[X] Write a list of the items and get what you need to do the research Safely, no point in teaching others if it does the OPPOSITE if you do it wrong, focus on getting supplies then conversing with oriko and nagisa about it, oriko would be useful at overwatch and warning when things are about to go wrong

The vote is clearly about a *what are your trying to do?*, what you are describing is a *how do you do the research?*. You're answering the wrong question.

It's way too soon for that, and you don't even have a direction to follow.

It's also important to remember some witches are familiars that ate a bunch of people and were never human in the first place.

All the more reason to do research on witches, as it allows them to not suffer eternally just from being born. E.G.O and doppel research don't cover that.
 
Just because Kyubey had access to an alternative energy source doesn't mean he's going to stop using Witches. Otherwise Rebellion wouldn't have happened. He'll probably try to use all sources unless it's literally impossible too.
 
Mami really needs to not be left alone for the next... I'd say week, at least, month is more probable.
Let's go with lifetime, just to be safe.


Does gaining control of one's doppel affect the likelihood of witching out in any way? I'm leaning towards that option, but if it's more just a power up then I'm fine with doing witch research.
 
I think we can close it here
Adhoc vote count started by Naron on Feb 5, 2025 at 5:59 AM, finished with 17 posts and 10 votes.

  • [x] Do testing with regular Witches
    [X] Do testing with regular Witches first
    -[X] Write a list of the research ideas you have and get what you need to do the research Safely, no point in teaching others if it does the OPPOSITE if you do it wrong, focus on getting supplies then conversing with oriko and nagisa about it, oriko would be useful at overwatch and warning when things are about to go wrong for the ego and witch harnessing option

And would you look at that, we are unanimous. Not where I expect this vote to go, but such is the way of Quests.

Time to reenact Lobotomy Corporation, but this time with more magical girls!
 
35. The Science of Despair New
Do testing with regular Witches

Yuki gives a slow nod, mostly to herself. This is the most suitable approach, and the most likely to provide some sort of result.

"Let's do some testing with Witches," she suggests to the girls. "They still differ from Abnormalities in some ways. Even Kyubey doesn't know that much about them. There might just be a way to do the impossible and create coexistence."

Mami and Kyoko exchange wary looks. For once, even Yuma being on-board does not quite convince them on its own.

"I hate to burst your bubble," Kyoko starts, "but there's some big problems there. For one, all Witches we've ever seen were hostile. They kill without care and attack anyone invading their barriers. I've never heard one talk, either."

"I did," Yuki retorts simply. She has her hands folded, the picture of certainty. "And I doubt she was the only one. I can translate if need be, and I'm not denying that Witches are dangerous. But so are Abnormalities, even the most benign one can kill. I think we had this whole song and dance before when it came to me."

The older magical girls nod slowly. They both remember the original issue between Mami and Yuki, even though it feels incredibly long ago to them now.

"Not all Witches can be like me," Yuki acknowledges. "But there may be some who can. More importantly, if we can prove that careful handling allows dealing with a Witch safely, then we can get Kyubey on-board. And if we get Kyubey on our side, then we can use everything at their disposal to improve the lots of every magical girl across the world. Scarcity of resources will be a thing of the past, communities can be built around a core of stable Witches, and life-expectancy of magical girls will grow significantly."

Yuki's voice gained some fervour along the way. She leans forward with gleaming eyes, capturing all three girls with her gaze.

Yuma claps, awed and excited in equal measure.

The noise breaks the spell, though it leaves Mami and Kyoko in a speculative mood.

"You really think it's possible?" Mami asks, earning a nod.

Kyoko rubs her forehead thoughtfully. "I guess there's nothing impossible after what happened with you. But if it's even achievable, why didn't anyone do it before?"

"Because no one, not even Kyubey, knew it was possible before I came along. And on that note, Kyubey?"

"You called?"

Yuki invites the bunnycat onto her lap, idly petting their head as she speaks: "Have you looked into methods of Enkephalin generation after our talk?"

"I have. The theory you outlined does have merit, though we lack conclusive proof yet. Testing requires careful selection of specimen."

"I actually have one in mind. Do you still have Gertrud's Grief Seed?"

"I'm not familiar with that name."

"The Witch that raised roses," Yuki elaborates, "the one Mami fought when she and I first met. I was in the middle of talking to her."

Mami offers a thoughtful hum in response. "I remember that Witch. But I would not call her peaceful."

"She's sedentary and easy to please," Yuki counters. "Which is about the best we can hope for in a test subject."

What she does not say is that she wants another chance to talk with Gertrud. They could never finish their conversation, nor did Yuki even say goodbye. But Witches are enough like Abnormalities in that they can not die, so it is still possible.

Kyubey meets her gaze wordlessly, weighing pros and cons for long seconds. Then they pull a Grief Seed from seemingly nowhere, pulsing with darkness that is barely contained.

"Here you go. May I observe your experiments?"

"Sure. I wanted to work on this with you to begin with."

"Very good. I hope you three don't mind, either?"

Kyubey looks to Mami, Kyoko, and Yuma, who are in various states of upset. Yuma barely, Mami very, and Kyoko somewhere in the middle but trying for nonchalant.

"Sure, let's do it," Kyoko says, subtly squeezing Mami's hand under the table. "We'll need every advantage we can get if we wanna do this. But let's be clear here, you're on thin ice. If you try screwing us over again, then we're through."

She leans forward to point her finger in Kyubey's feline face, prompting a nonplussed tilt of the head. They nod anyway, recognising that arguing will earn them nothing.

"Then it's settled. I will confer with Yuki to figure out proper testing conditions."

Kyubey turns around and wiggles out of Yuki's grasp, leaving the Grief Seed in her lap. It pulsates already, ready to hatch from the slightest influx of tainted energy.

Yuki makes sure to keep Gertrud nearby until everything is ready. Despite the Grief Seed's state however, it does not hatch on its own. Yuki has ample time to plan with Kyubey and Oriko, seeing that school goes on as normal in spite of the approaching apocalypse.

They spend three days debating and settling on the exact plan. Oriko drops out Tuesday afternoon, head smoking from how meticulous Yuki and Kyubey are about research. They do not only set up testing conditions, they reiterate over the plan at least a dozen times to refine it. Potential sources of errors are brainstormed, identified, and accounted for. The same is true for dangers and benefits.

Truth be told, working with Kyubey is a joy for Yuki. Her only complaint at all, which is not fair in the slightest, is that they have not figured out any form of Qliphoth Deterrence. Weakening the Witch is currently impossible, and neither is shutting her down completely.

They will have to compensate with stricter security measures. Oriko using her foresight was a given, but Homura will also be on standby to interfere at a moment's notice.

Recruiting Madoka and Sayaka to do the actual work process is almost too easy in comparison. At least Madoka, that is; Sayaka is way out of the loop and understandably wary of all those sudden changes. But the combined weight of Madoka and Mami speaking in Yuki's favour helps bring her around to help.

That does not mean she is happy to be dressed in gardening clothes on Thursday afternoon. Even less so when they lead her into Gertrud's barrier to tend the roses, right after Madoka comes out.

"Why can't it be one of us?" Kyoko complains once again as they watch. Kyubey projects magical screens to display the inside of Gertrud's lair, but contact with the inside is kept to a minimum.

"Because we need to establish a baseline," Yuki reminds her from nearby, wrapped in gleaming gossamer strings of various colours. "Now shush, I need to focus."

She plucks on some strings to fine-tune her observational and analysing spells. Some of them are brand-new, created in cooperation with Kyubey. They have yet to finish making a comprehensive translator between Yuki's findings and their shorthand, but the manual translations work fine for now.

Truthfully, Yuki does not understand all the things they measure. Kyubey used a lot of words that humanity has not even imagined; imparting even just one, the obscure-emotional-parting-principle, required going over four other theories before reaching familiar waters.

But Yuki knows enough to gauge the work process itself.

"Witches are capable of recognising magical girls," Kyubey adds. "And in most cases, they react violently to their presence. I do agree with the sentiment that Madoka Kaname is a bad candidate for initial testing due to her irregular potential, but the existence or lack of a response to said potential may yield valuable data on its own."

"The short version, please."

"You can go in after Sayaka is done."

Kyoko scowls at Kyubey, perhaps not quite happy that the Incubator guessed her intention. She did want to take that task off the regular girls.

"There are adults we could have asked," Mami supplies right after, supporting her friend. "It did not have to be them."

"The only adults with full disclosure that we have are your teacher and Madoka's parents," Yuki shoots that down. "Neither of them is that much more qualified than them, and they're far busier. Reading in anyone else, much less getting them to agree to this, would take a long time. We only have so much of it before Walpurgis comes, and I'd like to see some results before then."

Now Mami joins Kyoko in looking unhappy. The super-Witch's imminent arrival was something Homura brought up by now, but they have yet to decide on anything beyond training together. It has become another string in the noose they feel tightening around their necks.

"How is she doing?" Madoka asks into the uncomfortable silence. She joins them belatedly, needing Yuma's attention over some scratches from thorny vines.

"Prognosis positive, flow of energy is stable."

"She works slower than you did," Yuki adds on top, squinting and tugging at strings. "But the Enkephalin Gertrud produces is still positive."

"I kinda get that," Madoka murmurs, rubbing her side. "Getting whipped by that vine hurt a lot."

"Hence the protective clothing," Yuki returns. "She was a lot more agitated before we figured out how to hide us and the magical girls from her senses."

Homura shadows Madoka and does not look too happy. They barely stopped her from rushing in when that happened; she only let them convince her at all because Oriko gave no indicator that there was danger. Gertrud made no motion to follow up on that one reprisal. By what Yuki heard with her translation magic, she thought Madoka was too rough with the rose she pruned.

While they watch Sayaka work more methodically than she ever has, if just to avoid getting hurt, Yuki can not help but wallow in disappointment.

She tried talking to Gertrud first thing after waking her. Unfortunately, the Rose Garden Witch did not recognise her at all. She acted like it was their first meeting, her responses and reactions exactly the same as back then. It was eery to experience from the outside.

That is one path cut off, at least with this Witch. If there is a way to develop her into breaking the pattern, Yuki does not know it.

They continue to observe. Kyubey keeps an eye on Sayaka's vitals, noting the decrease in life force just like with Madoka. Just being in the presence of a Witch saps the energy from people, both physically and mentally. A short exposure like the half-hour sessions they settled on has no lasting impact, assuming the one working does not mess up.

What they learn that day is that Madoka's potential has no real influence on a Witch's behaviour. They also learn that Gertrud reacts harshly to a magical girl coming near her roses; even when Kyoko displayed entirely peaceful behaviour after a dozen lashes from the vines, the Witch kept hovering above to watch her closely.

There was still some positive Enkephalin produced, but notably less than Madoka and Sayaka got out of her. Kyubey comments on the greater potency of it, too.

"There is value in pursuing this avenue of research further," they conclude. "I will have to consider how to gain more volunteers for testing purposes. Due to Witches' preference for hunting emotionally weak or vulnerable people, the opposite qualities are desired here."

So they send Gertrud back to sleep -by killing her in a rushdown assault- and conclude the day.

Friday dawns early for Yuki, even though she was kept up mulling over everything they learned. She is at a loss for how to continue, beyond catching another docile Witch to get comparative values on. But sending in Madoka and Sayaka every time sounds wrong to her; Kyoko and Mami were not wrong in that regard.

What is more, Walpurgis is a mere eight days away. They need to step up their team exercises soon, lest they be caught flat-footed. Right now the team has some trouble working together; Mami and Kyoko are a well-oiled machine, but Nagisa and her exploding bubbles do not fit in too well with any melee fighter. Homura can compensate a bit, but she has a habit of going solo. She is often right, but the point of being a team is to work together.

This is a work in progress. And not one Yuki can do anything with right now. She rolls over and buries her head in the pillow, having been left to sleep in by Kazuko.

Naturally, Oriko and Kirika are around as well. But they quietly look into flats to rent across Mitakihara. Yuki decides not to bother them for now. She just grabs some fruit to eat and goes for a walk.

The morning air is nice, still a little crisp and cool, but not uncomfortably so. Yuki basks in the sunlight, rare as it is at the moment. These faint rays give her a glimpse of the bright future awaiting them.

Walpurgis will be overcome. That is not in question.

Regardless of that, Yuki realises this is the first time she was really alone since 'the incident', as everyone took to calling the events of the previous Friday. Either Yuki sought someone's presence, or they were around for other reasons.

But this is nice, too.

Yuki spends the morning on her walk, then buys ice cream for herself. After slowly eating everything to the last flake, she settles on a park bench to read. A stray cat comes sit with her for a while, lying down in the sunlight.

Birds sing above, unconcerned by the lives going on below them.

Around noon, Yuki shuts the book. She finished reading it, and she feels refreshed now.

"Kyubey?"

"Yes?"

The Incubator perks up from their spot by her side. Yuki has no idea when they arrived, but she honestly does not care.

"Do you have suggestions to improve our team cohesion?"

"I do have them, but I'm hesitant to offer you help in that particular regard. Walpurgis' arrival is our best chance to make Madoka form a contract. Even with the improved energy generation we work on, the projected numbers are still lesser than what her transformation into a Witch will produce."

She sighs, playing with the thought of crushing Kyubey's head like a grape. At least they are straightforward about it to Yuki. They know she understands, to an extent.

"Can you at least tell me your estimation of our success chances?"

"Twenty-three point two percent," Kyubey answers instantly. "If you're willing to accept casualties-" "No." "-then it would be seventy-three percent without Madoka's contract. But I could guess that you will demand a perfect result. Which, I want to point out, having close to a one in four chance of is already difficult to achieve. I will also note an error margin of five percent, give or take, depending on how potent Oriko's precognition actually is. I lack conclusive data on that."

One in four is not what Yuki likes to hear. But then again, several miracles happened in short order. Roland and Angela made peace with each other. Yuki overcame her nature as an Abnormality. Oriko shook off magical girlhood and manifested E.G.O.

And then there is the one thing Kyubey does not know about. The two crosses still dangling innocently on that necklace Yuki wears. They have been inert from the start, but they also accompanied her throughout. When the chips are down, she knows, something will come from them.

"I'll take those odds," she says eventually. "And Madoka won't form her contract. Speaking of, run me through the logic of pursuing her potential rather than steady growth?"

Kyubey looks up at Yuki, tail swishing idly.

"As I said, the energy Madoka's Witch will generate is greater than all estimates of humanity's collective yield across the species' remaining lifespan. Even if it were merely equal, seeking her contract is beneficial because it gains us the energy in one go, rather than across the span of milennia. This is time we can then spend looking for alternatives, with all our resources freed up from interfacing with humanity. In the absolute best case, Madoka's Witch may even turn out to be reclusive and peaceful; should that be the case, we could obtain her energy and continue tending humanity. Although we expect that a Witch of this magnitude is liable to destroy the species in short order."

Yuki grimaces a little. This is just a grim reminder of what potent kindling she sits on. And Kyubey talks about it as nonchalantly as everything else. What is the death of one planet in the cosmic scheme?

Pebbles alight in the sky as a child of the galaxy cries out in loneliness. Yuki understands their feelings. But at the same time, an eldritch song answers somewhere in the void. It becomes more colourful as it approaches.

The impressions vanish quickly. Yuki pops Kyubey's head after all, prompting another to crawl out from beneath the bench.

"I can understand your reasoning, but I categorically disagree with it," she says. "We both know that, despite how much you comprehend humans based on patterns and gathered data, you can't predict them all the time. It's very possible that the species lives far longer than you anticipate. Or that you yourself will find better ways to gather your energy in the future."

Kyubey quickly finishes swallowing the last bite of their last body, then takes its place with their front paws in Yuki's lap.

"You're correct. Our assessment is not always right, even with tens of thousands of years worth of data. We're actually holding an audit at the moment, to determine if this very scenario you outline is possible to occur. Chances appear fairly slim so far, though."

"And what if Madoka's Witch is too powerful?" Yuki follows up curiously. "What if she doesn't stop at Earth?"

"Unless her Witch would eradicate all life and possibility of future life across the universe, that is a negligible price. Even if she ended up destroying us Incubators in the process. If we must die so everything can live, then we will do so."

Yuki huffs at that.

"You almost sound like you have conviction there."

And in turn, Kyubey pauses. Their head tilts left, then right, then left again. A shadow flickers across their impossibly big, pink eyes.

Then they blink, and whatever it was is gone.

"Internal assessment complete. This unit has no mental disorders."

This earns an actual snort from the taciturn woman. The dissonance of how Kyubey says it so matter-of-factly, yet with their voice so high-pitched, is kind of cute to her.

"I guess that's fair," Yuki finally says. Her hand drops down to keep petting the bunnycat for a while, and they remain like this.

If it were anyone else with Yuki, she would call the silence companionable. But with Kyubey, it just is. And that is fine, too.

Soon enough, Yuki's thoughts return to the upcoming plans. Outside of team training, the weekend has come yet again; meaning that everyone is free. But she has a few things she could potentially do on Saturday.

For one, Yuma had that invitation by the Kurosawa family. She and Kyoko are going, and Yuki is invited as a plus-one. Seeing how things progressed on that end may be worthwhile, as is keeping an eye on her friends.

For two, Sayaka. The blunette has grown a bit detached from everyone else, partly because she was not with Yuki during 'the incident'. She is still alienated with the sudden swing in opinion regarding Yuki. And there may be something else that gives her trouble, though Yuki could not tell what. Now would be a good time to try reaching out to her.

However, both of these sound bothersome. Yuki has half a mind to hang out with Kirika and Nagisa instead, which would be much more relaxed than either of the other two.

What she knows is that her social battery will only allow to do one of these things. Or one other thing she has yet to think of.


[] Visit the Kurosawa family with Yuma and Kyoko

[] Connect with Sayaka

[] Play with Kirika and Nagisa
 
[X] Visit the Kurosawa family with Yuma and Kyoko

I'm curious where this plot thread leads. We've gotten hints that there's more to Kurosawa than being a stereotypical Yakuza boss. Also Yuma is delightful and I'm sure Yuki will enjoy hanging out with her, even if there are bothersome responsibilities attached.
 
"I hate to burst your bubble," Kyoko starts, "but there's some big problems there. For one, all Witches we've ever seen were hostile. They kill without care and attack anyone invading their barriers. I've never heard one talk, either."

Too bad Yuki was the only one that heard them talking, and was always alone when they decided to not be hostile to her because she doesn't feel right, contrary to Megucas.

"Not all Witches can be like me," Yuki acknowledges. "But there may be some who can. More importantly, if we can prove that careful handling allows dealing with a Witch safely, then we can get Kyubey on-board. And if we get Kyubey on our side, then we can use everything at their disposal to improve the lots of every magical girl across the world. Scarcity of resources will be a thing of the past, communities can be built around a core of stable Witches, and life-expectancy of magical girls will grow significantly."

I am not entirely sure that's the correct angle for convincing Kyubey, he wants Megucas to become witch so you first have to remove that incentive.

Yuki invites the bunnycat onto her lap, idly petting their head as she speaks: "Have you looked into methods of Enkephalin generation after our talk?"

"I have. The theory you outlined does have merit, though we lack conclusive proof yet. Testing requires careful selection of specimen."

The incentive is under attack, now to see if it dies or continue existing.

They spend three days debating and settling on the exact plan. Oriko drops out Tuesday afternoon, head smoking from how meticulous Yuki and Kyubey are about research. They do not only set up testing conditions, they reiterate over the plan at least a dozen times to refine it. Potential sources of errors are brainstormed, identified, and accounted for. The same is true for dangers and benefits.

Truth be told, working with Kyubey is a joy for Yuki. Her only complaint at all, which is not fair in the slightest, is that they have not figured out any form of Qliphoth Deterrence. Weakening the Witch is currently impossible, and neither is shutting her down completely.

They will have to compensate with stricter security measures. Oriko using her foresight was a given, but Homura will also be on standby to interfere at a moment's notice.

The main advantage of Kyubey's lack of emotion is that he doesn't hold grudges and only cares about results.

The main disadvantage is that he only cares about result and doesn't hold any loyalty either.

We can work with him while our goals align, but have to be careful for if they ever end up misaligned.

Also, Homura must be so happy that her long and difficult training in how to be the perfect guard has a use. :V

Homura shadows Madoka and does not look too happy. They barely stopped her from rushing in when that happened; she only let them convince her at all because Oriko gave no indicator that there was danger. Gertrud made no motion to follow up on that one reprisal. By what Yuki heard with her translation magic, she thought Madoka was too rough with the rose she pruned.

Gertrud likes doing Insight work, I think? Sayaka and Madoka are working on the roses and not her body, they are not repressing her nor talking to her, it is all about the environment of the barrier.

Madoka also has a higher level of attachment than Sayaka (work faster) and was penalized because another of the work conditions wasn't followed (don't have magical girls too close).

I think H.N.ELLY would prefer some attachment work, Candeloro is definitely someone who likes both instinct (give her hugs!) and attachment but has to be careful when it comes to leaving, Charlotte is probably instinct (cheese), Homulily would be repression because Homura is self destructive.

Which brings us to Walpurgisnacht.

This one wants you to follow her script, to play a tragedy for her amusement, to show her a good story.

Attachment work, probably, almost certain to have some special conditions in the line of Blue star, CENSORED or WhiteNight.

As long as she's not like Silent Orchestra.... :rage:

What is more, Walpurgis is a mere eight days away. They need to step up their team exercises soon, lest they be caught flat-footed. Right now the team has some trouble working together; Mami and Kyoko are a well-oiled machine, but Nagisa and her exploding bubbles do not fit in too well with any melee fighter. Homura can compensate a bit, but she has a habit of going solo. She is often right, but the point of being a team is to work together.

I propose asking Walpurgis what she wants... and praying it's not *a beautiful display made out of your dead bodies*.

"Twenty-three point two percent," Kyubey answers instantly. "If you're willing to accept casualties-" "No." "-then it would be seventy-three percent without Madoka's contract. But I could guess that you will demand a perfect result. Which, I want to point out, having close to a one in four chance of is already difficult to achieve. I will also note an error margin of five percent, give or take, depending on how potent Oriko's precognition actually is. I lack conclusive data on that."

Hey, one chance in four isn't bad, like, it could be one in a million or trillion or 10^1564168.

"As I said, the energy Madoka's Witch will generate is greater than all estimates of humanity's collective yield across the species' remaining lifespan. Even if it were merely equal, seeking her contract is beneficial because it gains us the energy in one go, rather than across the span of milennia. This is time we can then spend looking for alternatives, with all our resources freed up from interfacing with humanity. In the absolute best case, Madoka's Witch may even turn out to be reclusive and peaceful; should that be the case, we could obtain her energy and continue tending humanity. Although we expect that a Witch of this magnitude is liable to destroy the species in short order."

And the destroying can even happen if the witch is peaceful (like Kriemhild is, by the way, technically), because something that powerful is liable to do a lot of damages by accident.

"Unless her Witch would eradicate all life and possibility of future life across the universe, that is a negligible price. Even if she ended up destroying us Incubators in the process. If we must die so everything can live, then we will do so."

Yuki huffs at that.

"You almost sound like you have conviction there."

And in turn, Kyubey pauses. Their head tilts left, then right, then left again. A shadow flickers across their impossibly big, pink eyes.

Then they blink, and whatever it was is gone.

"Internal assessment complete. This unit has no mental disorders."

I'd say: "This unit has not detected any mental disorder" instead.

Because I am not sure there isn't something here.

Vote:

[x] Connect with Sayaka

Work on the weakest link and increase our bonds. I don't want Sayaka to fell like she has been left out too much and decide to do a stupid, like a stupid wish.

At least wish good!

Also:

No option for Ai?

 
I mean, write-ins are allowed? The issue there will be finding her, seeing that Yuki does not know where she lives.

But a good scavenger hunt across Mitakihara could be fun for her, too :V

I so want to search for her... but Sayaka is important and I want to remind her of it and....

[x] Go search for Ai.

Forgive me, one sin, for I am weak.

Who knows, maybe we can finally meet Ai parents?

Maybe they even look like this:

 
Well, at least Sayaka won't be making a wish for Kyosuke's healing.

The vote to try and find Ai is very tempting. I think it would still be good to go check on Sayaka though.
[X] Connect with Sayaka
 
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