalent, despite supporting the open wormhole, until Carter built the particle beam and shot dead center of the gate for an opening cycle, and then the kawoosh cleared the blockage in the volume the kawoosh Vortex clearing effect covered.
It's possible that there's a threshold on what's solid and sturdy enough to block the kawoosh clearing effect and what isn't.
I think that in Solitudes, the ice was probably not sufficiently complete coverage to block the clearing effect - ice shifts, after all, and the same is likely true for Continuum.
I'm blanking on the episode name right now, but the one with the Bedrosians and Optricans, where the gate (and DHD) was buried and being excavated by one of the local factions and their security forces thought SG-1 were from their enemies, that episode would be another argument against debris and other matter around the receiving gate being particularly critical to whether or not it can recieve incoming wormholes.
Sure but "enough rubble is in front of the gate to be a hazard but not enough to prevent the gate from opening at all" seems like a pretty narrow window for it to be an intentional design feature for. Like if you were intentionally designing a "landing zone clearing energy burst" why wouldn't it operate if the gate's totally buried?
Maybe if there's also a 'self cleaning cycle' that runs it every couple hundred years or so of inactivity to keep anything except a sudden catastrophic landslide from naturally putting the gate into a 'totally buried' state, otherwise any location with any phenomenon that's going to build up enough debris in a hundred thousand years to be a problem at all is likely to build up enough in a million to totally bury it.
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Ace Dreamer
Verified Reality User
- Location
- Between The Unknown & The Known
I'm reasonably sure that the Asgard combined with Ancient tech could fix this problem. A bio-tech (partly living) interface (with encrypted security features) could allow android Wraith to interface to their tech.
It's a multi-step process.
Step 1: Destructive mind upload into static storage, with 'soul catcher' tech (psionic/'ghost') if that can be riddled.
Step 2: Transfer to active storage allowing 'running' the uploaded mind in a purely digital Virtual World.
Step 3: Download willing Wraith into android bodies - these might be bare-bones to start, but upgraded ASAP (techno 'telepathy', hivemind access, mind backup...).
Step 4: Sideload willing Wraith from android to perfected Hybrid bodies.
Alternative? Wipe-out (thoroughly genocide) the Wraith. They will not play nice, they are sapient super-predators - historically the only answer is dangerous predators end-up dead-dead, with none even kept in zoos.
Immoral? Does how 'moral' you can be depend on your resource-base?
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Foxy Boxes
[Verified Box]
- Location
- England
Well if it's totally buried like in 100 Days any traveller would be trapped.
That does leave the question of why connections are allowed to form without a kawoosh, but that'd presumably be a security exception to allow for iris-like protections.
- Location
- Attempting to cast animate object on a black hole.
Didn't one of the recurring Wraith characters in the show actively work towards removing the need to feed, and he basically got laughed at as why would they ever want to cause less pain?
One of Todd's people said something to the effect of feeding being a huge part of who the Wraith are (which is unquestionably true), in response to an Expedition proposal about possibly removing the need to feed. That's one of the reasons why I don't think there'd be sufficient buy in from the Wraith for most possible solutions. Plus, a lot of those possible solutions probably come with trade offs, such as reduced powers available to the Wraith.
Todd still did some experiments to that end (he's smart enough to know that as long as Wraith are feeding on humans, there cannot be peace between Wraith and humanity as a whole), but said experiments backfired rather badly.
Even handing the Wraith the perfected version of Michael's Hybrids would be a difficult sell for most Wraith. And still largely a cultural genocide, given that feeding is a central part of Wraith existence and culture.
But since that kind of solution doesn't exist yet, and even if it did, there isn't any way to get buy in and cooperation from the Wraith ... the only other alternatives are to let the Wraith keep eating people or kill them all.
And personally, I would say extermination of the Wraith is more moral and ethical than letting them continue eating people.
Chapter 44 - Flight or Flight Part 1
New
- Location
- Oblivion
Chapter 44 - Flight or Flight Part 1
"That's a starship." Lorne offered as he stared at the squat vessel currently positioned between them and the Navis on the Enterprise's central display.
Eventus had somewhat hoped the Travelers wouldn't be at the Navis's location this early, mostly for his own sake, but he supposed he would just have to deal with dashing their hopes directly.
"I'm not sure I would call that a ship so much as a coffin." McKay muttered as he studied the sensor readout, no doubt seeing the same worrying levels of reactor leakage that he was.
"Let's see what they have to say." Eventus said as he sent out a standardized hail, only for his look to slowly transform into one of annoyance as the minutes passed by with no response.
"Okay." He muttered as he set the communications system to holographic mode and initiated a transmission. "We'll just do things the–
"I think they just raised their shields." Lorne interrupted, and Eventus felt his eyebrow twitch slightly as the hologram on the other ships bridge was cut off before it could even finish forming.
Turning to Lorne, Eventus pointed at the other ship. "You saw it, I tried to be reasonable and discuss things first."
"Sure." Lorne agreed with a nod as he considered the other ship for a moment. "But they might be trying to figure out what to do, so it couldn't hurt to give them a few more minutes."
While it was true they weren't exactly in a rush, and there probably wasn't anything the Travelers could do, that didn't mean Eventus wanted to sit here for however long it would take them to figure that out.
"I'll send a direct transmission first, then we'll give them a half hour to respond." He countered, setting the communications system to transmit.
"Unknown vessel, this is the Lantean warship Enterprise, here to retrieve the Lantean warship Navis, you have thirty minutes to respond before we begin, Enterprise out."
A minute passed before McKay looked over to him. "So I was thinking, what about renaming the Navis to be the Millennium Falcon?"
"No." Eventus deadpanned.
"Come on." McKay whined. "We can't call a ship, ship."
"Just because one of your languages decided Navis means ship doesn't mean it actually does." Eventus shot back, still finding the whole thing rather hilarious. "The Navis was actually named after Navis Pren, the captain of the Explorer that first encountered the Asgard."
She had been something of a folk hero to the Exploration corps given how rare non-seeded sentient species tended to be in the universe. Sadly however her ship had vanished with all hands long before Eventus's time while investigating a dimensional fissure of some kind.
Personally he gave it fifty fifty odds that the ship had ended up stranded in a parallel dimension somewhere and the crew had just decided to continue on with their whole 'seek out new life and new civilizations' mission.
"Also." He continued, shooting a light glare at the man. "I know that reference now, and you don't call a warship the Millennium Falcon, you save that for a high speed transport."
Not that he knew of any still around that they could do that with, but it was the point of the matter.
"You've watched Star Wars?" McKay inquired with an accusatory look over to Lorne.
"Don't look at me." Lorne protested with a shrug. "I only told him about Star Trek and Lord of the Rings."
"It was in the copy of your media database that I downloaded." Eventus offered, still a bit annoyed at how small their digital library had been. "I've been watching the movies on it at night while going through various work backlogs."
Which was seeming more and more like an endless task given how many things there were on an explorer class vessel that should have been automated to streamline operations but hadn't been for various reasons.
"Huh." McKay muttered, seeming to consider something for a moment before turning back to Eventus with a focused gaze. "So lightsabers, yea or nay? Because I've tried to draw up the blueprints for one and keep running into power supply and containment field issues."
"You could use a crystal energy cell for power." Eventus offered as he seriously considered the question. "But what kind of containment field are you attempting to use?"
"Shaped magnetic." McKay admitted.
"We did something similar with our plasma cutters." Eventus offered as he brought up a hologram of the device.
Lorne furrowed his brow as he studied the image. "Is that a plasma chainsaw?"
"Technically?" Eventus began as he quirked an eyebrow at the man. "No, as there are no chains involved in its operation. However in operation it shares an extreme visual similarity to chain based cutting implements."
"Is there any chance I could get a copy of the design documents for that?" McKay asked with a hopeful look over to him.
There was a very real temptation to say yes, just to see what McKay might be able to make with the technology. However Eventus was holding back from offering the expedition anything even approaching weapon technology for a reason, so he gave the scientist an apologetic shake of his head.
"Sorry, but I can send you a copy of the magnetic field equations when we get back to Atlantis if you want?"
McKay's shoulders slumped slightly and he let out a sigh. "It's because–
"Hold that." Eventus interrupted as a tight beam communications signal issued forth from the Traveler vessel. "Looks like they finally want to have a conversation."
Sending the mental command to bring the signal up on a display, Eventus visibly cringed at the ramshackle interior that appeared as a backdrop to the wavy haired woman now on screen.
"Whoever you are, we found this ship first, so back off."
Eventus exchanged an incredulous glance with McKay at the sheer balls it took to try and make that argument given the vast disparity between their two ships.
"No?" He put forward as he focused back on the display. "That is literally my peoples ship, and just because we're a few thousand years late picking it up doesn't mean it's up for grabs."
The woman scoffed at him. "Try another one, the Ancestors have been dead and gone for ten thousand years."
That was a fair amount of skepticism given the circumstances, however it ignored the rather important reality that was staring the woman in the face.
"Believe me or not, I'm in control of a fully operational Lantean warship, and the one behind your ship is still under full security lockdown."
Which was why he couldn't just remotely seize control of the Navis from the Enterprise.
"Maybe." The woman said in a remarkably unconcerned tone. "But I'm the one who has a bomb strapped to the Ancestral Warships reactor. So either it's ours, or nobodies."
Mentally directing the Enterprises sensors to run a full sweep of the Navis, Eventus let out an annoyed growl when the only thing that showed up was a pair of semi-shielded life signs.
"I applaud your ability to lie, but not your intelligence for doing so in the face of someone who has sensor systems capable of checking your claims."
Her eyes darted to the side in a sudden show of nervousness before she steeled herself in a way that left Eventus deciding to cut what was probably some act of pointless bravado off at the knee's.
"So as my human friends here would say, let's cut to the chase. Who are you, what do you want with a ship you can't even turn on, and why are you so utterly desperate that you'd risk death to get it?"
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Author's Notes: Poor Larrin, her bravado is a lot less impressive when she doesn't have the absolute advantage.
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StarSerpent
Upjumped Peasant
- Location
- Cowtown, AB
Counterargument, she's hot, walks around in leather all the time and knows how to tie you up (Sheppard was a lucky dog)
I always assumed that the iris had to be closed after the kawoosh, but apparently there was one episode where a "natural iris" was formed by a stargate being buried while active [so obstructions close enough to count as an iris, but not inside the ring itself as to prevent dialing] and they had to do something special to get it clear enough to allow the kawoosh to happen.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Hard to bluff against the guy who can read your cards.
100 Days.
It's possible that the SGC's iris isn't quite close enough to prevent the kawoosh clearing vortex from beginning to form. Or wasn't, at least initially. That might be something they figured out in a later iteration of the iris. The precision on being close enough to prevent the kawoosh from forming and eating the iris would be insanely tight ... and possibly prevented by the fact that the leaves of the iris overlap and interlock on the outside of the iris, which means that the center would be ever so slightly further out from the event horizon than the rest of the iris.
--
Larrin's desperate. But at least she's got a good reason and cause. And she's not in the position of power she was with Sheppard in canon, but she's not insane either, so coming to a deal should be a lot easier and faster.
On the upside, hopefully relations with the Travellers will be better here - Eventus won't trade weapons tech at this point, but trading for Traveller weapons tech should be quite doable.
Shadow Archon
Protoss Preserver
- Location
- Louisiana
Just letting them use Atlantis or Taranis as a port for their ships to get repairs would be an easy way to better develop relations. The Travellers are a prickly bunch, but they're no Genii.
😆 Eventus' whole mood can just be described as 'patient annoyance'. Poor guy. Wonder how long it takes before he picks up with the snark and sarkasm just to deal with all the bullshit he now is semi-responsible for...
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Except those are technically under Lantean/Eventus's control, rather than the Expedition's.
But a deal for helping with repairs in a secure location should be doable.
Yeah, better the Travellers than the Genii. More useful, more reliable, and more trustworthy. And more to trade, in both directions.
begin what? Firing? Boarding? Something else?
went -> want
starting -> staring
Foxy Boxes
[Verified Box]
- Location
- England
Exactly. It's intimidatingly vague, while also not explicitly a threat, so they can deny they made one during negotiations.
ScreamyBirb
Here is Screaming
Offering to treat the radiation poisoning they've probably got from their reactor leakage is a damn easy way to both sweeten the pot and tangibly prove what he is.
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Foxy Boxes
[Verified Box]
- Location
- England
A minute is "roughly as long as I need to complete this thing I'm invested in" from my experience.
that might be part of the DHD Correlative updates, in that they would periodicly dial each other for updates regarding Stargate coordinates and system modifications.
Ace Dreamer
Verified Reality User
- Location
- Between The Unknown & The Known
As ever in Stargate, the question of what language is being used is passed over.
(I know, very early episodes, they tried to be more realistic, but gave that up as impractical.)
You can assume a 'minute' is long enough to think, and make a decision, but bot as long as you'd like? Maybe a count-down was also being transmitted, on a digital channel, 'off screen'?
Classically, two minutes is as long as someone will wait, without any feedback on how long they're likely to have to wait, or some indication that their presence has been registered?
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