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Andor Disney+ Series

TURBODERP said:
Honestly I feel that Kino's revelation and change are a likely mirror of what Luthen went through. And where it'll end up going
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My guess is that Luthen will take a dive so Mothma can escape Coruscant in the chaos he causes. If you're going for a moment with narrative weight, that seems like the best opportunity.
 
I'm gonna put good odds that Vel is blown. Her face was seen by Syril during the Ghorman op and she is close to Mon Mothma, who is about to blow up her own life to go be the leader of the Rebel Alliance post Ghorman massacre.

She is my easy bet for the cast member next on the chopping block, her or Luthen himself.
 
Undead Martyr said:
Cassian himself eventually.
And Jyn Erso for that matter.
Might be where Vel is headed tbh.
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"We'll take our chances, until the chances are spent", recontextualised.

If we're running a sequential deadpool, my money is on Vel to make the Karn sting hurt, then Luthen to cover Mon somehow, then Syril during the massacre (although I like to think that Rael and Meero go after each other and cancel out somehow).

That being said, Dedra getting iced by Syril in a lover's tiff or something (maybe at Cassian's urging to prove his revolutionary bona fides??) could only be topped by both of them getting transferred to DS1 at the end as faceless drones, to be knocked off by a certain flaxen haired saviour.

Only death I haven't got a picture of is Bix. Hopefully one of the little people gets out of this, and maybe it's her.

We'll see.
 
maskedanddanger said:
I'm gonna put good odds that Vel is blown. Her face was seen by Syril during the Ghorman op and she is close to Mon Mothma, who is about to blow up her own life to go be the leader of the Rebel Alliance post Ghorman massacre.

She is my easy bet for the cast member next on the chopping block, her or Luthen himself.
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My money is on Bix and Kleya. Bix needs to have died long enough ago that Casian's tension with Jyn isn't weird, and Kleya dying can lead to Luthrn unraveling as he fully loses control on all the various threads he's pulling on. It's pretty clear she is the main thing keeping everything going under him.
 
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TURBODERP said:
Luthen assumes he's already dead (the inevitable conclusion that Luthen talks about is explicitly that Luthen is damned) and is working from there.
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I think another important aspect of Luthen's view of himself, especially his own mortality, is the specific "I'm condemned to use the tools of my enemy," bit. He starts his monologue to Lonni with how he's given up any measure of kindness, love, kinship in his own life, the good, peaceful things that might've brought him comfort even in a galaxy ruled by the Empire, but finishes it talking about how he's burning his decency for the benefit of others, how there will be no reward, no gratitude for everything he's done in his pursuit of rebellion. But the "tools of my enemy" line sticks out hard for me, especially in the context of what he's planning in the scene.

There's absolutely a parallel to be drawn between Luthen and Dedra, as well as the ISB as a whole, with the way they each balance lives on ledgers of risks and benefits. Lonni is explicitly trying to offer Luthen a win, a chance to save a rebel cell from falling into an ambush, and Luthen remorselessly rejects it, because saving that one cell would mean burning the advantage Lonnie offers him and he refuses to give that up.

Sure, his monologue ends with talking about how his is "the ego that started this fight," framing it as him being denied a reward he's rightfully owed, and I do think that's definitely part of what drives his bitterness, but I believe the greater part is just that he despises what he's become even as he recognizes its necessity. The role he plays in the nascent rebellion, balancing who knows how many disconnected cells and movements across the galaxy, before it grows enough to get the capital R in its name is undeniably a critical one, but it's a cruel, vicious role, and Luthen sees himself as a monster who's only redeemed by setting himself against greater ones.

Make no mistake, he's absolutely aware that he could die at any time, whether through betrayal, a cunning trap, or a simple slip-up, which also informs the inevitability he views his death with. But I think that even if his plans all go exactly as he hopes, if the Empire falls and a new Republic rises from its ashes, he wouldn't be able to find a place for himself within it. Not because there wouldn't be one, not because no one would glorify, justify everything he's done, but simply because he himself couldn't stand what he became to get there. Neither him nor the ghosts in his dreams.
 
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I think one of Kleya or Vel might survive and become sort of a Rebellion-era Luthen. Maybe someone ends up on Alderaan.

Bix is 100% dead though, and it feels like she has to die before the last quartet, unless there's a mini timeskip at the end.
 
HeirApparent said:
I think another important aspect of Luthen's view of himself, especially his own mortality, is the specific "I'm condemned to use the tools of my enemy," bit. He starts his monologue to Lonni with how he's given up any measure of kindness, love, kinship in his own life, the good, peaceful things that might've brought him comfort even in a galaxy ruled by the Empire, but finishes it talking about how he's burning his decency for the benefit of others, how there will be no reward, no gratitude for everything he's done in his pursuit of rebellion. But the "tools of my enemy" line sticks out hard for me, especially in the context of what he's planning in the scene.

There's absolutely a parallel to be drawn between Luthen and Dedra, as well as the ISB as a whole, with the way they each balance lives on ledgers of risks and benefits. Lonni is explicitly trying to offer Luthen a win, a chance to save a rebel cell from falling into an ambush, and Luthen remorselessly rejects it, because saving that one cell would mean burning the advantage Lonnie offers him and he refuses to give that up.

Sure, his monologue ends with talking about how his is "the ego that started this fight," framing it as him being denied a reward he's rightfully owed, and I do think that's definitely part of what drives his bitterness, but I believe the greater part is just that he despises what he's become even as he recognizes its necessity. The role he plays in the nascent rebellion, balancing who knows how many disconnected cells and movements across the galaxy, before it grows enough to get the capital R in its name is undeniably a critical one, but it's a cruel, vicious role, and Luthen sees himself as a monster who's only redeemed by setting himself against greater ones.

Make no mistake, he's absolutely aware that he could die at any time, whether through betrayal, a cunning trap, or a simple slip-up, which also informs the inevitability he views his death with. But I think that even if his plans all go exactly as he hopes, if the Empire falls and a new Republic rises from its ashes, he wouldn't be able to find a place for himself within it. Not because there wouldn't be one, not because no one would glorify, justify everything he's done, but simply because he himself couldn't stand what he became to get there. Neither him nor the ghosts in his dreams.
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Well that whole "conscience" aspect is clear of course.
 
oh yeah I can feel it, ~15 minutes into the arc and I can see the #SyrilSweep incoming

Edit: Ah! Well, nevertheless
 
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Cassian coming in clutch for the first fanservice of the day.

I love the Viet-Cong jungle vibe.

EDIT- yeah, I increasingly suspect one of Syril or Dedra are dying on Ghorman. Wonder if Bix'll go after her.
 
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I really wish the Medstar and Coruscant Nights books were better- Jedi MASH or Noir would be epic.

I also love the low-key force stuff, like with Cirrhut and Jedha in Rogue One.
 
Holy shit, Episode 8 is absolute gold.


Bruh why is Bail mentioning Yavin twice by name.
 
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It was definitely intense.

I suppose some nerds will come in here and talk about tactics, but honestly I don't mind it. Yes, those stormtroopers were in the open but that was sorta the point. They were "crowd control" - I doubt the individual troopers were in on the plan, they just went with the flow when the shooting started - and were (mostly) firing into an unarmed crowd anyway. Like Ferrix, except this time the Empire intended for it to happen. And anyway, Imperial deaths just help to sell the narrative ISB is pushing. Just like that poor security trooper taken out by a sniper to start the whole thing, their deaths were an acceptable cost.

Captain Kaido would do Lord Farquaad proud.

 
What a great three episodes.

Episode 8 was obviously perfect and I have nothing to say that isn't just gushing. Though I did like the all forward line from the hotel worker.

So I guess Mon Mothma gave three speeches that day.

The first on the Senate floor
which was great, by the way. Very Rix Road. Even with my anticipation being too high, I still loved it.​
The second where she calls Palpatine a liar as seen on Rebels when they are watching the holonet.
Presumably given from her first escape ship to reinforce her Senate speech to the wider galaxy.​
And then third, her call to action over Dantooine.
As seen on Rebels.
​
The one thing I didn't like was the implication that Mon was a puppet ruler with the lines about "They want her to do x or y".
The call to action over Dantooine being implicitly staged also annoys me but I guess it would explain the quick response.:rolleyes2:​

I honestly thought they were going to pull a trick where it would only be implied that the droid Cassian captured was K2SO and the comic origin would be left intact for those who read it.
But, no great loss.

Anybody have any thoughts on why Luthen stayed on Coruscant?
 
Andor has done the impossible, it has made me sympathize with the Space!French and a Space!Fascist simultaneously.
 
The discourse about Luthen earlier this thread was pretty on point lol

What a fantastic 3 episodes.

Cassian losing Bix this way is actually even more painful than her just dying.
 
So I was way off regarding Syrill fate, but I want to imagine he didn't even make it to the Imperial Martyr memorial reel
 
Undead Martyr said:
Bruh why is Bail mentioning Yavin twice by name.
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Yeah, that bugged me. Use code names, people! You could be overheard! It's bad enough that in Rebels they called it Massassi Group while they're hiding on the only planet with Massassi temples.


buli-buli said:
Anybody have any thoughts on why Luthen stayed on Coruscant?
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No reason for him to leave right now. He's not exposed. The only connection between him and Mon is that she was one of his many wealthy customers.
 
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