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Puella Magi Imperatrix Mundi, or: Wherein Half Of Japan Tries To Kill You

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Just as an FYI, vote will probably be open for at least another 24 hours; that's the soonest I'll have the opportunity to do any writing.

Genial Precis said:
Word of Grimoire says that Chizuka's teammates are somewhat untrustworthy, so absent a clear reason to recruit them I'm against it.
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Note that all you can really say for sure is that her trust in them is at least somewhat unwarranted; at one extreme, it's a possible (albeit unlikely) scenario that Chizuka attached herself to the group of her own accord and they're just too polite to tell her to go away, with any camaraderie being entirely imagined by Chizuka herself. At the other extreme, it's possible that they're actively exploiting her.

Maiko's grimoire, of course, could narrow down the possibilities dramatically. Speaking of which...

redzonejoe said:
This information might be important even beyond this conversation, but stalling is grating, yes. I can understand the distaste when we've a Caligruca to find. Not sure what to do about it though, difference in priority I suppose. To me it's a necessary evil.
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Stalling is only necessary if you want to use that information in this conversation. At this point, Maiko could look up the Nerima girls and/or calligraphy girl on her without spending unreasonable amounts of magic. If you want, you could assign her to do that while Yui is busy with sleep or school and then follow up as appropriate later on, freeing up this evening to do something entirely different.
 
[X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
-[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
-[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
-[X] Ask Maiko to try to get a look at the Nerima girls' soul gems, if she can do so while confidently remaining undetected, and then join Minami.
-[X] "okay look, I actually was trying to do something before I got sidetracked here so I'll make this short: I'll leave you my contact information and with the promise that I will not interfere with your business if you don't interfere in mine."
-[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
[X] QBmail Chizuka: "Listen, you've seen that I can be reasonable. If you or your team get in over your heads, contact me and I'll be at least as reasonable with them as I was with you."
 
Gilding the lily on this local maximum, but:

[X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
-[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
-[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
-[X] Ask Maiko to gather as much additional identifying information as she thinks appropriate, planning on looking up the Nerima girls later, before joining Minami.
-[X] "okay look, I actually was trying to do something before I got sidetracked here so I'll make this short: I'll leave you my contact information and with the promise that I will not interfere with your business if you don't interfere in mine."
-[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
[X] QBmail Chizuka: "Listen, you've seen that I can be reasonable. If you or your team get in over your heads, contact me and I'll be at least as reasonable with them as I was with you."
 
I'd vote for it but since I voted redzonejoe and he is voting you, I already am. :p

However, I would point out that this...
Genial Precis said:
"I'll leave you my contact information and with the promise that I will not interfere with your business if you don't interfere in mine."
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...forbids active interference in the team affairs unless we want to break our own promise, so we limit ourselves with a completely hands-off approach until they make it our business again.

That means that unless they or Chizuka come to us for help, we do not do anything about them, regardless of what happens with or inside the team.

It is a viable approach, but there seem to be two schools of thought about how we handle these situations.

Edit: actually, if Chizuka does come for help, would it count as 'interfering with our business' sufficiently enough for us to help her, because it surely would be interfering with theirs?

Basically, these exact words is what they want to hear, but is it what we want to do?
 
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Nevill said:
However, I would point out that this...

...forbids active interference in the team affairs unless we want to break our own promise, so we limit ourselves with a completely hands-off approach
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Actually, good point. I don't like limiting ourselves this way. Interventionist Empress Yui sticks her nose wherever she pleases! (Lewd! :o:oops:)

Dark Lord Potato said:
I feel stupid for asking this, but K.I.S.S.?
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Keep it simple, stupid.

Not a huge fan, personally :p

Edit: Minami'd again
 
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There's a bit of an implied "unless I'm asked to" in the non-interference offer, especially with the explicit offer to Chizuka to come to us if she needs help
 
Nevill said:
...forbids active interference in the team affairs unless we want to break our own promise, so we limit ourselves with a completely hands-off approach until they make it our business again.

That means that unless they or Chizuka come to us for help, we do not do anything about them, regardless of what happens with or inside the team.

It is a viable approach, but there seem to be two schools of thought about how we handle these situations.
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Huh. You're right, that's not obviously the best approach. I see no reason to make that concession. Also, we can be a little more on-point about our interest in border trouble that might spill over. How's this?

[X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
-[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
-[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
-[X] Ask Maiko to gather as much additional identifying information as she thinks appropriate, planning on looking up the Nerima girls later, before joining Minami.
-[X] Give them your contact information, ask for theirs but don't insist.
-[X] "I won't involve myself in your business if you don't involve yourselves in mine, but I don't want trouble spilling into Nagamioka. I'd appreciate it if you would inform me if such trouble began to develop."
-[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
[X] QBmail Chizuka: "Listen, you've seen that I can be reasonable. If you or your team get in over your heads, contact me and I'll be at least as reasonable with them as I was with you."
 
That works too
Adhoc vote count started by kinigget on Jul 13, 2017 at 5:55 AM, finished with 105 posts and 18 votes.
  • [X] QBmail Chizuka: "Listen, you've seen that I can be reasonable. If you or your team get in over your heads, contact me and I'll be at least as reasonable with them as I was with you."
    [X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
    -[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
    -[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
    -[X] Ask Maiko to gather as much additional identifying information as she thinks appropriate, planning on looking up the Nerima girls later, before joining Minami.
    -[X] Give them your contact information, ask for theirs but don't insist.
    -[X] "I won't involve myself in your business if you don't involve yourselves in mine, but I don't want trouble spilling into Nagamioka. I'd appreciate it if you would inform me if such trouble began to develop."
    -[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
    [x] Pout adorably. Alright then, I get it, you don't want to let the power of friendship flow through you. You're missing out! I make a great friend to people (who don't endanger my city's population or infrastructure), I think. If you change your minds, just contact me and we can meet up over ice cream or something like reasonable superpowered teenage girls.
    -[x] Oh, and? I'll be keeping an eye on my border all along Toyko. Please don't test me, alright? That won't be fun for anyone.
    --[x] Ask Maiko if you're forgetting anything important, if not, go look for the calligraphy girl. Have Minami switch her focus to monitoring the group until you either get close to where calligraphy girl is or they get far enough from your border, for now.
    [x] Continue attempts to negotiate with the Nerima girls in hopes of establishing some sort of agreement.
    - [x] Chizuka said they were worried about being attacked, offer to help with that?
    -- [x] Suggest a mutual defense pact of some sort
    -- [x] Just offer to help defend their territory, no strings attached
    - [x] Be a little more aggressive with the "too powerful for them to ignore" angle
    - [x] Send Maiko and/or Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
    - [x] (write-in Yuiplomacy?)
    [x] Thank the Nerima girls for their time and move on
    - [x] Go look for the calligraphy girl
    -- [x] Keep searching until you find her or need to head home
    -- [x] Do a quick search in the likely area and do something else if you don't find her
    - [x] Go check on one of the other leads Maiko and Minami had
    -- [x] Investigate the might-be-a-Witch incidents in the Saitama historical district.
    -- [x] Look for the girl in Yoshikawa Ward.
    -- [x] Look for the girl in Kawaguchi Ward.
    - [x] Just hunt some witches
    [x] (write-in?)
    [x] Continue attempts to negotiate with the Nerima girls in hopes of establishing some sort of agreement.
    - [x] Send Maiko and/or Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
    - [x] Chizuka said they were worried about being attacked, offer to help with that?
    --[x] They probably don't trust you to watch their backs, or enter each other's territory, so set up communications, exchange phone numbers so you can talk without brainmail range, arrange to have free passage if they are passing through your territory on civilian business, prior warning/permission if you are passing through theirs on magical business and offer to share information on regional problems.
    ---[x] Would be nice to reciprocate fully, but not strictly necessary.
    [x] Continue attempts to negotiate with the Nerima girls in hopes of establishing some sort of agreement.
    - [x] Write-in Yuiplomacy: You guys wanna go get some ice cream? My treat.
    - [x] (In case of a 'no'): Look, it is unlikely for a teenage girl not to like ice cream, and it's completely impossible not to like me, so I'm not sure what's going on here.
    - [x] I'm getting the sense that you guys are not having a super easy time of things. And I get that, everybody has problems right? You know, invisible invaders or exploding buildings or whatever. But we can talk things out instead of trying to murder each other!
    - [x] So here's what I'm offering: you guys ever need a place to crash? You can come talk to me. I mean, if somebody comes in and attacks one of my girls I will totally beat them up and stick their not-corpse in my basement. But polite girls who aren't being mean are always welcome, at least temporarily! So don't be a stranger, okay?
    [x] Okay, this conversation's getting real boring. I feel like I'm the only one contributing! So when you guys feel like holding up your end of a conversation and, like, actually introducing yourselves and all, brainmail me and we'll talk, 'kay? Byyyye!
    - [x] Go look for the calligraphy girl
    -- [x] Keep searching until you find her or need to head home
    - [x] Be a little more aggressive with the "too powerful for them to ignore" angle
    - [x] Send Maiko and/or Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
    [x] Red Team
    [X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
    -[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
    -[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
    -[X] Ask Maiko to try to get a look at the Nerima girls' soul gems, if she can do so while confidently remaining undetected, and then join Minami.
    -[X] "okay look, I actually was trying to do something before I got sidetracked here so I'll make this short: I'll leave you my contact information and with the promise that I will not interfere with your business if you don't interfere in mine."
    -[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
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Genial Precis said:
How's this?
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Mostly fine. I would like to know two things, though.
- What do you consider the difference between this one and the previous version?
- What is the intent behind the message, i.e. what is it that we are saying we will and will not do, and what do you consider sufficient grounds for involving ourselves further?
 
Nevill said:
Mostly fine. I would like to know two things, though.
- What do you consider the difference between this one and the previous version?
- What is the intent behind the message, i.e. what is it that we are saying we will and will not do, and what do you consider sufficient grounds for involving ourselves further?
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The differences:
  1. Explicit nudging for them to let us know if trouble is likely to spill over, with subtext of favorable attention if they do so alert us.
  2. Try to exchange contact info rather than just give them ours.
I intended to make the noninterference explicitly conditional on the absence of trouble brewing in Nerima that might spill into Nagamioka, but did not clearly think it through and wrote an unconditional assurance instead. Oops.

To me, the condition for further involvement would be things happening in Nerima that might lead to more Nagamioka invaders. For example:
  1. If the Nerima group tried to expand.
  2. If the Nerima group got into a big, territory-changing fight.
  3. If another group tried to pass through Nerima en route to causing trouble in Nagamioka.
If the Nerima group sits on our border and doesn't get into major fights, I would prefer to mostly leave them alone and just make sure we have open channels of communication with them in case the need arises.

Now, to address the unconditional promise that was supposed to be conditional. Rather than:
-[ ] "I won't involve myself in your business if you don't involve yourselves in mine, but I don't want trouble spilling into Nagamioka. I'd appreciate it if you would inform me if such trouble began to develop."

I would change that line to:
-[ ] "I won't involve myself in your business if you don't involve yourselves in mine, or unless your business threatens to spill into Nagamioka. I'd appreciate it if you would inform me if such an incident began to develop."

Which is a reasonably large change of direction. Thoughts?
 
Yeah, it's a big shift, but it is consistent with what we are trying to do here and around our city in general.
Genial Precis said:
  • If the Nerima group tried to expand.
  • If the Nerima group got into a big, territory-changing fight.
  • If another group tried to pass through Nerima en route to causing trouble in Nagamioka.
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Though some of those conditions are pretty harsh, mind. You are telling them not to move out of their territory on fear of your intervention, something that most groups would have told you off for if you suggested it.

However, it is true that we don't want them to start killing others to take over their territory, or pushed out of theirs.
 
Nevill said:
Though some of those conditions are pretty harsh, mind. You are telling them not to move out of their territory on fear of your intervention, something that most groups would have told you off for if you suggested it.
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There's intervention and there's intervention. One reasonably likely kind of intervention would be bringing in Yui as a mediator. Conversely, another condition for intervention would be the Nerima group being invaded by an aggressive, expansionistic group.

I'll make the change unless someone persuades me that it's a terrible idea. We probably wouldn't stick to a promise of unconditional noninterference, so let's not make one.

[X] Invite further negotiations at a later time but mostly thank them for their time and move on.
-[X] Ask for Maiko's read on the situation
-[X] Send Minami off to search for calligraphy girl while you negotiate
-[X] Ask Maiko to gather as much additional identifying information as she thinks appropriate, planning on looking up the Nerima girls later, before joining Minami.
-[X] Give them your contact information, ask for theirs but don't insist.
-[X] "I won't involve myself in your business if you don't involve yourselves in mine, or unless your business threatens to spill into Nagamioka. I'd appreciate it if you would inform me if such an incident began to develop."
-[X] "If you want to set up a more formal arrangement later we can do that. I'd honestly prefer it, but I won't force the issue"
[X] QBmail Chizuka: "Listen, you've seen that I can be reasonable. If you or your team get in over your heads, contact me and I'll be at least as reasonable with them as I was with you."
 
I'm not sure asking Maiko for her take, giving Minami her marching orders and then asking Maiko to grimoire all available magical girls can fit properly into the space of a 4 line conversation - 6 if you count brain-mailing Chizuka, which you probably shouldn't.

This vote may involve a fair amount of Yui standing in front of the Nerima girls with a vacant look on her face.
 
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Guile said:
I'm not sure asking Maiko for her take, giving Minami her marching orders and then asking Maiko to grimoire all available magical girls can fit properly into the space of a 4 line conversation - 6 if you count brain-mailing Chizuka, which you probably shouldn't.
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I think the complaint could be summed up as: why ask for Maiko's read before she has her intel? The vote already states our decision to wrap up the talks, so there isn't much Maiko can tell us that we can't hear later, since it does not influence our actions.

Personally, I don't think she'll have a lot to say at the moment, so that won't be an issue.
 
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We could probably combine the instructions for Maiko into a single subvote, but that's honestly not too much of a problem
 
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